5 votes

Don't you just hate Leviticus?

Who doesn't? Even the Commander in Chief wants in on the action.


http://youtu.be/YUbf3purr_E

This is normal. It's not just the president that feels this way. I have seen the following list of questions on Leviticus floating around social media, and I thought, well, let's just answer these questions directly.

So that's what I'm going to do. You will be able to find my responses to the questions below in [brackets].

Remember, we hate this law. Romans 8:7 makes that quite clear. "Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be." Romans 8:7 KJV Translation

Here we go...

---

On her radio show, Dr Laura Schlesinger said that, as an observant Orthodox Jew, homosexuality is an abomination according to Leviticus 18:22, and cannot be condoned under any circumstance. The following response is an open letter to Dr. Laura, written by a U.S. man, and posted on the Internet. It's funny, as well as informative:

Dear Dr. Laura:

Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination ... End of debate.

I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some other elements of God's Laws and how to follow them.

1. Leviticus 25:44 states that I may possess slaves, both male and female, provided they are from neighboring nations. A friend of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?

[There are 2 reasons you cannot own Canadians. First, in our country, only the state can own slaves. So, if you want to own anyone, you are going to have to take it up with them. Second, the Canadians are from the same stock as Americans. Just a few generations ago we shared common blood. They would fall under the law of brothers, Hebrew servants. That means, according to Deuteronomy 15:12, they have to be released every 7 years. *Or he could sell himself to you through the year of Jubilee, or he could voluntarily stay with you forever. Lev 25:39-42; Deut 15:16-17]

2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for her?

[Marriage in Hebrew law is a 2 party contract between the man and the father of the bride. The man takes over guardianship of the woman and the liabilities that come with her. That is, he has to feed and clothe her. Exodus 21:10-11 makes that clear. With that in mind, you are free to charge as much as you like. Jacob agreed to work 7 years for his wife Rachel. But she may have been more valuable and better looking than your average girl. If you take the girl without asking the father, you pay 50 pieces of silver and the father can still refuse to give you his daughter. Deuteronomy 22:29 and Exodus 22:16-17.]

3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her period of Menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15: 19-24. The problem is how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.

[It is the responsibility of the woman to keep herself separate during menstruation. Menstrual blood is a bio hazard. If you touch an unclean woman or her bed, you wash and are unclean till evening. *It's not sin unless you are approaching the woman to uncover her nakedness or lie with her during her period. Lev 18:19 and 20:18]

4. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?

[No.]

5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill him myself, or should I ask the police to do it?

[No. If the police, judges, or elders will not enforce the law, then you have no right to take the matter into your own hands. Your neighbor has a right to stand before the judges and plead his case.]

6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an abomination, Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality. I don't agree. Can you settle this? Are there 'degrees' of abomination?

[Some abominations require capital punishment. The death penalty is not commanded for dietary laws, although the health and social effects may prove deadly.]

7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle-room here?

[This law applies to the Aaronic priests. Normal people do not keep the service of the altar. Glasses would pose a problem in this service.]

8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. 19:27. How should they die?

[The death penalty is not commanded for a violation of this law.]

9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?

[Better to use a different football. But if you do pick up a pig skin, wash your clothes, and be unclean till evening. Lev 11:25 *EDIT* Turns out, footballs are not made of pigskins.]

10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev.19:19 by planting two different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family affair, like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)

[No, the death penalty is not commanded for mixed seed or clothing. For blasphemy, yes, they are stoned. But there must be due process. Deuteronomy 17:2-4 *Also, the word "private" here is wrong.]

I know you have studied these things extensively and thus enjoy considerable expertise in such matters, so I'm confident you can help.

Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging.

Your adoring fan,

[*Edit* I think it was falsely attributed to]
James M. Kauffman, Ed.D. Professor Emeritus, Dept. Of Curriculum,
Instruction, and Special Education University of Virginia

P.S. It would be a damn shame if we couldn't own a Canadian.




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you don't have to condone homosexuality to

accept that the people that have that lifestyle have the right to it. But I also have the right to discrimate if I wish.

I don't condone it. Think it is weird, unnatural, deviant, etc. But I don't think denying them rights or outlawing that behavior is right either.

Leviticus this, Leviticus that..

Since the atheist like harping on this.. guess the Pres. is an atheist.

"Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal and unchanging."

Unchanging in the sense that He is able to keep it. Not unchanging in that His mind hasn't changed. The decisions are eternal.

We are now living under the New Testament and not the Old. The Old was for them, the New for us.

And, some people can't be pleased no matter what.

Why would a perfect being

Why would a perfect being ever need to change his mind? Wouldn't perfection imply that every choice he ever made was perfect and never needed revision? When I solve a series of math questions perfectly, I don't need to go back and revise.

Preconceived ideas

People have preconceived ideas about God, who they think He is or who He might be. How He behaves, how He works.

In junior high one year (my school), a student was taking a survey asking people what do you think God looks like? ..and in conclusion, most thought of Him as being like, "the old grey haired man" that was portrayed of Him at that time if only in people's minds. Was common at one time, not sure what the survey would represent now-a-days. So, God might not be who He was\is thought of being. God is "eternal", trust me or not, He doesn't have the "old man look", He is not an "old spiritual man creature, like being".

God might not be who you think He is.

I've heard this over and over

on this thread.

"We are now living under the New Testament and not the Old. The Old was for them, the New for us."

I don't mean to pick on you, but I'm going to answer them all by way of your comment. I think I could reply to about 20 people on this thread with this same comment. So listen, this is for all of you. :-)

The book of Titus was not addressed directly to me. 1&2Timothy and Philemon were not addressed to me. Does that mean I should not read those books and apply the teaching? No.

Most people forget that when the statement was made in Matthew 4:4,
"It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of YHUH"

not a word of the New Testament had been written.

The same said in Matthew 5:17 KJV, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil."

.

Hear, O Israel: YHUH our God YHUH one. And thou shalt love YHUH thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

You make this a Christian

You make this a Christian argument when it really is not. This is a natural law argument. There are things that go against nature. No matter how libertarian a person is they will not be able to eat stones and survive.

It so much of a natural law argument that atheist systems - which are under the other side of the spectrum and Antagonistic to Judeo Christianity - also recognized homosexuality as a disease. For example, Fidel Castro sent all prisoners and homosexuals to Miami during the Marielos incident.

Thanks for quoting Laura Schlessinger as she was blacked out and censored by the mainstream culture.

Meaning behind the words.

If this were truly a Christian nation it would have said Jesus Christ and not creator. The use of the word creator was used to show king George that he wasn't the supreme ruler and that something out there was above him whether it was god, nature, or whatever your mind can conjure up. It was used as a diss to the tyrant George and his power.

Jury Nullification is a power of the last resort against tyranny.

So much paper wasted on

So much paper wasted on bibles and so many beautiful buildings wasted on people that like to hang out and talk to themselves. I wish bible paper was softer so I could put it to good use, but it hurts the toosh.

Wipe your ass with another person's holy book?

It's an immature and intolerant comment, but you're perfectly free to say this in our country.

Of course you wouldn't have the balls to take your intolerance to a place like Saudi Arabia where you wouldn't be protected by Christian values. They may cut your head off.

Obviously not all religions are created equally.

What's more interesting is the hate that another person's metaphysical conclusions inspire in others. You have faith in your family, or friends, or relationships, but no faith in God, and that is your decision, but what help is it to you by mocking someone else for what they believe? Does it make you feel better? Do you feel superior? Do you feel more intelligent because you don't believe in hokey fairy tales written by people who didn't have scientific inquiry?

Let me ask you: Your science can help you build a nuclear bomb, but does it also tell you if it's right or wrong to use it?

Do you need a plagiarized

Do you need a plagiarized book to tell you its wrong to use that nuclear weapon? Please.

Dr. Paul

Do you think Dr. Paul likes Christ haters posting here?

No King but Jesus, no President but Ron Paul

Probably, because he loves

Probably, because he loves freedom and liberty. You don't like christ hating posts and I don't like christ loving posts. That's freedom of diversity my friend. And it's Michaels site, not Dr. Pauls.

Admits he's a hater

I didn't say it was Dr. Paul's site. See how dumb you are? You might try giving up your hate.

No King but Jesus, no President but Ron Paul

Now your personally attacking

Now your personally attacking me? Surely you know and understand the guidelines of this site. I don't hate anybody so you can chill with that. I'm an atheist, get over it.

alternate?

You obviously hate Christ and have no respect for Christians. The "personal attack" started with you. And since you see things that aren't there and don't appear to have a lot of reading comprehension, do you have another word other than dumb you would like me to use? That seemed rather tame out of all the choices that were available.

No King but Jesus, no President but Ron Paul

Sigh. Poor guy, I pity you.

Sigh. Poor guy, I pity you. All that I will say is that one can easily gauge a persons intellect when they resort to personal attacks because they lack the mental capacity to engage in debate. You've said absolutely nothing of substance. However unfortunate, it's to be expected. Take care bud, I still wish you all the best.

LOL

Pretty funny. You just described yourself. You attack Christ, Christians, and the Bible, say nothing of substance and when that's pointed out, you try to make it about me. And before you make your little goodbye speech, you're supposed to say something that uses the words "spew" and "venom." Didn't you know that?

No King but Jesus, no President but Ron Paul

Turn the other cheak brother

Turn the other cheak brother Spock.

But can we all just love one another?

and not hate each other's posts and words?

Why? I don't get along with

Why? I don't get along with EVERYONE in the real world, why should it be any different here? =)

But seriously I hate all Jesus freaks who thump their storybooks and have seizures in church.

I had forgotten to get back with you, but I wanted to let you

know that as far as having seisures in churches, I had a couple of verses that came to mind:

1 Corinthians 14:33 KJV
For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.

1 Corinthians 14:40 KJV
Let all things be done decently and in order.

IMO, those shows may be put on for several reasons: to inspire hatred & confusion, to gain money & power, to give a false report & counterfeit image of Christianity, and perhaps to cause division & diversion.

I don't get along with everyone, but I sure try to follow the Golden Rule as well as

Romans 12:18 KJV
If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

...

People have loved the words on that paper so much that they

have counted themselves fortunate to both clean and to collect it from the sewers of their oppressors

http://youtu.be/dGpONaKpDL0

Actually, the THING I hate is the SICK feeling I get everytime I

read the title to this post followed by the sick feeling I get when I am unable to reply to this post with the answer "NO" because I fear that those I think of as Friends in Liberty will hate me for saying, "No, I do not hate Leviticus." It was not written to me. It was written to the Children of Israel.

I love the Lord God and His Word. It is a Light unto my feet and a Lamp unto my path and I have hidden His Word in my heart so that I might not sin against Him. Psalm 119:11 & 105.

Actually Psalm 119 is the longest Psalm in the Bible. It is the longest Psalm with 176 verses that center around love of God's Word.

http://youtu.be/dVA3mxfsvKo

...

Makes me sick too

There is still a small remnant out there. The title does not apply to them.

Thanks for that Psalm. "74 They that fear thee will be glad when they see me; because I have hoped in thy word."

.

Hear, O Israel: YHUH our God YHUH one. And thou shalt love YHUH thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

I didn't take it

To be an insult...

I laughed out loud several times while reading it. I was raised in the church, attended private Christian schools for 9 years of my education, and met my husband (who is a preachers son) at youth camp, but I believe it is wrong to pick and choose which parts of the Bible you follow and which ones you ignore. If you are going to make a huge fuss over one thing to keep others from sinning you have to be consistent or you are a hypocrite. What's your position on gay marriage (because ultimately that is the reason for these posts)?

Ron Paul convert from the Heart of Dixie

Really?

Thank you for helping me out. I am probably too sensitive :)

I think the federal government should stay out of people's business. I also think that it is unfortunate that we are being divided and diced up in as many ways as possible to have everyone at everyone else's throat so we can be picked off in groups...one at a time.

It's easy to become defensive or "too sensitive"

When you are frequently forced to defend your beliefs. I think there are posts on DP which are anti-religion regularly, I just didn't see this as being one.

I completely agree with the second half of your comment.

Ron Paul convert from the Heart of Dixie

There are a lot of people who

There are a lot of people who believe a lot of differant things. If at times it tastes bad, try to remember that that is exactly what freedom is. The freedom to express thyself. Its not always pretty, its not nice all the time, but it beats the hell out of the alternative.

I make tons of anti-religeous posts, because I hate it and consider it early brainwashing that leads humanity into the habit of blindly accepting authrority and collectivism. That said, I would take 1 christian libertarian over x1000 athiest collectivists.

As was said above, the OP's topic seems to me 100% to be about pointing out the stupidity and hypocracy of christians taking a stand against homosexuals when they themselves are breaking nearly every other commandment in Leviticus (not to mention most of the top 10). You don't like gays, fine, but don't try to force your bigot "morals" onto others through law, and remember you are no angel yourself. Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone.

I don't think the christians quite understand how much damage these authoritarian zealot stances they make are doing to us. Opposing other people's rights based on one cherry-picked offense in the bible is exactly the sort of thing that makes liberals who might be our allies on many fronts HATE us. Many liberals care far more about civil liberties than blowing money, and would happily join a libertarian leaning conservative if they didn't have the perception that we were all psychotic zealots who want to set up a Theocracy and persecute non-christians with biblical nonsense. It may seem like an exageration, but its how the right is often viewed by the left. I know, its what I believed before Ron Paul woke me up.

If we are to win, we need to drop the social conservative bullshit. Like a rock. Even some of my most staunch libertarian pals out here voted against gay marriage. It makes me so mad, esspecially when they are pissing all over the rest of god's commandments in Leviticus with nearly every aspect of their lives and behavior.

Talking to your pillow each night and going to a building with other delusional people on Sundays does not make you better, or deserving of more rights than homosexual citizens, or anyone else for that matter. You believe it pleases your god, and that should be enough. Feel free to try to persuade others to change their evil ways, but the moment you attempt to use the government as a club to force your will on others, you are an enemy of liberty.

It's clear

that you completely missed my point. Did you read my first comment? I agree with pretty much everything you said. Maybe that's why I wasn't offended by this thread at all. In fact, my husband heard me laughing out loud when I was reading it and came to see what I was laughing at. He found it funny, as well. Like I stated above... I was raised in the church my entire life. However, I actually do not currently attend any church at all. Why? Because hypocrisy pisses me off and I tend to focus on it when I see it. Plus, I now question everything (EVERYTHING) I ever knew to be true, but that's less of a factor.

Personally, I don't think there are any libertarian Christians who try to "force" their "authoritarian zealot stances" on people. That goes against the most basic principles of libertarianism as I understand it, therefore, it is my belief, they can not be both libertarian AND authoritarian. They may claim to be, but they are mistaken.

Now, what I said was that when you are insulted by someone who does not think like you (which I acknowledge that nobody is required to do), it is easy to become defensive. If I were to call you a "ignorant Godless sinner" because you do not think like me it would make you angry (as your above comment shows) because you have the right to believe what you want to. Likewise, if you call a Christian a "delusional hypoctical bigot" who likes to "brainwash" people (which BTW is a collectivist way of thinking), it will also make them angry because they too have the freedom to believe what they want to.

Regardless of WHO is insulting who... you're not going to make many friends that way. It's childish and it needs to stop. We aren't ever going to be able to get past these differences and make changes to the path this country is on if we are constantly arguing about who is right on this issue. Bottom line is IT DOES NOT MATTER WHO IS RIGHT. It's a moot point, and if we do not get passed this and unite to accomplish our ultimate goal, which is liberty, then we are guaranteed to have tyrrany.

Ron Paul convert from the Heart of Dixie

I wasn't actually responding

I wasn't actually responding to your post.

When I say things that sound insulting, you might note that im directing them at those who try to get laws passed to force their morality on others. If you're not one of those, then its not directed at you. If you are, you deserve it.

I would love to think that there are no libertarian christians who think this way, but you'd be mistaken sadly. I recently got into it with one of the greatest libertarian activists I know because he voted against the gay marriage bill in our state. You're of course right, it "does" go against everything we politically believe.

I agree you can't be a libertarian and an authoritarian at the same time, though I think you can pretend to be one or the other with a lot of success through your life. Infact you could even believe in "earthly" individualism, however a man may not serve two masters and you must ask yourself: Is god a president who derives his rights from the people, or is he a king who gives and takes rights from his serfs as he pleases? Does he respect your right to prviacy? What happens to you if you don't worship him?

When push comes to shove, you "must" believe god is perfect, and thus monarchy is the best form of government so long as you have a perfect ruler, since heaven is setup as a monarchy, not a individualist republic. Just symantics really, but I believe when we teach our children to believe in such things, such as supernatural things, authrority figures we must obey without question and collectivist systems of government, we are preparing their minds to default back to Collectivism as their default state of organizing themselves. Religeon is one of those societal control mechanisms that insures the elites stay in power. It reinforces our "belief" in authority.