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Turn out the lights, the party's over...

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What are you even talking about

They have no need to be the reserve currency, they are a massive country run by a single party govt and they make everyones stuff. They can set the terms of trade at any given time. Their system of government is nothing like ours, they have no need to peg their currency to anything because their country is not interested in limiting govt spending. In fact, govt spending is what drives a massive part of their economy so it would actually just create more problems for them and no foreseeable benefits.

exactly, because it has

exactly, because it has worked out so well for us.

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
― Ron Paul

Lol

Well we don't just openly and voluntarily trust a group of individuals to manage our wealth and prosperity, you are comparing apples to oranges.

Doesn't matter if you're

Doesn't matter if you're communist, socialist, capitalist, etc. Every single fiat currency in the history of the world has collapsed (average 40 years lifespan)...and the dollar is drawing it's final breath (42 years since Nixon broke from the gold standard).

I'd guess the Chinese have enough sense to look at history. This country sure doesn't.

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
― Ron Paul

History?

All historical currencies have failed--including fiat--because the issuing government was unable to guarantee its value (and that generally only becomes an issue when dealing with other nations). If the people within a particular nation have no objection to using a fiat currency, then it will continue to work until some event occurs upon which the people of that nation no longer trust that the value of the currency can be guaranteed (e.g. hyperinflation). I do not debate that we may face a currency crisis in the future, however, China's circumstances are vastly different from ours--both politically and economically.

BTW, the Chinese basically invented the fiat currency, so what history do you want them to look at exactly? They are still around as a nation, and doing pretty well as a matter of fact, if I may add.

China has already had to

China has already had to replace their old yuan with a new yuan. They experienced hyperinflation. A revaluation occurred in 1955, at the rate of 1 new yuan = 10,000 old yuan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renminbi

Yeah, I'd say they may be looking to try something new. The fiat road ALWAYS ends the same way...no matter the type of regime running the country.

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
― Ron Paul

I'm saying

what if china sees the writing on the wall, and wants to restructure.

A fixed currency would force the market to restructure in China, selling their stuff to themselves. Meanwhile, Yuan would then be a stable currency, which holds value for a long time, and buys lots of great stuff. Vietnam would trade oil for yuan, etc.

It's not America and Europe and the big currency manipulators that China would be dealing with. The gold yuan would strengthen it with its weak neighbors.

All China needs are natural resources. It could barter yuan for resources in exclusive trade deals with banana republics. Sounds pretty solid actually. It's how AMERICA got its start.

Currency and economic manipulation manages an economy much more effectively than brute political force. You don't think China has been learning?

Hey, this story is probably BS, and China may be stuck in its corner. But why assume they'll stick in the losing end of a deal with a broken West if they have an alternative?

What?

What writing on the wall? Why in the world would China want its market to restructure? Their economy is growing at ridiculous rates. They already sell their stuff to themselves, and to others, and they are damn good at it. If they thought the U.S. dollar was worthless, then they would just require us to use their currency in order to purchase their goods from them.

China already has exclusive trade deals, tons of them in SSA. Except they go to countries and build roads and hospitals, and in exchange receive resources, so currency isn't even technically an issue (the contractors building the roads and bridges are generally Chinese state owned enterprises).

Not to be mean and I honestly mean this in the most respectful way, but unless I am really missing something, it seems like you don't really have an in-depth understanding of the issues you are attempting to discuss and instead are just spewing the general talking points everyone else around here constantly throws out there. A lot of issues are extremely complicated and don't have simple answers/solutions and pretending like they do doesn't generally help to facilitate a better understanding and development of solutions (at least in my experience).

No I see what you're saying

This gold thing is a ridiculous rumor.

I'm just trying to take the point of view of whether conventional wisdom might be lacking.

For example, the US dollar isn't worthless... yet. But what if it becomes so someday soon. What position will China be in? If it just keeps up with the status quo? Which is of coursed managed centrally in the West?

I'm trying to challenge the conventional wisdom and speculate concerning scenarios where China might have an advantage by forcing strategic changes on its own timeline not the West's.

Isn't China's economy considered something of a bubble? That's what I mean by restructure, pop the bubble and start selling their stuff to themselves instead of for dollars. Let prices adjust, and industry adapt. There would be massive deflation, but that would probably lead to long-term prosperity as the lower classes rode a rising tide to the middle class.

These ideas aren't supposed to be based on a well-informed analysis of China's situation, but from what I understand many experts are confounded by the data coming out of China. Sometimes it's like a black hole from what I've read.

I'm just wondering why China, despite its gains to this point, would continue to ride out a system that is now set to collapse and destroy them? Maybe they have no choice. But I can't believe they'd choose so if they had a choice.

How exactly would the current system collapse and destroy them?

If anything, it would destroy our economy and China's economy would be effected to the extent that it relies on the U.S. for trade, but aside from that China would go on living as they ordinarily do. An assumption that a "collapse" of a U.S. currency will somehow cripple China is unfounded. Not to mention everyone around here's idea about how a currency actually collapses and is replaced his misguided.

Not Plausible

China employs a mercantilist economic policy... ie they achieve trade surpluses by weakening their currency. Pegging the yuan to gold will wipe out their trade surplus with the U.S. as the relative value of the dollar falls and Chinese goods become dramtically more expensive to American consumers.

Is China going to do a 180 and become a hard money economy? I seriously doubt it.

Comments? Imbecilic down-votes?

China and USA have a common problem: Government

Both governments run mercantilist economies in order to maximize the benefit of a few.

Problem with governments running an economy is that when a national government screws up the nation is screwed over.

It's theoretically so technically impossible to control a complex system. Governments will fail at economic policy, and always have.

Governments are create economic weather patterns with storms of surpluses or droughts of shortages, always at the wrong time, in general.

If government is in control of the economy, the results will be sub-optimal.

All I can do is weather their storms, Governments are a force of nature. Chaotic and Self-serving.

Free includes debt-free!

But what if

They've decided to shift strategies and restructure. And what if this is their best opportunity to do so?

Do their leaders hope to retain mercantilist policies forever, while the West implodes itself?

Agree. While it would be

Agree. While it would be awesome in some ways, they won't do it. Aside from largely buying into cult of Keynes as you properly note, it would essentially be a declaration of war.

As well it would mean they would have to fund all government waste and corruption, I mean 'infrastructure' and 'investment', solely with taxes.

The popular delusion that inflation isn't taxation is very powerful and allows much more wealth to be extracted. I can't see them giving it up voluntarily.

But if they did, and could keep from being clobbered by the west for doing it, they would become the sole global economic power within two generations.

Watch Out China

I hear that Banksters like Gold.

It's scarce, so easy to manipulate

But as free money, combined with silver and other currencies, the power that comes from manipulating gold diminishes.

In this case, gold becomes a pretty valuable backstop/reserve. Not so great as the only currency around though.

Manipulating Gold

Seems to me that gold is easily confiscated. Why is it that the American people were forced to turn in their gold and I didn't even get so much as a history lesson on the subject. I was around 40 before I knew anything about it, and that was only because a gold painted cup was passed to us and the remark was made that the family melted a gold coin and painted a plate and a cup instead of turning the gold in.

When is the last time Fort Knox was audited?

It seems to me that gold is easily confiscated. Have you ever watched Banking with Hitler? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YauM5dHLn1s

I think Gold is a draw for plunder. Seems I watched a Gaddafi documentary and the gold was plundered in Lybia after he was toppled.

I hear the Banksters are moving to China.

...

You're right

That's why the main currency of the common person would probably be silver. Gold would just be a more valuable denomination for storage of high quantities of silver equivalent. In other words, only very rich people and banks would probably even use gold, and the common folks wouldn't possess enough to make confiscation worthwhile.

I'm not a gold bug, I'm just saying that gold is a legitimate store of value. The danger is central banking which enforces a gold standard.

We need free money.

Silver?

Hmmm, I think we used to have silver money...it is missing too. Not confiscated, mind you, just missing from coinage...poof...the silver is gone.

You say

"...gold, and the common folks wouldn't possess enough to make confiscation worthwhile."

It is when it is collected in mass from all the unfortunate common folk.

I'm not a money expert, and I do believe that gold and silver are legit stores of value. They also create a target on your back, so to say, because they do have instrinsic value.

"The danger is central banking which enforces a gold standard." I agree, the problem is lack of competition...free market...then perhaps we would have what we need:

"We need free money."

This guy: Josf, has an interesting take on money. He has a challenge issued that people begin creating currency to use instead of fed dollars: http://www.dailypaul.com/259985/liberty-day-challenge-july-4...

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Wow, good sense

Let's follow the Chinese back to the gold standard. Do you think people would start conserving energy, if the true cost of it became obvious?

凹凸

http://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindict.php
凹凸

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

Witty

Witty

Southern Agrarian

B.R.I.C.s

It's actually the final implementation of the quad-global-companionship.

Through the IMF, four major multi-national unions will be established in the form of the E.U.... Many of us are waiting for the North American Union to be established but Clinton signed NAFTA it opened our economic borders to canada and mexio... there is a place called mexicali which is the making of a culutrual zanzabar.

Lots of big puzzle pieces to see, lots of little ones within - fractals upon fractals of implementation.

They that give up liberty for security deserve neither.

wait, i thought they were gonna back it up with bitcoin

lmao

they would have to hoarded

more than Germany, the US and Switzerland combined.

Still woud need a lot more to be the world currency.

I understand they have been urging their people to buy it for

years... and they have a lot of people.

Integrity means having to say things that people don't want to hear & especially to say things that the regime doesnt want to hear -RonPaul

Lets see how close it plays

Lets see how close it plays out to this. Jim Rickards interview on currency wars.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdPkaCTdxBU&feature=player_em...

They've been hoarding for a while

I wander if this was why...