10 votes


I'm putting this here for all of you guys questioning lawyers or future lawyers. Stop putting us all in one group as if we are all greedy, power hungry, assholes. We are not. Some of us actually care about our brothers. I'm posting this link on my persona website. Yes, that's my real name. I don't care. That is me. I will be a lawyer in 5 months. Read this and tell me I am a greedy, non-caring bastard. I got an A on this paper by the way.


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I take it in July

good luck to you sir

for liberty.

A true flower can not blossom without sunlight and a true man can not live without love.

The truth is that the

The truth is that the brutalization effect of law school and the profession as well as a selection bias of those that want to become lawyers does make lawyers a below-average group of people when it comes to argumentativeness, money and status obsessions and out of control egos.

Ventura 2012

Don't join the BAR

You don't need a "license to practice law" in fact there is NO SUCH THING... it's a certificate granted by a PRIVATE COMPANY.

The BAR is running a CLOSED UNION SHOP and are not allowed to properly defend their clients or they will be DISBARRED!

Where does it say in the constitution that you cannot have your trusted friend defend you in an action in court? Where does it say that you are REQUIRED to have a BAR member you've never even met before? Isn't that similar to being on an auction block while your OWNER negotiates your PRICE with the PLANTATION MASTER? How can a BAR member possibly have your best interests in mind if they've never met you before seeing you in a cage?


Another thing... please do not confuse "Lawyers" with "Attorneys." Lawyers study law and do not "practice" it. Attorneys study ACTING and PROCEDURES on how to SCREW OVER their FELLOW MAN.


My take on the death penalty

The legal system should be all about restoring the inequality created by a person's actions. If you focus on restoring the inequality, you find that you can avoid cruel and unusual punishment simply by restoring inequality and going no further than that. The question is, when a person murders someone, how do you restore that inequality?

My belief is how you leave others is how you should be found. If you follow the golden rule about "do unto others as you would have them do unto you", is it not reasonable then that when a person commits murder, they commit a murder upon themselves? Ultimately, the issue comes down to what society believes is justifiable as a level of punishment for criminals. Some people have a real blood-lust towards criminals while others are more compassionate. The law shouldn't look at what society deems reasonable but should look at what restores the balance caused by one's actions.


I disagree, by this way of

I disagree, by this way of thinking would it still apply if it was in defense, or is the defense the equalization? Also how do you figure government is capable of deciding on capital punishment?

Mr. President, it is natural to man to indulge in the illusions of hope. We are apt to shut our eyes against a painful truth, and listen to the song of that siren till she transforms us into beasts.
-Patrick Henry

Justifiable homicide is

Justifiable homicide is justified.

Government is not capable of deciding how much justice is needed to restore the imbalance. However, whatever the correct amount is, it needs to be just a little out of favor of the criminal. Otherwise, there wouldn't be enough deterrent force to prevent some people who would run afoul of the law simply because the punishment is too weak.


Whether a lawyer does good or ill...

...depends on the nature of the law. Lawyers aren't good or bad per se.

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

You have my 100% approval

One by one your detractors will show up at your office, hat in hand, begging for representation.

Most of those who think so actually don't and most of those who think sew actually rip.

If I could turn this around

"The court has yet to explain how putting someone to death helps protect society more than a life sentence would." Page 20

You have yet to explain how locking a man in a cage for the rest of his life without the possibility of parole is less vindictive and more reformative than putting that man to death.

Also, the data that you use to argue that the death penalty is not a greater deterrent to murder is insufficient. That data does however indicate that the death penalty as it is carried out at the moment in several states is not always a greater deterrent than life in prison.

I am just thinking out loud here. I appreciate the time you have given to this issue.

That was not something that I

That was not something that I missed unintentionally. There has been much said about whether it is more or less vindictive to leave a person locked up as opposed to killing them. That is a topic that is long and complex and cannot every really be resolved as it in the end relies on opinion only. Would a person rather die than be locked up? Well that depends on the person. That is why I left that entire topic out of the paper. The paper is more about state sanctioned murder. We could get into all kinds of different avenues with what you mentioned and I agree that it is a valid argument. But you just have to take it as it is. It would take me much longer than a semester to get into those kinds of arguments.


I enjoyed reading your paper. I never thought about the death penalty being vinication or even handed justice to protect society. My own thoughts about it were much more emotional, fear based.. as it just seemed to me, that the commandment, Thou Shall Not Murder or kill (Depends which Bible you read) was not eliminated by collectivism.

Maybe you should consider changing your handle to Atticus Finch?

CONGRATULATIONS on the A paper. and I wish you much success in your future at the bar.


As a lawyer that is the son of a lawyer, I'll share the advice I was given.

Choose a new law or area of law and make it your own. Be the first one to take it on and let others lawyers know you have done so.

You made me think

If I was to become an attorney, I would enlist in the Navy because my Navy contract would provide me the honor of being an officer, getting benefits for life and retirement by the time I turned 40, I would have enough security, experience and connections to do well whereever I went or whatever area I enjoyed.. go into an area of law you enjoy and never stop reading everything you can about it is what F. Lee Bailey told me when I interviewed him back in the 80s. I always thought he became a dangerous man when he did "Paul is Dead".

Good Work

Glad to hear there are some good guys in the business.

It made me wonder if the purpose of law is to generate income for those in power.

The cost benefit of the death penalty is one that needs to be explored.

The same goes with other laws. What part of protecting a society is a 200 dollar fine for some insignificant traffic violation. Or throwing someone in jail, fine for marijuana?

Cost benefit was something I

Cost benefit was something I was considering putting in my paper. It costs way more to kill someone than to put them in prison for life. I purposely left that out. My paper is about the constitutionality of the death penalty so I really could not make any monetary arguments... even though you are 100% correct.

Guys I'm proud of this paper

Give me some up votes if you agree with my paper. I mean, hell. You never know what will become of it. If I had my choice it would halt the death penalty in Indiana. Unfortunately, I have have very little say in that matter. But perhaps if we can get this out we can save some lives. The state should never have the authority to take a life, especially in Indiana. If you read the paper you will see how the state of Indiana cannot take a like without violating the constitution.

I'll glance later.

Next time fishyculture goes by check out her link to Carl Miller prose legal operative. He lives to protect his rights.

He never took the bar exam nor attended Law School. It is unconstitutional to convert a right into a privilege then legislate rules of use. He provides Case Law examples that make his case.

Free includes debt-free!

YeahI get what those guys are

YeahI get what those guys are saying but you really can't fight them. They'll just keep you locked up. It's better to just know and or change the law.

Yup, he has been in jail, he says. It's a price he pays.

If a right is violated, they have to listen or risk committing treason. Marbury v Madison 1803.

If a Oathtaker fails to report Treason to a governor or judge in a timely fashion they are guilty of Misprision of Treason.

You are not alone, though it may seem like it some time. Tyranny can be fought. Easier today than tomorrow the way things are going. IMO.

Free includes debt-free!

man, if i had a few "friends"

man, if i had a few "friends" or you know..... perhaps we'd go make a change or something. I mean it will take more than myself and I am busy with school. I bought my weapon. I am ready. No one is going to come in this house without a 7.62 round in their ass. I can only wait. First of all, I am no where near my home state and second I am trying to just finish school. If shit goes down, you bet I'll be there. No worries man. Hence the reason I just bought weapons.

Finish school, first things first.

How many veterans have taken the Oath? You may not be that alone.

Free includes debt-free!

Main thing is, I have to just

Main thing is, I have to just chill and shit and not make any waves because I expect to get my law license. I have no problem with a real revolution if it is to uphold the constitution . But who knows what if that will happen and if not what will the bar say? You see? I'm in quandary. I'll fight with all my heart and just by saying this perhaps they'll reject me. I dunno.

You don't need to testify against yourself.

So lay low, and lay your plans. People tend to think that actions speak louder than words.

Politicians use words since they don;t intend to act.

That's fine because the only authority they have is to protect our rights.

Free includes debt-free!

Word, I now I'm not alone....

Word, I now I'm not alone.... and I know we are all ready. But you know, it's not easy to find that "shor heard 'round the world" I'm not gonna start anything of course and probably no one else will either. We just have to wait for them to make the first move.

Sorry Haysoose

I did make a lawyer jab yesterday. It was a correct jab to the attorneys that represented most of the people I know. They got ripped off. But, of course, not all lawyers are like this. I do have a friend that was helped immensely.

Your paper is great. I will finish it later. I wish you lived in my neck of the woods.

Good Luck!

Well I really appreciate your

Well I really appreciate your kind words. Hey, it's all about justice. It's all about law. If our courts can't even follow our most basic laws then how can we rely on them?

Good luck.

It has been my experience that law school changes a person's core values, and they become insensitive to human suffering. I hope you are an exception.

Love or fear? Choose again with every breath.

my experience too lol

my experience too lol

Ventura 2012

Eh, this is my 3rd year. I

Eh, this is my 3rd year. I have one semester left. I just went and bought an SKS and I will fight for our constitution so whatever. Look, I spent 5 years in the national guard infantry through college. I spent 5 years as a linguist in the navy. I have been around. I have heard arguments from this side and arguments from that side. I had no weapons until 2 days ago. I found a very nice SKS (chinese) for a decent price and gobbled it up. Took it to the range yesterday morning, OMG it shoots like a dream. I have a bagillion rounds on the way and I'm totally stoked.

My core values? Nah. Those won't change bro. I went to law school to help protect my core values. Don't mistake me for those money hungry shit heads.

You hang on

You've got a battle on your hands - glad to know you're out there.

Love or fear? Choose again with every breath.