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The Problem With Most Conspiracy Theories

The problem with most conspiracy theories is they make one very wrong assumption. This assumption goes against everything we know to be true. That assumption is: the Government is adept enough to do something sophisticated, coordinated, and secret.

Simply put, the Government is a collection of power-hungry bureaucrats each competing to get more power, wealth, or influence. They have competing interests and work against each other more than work together. While individuals may or may not be involved in things we deem 'conspiracy', the obvious reality is Governments are just not good at anything other than waste.

I am not advocating anything here other than those who support various conspiracy theories need to address this issue. Any conspiracy theory that involves a large amount of people, or sophisticated coordination seems logically implausible. People do not keep secrets, especially if many people are involved, and Governments are inept at doing the most basic tasks.

So, when discussing conspiracy theories, please address this issue. Without addressing it I believe there are serious logical holes in any assertion.

/EDIT
I would also love to see the issue of 'who' addressed more. When AJ was on Piers he was asked 'who' did 9/11. AJ either had no answer or decided not to give one. I think the movement would be best served trying to answer that. The mysterious 'government' or 'NWO' answer just doesn't work for most people. I am honestly asking, not being patronizing.

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The problem with most conspiracy theories is...

that MOST of them are proven to not be theories, but fact.
We have all been conditioned (since childhood) to always make the word association between "conspiracy" and the word "theory".
A conspiracy is simply 2 or more people, working in secret, at something nefarious. There PLENTY of that going around. As far as 9-11 goes, no normal person would believe the "official" story anymore as there is far, far too much evidence to the contrary. The theory part comes in when trying to point a finger at a real culprit. Because there is so much evidence (circumstantial or not) pointing in the directions of many, it is reasonable to assume many factions were complicit. CIA? Israel? Haliberton? Silverstein? Carlyle? Of course they're all in on it together!!! But, that's just a theory.

------------------
BC
Silence isn't always golden....sometimes it's yellow.

"The liberties of a people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." - Patrick Henry

There's a hole in the head (allegedly), but the body's missing

Obviously, the U.S. government is not adept enough to do something sophisticated, coordinated, and secret.

Only "Bin Laden" is.

Give my regards to Whitman, Price, and Haddad of SEAL Team Six (TM - DisneyCorp).

Cheers, from The Happiest Place on Earth

How do you think I feel?

It's almost 2014 and they still can't invent a shampoo bottle that you can open without cutting your thumb open?

And have you seen this show - Wheel of Fortune? They've got people buying vowels. $250 for a freakin' vowel while I'm buying my shampoo from the dollar store.

Speaking of wasting money - how about No Parking signs on the main drag in town where a car's going by every 4 seconds even at night. And the 'Pedestrians Walking' signs. Thanks - I was wondering what they were doing. It's called walking you say.

9-11 was a panda job.

And what about these comments that are up for 24 hours...

and don't get any upvotes even though they're very funny. Huh? What's up with that?

9-11 was a panda job.

The Who= The Israeli Mossad

The Who= The Israeli Mossad and the CIA.

There is no Left or Right -- there is only freedom or tyranny. Everything else is an illusion, an obfuscation to keep you confused and silent as the world burns around you." - Philip Brennan

"Invest only in things that you can stand in front of and pr

Like I said

there is little doubt the government stories are false. I still find it hard to believe anyone outside of the loop know for sure who is responsible. Do you have inside information or any real proof about your statement. I would like to hear the evidence with documentation proving your statement.

The way I see it is that the

The way I see it is that the government is not the director but instead actors in the play. Follow the money it does not end with the government but instead with the ones behind the lobbyists. There are the one running the show. The many corporations are the ones telling the government what to do. Look at the pyramid of power and you know that Obama is not on top of that pyramid. Heck the government is not even in charge of the money. We the people are the ones that can take control of this mess, but unfortunately many of us are trained to be told what to do and we just trot along as we are told.

It is better to look dumb and not be, than to look smart and not be.

Whatever you want to call it

the truth is the government's story on most tragedies are full of holes. We may find out someday what the real story is but it will be after all the people involved are dead. Any person who says they know how certain actions were carried out, without inside information, are kidding themselves. However, one has to be blind and deaf to believe the government's version is the truth!!!!

Only takes two to play, everyone else just does their job

The most powerful Conspiracy theory of all is the one that leads you to believe that conspiracies are based on theory. There are conspiracy facts alone That lead to the term "Conspiracy Theory" So by the act of questioning a fact that may lead to a Conspiracy, you automatically become a "Conspiracy theorist", this has been downloaded on to that Computer that we call a brain. Most people will automatically associate the word "Conspiracy" with the word "Theory" now isn't that quite convenient for the criminals in control?
Assuming that it would take too many people to execute a conspiracy of of any significance is just plain (with all due respect) Ignorant.
It only takes a few people with too much power to set the agenda by financing and dictating through Media, Pharma and Agra to control the people.
Do some research on "Compartmentalization" and think again.

buddy

Power market

A commercial marketplace is a collection of people often pitted against each other, all trying to gain for themselves first and foremost....But their self-interest coordinates their activities and advances the most efficient actors.

If you think of government power like this you might be able to see how the "government is stupid" argument is flawed. Government is stupid for solving problems for regular people. Government is brilliant for securing power for a small number of people over a very large number.

The profit sought in government is leverage...power over as many people as possible. Conspiracies in government are just as natural as cooperation, or at least professional courtesy, between competing businesses, or between business owners and employees--who are each trying to get the most out of the other with the least expense.

The self-interest of actors in a power marketplace is directed not at pleasing the general public--as in a commercial marketplace--but at gaining and keeping political power. When this self-interest is brought to bear a whole lot of efficiency can be achieved, and seemingly impossible challenges overcome....You just don't see it because you're looking for commercial-style efficiency and problem-solving.

That issue has been addressed

repeatedly.

Address the evidence.

Cyril's picture

Don't forget even normal people are on notice, though

Anyway... don't forget that besides conspiracy theorists, normal people themselves have been on notice for while, now :

http://www.dailypaul.com/282618/normal-people-now-on-notice

So, careful!

;)

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.

http://Laissez-Faire.Me/Liberty

"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

The problem with most citizens

is that they assume their government is either too incompetent or too benevolent for individuals within it to get together and do evil things, and that they further assume that if they did we would hear about it on the mainstream news.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Don't fool yourself. There

Don't fool yourself. There are two things that governments are "very" good at. Spying and destruction. This is for a very simple reason, because its what the people who choose to go into government are passionate about. Much like a private contractor builds very good houses because its what he's passionate about.

Government attracts psychopaths and criminals. Like Aynn Rand said (roughly); If you tear down the rule of law and a society becomes a contest, not of those who can produce the best, but rather those with the most ability to plunder, than what you are left with is a society of criminals where the murderer trumps the pickpocket.

In government, the pschopath and control freak rises to the top. Thats why they spy and destroy so very well.

I like when people say to me,

"Conspiracies don't happen! You're just crazy..."

What happened on 9/11?

A conspiracy.

Conspiracy 1:
I believe Israel conspired with US insiders (Cheney, etc...) and blamed muslims.

Conspiracy 2:
19 muslim hijackers conspired with OBL...

Either way... conspiracy

My Political Awakening: I Wanted to Change the World...
I am NOT Anti-America. America is Anti-Me - Lowkey
How to Handle POLICE STATE Encounters

Yep and in conspiracy

Yep and in conspiracy 1.Cheney's secretary may have had no idea yet she helped pull it off.

In conspiracy 2. the flight instructors had know idea they where part of the plan.

Compartmentalized .......

You sir

are correct

My Political Awakening: I Wanted to Change the World...
I am NOT Anti-America. America is Anti-Me - Lowkey
How to Handle POLICE STATE Encounters

One word for

One word for you

Compartmentalization

On a need to know bases..... Many in the plot don't even know they are part of the story.

How many people worked on the NSA software and had no idea until Snowden that they designed the software that spies on themselves?

Also, there are severe

Also, there are severe penalties for revealing the truth as evidenced by Mr. Snowden and others.

"The United States can pay any debt it has because we can always print money to do that." — Alan Greenspan

Tired, ineffective, and played-out assertion. Sorry.

Yes, it is obvious that many in government are self-serving and purely self-interested, and this is increasingly becoming apparent: "Governments are just not good at anything other than waste". I hear ya, brother! (Waste itself can also be deliberately employed, but that's another topic.)

It is also true that in our monstrously gargantuan government one hand often doesn't know what the other is doing (to whip that cliche to death); however, it is surprising how one or some compartments of government can affect leverage over others--especially in a national security state (and thus military-industrial-complex-ruled) paradigm. It doesn't take much anymore for a few to generally hoodwink the many.

(Look up documented events like the Gulf of Tonkin Incident, etc.)

Also, "They have competing interests and work against each other more than work together [sic]." Perhaps. If you *believe* the right (Republican) versus left (Democrat) theater taking place is truly representative of the goals of those respective camps (and assume they by extension actually represent their constituents and their interests), then I can understand how you would state this as presumably indisputable fact. However, look at the sorts of things which--despite even where vociferous public arguments are made by one side against the other--come inescapably and unavoidably to fruition: wars; bank and corporate bailouts; grossly voluminous foreign aid; the ever-increasing immunity of government officials from the very laws they impose upon the citizenry; presidential executive orders antithetical to the Constitution; and the continuous assault on / removal of our personal liberties and freedoms under the guise of our "security" from shadowy foes (never mind the push for open borders since before Reagan's time). Representatives and administrations on both sides of the "aisle" have steered us steadily toward many outcomes which have been no less than absolutely hazardous to We the People.

Call it conspiracy theory if you like, but the reality / results can be plainly seen. I've been saying for some years now that yesterday's conspiracy "theory" is today's reality.

But on we go....

"That assumption is: the Government is adept enough to do something sophisticated, coordinated, and secret."

Yeah... like the Manhattan Project? (Look it up.)

Also the recent far-reaching NSA surveillance which has been exposed?

Nothing personal, but please do at least the *basic* homework next time before you try to resuscitate this feeble line of argument.

What would the Founders do?

Cyril's picture

Don't know about "most" but the problem I have w/ the "biggest"

Don't know about "most", but the problem I have with the "biggest" conspiracy (once-) theories is that they have the rather HORRENDOUS habit of...

... turning out to be true !

Quite irritating after a while and past a certain scale, if one asks me.

More specifically...

By now, I really can't see where is the "theory" after looking at some blindingly UNCONTROVERSIAL FACTS that don't quite suggest genuinely good intents, in my book anyway :

'Think you have real money on your bank account? Think again...

Bank Fraud in Ten Minutes... a 100+ year long story... ongoing :

http://www.dailypaul.com/275696/bank-fraud-in-ten-minutes

What's up in public schools these days?

Indoctrination in Common Core ELA Texts :

http://www.dailypaul.com/299607/indoctrination-in-common-cor...

'Think there are no discussions about legitimizing global Internet surveillance and censorship and implementing it thanks to corporate giants? Think again...

The CFR on "defending" an open, global, "secure", resilient Internet :

http://www.dailypaul.com/296263/council-on-foreign-relations...

(strange conception and modus operandi they have about "defense"! govt. + big corporate banding together and announcing it... er... a lil bit of taste of "fascism" in the mouth... anyone?)

And isn't that their own paper, and not the one of some kook isolating himself in his basement?

...

"Conspiracy Theories"?

Right.

Where the heck is the "theoretical" left to be speculated about, there? I'm interested.

Related : Yuri Bezmenov on distortion of perception of REALITY :

"Deception was my JOB" :

http://www.dailypaul.com/294984/g-edward-griffin-interviews-...

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.

http://Laissez-Faire.Me/Liberty

"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

Great posts from many DPers on this thread!

Yuri Bezmenov is the man.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

It's all or nothing?

According to your logic, there has never been a conspiracy. So why do we even have the word? Are conspiracies like unicorns, a fantasy invented to entertain us?

Or could it be, perhaps, that some conspiracies are true, and others are fantasies?

“With laws shall our land be built up, but with lawlessness laid waste.”
-Njal Thorgeirsson

Unicorns

Aren't real?

;)

Ron Paul convert from the Heart of Dixie

There is a conspiracy.

And it is this.

The super wealthy have corrupted the worlds governments and monetary system. Those very same governments have worked to create a critical mass of deadbeat moochers to vote themselves entitlements and become dependent on the government, and by extension, their masters. This in turn neutralizes and impoverishes the free people, who become deadbeat ignoramuses, etc. etc.

Meanwhile, the educational system, from top to bottom, is used to brainwash us all and make us incapable of critical thought (See the brain dead journalism of our time).

Of course, there are off shoots to this central theme. Global warming is the ultimate justification for central authority and taxation. "Terror" is a grand justification for domestic spying and war.

It is all about eliminating true freedom and economic competition. Many on here have greater knowledge and understanding than me. But it is a big mistake to think that the mainstream version of reality is correct.

You will know the conspiracy is at an end when you see public hangings on the Mall in Washington D.C., Harvard Square, Wall Street, Hollywood, etc. Of course, as the NSA knows, I am against public hanging. But it will be a sign.

Until then, it is ongoing.

Are mass shootings organized to push for gun confiscation? Not sure. It is a big country. There are bound to be such acts. But most certainly, the mechanisms are in place to take advantage of any and all occurrences, both those contrives and those not. The objective is to control the effect.

I think the more outlandish sounding conspiracy theories are what you refer to. Probably some are true. Some are not. But you have to remember that most of the mid-level operatives in these deals are just brainwashed sheeple people. Even Obama realizes that he is just playing his role, and cannot stray too far from the reservation.

Also please note the killing the Insurance Industry is making over Obamcare. Remember that the big insurance players were for it. It is counter intuitive, isn't is? For years the left has been lambasting the Insurance Companies. Now that their time has finally come, the Insurance Companies are making out like bandits.

Always look for the nexus between Government and Business. There is where you will find the true conspiracies, and perhaps the roots of the seemingly implausible ones.

Where I have a bone to pick with the conspiracists is their tendency to wrap everything up in a neat package, and vilify everyone outside of the small piece of the world which they feel they understand. The Ron Paul movement is ripe with these people. It is understandable, since Paul has been out there telling the truth for 50 years (which is why I am here). But the tendency is to see any new or unfamiliar voice as"part of the conspiracy" or "part of the establishment", even when all evidence suggest otherwise. It is this intellectual laziness that bothers me. And what further bothers me is that many of these people see our belief in "conspiracies" as the unifying force behind this "movement", when ideology should be at the forefront.

"The problem with most

"The problem with most conspiracy theories is they make one very wrong assumption. This assumption goes against everything we know to be true. That assumption is: the Government is adept enough to do something sophisticated, coordinated, and secret."

The Manhattan Project

"Simply put, the Government is a collection of power-hungry bureaucrats each competing to get more power, wealth, or influence. They have competing interests and work against each other more than work together."

""You don't need a formal conspiracy when interests converge. The owners of this country went to the same universities and fraternities, they're on the same boards of directors, they belong to the same country clubs, they have like interests, they don't need to call a meeting because they know what is good for them...and they are getting it. There used to be seven oil companies, there are now three...it will soon be two. The things that matter in this country have been reduced in choice, there are two political parties, there are a handful of insurance companies, there are six or seven information centers...but if you want a bagel there are 23 flavors because you have the illusion of choice. You don't get the real important choices, you have no freedom of choice." — George Carlin

"I am not advocating anything here other than those who support various conspiracy theories need to address this issue. Any conspiracy theory that involves a large amount of people, or sophisticated coordination seems logically implausible. People do not keep secrets, especially if many people are involved, and Governments are inept at doing the most basic tasks. "

See the above.

"I would also love to see the issue of 'who' addressed more. When AJ was on Piers he was asked 'who' did 9/11. AJ either had no answer or decided not to give one. I think the movement would be best served trying to answer that. The mysterious 'government' or 'NWO' answer just doesn't work for most people. I am honestly asking, not being patronizing."

Because the question is not a simple one that can be answered and explained in a 30 second sound bite.
The simple answer is that those in power are responsible. Who is that, you ask? The same people that have robbed us of our wealth, lied us into an unending series of wars, deprived us of our basic rights, and would deprive us of our property and our lives were it not for the fact that they cannot disarm us. ...yet.

"The United States can pay any debt it has because we can always print money to do that." — Alan Greenspan

This post and the fact it was neg 30

Tells that this site has been overrun by junior conspiracy kooks.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Do you believe in conspiracy theories?

Conspiracy [kuhn-spir-uh-see]
noun, plural con·spir·a·cies.

1. the act of conspiring.

2. an evil, unlawful, treacherous, or surreptitious plan formulated in secret by two or more persons; plot.

3. a combination of persons for a secret, unlawful, or evil purpose: He joined the conspiracy to overthrow the government.

4. Law. an agreement by two or more persons to commit a crime, fraud, or other wrongful act.

5. any concurrence in action; combination in bringing about a given result.

Now, can you please explain the official theory of what happened on 9/11?

Did the theory involve a conspiracy (plot) to attack the United States by any chance?

Did it go something like this?


http://youtu.be/yuC_4mGTs98

Transcript and sources: http://www.corbettreport.com/?p=2594

Can you run that "junior conspiracy kooks" theory by me one more time please, because I just don't get it?

How bout none of the above

I can't say that I buy anyone's theory on 9-11.

I do believe in the concept of massive govt incompetence.

I also believe there are some really creepy things that happened on 9-11.

I don't have the time or expertise or information to figure it all out.

I rather suspect you don't either. What's irritating about the 9-11 truthers is that they have their pet version, which often involves them playing expert in areas where they aren't, and that anyone who doesn't agree with their pet theory is some kind of member of the evil enemy, whoever they define that to be.

As one poster said, that kind of attitude has its roots in wanting to feel superior, being a "special snowflake" more than in any quest for truth. It turns people off. And it has nothing to do with whether one is or isn't a libertarian.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Expertise...

Expertise is gained by taking the time to look into the information.

If you haven't even taken the time to look at the information, and you know little about the details surrounding the terrible criminal event that happened on 9/11, why would you waste your valuable time to post a comment lambasting people who do take the time to look at the details?

Personally I don't have a pet theory, I do however know that many of the families of the victims - who died in that planned attack - are not satisfied with the outcome of the (underfunded, stacked deck) inquiry they had to fight for tooth and nail to even get in the first place.

Those families (kooks in your admittedly uneducated and uninterested opinion) are still fighting to be heard.

But before you waste your valuable time replying to this comment, may I suggest that you use that time to listen to what the 9/11 widows and orphans have to say about it.

But of course, if your time is too valuable to do so, I would suggest that you no longer waste it berating those who do go out of their way and make the time to listen to them.

Because your time is limited, I have time linked the video below to directly to the victims families first statements to save you watching the first few minutes.


http://youtu.be/uho8D-m9vSk#t=2m57s