65 votes

Resident Troll or Quality Control?

I cherish the DailyPaul as a place I can go to feel somewhat normal in a world where I constantly feel like an outsider due to my political an philisophical beliefs. However, as we get further from the election and there is much less "pro-Ron" talk, and much more conspiracy talk, my posts and my ideas have recieved a far more negative response than when I was simply singing the praise of Ron Paul to the Ron Paul choir.

If I disagree with a post about a conspiracy, I am labeled a troll, even when I am on topic, not inflammatory, and simply don't agree with the points of logic in the post. I'm constantly accused of being a neo-con who is just trying to subvert the movement, simply because I don't believe many of the conspiracies which are commonplace here.

It seems as though we are to the point here where if you disagree with anything, you are the enemy. I've posted, blogged, and commented on free market capitalism in the past, to a very positive response. This is fitting because like most of you, I assume I have a firm grasp on capitalism and liberty and thus, I supported Ron Paul and still support this movement. However, the conspiracies, whether they are true or not, do not in themselves diminish my view on liberty and free markets any more than they would diminish yours if you were mistaken about them.

I am not a troll because I don't believe a conspiracy. I'm not a neocon because I want more proof. I am simply a free market capitalist with a high standard for truth. You all have a high standard for truth from your government, which is rarely met. Doesn't it make sense to demand a higher standard when debating a conspiracy as well?

I cherish the Daily Paul and I apologize to anyone who thinks I've been a troll. In all honesty, my goal is simply to maintain a high standard of reason and logic, and not let emotion and speculation rather than truth, dominate our dialogue.

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There is no santa clause. There is no easter bunny.

...and there is no boogeyman.

jrd3820's picture

But there are aliens

.

deacon's picture

where?

utube or it didn't happen :)
deacon

If we deny truth before your very eyes,then the rest of what we have to say,is of little consequence

jrd3820's picture

Right here man!

deacon's picture

cool

that was something i never saw before
deacon

If we deny truth before your very eyes,then the rest of what we have to say,is of little consequence

jrd3820's picture

Deacon, I forgot to tell you about this!

I remember you said you are on the southeast side of MI.

Check this out.

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/viewnews.php?id=241248

Keep your eyes on the skies my friend, eyes on the skies.

deacon's picture

thanks for that

i am close to DT,maybe a half hour away
deacon

If we deny truth before your very eyes,then the rest of what we have to say,is of little consequence

lol if you're active in the

lol if you're active in the RP scene, we may know eachother.

I am a big Ron Paul fan

I do not believe in the 9/11 truther stuff, or the Sandy Hook conspiracy stuff. I don't run people down if they believe those things. I do feel if I say I don't believe I am beaten down by those who do, though, and that sucks. We're not the freakin' Borg here, I'm not walking in lockstep with anyone.

Was at a party over Christmas

Was at a party over Christmas with a family friend who was a lifelong Libertarian. Politics came up, he voted Gary Johnson, but said he couldn't support Ron Paul anymore because he had associated with too many "crazies."

I can't agree, but I think he speaks for a lot of Americans who are wary of third party politics in general, and this is an image to be careful of. I don't believe most of the theories on here, but I keep coming back even after the election because this community is tuned into events in a way that none of the media are paying attention. Empirically, this is just as good a news site as any other.

A word of caution for the DP: A theory is just that, a possibility to be investigated. If you instinctively believe every anti-establishment message you are just as blind as the MSM. Remember that we are here because we believe in freedom, and thus you trust the natural goodness of man. Be careful how many you are demonizing when these are the same people you would trust with the second amendment, and the country in general. Otherwise, Nystrom said it best. Great post.

Tell your friend

1) Liberty is popular. Even kooks like it.
2) Trolls happen.

Ĵīɣȩ Ɖåđşŏń

"Fully half the quotations found on the internet are either mis-attributed, or outright fabrications." - Abraham Lincoln

I'm Trying to Figure out Why a 2nd Amendment EVENT isn't HERE!

Hey, I sympathize SP. So quit your Whining. :)

---

But I have my own grievance - so move over. (Let me whine)

Guns Across America EVENT!

http://www.dailypaul.com/270130/guns-across-america-rally-ja...

This should be on the DAILY PAUL FRONT PAGE!

What is more important - Guns or Whine?

DP - Help all these Event Organizers Out!

Look!

National Web Page: http://www.facebook.com/events/144639815690301

Only One Day Left to get the word out!

RichardTaylorAPP - Chair - American Patriot Party.CC

John Locke #201, 202, 212 to 232; Virginia and Kentucky Resolutions 1798; Virginia Ratifying Convention 6-16-1788; Rights of the Colonists 1772.

My opinion exactly

You know, i'm not an american citizen, but i'm VERY concerned about all of the stuff since i learned of Ron Paul, you know the economy, community, family, philosophy, free markets, minds, and speech, anarcho-capitalism etc, all the good stuff i didn't know before. You know, few people actually know about Ron Paul, Austrian Economics, and Liberty where i currently live, so it's kinda hard. And those who know, ignore and distort this intentionally and they know exactly why.
I share those sentiments concerning all the conspiracy controversies.

To make it brief, here are my opinions:

  • There should be no taboos in any discussion AT ALL.
  • Priority should be to not get ourselves divided/distracted/whatever on Liberty by anything
  • Political power for fee people should come out of a healthy discussion
  • You do NOT win over people by just playing along
  • You also HARDLY win over people by aggression, overwhelming them and an "in-your-face" attitude

That's at least the impression i got here in Europe. But maybe we're just not as tough...oh but wait half the US aren't tough anymore either because of all the ignorance, right?
--> WIN THEM OVER WITH LOVE and UNDERSTANDING, with GENTLENESS, the world needs you to act humble NOW.

Thank you my friends,
in liberty, Paul
Peace =)

p.s. by the way i believe 9/11 was most likely an inside job, as was most likely the Sandy Hook shooting. I'm not sure about Aurora. And yes i can write that in Austria and not have the police coming after me ;)

Consider this

We can safely assume that the same CIA/FBI that co-opted Tea Party is trying to penetrate Libertarian Party, RP Libertarian movement and DP.

I suggest to review Operation Gladio (as Alex Jones suggested: Wikipedia - Operation Gladio) and see how CIA had hired former Nazi and anti-Semites in Europe for the subversion. I wont be supprised that CIA is using populists and anti-Semites to divert our attention to sideline scapegoats or esoteric conspiracy.

if someone calls you a troll

then just call them a troll back. wth

Snake!

You are just trying to spread a conspiracy! Troll! ;) good post buddy, though I believe in a lot of the conspiracies, I think moderation is the best solution. I up voted you. :)

Sorry, Don't Buy It. Still upvoted you for discussion though.

Back in the 60s the joint chiefs published a report on what they could do to instigate a war with Cuba. It was a laundry list of false flags. Excerpted below.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Northwoods

And don't start with me about wikipedia not being a good source as this subject is well referenced at the bottom of the article all of which sources are independently verifiable.

If they were floating and/or doing these things back in the 60s when we had actual national enemies and our society was much more innocent, I can only imagine what they are doing today and it aint pretty.

Again, this is no conspiracy "theory", this is flat out well documented and evidenced CONSPIRACY straight from the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

=====

A series of well coordinated incidents will be planned to take place in and around Guantanamo to give genuine appearance of being done by hostile Cuban forces.
a. Incidents to establish a credible attack (not in chronological order):
1.Start rumors (many). Use clandestine radio.
2.Land friendly Cubans in uniform "over-the-fence" to stage attack on base.
3.Capture Cuban (friendly) saboteurs inside the base.
4.Start riots near the base main gate (friendly Cubans).[13]
5.Blow up ammunition inside the base; start fires.
6.Burn aircraft on air base (sabotage).
7.Lob mortar shells from outside of base into base. Some damage to installations.
8.Capture assault teams approaching from the sea or vicinity of Guantanamo City.
9.Capture militia group which storms the base.
10.Sabotage ship in harbor; large fires—naphthalene.
11.Sink ship near harbor entrance. Conduct funerals for mock-victims (may be in lieu of (10)).
b. United States would respond by executing offensive operations to secure water and power supplies, destroying artillery and mortar emplacements which threaten the base.
c. Commence large scale United States military operations.
3.A "Remember the Maine" incident could be arranged in several forms:
a. We could blow up a U.S. ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba.
b. We could blow up a drone (unmanned) vessel anywhere in the Cuban waters.
6.Use of MIG type aircraft by U.S. pilots could provide additional provocation. Harassment of civil air, attacks on surface shipping and destruction of U.S. military drone aircraft by MIG type planes would be useful as complementary actions. An F-86 properly painted would convince air passengers that they saw a Cuban MIG, especially if the pilot of the transport were to announce such fact. The primary drawback to this suggestion appears to be the security risk inherent in obtaining or modifying an aircraft. However, reasonable copies of the MIG could be produced from U.S. resources in about three months.[15]
7.Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft should appear to continue as harassing measures condoned by the government of Cuba. Concurrently, genuine defections of Cuban civil and military air and surface craft should be encouraged.
8.It is possible to create an incident which will demonstrate convincingly that a Cuban aircraft has attacked and shot down a chartered civil airliner en route from the United States to Jamaica, Guatemala, Panama, or Venezuela.

Can someone explain to me the downvotes on my reply above?

My reply above is documented fact from a report directly from the Joint Chiefs of Staff word for word, including their suggestion of shooting down an american airliner on its way to south america by a Mig flown by an American pilot.

So, now we are voting down documented historical fact?

Explain that one to me.

I upvoted you to even the

I upvoted you to even the score :)

Michael Nystrom's picture

Hear hear!

Thank you for the post, for saying what needed to be said, and for stating what should be the obvious.

This is the other side, the price, of liberty and freedom. Everyone's not only got an opinion, they have an ego as well. Rationality breaks down into emotionalism. Fingers get pointed for personal reasons. The same thing happens in Congress.

We were all united here during the election. That was no accident. The mods and I were quite aggressive about banning the anti-Ron Paul trolls. In that sense, they truly were 'trolls.' We had a mission here, to support Dr. Paul in his bid for the presidency. There was censorship here. It was a one-sided conversation.

Now that the election is behind us, the DP is going though some growing pains. I know all the conspiracy talk has driven a lot of people away. I have wondered what to do about it. Mainly, I've done nothing. For me to "censor" such talk at this point would only draw the angry finger of ire onto me, and I would suddenly become "part of the cover up."

I think the problems we face here are similar to the problems that the Congress, and the country as a whole are facing. Namely: Everyone wants freedom, but other peoples' freedom is annoying. LOL! But not only is it annoying, it is dangerous.

Guns are dangerous! They kill people! Ban them! Gay marriage is dangerous! It threatens the fabric of a decent society! Ban it! Talking about conspiracies is dangerous! It is bad for the Liberty Movement! Ban it!

So - what can you do? On the Daily Paul, at the very least, I continue to ban those who are completely out of line, the antagonistic ones with the bad manners. But what can we do for the congress, and the country as a whole?

One of two things should happen, imo:

1) Break the country up; it is too big.
2) Break up the Federal government; it is too big.

Since #2 is unlikely, I have a feeling we're headed towards #1.

Anyway snakepit, thank you for the post.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.

Keep on doing what you are

Keep on doing what you are doing! It works or we might as well go over to red state or daily kos and get banned for anything and everything. I'm drawn to the place because of the free exchange of ideas...if you want to get rid of me start censoring things to a narrow dialog. Thanks for this wonderful site...keep up the great work!

Question for Nystrom

This is YOUR blog. I remember during the election someone asked you why you ban people if you believed in the free market, and your response was that you DO believe in the free market and that if someone didn't like the way you were doing things they could simply go somewhere else or make their own dailypaul. This was a great answer. So why stop now just because the election is over? This was never about just an election anyway, this is a movement. A movement that is being hurt by all this conspiracy talk.

I understand if you don't want to ban people, but for the love of God, DOES IT HAVE TO BE ON THE FRONT PAGE??

Michael Nystrom's picture

What part is it that you're concerned about

DOES IT HAVE TO BE ON THE FRONT PAGE??

What 'it' are you talking about? This post?

Again, there are disagreements as to whether "conspiracy talk" hurts the "movement" or not.

My belief is that in a free society, you can talk about whatever you like.

There are definitely seasons on the DP. We had a Gary Johnson season; that was no fun. Currently we're going through a Sandy Hook season. For lots of people (including me), it isn't much fun.

But I don't think there is anything wrong with this particular post. The Jesse Ventura post is there to hopefully chill some people out a little, not to encourage them. So again, I'm not sure which "IT" you're referring to.

Thanks.

To be mean is never excusable, but there is some merit in knowing that one is; the most irreparable of vices is to do evil out of stupidity. - C.B.

No, not this post.

It = conspiracy posts.

If you believe allowing all the Alex Jones type stuff to be highlighted front and center on the dailyPAUL helps the movement, then there's nothing more to say. But, if you believe as I do that they keep people away and allow the media to discredit everything this movement is about by lumping us all together, then I was merely asking if you could do something about it. Namely, at the very least keep it off of the front page. Thanks.

Scary to hear...

I hadn't spent much time thinking about those two options, but as you wrote them and I read them, they seem more real, more scary, but as I reflect, more necessary.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

Recommendation

When it comes to conspiracy, I suggest you do what I did. Read the ENTIRE house and senate subcommittee hearing transcripts on Iran Contra affair along with all criminal case files and evidence used to convict the people who were later pardoned by Bush 1. Once you are freaked out by the all out criminal exposure of the key neocons involved then track back each one of the histories all the way through their family trees back at least 200 years and then look at every single company they own or have been/are involved with and who they were surrounded by in those companies. Then once you find out it leads to the Bush family and Carlyle group look at the founding members and the banks they own in China. Once you then realize that they are using drug money to build these corporate empires then take the UN estimated dollar amount for worldwide drug trade and stick that number into a money multiplier calculation and see how much loans these people can generate from the drug trade and you will realize it is more than the entire worldwide GDP.

By the way. Before you start your research learn of the official rules for federal investigation used by the FBI.Secret Service and all federal investigators and apply those techniques to everything you study. After you study all of this then you will be able to get started with seeing how to find the truth. Do you have the will to do this? If not then you will never get to the real truth. My father was a US federal investigator who taught me the federal investigative rules when I was a kid later after I studied all the above things and much much more I then began to warn my dad of the real scenario unfolding before us. At first he just said BS. By the end of his career after he finally investigated some of the issuesI presented to him he finally told me that I was right about everything. Now he thinks the US Constitution is dead and we are totally screwed. He will not even talk about these things AT ALL because he believes they will kill him. It is real. But don't take my word for it. You want real truth then dig in. See you in ten years after the entire house has burned to the ground and the camps have exterminated millions of people and America is nothing but a relic that has burned to the ground by the psychopaths who set up the great culling by making America the largest tyrannical force of murder and death in the world/

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

I've checked out all the bs

I've checked out all the bs crap and bought into a little of it at times... but for some reason, this is the first thing I've ever seen which makes me really curious... mostly because the Bush family makes me curious. I mean, a Hitler funding, CIA running, Carlyle group owning, two president family is strange.

ya know what Snake?

I propose we "keep it real", and keep it grass roots!

Yeah, I got miffed for being downvoted, and especially so when Nystrom shut down my thread...but....I am not leaving the DP because it is my version of the Drudge Report.

I am "in it to win it", and this whole 2012 election season was unbelievably exciting...we were all a media force to be reckoned with; but now, Ron Paul's Presidential bid is over, and the talking heads are at it again trying to shape and mold and steer emotions and public opinion....well...I say we show them who we are, show no fear, and take it to them until we get what we are demanding!!!

My gig, as a bible-thumping pro-Ron Paul guy, is what it is...and...I am simply not going to remain anonymous as just some keyboard warrior....for a time, I am going to keep checking in on the headlines and hot topics of the DP, and, I am gonna make little YouTube commentaries...as well as post links to creationist Kent Hovind's materials which steer people the Ron Paul philosophical way, as well as sermons that expose the hypocrisy and compromise of ecumenical evangelicalism.

We have to keep the fire lit, but also let the media hounds know WHO made them, at the same time, hold their feet to the fire...that if they are for the rise/restoration/reclamation of this once great Republic, and they want us to succeed in tearing from power and place ALL who thrive by the public wrong; then they're gonna need ground forces, not only high tech media and a few talking heads who can whip up fruitless emotions and false fire!

So, here's my shameful promotion of my scatter-brained thoughts today....demanding that Alex Jones be kept honest, and he helps us to do it Ron Paul's way....via the ballot box....and more often than not,the vehicle of the Republican Party where we must!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XM7vB3ktUI

Smells like a troll and a

Smells like a troll and a neocon to me....

LMAO!

But you are right... If you even question or say anything bad about someone like Alex Jones you get voted down, as if how dare you..

If you disagree with me on anything you are not a real libertarian...

+1 I have seen legitimate

+1 I have seen legitimate posts get voted down and personally attacked simply because they are critical of Alex Jones or agree with Jack Hunter.