16 votes

Could We All Share The Same Soul?

I've never been inclined to believe in reincarnation, but I've read that there is a lot of good evidence that reincarnation is possible. (http://reluctant-messenger.com/reincarnation-proof.htm)

I read an essay called "The Egg" by Andy Weir and it blew my mind. It essentially states the possibility that we could all be the same person reincarnated over and over. Karma?

It's quite an amazing idea that I would be fascinated to hear anyone's thoughts and opinion.

You were on your way home when you died.

It was a car accident. Nothing particularly remarkable, but fatal nonetheless. You left behind a wife and two children. It was a painless death. The EMTs tried their best to save you, but to no avail. Your body was so utterly shattered you were better off, trust me.

And that’s when you met me.

“What… what happened?” You asked. “Where am I?”

“You died,” I said, matter-of-factly. No point in mincing words.

“There was a… a truck and it was skidding…”

“Yup,” I said.

“I… I died?”

“Yup. But don’t feel bad about it. Everyone dies,” I said.

You looked around. There was nothingness. Just you and me. “What is this place?” You asked. “Is this the afterlife?”

“More or less,” I said.

“Are you god?” You asked.

“Yup,” I replied. “I’m God.”

“My kids… my wife,” you said.

“What about them?”

“Will they be all right?”

“That’s what I like to see,” I said. “You just died and your main concern is for your family. That’s good stuff right there.”

You looked at me with fascination. To you, I didn’t look like God. I just looked like some man. Or possibly a woman. Some vague authority figure, maybe. More of a grammar school teacher than the almighty.

“Don’t worry,” I said. “They’ll be fine. Your kids will remember you as perfect in every way. They didn’t have time to grow contempt for you. You wife will cry on the outside, but will be secretly relieved. To be fair, your marriage was falling apart. If it’s any consolation, she’ll feel very guilty for feeling relieved.”

“Oh,” you said. “So what happens now? Do I go to heaven or hell or something?”

“Neither,” I said. “You’ll be reincarnated.”

“Ah,” you said. “So the Hindus were right,”

“All religions are right in their own way,” I said. “Walk with me.”

You followed along as we strode through the void. “Where are we going?”

“Nowhere in particular,” I said. “It’s just nice to walk while we talk.”

“So what’s the point, then?” You asked. “When I get reborn, I’ll just be a blank slate, right? A baby. So all my experiences and everything I did in this life won’t matter.”

“Not so!” I said. “You have within you all the knowledge and experiences of all your past lives. You just don’t remember them right now.”

I stopped walking and took you by the shoulders. “Your soul is more magnificent, beautiful, and gigantic than you can possibly imagine. A human mind can only contain a tiny fraction of what you are. It’s like sticking your finger in a glass of water to see if it’s hot or cold. You put a tiny part of yourself into the vessel, and when you bring it back out, you’ve gained all the experiences it had.

“You’ve been in a human for the last 48 years, so you haven’t stretched out yet and felt the rest of your immense consciousness. If we hung out here for long enough, you’d start remembering everything. But there’s no point to doing that between each life.”

“How many times have I been reincarnated, then?”

“Oh lots. Lots and lots. An in to lots of different lives.” I said. “This time around, you’ll be a Chinese peasant girl in 540 AD.”

“Wait, what?” You stammered. “You’re sending me back in time?”

“Well, I guess technically. Time, as you know it, only exists in your universe. Things are different where I come from.”

“Where you come from?” You said.

“Oh sure,” I explained “I come from somewhere. Somewhere else. And there are others like me. I know you’ll want to know what it’s like there, but honestly you wouldn’t understand.”

“Oh,” you said, a little let down. “But wait. If I get reincarnated to other places in time, I could have interacted with myself at some point.”

“Sure. Happens all the time. And with both lives only aware of their own lifespan you don’t even know it’s happening.”

“So what’s the point of it all?”

“Seriously?” I asked. “Seriously? You’re asking me for the meaning of life? Isn’t that a little stereotypical?”

“Well it’s a reasonable question,” you persisted.

I looked you in the eye. “The meaning of life, the reason I made this whole universe, is for you to mature.”

“You mean mankind? You want us to mature?”

“No, just you. I made this whole universe for you. With each new life you grow and mature and become a larger and greater intellect.”

“Just me? What about everyone else?”

“There is no one else,” I said. “In this universe, there’s just you and me.”

You stared blankly at me. “But all the people on earth…”

“All you. Different incarnations of you.”

“Wait. I’m everyone!?”

“Now you’re getting it,” I said, with a congratulatory slap on the back.

“I’m every human being who ever lived?”

“Or who will ever live, yes.”

“I’m Abraham Lincoln?”

“And you’re John Wilkes Booth, too,” I added.

“I’m Hitler?” You said, appalled.

“And you’re the millions he killed.”

“I’m Jesus?”

“And you’re everyone who followed him.”

You fell silent.

“Every time you victimized someone,” I said, “you were victimizing yourself. Every act of kindness you’ve done, you’ve done to yourself. Every happy and sad moment ever experienced by any human was, or will be, experienced by you.”

You thought for a long time.

“Why?” You asked me. “Why do all this?”

“Because someday, you will become like me. Because that’s what you are. You’re one of my kind. You’re my child.”

“Whoa,” you said, incredulous. “You mean I’m a god?”

“No. Not yet. You’re a fetus. You’re still growing. Once you’ve lived every human life throughout all time, you will have grown enough to be born.”

“So the whole universe,” you said, “it’s just…”

“An egg.” I answered. “Now it’s time for you to move on to your next life.”

And I sent you on your way.
- Andy Weir




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WELCOME

Welcome to your New World Order.

Some humor.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SSUQxGjZZ4

Demons dreaming
Breathe in, breathe in
I'm coming back again

This is spookin' me out.

I believe in reincarnation since I was 15

growing up in at the time 90% Catholic Poland.

LL on Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
sometimes LL can suck & sometimes LL rocks!
http://www.dailypaul.com/203008/south-carolina-battle-of-cow...
Love won! Deliverance from Tyranny is on the way! Col. 2:13-15

No.7's picture

oops

wrong thread

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

I've been atheist..

..ever since I talked to God when I was 4 years old, and he didn't answer. It wasn't until I found out about this experiment http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfPeprQ7oGc though, that I really started to come to the idea of a universal soul. I'm still an atheist, but in learning about the non-physical nature of reality, I've become a much funner atheist.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

I think the universal soul

I think the universal soul and the non-physical reality you mention can be explored by studying the psychedelic experience as it emerges out of nature.

No.7's picture

The DMT guys talk like the drug is proof of God

They say they look at their soul and travel beyond their fundamental weaknesses as humans to grow stronger spiritually.

I'm too chicken to try it though, those drugs can make you crazy.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

On the contrary!

It happens to be the safest of any "drug" you could take. It also only lasts 5 minutes then is cleared from the body, since it is also made naturally by the brain the body knows what to do with it. It is my opinion that living your whole life without experiencing safe psychedelic plants is crazy. There is a lot of info online about it so at least get all the facts. The experience isn't proof of god per say, but proof of a nearby dimension populated with entires that can communicate. Very interesting. "The spirit molecule" is a very interesting study to check out.

More or less..

...this is basically where I'm at, and logically, this idea that we are all one universal mind experiencing itself subjectively gives more logical reason to be good to each other than the old "some ancient dead guy said so" story.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

We all share...

...the same Source, but I don't see us as sharing some kind of pantheistic destiny with our individual selves lost in a cosmic blur, as one soul. I believe we will each retain our identities and actually become even more distinct and individual as we grow on our journeys into eternity.

We will continue to grow to become closer and closer to the ideal persons we were created to be. This is kind of the idea, I think, in Revelation, where the individual believer receives from his heavenly Father a 'white stone' with a new name written on it, that nobody except the Father knows. That represents that ideal person we were meant to be, yet distinct and particular compared to every other individual. We are not all One energy field with no distinction between us. As we grow, we do not become less individual, disappearing into some pantheistic sea; we become more individual, like a distinct flower in a cosmic garden.

As we grow, we will become more like the Creator -- but we will never BE the Creator. And so we are utterly dependent on the Creator, not only for our existence in the first place, but also for being drawn back to becoming those ideal persons we are meant to be, when we go astray in our wobbling, toddler-like steps.

No.7's picture

not THE Creator, another lesser creator

I'm not sold that God puts so much importance on individuality. We hold great virtue in not judging other people. I don't see why sharing a soul would make us all similar in our nature, God is likely much greater and more vast than anything within our comprehension.

"I believe in Spinoza's God who reveals himself in the orderly harmony of what exists, not in a God who concerns himself with the fates and actions of human beings" - Albert Einstein

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

Would it be...

...presumptuous for me as a human to suggest that a God who loves each individual for the individual person they are would be superior to a God who only loves a faceless, sea of humanity (the masses)? If Christ and the Father are One, as He said, and as I believe, then to see the Son's Love in action is to see the Father's Love in action through Him. So when I hear Him describing the search for the single lost sheep, the Father's eye being on even a lowly sparrow, etc., and then commanding us to love our neighbors and even our enemies (who are individuals), to forgive them as our Father forgives us, this all convinces me that God does indeed care about individual persons.

To me it sounds like a kind of hell, if we will all lose our individual sense of person, to merge into some cosmic Oneness. It sounds like a different kind of annihilation of the person. But maybe I'm misunderstanding your idea? Feel free to set me straight. :)

No.7's picture

Likewise, I like to be set straight as well

My faith in God is based on the cosmological argument

That the universe appears to be designed with symbols from the creator evident in it's nature. Some people say "God made me, God made all of us". While it may be true that God creates a soul for each individual human being, God has shown us that we create humans using sex, a natural temptation designed into us. It seems just as plausible that God created the human species, but humans created all the other humans that exist.

I don't really see it as losing your sense of individuality because it would mean that we are all different fragments of the same vessel. We are different tools, if you will.

Hell, in my opinion, is a loving God giving us what we love more than Him. I think we create our own hell repeating our mistakes and vices over and over for eternity.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

This idea resonates with me...

Very interesting..

From Wiki (I haven't read that much philosophy so I wouldn't have known the info below):

Nietzsche spoke about eternal recurrence.. The idea is common in most Eastern religions such as Hinduism/Buddhism.. and also Greco-Roman philosophy with the Pythagoreans and Stoics. I just found this quote from the Roman Emperor and philosopher Marcus Aurelius:

Constantly regard the universe as one living being, having one substance and one soul; and observe how all things have reference to one perception, the perception of this one living being; and how all things act with one movement; and how all things are the cooperating causes of all things that exist; observe too the continuous spinning of the thread and the structure of the web.

—Marcus Aurelius, Meditations, iv. 40.

9-11 Media Fakery: Did anyone die on 9-11?
http://www.cluesforum.info/

http://www.septemberclues.info/

9-11 Actors:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aPvJSQtmoE

Pysops.. media.. actors.. propagandists... disinfo agents.. fake videos.. fake photos

Quite interesting OldNo.7J.D.

Your thread has a pleasant atmosphere. Usually this type of topic results in riots. I read lots of good comments.

I like the story of the monk who asked the master "Master, what happens when you die?", and the master replied "I don't know, I am not a dead master."

I don't put much thought into it. I try to stay in the here and Now since that is all that really is. I fight to forget the past and not worry about the future. I got sick a few years ago, Lyme disease, and after that life really sucked. It is still the same now but mostly I refuse to worry about the future nor feel sorrow for the suffering I endured in the past. Perpetual illness is a bitter pill to swallow. So I am really good at being here in the Now. So illness has been a real blessing that way.

I can't get into the parts of religion and god that conflate morality and the supernatural. They just don't mix, imo. But as far as the supernatural, I have never experienced anything like that. But a lot of folks claim they have and so I would not knock it.

I think the egg theory could be slightly true but in this way: Energy is pretty awesome. The sun shines down, the plants grow from the sun and minerals in the soil, the animals eat the plants, they die, they become the minerals in the soil, the sun shines, the minerals become plants, and on and on. So, after so many billions of years, the energy you are comprised of took the form of hundreds of millions of lives. So we are all just one big bundle of sun energy ever-changing ethereal beings.

So that is why all the mystery religions worshiped the sun. They were very wise. I do to. I worship the Sun and the Now. So I guess I am a pagan at heart.

And I look forward to being dirt. I love dirt. That just sounds so relaxing to me.

The end. .........finally.

No.7's picture

You have a terrific attitude

Your outlook on life is encouraging and awesome to see. Keep up that great attitude, your doing great things with it.

Energy science is very interesting and the facts are facts. Where does the energy go when we die? What is soooooooo much energy inside a live human body? It is very plausible that our "soul" is the energy within us. Maybe those Asians are on to something with that "chi" or whatever it is....

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

You are probably right.

There most likely is more to it than plain old physics. It's too much for me to wrap my head around. I guess we will all find out soon enough.

Thanks for the mind bender. I will ponder it for a while.

I feel like this is pretty accurate

"Ye are Gods.". Psalms 87

To me it's like we are different waves in the same ocean. Clearly made out of the same cloth, spirit, energy - but individuated like the ocean has waves.

It's a good story.

Well done! I didn't find it convincing or even reasonable, but it hung together nicely as a play with ideas, and I quite enjoyed it. Do more like it -- it's of publishable quality. It reminds me of a science fiction/time travel short story by Robert Heinlein called "All You Zombies."

Recommended reading: The Most Dangerous Superstition, http://www.amazon.com/Most-Dangerous-Superstition-Larken-Ros...

No.7's picture

Andy Weir wrote "The Egg" I just shared it

but I agree that it is very good writing. I was the math teacher's friend in school, and the math teacher's friend is usually the English teacher's foe you know?

It never fails to make me mad when a professor or teacher tells me a well thought out paper deserves a C- because I wrote in the passive voice too much. I had a teacher that wouldn't let us use any form of the verb "to be" at all. If we did even once we had to rewrite the paper....

What was the point of that?

Sorry for the rant, double sorry if you're an English teacher...

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

Absolutely not.

If this is true, then it simply doesn't matter what bad things you do. After all, you're doing it to yourself! If we accept this claim, then the world is mine to dominate and control! Eat, drink, be merry, slaughter and torture, help and love, it doesn't matter! If you enjoy it, do it! All is acceptable if all is me!

Morality is no more. Nobody has rights, for everyone is me, and I may do to myself what I choose.

That's what you took from it?

Empathy is the non-religious, non-partisan reason we have morals. It isnt perfect, but it doesn't require me to believe the writings of ancient dead men in order to know how to act. Nature has no laws, so when we are talking about the nature of reality, who cares what libertarians think. The world wasn't created according to what is best for the libertarian movement. However, humans have evolved according to certain laws of nature, and empathy, the attempt to understand how another feels, is one of the cornerstones of that evolution. While this story has no scientific support, the moral of it is pretty basic, and more reason to be good to each other than some code somebody wrote thousands of years ago. We are smart enough to know that we should be good to each other, but even before we were that smart, there was a function inside our brains which made us attempt to feel pain when we saw others in pain. In primitive times, it was simply a survival tactic (don't touch that snake, the last guy who did is in terrible pain) but in modern times, we may very well find that there is a link between our soul, or our divine spark, which helps us to practice this empathy. To me, that is the reason it is wrong to kill, steal, hurt, etc.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

No.7's picture

No, not at all

If we share the same soul then morality and Karma are infinitely important. If this is true then "we" are but an infant God growing in His egg that we call the "universe".

I'm not saying it's true, I do not know the truth. However, this is an interesting question that you would do well to open your mind to.

Did you even read the story?

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

I read the whole thing.

It'd make a great novel and it's a fun philosophical thought, but there is literally no way to derive any ideas about right and wrong from it. The implication is that if all is me, then logically I am all. If I am all, and if I belong to me, then, logically, all belong to me. Obviously, most people don't want to hurt themselves... but then it's no longer right and wrong, it's what I want. The unstated claim is that there is no higher law that matters; if we take the example in the story, "god" just kinda watches us and does the equivalent of giving us a Youtube like or dislike for each life.

Sorry. It's well written and entertaining, but I find very little substance to it if you claim to believe in morality. On the other hand, a sociopath or a relativist could certainly make a case based on that assumption.

I've never been one for the New Age stuff, anyway. I'm young, but my ideas are old. Very old. You might call me a traditionalist or a fundamentalist. I call myself a Christian and a classical liberal.

With that, I respectfully disagree with you and wish you the best in your pursuit of truth.

No.7's picture

The Egg Is Literally An Extreme Version ofThe Golden Rule

Do unto others as you do unto yourself... because the others are you as well. It would mean, don't screw someone over because it's gonna be you getting screwed later. I don't follow your train of thought. This idea puts a greater significance in morality in my opinion.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

Not necessarily... but maybe

If you mean that when an individual dies they are reborn on some other level of being based on their karma, then no, I have never witnessed or known anyone to witness such a thing.

If reincarnation is the universe living and dying and becoming reborn again within each individual creature, then this definition may be acceptable to me. The only reason I might take this into account is because to me, the universe is everything, including myself. Who knows, maybe we are also on the back of a spaghetti monster.

-Matthew Good

No.7's picture

Maybe, we might all be computer holograms

Our universe could be a speckle in a much larger universe. Like you said, who knows?

We could be an egg, our spirit growing through each life into another God as Andy Weir suggests.

Or we could all be random accidents floating through an incredibly dangerous space luckily flying through the chaos unscathed.

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

jrd3820's picture

I have always liked

the hologram theory. Or the avatar theory where we are all just being played as a part of a large video game or something. Kind of how we play sims (or some people do, I am not much into video games myself) or second life. I mean... we think we have free will, but how do I know that my responding to this right now is of free will or if it is because something is controlling me?

No.7's picture

Where do thoughts come from?

Could it be that everything I think is being typed somewhere else? Maybe!

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson

---

I think. Therefore I am. I think.

I don't care for video games either. Or electronics. In fact, being an outdoors and face to face person, I am surpised that I am on this mildly addictive board so much.

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

No.7's picture

I love video games! I love being outside too!

I was raised in the woods but I've had a nintendo since forever. My outdoor time these days is spent mostly on the golf course or frisbee golf course. Any other outdoor time comes fishing, hunting, or hiking.

If you don't mind me asking, what is your favorite outdoor activity?

Speaking of "I think. Therefore I am." Have you ever heard of the theory that we created God instead of God creating us? http://science.discovery.com/tv-shows/through-the-wormhole/v...

The individual who refuses to defend his rights when called by his Government, deserves to be a slave, and must be punished as an enemy of his country and friend to her foe. - Andrew Jackson