-25 votes

Rand Paul: An attack on Israel is an attack on the US

Take a look at this video and tell me if you still think that Rand Paul is as much of a true patriot as his Father:

Go view the video here:

http://youtu.be/l0jIQ-YxnkE

http://hotair.com/archive...

He is doing the dance of the Neoconservative right. He's nothing more than a traitor. You vote for this turkey, you might as well be voting for George W. Bush.




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Might be some confusion here...

I'm not sure how I feel about Rand but he is definitely better than any other options we have. I'm just saying that we cant rely solely on others. This power we are discussing only exists because it was relinquished from the people by misinformation and fear. The trick is to not be afraid. I have made the conscious decision that i will not be a slave. Whatever that means, whatever it might entail, No matter what happens. Right now it's seemingly little things, open carrying my firearm, writing in Ron Paul, maybe voting for Rand, keeping myself educated, and educating others to the best of my ability. I have faith armchair, faith in myself, faith that the citizens of this country will someday find strength in themselves, and when that happens, the "power" will no longer bind us and we can truly be free.

"What light is to the eyes - what air is to the lungs - what love is to the heart, liberty is to the soul of man."
-Robert Green Ingersoll

No one in their right mind

No one in their right mind could ever equate Ron Paul and Rand Paul.

However, Rand is still the best thing we have in 2016. Far better than Christie or Rubio, Romney Jr.'s. We know who has raised Rand, and we know he understands the free market.

Another bullshiiit post.

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Rand Paul traitor = Israel hater

What seperates Rand from the Neoconservatives is Rand is opposed to pre-emptive war.

Many here, for example, are willing to take up their arms to fight in a ISA civil war, against the Federal and State government which is not an anti-war attitude. So many here are not anti-war, as they have said they will fight in a civil war, but against America taking our money and building other nations.

Israel has a symbiotic relationship with America, many leveled, from the establishment of Israel since the war of 1948. It is a very complicated issue, which Ron Paul and Rand agree with Netyanahu who claimed they would rather the USA did not give foreign aid and expect Israel to be the USA'a lap dog in the wars for oil, and drugs, in the mid-East.

I completely agree with Rand, that foreign aid cuts begin with those burning American flags, abducting Americans, protesting the American occupations. We need to cut aid and remove our troops. That is not Israel, where we do not have troops. Israel is friends to the USA.. they acted in self defense when the "Ear" U.S.S. Liberty was caught spying on them, and that's why the USA has never done anything about the innocent men who lost their lives on an ILLEGAL secret mission.

Entangling Alliances

Entangling alliances with none .

There is nothing complicated about it , their domestic agents ( AIPAC , ADL , JDL , Republican and Democratic parties etc....) have ingrained themselves so deaply into our body politic , that making any stance against anything the Israelis want is shouted down with screams of antisemitism . The only thing that complicates the matter are people like you who are borderline Israeli Firsters .

As far as the USS Liberty , our military forces should have decimated the Israelis for their murderous assault on our sailors . It is because of the Rand Paul (Neocon) mentality that our brave sailors have never been properly honored and avenged .

Israel is not my friend , nor do I feel that , us as a Nation being entangled with them is a positive for me or any American citizen . They demand American taxpayers money to fuel their slaughter machine . Our entanglement with them has cost many American lives (read up on Blowback). Not to mention those who died aboard the USS Liberty . So you and Rand can give it a rest , because your propaganda is old and getting weaker .

Entangling Alliences

There is nothing complicated with entangling alliances with none, except we are very entangled.

You are proposing that we should have not just spied on Israel, but pre-emptiviely attacked? We had no business spying, and it's a tragic SHAME what happened to our innocent sailors, that took a hit for merely being deployed on the U.S.S. Liberty that was on a secret ILLEGTAL mission.. and why the USA failed tham and their families.

Neocons believe in pre0emptive Bush Doctorine and Rand does not.

Israel does not entangle us, we entangle them, wich has cost lives globally.

I'm not going to give it a rest. Your communist UN Agenda HATE America propeganda is trash.

Communist ?

I think you have it backwards . You are the one spewing the communist rhetoric here .
Only a healthy red blooded American here , the Constitutional Republic which Thomas Jefferson so clearly and eloquently presents is my guide .
I can see you have followed the teachings Marx . You are an Israeli Provacatuer . Good luck with that .

Israel

Israel was established by the League of nations as a secular state for Russia and other communist countries to dump their unwanted Jews.

It has been a secular NWO agenda that has manipulated Israel all these years.

The fact is, we are entangled and Rand is giving us an out as a f4riend in the name of defense.. that's fair. It will bring us and enable us to restore a constitutional republic far better than anything anyone else has with presidential interests.

If I were in the Oval Office,

If I were in the Oval Office, I would have immediately ordered the base where that attack was launched from buried forever.
Instead we bomb third world countries who have done nothing to us into the stone age.

An attack against Israel is an attack against Israel. If it were an offensive attack against Israel, I would condemn it. If it was another country defending itself against Israel action, that's between those two countries.

The center piece of the Ron Paul ideology is just as much about foreign policy and the idiocy of our empire as it is about the Fed.

But you aren't, and you won't be...

...nor will anyone else who refuses to play the political game. ; )

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

So then what's the difference

So then what's the difference between Rand the other folks we condeem for playing the game? Just because his last name is Paul makes it okay?

I respect Dr. Paul for the steadiness of his convictions. This is the type of leadership we need today, not those who will bend to the established political lobbies.

A game ?

This is not a game . Our Constitutional Republic depends on Courage and forthrightness , not pandering .

Rand said we will go to war

Rand said we will go to war pre-emptively to defend Israel no matter why they are attacked. This is preemptive, bad policy and interventionist.

Ventura 2012

Quote? Link?

Quote? Link?

So you say BmoreBrawler

But I have yet to find anything to back you. I'm searching.. could you help?

And as for going to war.. Seems to me there are many people here who have NO PROBLEM joining in a civil war, eh?

Asked whether the United

Asked whether the United States would stand with Israel and provide it foreign aid if the Jewish state were attacked by its enemies, Paul went a step further.

“Well absolutely we stand with Israel,” he said in an interview with Breitbart News, “but what I think we should do is announce to the world – and I think it is pretty well known — that any attack on Israel will be treated as an attack on the United States.”

1. Pre-emptive? Yes, no one is attacking us. Someone attacked someone else. Someone is *always* attacking someone else.

2. Internventionist? Yes, this is why Ron Paul wants us out of the UN and NATO. George Washington foreign policy of no entangling alliances. This particular "alliance" is very entangling, which leads me to....

3. Bad Policy? There's a reason why Israel is not in NATO, it is because Israel is a target for enemies. You don't make entangling alliances with small countries that not only are a target for attack but might even START a war. See: WW1.

Ventura 2012

He also stated that Israel

He also stated that Israel does not need to call him to defend themselves if Bombs rain on the Gaza. I wonder if that is what is meant by "stand by Israel"?

I don't agree

1. Pre-emtive means we strick without being attacked. Rand is saying IF ISRAEL WAS ATTACKED.. thus it would be defense of our friend, Israel. Pre-emptive wars, begun by Bush are continued by Obama. Rand would end Pre-emptive strikes.

2, Interventionist,, yes, I agree,, and while Washington's wise foreign policy advice is to not entangle, we are. Our Constitution does not provide for a social security system either, however we have one. Ron Paul said he would not end payments to those who were dependent and paid into them.. but would offer a choice for those to not pay and come up with their own plan.. this can be applied to the foreign policy issue reguarding Israel, where instead of cutting them off, we give nations the opportunity to build their own nations, helping those who are friendly, and letting our enemies suffer the consequinces.. to where each can find independence on mutual terms, giving us a path to end intervention,, and social security for that matter.

3. Israel is a product of the Leaque of nations, where communist countries pirged their Jewish poplulations making Israel a human waste land. There were hundreds of thousands of Jews imprisoned in Stalin's gulags, who gave birth and raised children, for no reason other than being Jewish. The world allowed these children to grow up in these gulags, and Israel was considered a solution. This is why the UN/NATO works to protect the area they gave to these children.. and it's very unfair on many levels to these people who are pointed to occupy parts of palestine, armed and told to fight..

Meanwhile, Israel has created the greatest military on Earth, their weapons are the best, their intel.. they are a product of the world.. a world that has been so entangled for so long, the threat of nuclear holocast is something everyone alive on Earth is was born into. So as I said in #1. What Rand is offering is a solution, very simular to the solution Ron Paul offered on Social Security.. an option OUT. Neither the Neocons or the Obama administration of Neoliberals are offering that.

The armed forces of the

The armed forces of the United States of America are to defend the United States of America. If Israel was attacked, that's Israel's business. If Americans want to volunteer to fight for Israel, as they did for France and Britain before we entered World Wars I and II or fighting for the elected Spanish government in the Spanish Civil War, that is their right.

Hence why he would allow the

Hence why he would allow the vote for war in Congress.

Rand is using Rhetoric

By saying we stand with Israel 100% if they are attacked then we almost assure ourselve of not having to go to war to help them. If we tell the whole arab world to go ahead and attack I guarantee we'll be involved, because we won't let a second hgolocaust happen while we stand by and do nothing. It is simply the fact of the matter. If you want to actually avoid the fight, you have to be willing to fight it and win, otherwise you'll be attacked because others think you are weak. The world is full of bullies, and they love to pick on the little guy.....

Josh Brueggen
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Ok

I don't disagree with anything you posted.

#1 is totally immaterial

#1 is totally immaterial because we can always find a pretext to justify an action and make it not technically pre-emptive. Ex. Saddam shot at our planes. Ho Chih Minh attacked South Vietnam. Gaddafi shot at protesters. The true anti-preemption doctrine is that you only attack people that attack YOU.

#2 Two wrongs don't make a right. Give me a break. Israel has plenty of nukes anyway. We are talking about committing to war and letting a bunch of religious radicals hold the switch.

#3 These are very poor arguments, VERY poor. Rand Paul is escalating any necessary military commitment, not giving a safety net. he And no, Israel is not the #1 military lol. Maybe pound for pound, as they were allowed to steal many nuclear secrets and given weapons from us.

Ventura 2012

YOU proposed #1

Now you say that is immaterial? I agree that true pre-emptive doctorine is to not cast the first stone.. I always thought, "Land of the Brave.." was because we were brave enough to not attack first. Rand claims he is opposed to pre-emtive war, and I'm going to take it that is what he means.. and that he is not looking for false flag.. as some do.

#2 Israel has too many nukes and a big part of their problem. They have to protect those nukes from a pre-emptive strike, least the world gets a huge grand canyon of black glass.

#3 I'm not seeing Rand esculate any war doctorine, but standing for non-pre-emtive wars, and admitting he would defend our friend, Israel. The USA military is dependent on Israel's military and Intel. Every Israeli citizen but the Orthodox has spent two years in the military.. pound for pound, Israel is the best.

GrangerYou are right here.

Granger
You are right here. Rand also stated that he would allow for Israel to defend themselves and they need not call him if bombs rain in on the Gaza. Couldn't that be what is meant by "we stand with Israel"? And he also stated that war is to be voted and approved of by Congress.

I proposed it, you tried to

I proposed it, you tried to distinguish it, and I said your DISTINCTION is immaterial. The rest of what you said is of course utter garbage and totally unprincipled.

Ventura 2012

DISTINCTION OIC

Have a good posting day

Forget IT

Granger is the biggest hack on this forum. A pseudo-statist who constantly pats herself on the back for voting for team red and sneers at those who have the intellectual honesty to say no to tyrants. She's a Republican dick-rider, you WILL NOT change her views with facts.

“Facts don’t cease to exist because they are ignored.” – Aldous Huxley

She does give ground

She does give ground occasionally. But you're right, consider it "for the record".

Ventura 2012

That is incorrect BmoreBrawler

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0J5_xb4A-4

Please back up what you are saying.. I would prefer you educate me than make a claim with no backing.

Thank you,, I'm waiting.