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Atoms Reach Record Temperature, Colder than Absolute Zero

Absolute zero is often thought to be the coldest temperature possible. But now researchers show they can achieve even lower temperatures for a strange realm of "negative temperatures."

Oddly, another way to look at these negative temperatures is to consider them hotter than infinity, researchers added.

This unusual advance could lead to new engines that could technically be more than 100 percent efficient, and shed light on mysteries such as dark energy, the mysterious substance that is apparently pulling our universe apart.

[Gee, are they not admitting the existence of "Zero Point Energy"?]

read more http://www.livescience.com/25959-atoms-colder-than-absolute-...

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What's Cooler than being Cool??


The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself.
Friedrich Nietzsche

Being absurdly hot

A system with a "negative temperature" is actually hotter than any normal system. By that I mean, create an interface between a "negative temperature" system and a normal one, regardless of how hot the normal one may be, and the normal one will take energy from the neg-temp system.

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"Fully half the quotations found on the internet are either mis-attributed, or outright fabrications." - Abraham Lincoln

Hotter, what does that mean?

Did they create a super-heated Bose-Einstein condensate by adding constraints to the system or something?

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jrd3820's picture

Ice Cold


All Right All Right All Right All Right All Right All Right All

Right Ok now ladies, we gonna break this thing down in just a few seconds.
Hey Ya!

The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself.
Friedrich Nietzsche

jrd3820's picture


Glad you chimed in because I thought maybe no one else got it!

that is why I do commercial Refrigeration work.

I mean seriously. what is more noble than he who keepeth the beer cold?

jrd3820's picture

No one!

No one is more noble than the man who keeps the beer cold sir, you are a hero lol

I think we know these devices already exist Bob ;)

Albeit in undisclosed private labs for now but I do believe we are getting close to some kind of disclosure regarding "zero point" energy. I still think that this should be released as open-source for the world.

"Time" will tell :)

"We are not human beings having a spiritual experience; we are spiritual beings having a human experience"—Pierre Teilhard de Chardin

Someone flunked thermodynamics got grant anyway.

Tantalize the ignorant with promises of free energy. Maybe we can now burn seawater for energy. LOL!

Absolute Zero is at the asymptote of the Ideal Gas law. It's merely the best guess of what that temperature is.

T==change of enthaply(heat) divided by the change in entropy at constant mass and volume as defined by thermodynamisists.

When the change in entropy goes to zero the temperature is undefined unless the change of enthalpy goes to zero at the same time.

This makes assigning a temperature to absolute zero fraught with problems and errors.

A black hole describes a mass that is decreases the in entropy (chaos) of its environment but emits no radiation. The flow of heat is zero (black hole) although the change of entropy is not therefore T == 0 by definition. Got a thermometer? But Heisenberg recognized the affect of measurement on subatomic processes.

The Big Bang has been discounted. Msssive galaxies can red shift the light of neighboring stationary quasars. Stationary relative to the galaxy.

What Hubble saw was a red shift he mistook for the accelerating expansion of the universe that fit his preconceived notion of reality.

He failed to recognize the lens of "gravity" that he was looking through to see the furthest stars. The further away the larger the "lens" and in his mind the faster the acceleration of expansion.

Einstein pointed out years before that the affect of gravity and acceleration are indistinguishable to a third party observer.

I am not sure what this experiment shows except that our understating of heat and entropy is incomplete.

Most of it strikes me a techno-babble. Oh, yeah throw a little of Boltzman's statistical mechanics, few understand that!

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Black holes emit radiation.

Black holes emit radiation. They must, because they consume mass. Google "Hawking radiation."

The "zero temperature" systems in question are constrained somehow to limit their possible energy content to some finite maximum. The ratio dT/dE become negative. That's all it means. The laws of thermodynamics do not apply, because the conditions for applying them are not met.

The implied promise of free energy in the article is probably just the typical journalistic misinterpretation one finds in these science-for-dummies articles.

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"Fully half the quotations found on the internet are either mis-attributed, or outright fabrications." - Abraham Lincoln

so, you do have a problem with the scale going negative?

I already know that you do not know what Mass is. or they would not have built the LHC.

enlighten me oh wise one. what does it take for the laws of thermodynamics to take effect?

Google it.

Google "Hawking radiation" and "information entropy".

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"Fully half the quotations found on the internet are either mis-attributed, or outright fabrications." - Abraham Lincoln

Not sure that thermodynamics does not apply.

A whole chapter in Balzheiser on entropy and information theory. I'm only 40 years of of date.

But deriving Newton's Law F=ma from Fdx=TdS links gravity to changes in entropy.

I said a black hole it T=0 because no radiation is emitted. T is near zero if Hawking radiation is proven.

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enthalpy is total heat content.

to include both sensible and latent heat. entropy indicates the direction of the flow of heat.
a BTU is a measurement of the amount of heat. temperature is a measurement of it's concentration or intensity.
the Bose Einstein did occur when absolute zero was obtained. and the particle turned into a wave.


the cosmological constant is the basis for dark energy, matter and black holes. and the big bang theory too. I am not sure if you are suggesting the universe is static or not.


the search for the higgs boson appears to be getting more desperate all the time. but it remains "elusive". it is a search for what Mass is, and if we cannot even define what mass is....then all of our theories about gravity will go right out the window.
if I am wrong on any of this, please correct me.

Hi HVACTech, good day.

Bose-Einstein condensate: ah! The de'Brogie duality of a particle and a wave. The article says it occurs at low temperature or at very high pressures. The report says the these guys were working in a vacuum.

I think that the universe is steady state. entropy and enthalpy in tension seeking equilibrium.

Gravity as an entropic force. 'Get yourself organized lads.'

Fdx=TdS (Work - force over distance == Temperature times change in entropy.)
Using known equalities Newton's Law is derived from quantum mechanics: F=ma.

The flow of heat Q = TdS and that suggests that heat flow Q can do work. Carnot tells us how much. Efficincy = 1-Tlo/Thi (I did a shortcut, getting tired.)

So the tension between the organizing forces (entropy) and the heat forces(enthalpy).

Are we looking at distant stars accelerating or are we seeing those stars through the gravity of the universe. If Hubble was wrong then Einstein's gravitational constant was an erroneous addition to his standard model.

I am not up to speed on dark energy and matter. I wonder what the weight of all those photon zooming around, E=mc2. Dark energy or dark mass?

If F=ma can be derived from quantum mechanics then we know what gravity is. We don't need to look for the Higgs Boson for that, IMO.

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I knew this was a Bob-45

I knew this was a Bob-45 story before I even looked. Now that I did look, I regret it.

egapele's picture


9 out of the 10 new posts that catch my attention always end up being from Bob-45.

Bob, you never disappoint!

Yet, you keep coming back, Velveeta.

Admit it, you love me.

I like you, I really do

But I do not like your threads. If you had your own web site devoted to kooky stuff I might occasionally stop in to say "hi", but quite honestly it is all so far removed from the focus of the DP it is annoying. I know all the arguments against me commenting on these particular threads, but I do feel like a counterbalance to unfettered, unquestioned goofball posts is needed. Nothing against you as a human being.

If he doesn't, I will.

I don't comment on your posts, but I really do enjoy reading them :-)

So, keep it up!

Btw, I agree, based upon current laws, this story is bogus, lol.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Thanks, ProudAmericanFirst.

I will admit it. I do not have the physics background to know whether or not this is bogus. I do, however, trust LiveScience.com to be a pretty reliable source; and, unlike, "Parson Velveeta", I do not crucify people who provide access to ideas outside of my comfort zone.

I might be looking at your

I might be looking at your posts the wrong way since you mentioned this, Bob. If you are curious about science, starting with more credible, less click-bait oriented stuff would probably serve you better. I wouldn't look to TMZ or the National Enquirer to learn about current events. Would you?

I see, Velveeta. Is this why you attacked my earlier post...

on the company that has developed a car that can easily convert from sports car to hatchback to truck?

BTW, the NATIONAL ENQUIRER reported Steve McQueen had cancer 14 months before the MSM got around to it. Not to mention, LiveScience.com and Gizmag.com are hardly the NATIONAL ENQUIRER.

Ask yourself

Ask yourself if what you feel like posting has any relevance whatsoever to the reason for this site, besides being something that confuses, amazes or amuses you. Some self-discipline during the story selection process might do wonders.

For example, if a scientific discovery or product that you stumble upon may have greater relevance to individual liberty or have economic or social ramifications, it could be fantastic candidate for posting here. Resisting the urge to post nonsense increases your credibility and worth to everyone who reads your threads. A person who enjoys confusion and absorbs bafflement cannot learn or grow.

Just my opinion.


Many things were born of accident, unintended, and the great inagination. One never knows.

'Theoretical' physics is called just that, for a reason :-)

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Bob-45 is ok. He brings this stuff in and we crush it.

That is no reflection on Bob but the media that takes money to publish this noise.

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On the downside, this "noise"

On the downside, this "noise" clutters the DP like so much detritus. I don't have to eat a dead rat to know it's not good for me.

some people can't recognize the rat when covered wtih science

She blinded me with science:

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But this story isn't science.

But this story isn't science.