3 votes

Who is the best leader in our Liberty Movement?

I have been a part of our 'fringe' movement since 07. The issue that bothers me to my core is the fact that we are all individuals but seem to fail at rallying around a common message. Is it impossible to shake our personal view to gain support to a broader message? The slightest abridgment away from any inkling from an individual view, divides us like oil and water. As if none of has learned from the leadership of Ron Paul.

We need solutions to our issues and a plan to unite our community behind a message we can agree with 80% of the time. I do not believe in 90% of the conspiracy theories because it would take nobody whistleblowing, screwing up their post or working together to achieve their goals. For christs sake.. Alex Jones showed up to their 'secret' meeting! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpKdSvwYsrE

If not Ron who? If not Rand who? If not YOU... Who? I posted that inflammatory thread 'Screw Alex Jones' because I understood it was not helping our cause. Reasonable debate like Larry Pratt from GOA absolutely helps shape our position: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3C1d4onZsyw

6 yrs now I have had to put up with being labeled as a kook, cultist, nutball, RINO, Libtard.. and if you have been here half as long, you know EXACTLY what I am talking about.

So grassroots, please enlighten me. How do we defeat enemy number 1 of our movement? How do we advance our cause with the hardcore numbers we have? How do we defeat Karl Rove in the midterm elections? Where is the leadership showing us how we WIN?

I am all ears. I offered this post twice:

The $7.00 MoneyBomb 2/19/2012

and this post once:

Anybody else proud of Rand

This post is not about me or my ego. This post is trying to solve the hardest obstacles we face to WIN.

I want to end this post with a question.

Where do you see this movement going and what are you personally doing to reach goals?

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That sure came out of left field

You stated "it's easier to co-opt a leaderless revolt than if the one histrionic leader isn't corruptible because he has a platform to call out the people who are trying to co-opt the movement."

Then you say what?

Nothing directed at me, you just what documents?

I never thought you stated anything at me so where or how did u come up w that one.

Second, DOCUMENTS. HUH? Lost me what doc


Alex Jones: I"ve got the

Alex Jones: I"ve got the documents! I know their plans!


Dont listen to AJ

Fog Horn Leg Horn not my style.


the converse is true

If you do not have a guiding principle(s) and you follow a "great leader" you are doomed to failure.

Natural law, equal before the law (even government minions), the non-aggression principle.

leaders are human and are are prone to mistakes (or evil) like all of us. Politicians are a self selecting group that want power, They may have good intentions, but I do not want anyone to have power over me. Those leaders have a skewed personality.

The supreme leader dont even have to be sold out to be

compromised and controled. Lies and propaganda will destroy any leader.

Beyond this place of wrath and tears
Looms but the Horror of the shade,
And yet the menace of the years
Finds, and shall find, me unafraid.

It matters not how strait the gate.
How charged with punishments the scroll.
I am the master of my fate. I am the captain of my soul

Enlightened disengagement, I respect your power, I do not respect your authority.

No sovereign human can be enslaved if they are their own master.

Chains of deception are forged from links of ignorance.
I do not consent to anyone leading me and I do not wish to lead anyone. To me Dr. Paul has been and is but a messenger.


rand paul is not there to

rand paul is not there to call out the traitors. he goes to bed with them. at least ron paul was naming names of who were the neo-cons who hijacked the republican party.

a leader does have benefits. the illuminati hatchet man have the power of the mainstream media to take control of a movement.

a powerful leader who swayed his followers could cut that down to size.

you can organize something locally, and get people dedicated to a few things. you need to go up to the strangers on the street and hand out information to them. wake them up from the matrix.

i felt better recently talking to strangers like i once did, even though i'm still paranoid to do it before the all seeing eye.

if you feel safe at home, you can unleash a fury of info on the populace. right now everyone is looking at protecting their home. neighbors be damned.


all the good leaders get

all the good leaders get assasinated (sic) by the illuminati, or go in hiding until they can make a move, but it may be too late for them.


But we don't need a leader to inform us that

Slavery,murder, fraud and theft are unacceptable ideas. These acts have proven destructive of civil society.

There is an info-war. One task is to identify liberty and hone arguments in support.

I am not entirely on anyone's side as no one is entirely on my side.

I dreamt I was on a train, but it made me uncomfortable. I did not belong so I grabbed my bicycle and left the train to go cross country. Dreams are funny things. Hard to say what they mean.

Until a majority crave liberty over dependency their is a lot of work to be done. When winning is no longer important that will be the turning point, IMO.

Free includes debt-free!

Cyril's picture

There is an info-war. One task is to identify liberty and hone

"There is an info-war. One task is to identify liberty and hone arguments in support."

Hence, this and/or that, maybe?

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

i didn't hear about the word,

i didn't hear about the word, "Agorism" until a few weeks ago.

talk to the strangers on the street. you can gauge their understanding. You will find some willingness to overthrow the system in a non-violent manners. if you know people that live on a road, infiltrate the city government and privatize that road. or infiltrate the state gov. and privatize the road. private roads do not welcome police. privatize roads no longer belong to the government. no more checkpoints.

take children out of public school, and better yet, never let them be born in a hopsital. their blood will not be taken and they won't be assigned a number.

conduct business through bitcoin, under the table, or some other currency, on private roads where government has no clue what goes on.


tell your friends and tell

tell your friends and tell strangers to stop having children born in hospitals. don't let the government know they exist.


Phxarcher87's picture

Tom Woods

Is a personal favorite of mine. He is really changing the minds of people every day of course for the better.

1. Dr. Paul
2. Lew Rockwell
3. Tom Woods
4. The Judge Andrew Neapolitan

James Madison

You have found him...

Look in the mirror and recognize all that you are. Be confident, be knowledgeable and most importunately know thyself.

In 2007 you didn't find Ron Paul, Ron Paul found you. It wasn't about the man, but rather a reminder of what you always believe in. Each one of us must now accept the burden that comes with liberty. We wont agree 100% but as long as the core belief is the same it shouldn't matter.

If you feel that you need a leader or a spokesman for the cause of the liberty, be that person. And if you can't be that leader, perhaps you never truly believed in the message to begin with.

The Libertarian Party, irrelevant since 1971.

Still waiting for an answer..

Rand is my guy so far. He is smart enough to distance himself and earn his own base.

Unless he declares war on some country, he has my full support.

Although, to me, he should display a little better leadership by speaking directly to us through the Judge or Cavuto.

Im here to say flat out the political masterminds behind Ron and Rand failed miserably. Lee Atwater would not have missed that opportunity and neither did I.

'Peace is a powerful message.' Ron Paul

bit coin is one of the major

bit coin is one of the major players.

i don't know anything about it, but if the globalists talk about and are concerned, then i like it.

i think rand paul is compromised. I wish someone would ask him about the constitutionality of an israeli dual citizen holding high levels of office in the u.s. government, and ask him if he would like his yarmulke while he answers.


Why are you seeking a messiah?

The messaiah came a long time ago.

Do you not realize your error in looking for a messiah? As long as you are looking for a "leader", you will find one. And the ultimate result will not be what you were hoping for.

you missed the point..

not seeking Jesus.. seekng leadership and a path to win. Cmon man.. play ball.

'Peace is a powerful message.' Ron Paul

Actually, I did not miss the point.

You sound like a messianic, waiting for a messiah.


Oh saviour please come save us all. please. pretty please. oh. please. please please.. PLEASE!!!

OK fucknut. Without George Washington, where would we be? Without Thomas Jefferson where would we be??? Adams, Madison... Would you be so bold to admit we may have had a few leaders?

I am looking for motherfucking leadership. It is not fucking delusional. It is not cultish or seeking a fucking messiah, medals or prizes.

At what point can we gather around a common idea and advance our message forward regardless of the differences between north and south?

Yes, you did miss the point.

We can either be a movement of herding cats or a vocal minority that changes policy. I prefer the latter.

Im not waiting for a messiah. I am looking for leadership. Big fkn difference.

Next time offer more than five words in your criticism.

'Peace is a powerful message.' Ron Paul

this is a song about Ian

this is a song about Ian Curtis




Attend your next local FACL training. If there's not a local FACL training then call them and schedule one.


Jim Cunningham
Mississippi for Liberty

Cyril's picture

What are you personally doing to reach goals?

"Where do you see this movement going and what are you personally doing to reach goals?"

On this end, I am striving to work on this:


and that:


Still in the homework phase as of today. With 2 to 4 kids around and a pretty involved full time job and loaded schedule to sustain them all guys by myself alone, it's a rather slow process, I can confess easily.

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius


aint it???

p.s. Thanks for just being involved!Means a lot. :)

'Peace is a powerful message.' Ron Paul

Cyril's picture

"Tough, ain't it?"

"Tough, ain't it?"

Yes, quite. At times.

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

sharkhearted's picture

Every single one of us...that's who.

The age of authoritarianism....is DEAD.

"Leaders" are an illusion.

All we need is"facilitators"...not "leaders".

Hope that makes sense.

At the end of the day...as to who would be the chief facilitator...(leader)....then I still vote for Ron Paul...even for just decorative reasons.

He has ignited a rEVOLution...and there is no going back from here!

And I salute you for being enlightened in this whole liberty movement way longer than me. Kudos and props.

But you are wrong on "Screw Alex Jones" and other minutiae. And probably 90% of the "conspiracy theories" that you denigrate as not true...are probably are,,,indeed....they.might be ALL true and that the real "conspiracy theories" that actually exist are the official state-sponsored lies.

Think about it. The real conspiracy theorists...are the ones who are allergic to the truth...hence they have to make up and falsify some osrt of govt sponsored conspiracy.


Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

I disagree.

We need leadership. Otherwise we are a bunch of barking dogs. No offense, and I mean it.

Someone has to steer this ship and take responsibility and ownership for it.

'Peace is a powerful message.' Ron Paul

sharkhearted's picture

Individuals are SOVEREIGN in America

Any "leader" should be rather...a "facilitator".

We DON'T need "leaders" in the traditional sense of the word.

Some people might....and they would be the "barking dogs."

But for the rest of us, the less "authority" there is...the better!

Again...individuals are sovereign in America...not the government.

That's not to say we don't come together for things military and legal etc...but WE should be in control of it.

The Age of Authoritarianism...in all forms...from political to social to in some case, even religious... this unevolved age of submitting to the "authorities" ...has FAR outlived its use and it, as an idea, needs to be DISCARDED to the DUSTBIN of HISTORY!

Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

Cyril's picture

I'm in.

I'm in.

Find me a few stages and cameras outdoors, appoint me, and I'll be there to offer my time, knowledge and my own phrases about what liberty means and what happened to this country.

For I have seen it happening elsewhere - across a well-known ocean - and reflected upon it for more than two decades ALREADY.

Of course, I would do it totally free of charge regarding the amount of my time I'd dedicate for that.

The main issue I see is there are probably hundreds or thousands others among us who'd be willing to go for the same thing, just as easily - how are we going to figure who's "best"?

So far, we don't have many more options besides Dr. Ron Paul himself (and a very few others), and we can barely unite enough for money bombs - every time.

All this saddens me, too.

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.


"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

sharkhearted's picture

Im not in.

Yeah Ron Paul is the leader of the movement.

But we all are individual sovereigns.


Finished. Done for. Over.

The whole idea of "leaders" is completely and sufficiently outdated.

Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

sharkhearted's picture

We need leadership indeed.

But the Age of Authoritarianism....is DEAD.

Leadership is much more fluid... VOLUNTARY....than any traditional picture of it.

Not going to waste my time arguing on this further.

But let me leave you with this: There ARE no authorities. WE.....you...me....are the authorities.

INDIVIDUALS are sovereign in the United States.

Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.