-119 votes

Truthers continue to see what they want to see.

Let me give you an example, and then I will go off on my rant.

Regarding the passport: You guys only see what you want to see. Why don't you list every item that survived? Drivers licenses survived, entire arms and other limbs, clothes, etc. Tons of things survived, but you frame the argument like only the passport survived. They already had flight manifests. They knew who was on those flights. There was no reason at all to plant a passport. The fact of the matter is that tons of things survived, not just a passport, and planting a passport would have been useless. It only seems like it matters to you guys because you want it to matter. If it was a conspiracy, don't you think the real cover up would have been about how they faked the flight manifest?

You people just continue to see what you want to see, regardless of how ridiculous it is. You take every bit of flimsy evidence and force it to support your conspiracy. Check that, I shouldn't even call it "evidence' because it isn't. It is a lack of evidence that you have. You invent questions about the incident and when you can't wrap your brain around reason and logic, you take every stupid thing any witness ever said and cling to it as if it were straight from God's mouth to your ears. You twist logic to fit your own narrative so you can feed your feable need to feel important on a national scale, like somehow the nation is reading your posts.

I remember when this sight was about liberty and free market capitalism. I remember when people here discussed topics related to the ideas Ron Paul was bringing up every day. You all have driven those fine people away with your own ignorant lack of critical thinking. I enjoyed those people. We shared information and learned together. I don't enjoy you people. You spread fallacy through verbosity. You post every tiny scrap of psuedo-evidence no matter how easily refutable, rendering the rest of us simply too tired to continue to address your never ending pile of fiction.

And worst of all, you continue to move the goal post, to the point that no amount of debunking will ever satisfy you because you will simply wait for the next bit of psuedo-evidence to come out, and if that evidence isn't readily available, you resort back to the old time honored defense of "All I know is that I don't believe the official story". And that only creates another fallacy you all love, the false dillema, where you try to shoot holes in the official story thinking that it somehow proves your story is true, only you don't even have a coherent story to back up. If I point out all the inconsistency in the Bible, does that somehow prove that Thor is real? You need evidence in support of your story, not lack of evidence in support of their's. You people don't have evidence. You don't have a story. What you do have unfortunately, and in abundance, is a never ending supply of fallacies.

As a middle school teacher, part of my curriculum is teaching fallacies, so when I claim you are using them in abundance, I'm not speaking generally. You are using them in abundance and it is killing your argument. The sad part, is that even if you all were right, your constant use of fallacy and lack of logical skills has driven away countless people who might have actually cared.

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Thanks for demonstrating...

precisely what's wrong with the Daily Paul right now. Can't handle an opposing view, so you have to try to downvote and censor it instead.

I don't play, I commission the league.

What view am I opposing??

And how am I censoring anyone?? Do tell.

Go find my first post on this thread and read it.

Resist the temptation to feed the trolls.


How has snake's post been censored? It's still on the active forum topics list. The downvotes do nothing but represent the sentiment of the DP.

ecorob's picture

I AM a Truther!

You ARE a liar.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.


Straight to the name calling. Always a high level argument coming from you.

A liar?

Couldn't I just be mistaken? Why do I have to be a liar just because we disagree?

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

Ok Mr. School teacher. How

Ok Mr. School teacher. How about you take some time and watch this and tell me where the M.I.T. Professor of Physics (and 1500 other engineers) are just reporting fallacies. I don't know what subject you teach but I'm guessing it isn't metallurgy or physics or we wouldn't be having this discussion.


Live Free or Die Trying

Jefferson's picture


only connection this dude has to a "school" is probably lurking around the playground.
We used to have another class clown around here that claimed he was a "high school physics teacher." He also didn't have any explanation as to why he would spend all day on here "debunking" evidence during school hours. Go figure. He'd get pummeled on a daily basis like one of those inflatable boppo clowns, and he'd still rise back up with that creepy look on his face. My knuckles are still sore. (that's why I rarely get involved in these pissing matches anymore)
No offense, but he's not interested in your youtube link. People that initiate multiple threads like this usually aren't. They are a giant black hole of time and energy imho.

sharkhearted's picture



Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

Take that "Truthers"!

What kind of idiots want to know the truth?

High Ranking US Major General Exposes September 11

He was in charge of the militaries entire strategic intelligence.


Jefferson's picture


if you're a "teacher" then why aren't you in school "teaching?"

How did the molten rivers of

How did the molten rivers of steel that didn't cool for months, and was infrared photographed from outer space happen?

What about Payne Stewart?

Just a few months prior to 911 golfer Payne Stewart boarded a plane in Florida and was headed towards Texas. Something went wrong and the pilot and passengers were overtaken by lack of oxygen and passed out. Less than 15 minutes into the flight a fighter jet was scrambled because the pilot was not responding to flight control. The Fighter jet was alongside in minutes and followed the plane to the Dakotas where it ran out of fuel and crashed. It only took minutes for a jet to respond to a private jet. Why do you think a fighter jet was not dispatched to any of the planes that crashed once it was reported that the pilot was not responding and changing from its flight plan? There are a lot of unanswered questions but you can go ahead and believe the Popular Mechanics version of what happened if you want. Just don't tell someone with an engineering background that the buildings fell at free fall speed without any resistance from the supporting structure below. So what if you are a teacher. My sister is a doctor and I don't think she knows everything about medicine. Get over yourself. We all have reasons to doubt the officials stories that the MSM would like us to believe. Look up the Northwoods Document. Learn what your government was capable of back in the 60's and see if you don't change your mind about the possibilities.


"So what if you are a teacher. Get over yourself"
So what if you have an engineering background? Get over yourself.

You claim that you know something about engineering because you have that background.
I claim that I know something about fallacies because I currently teach fallacies to students.

I wasn't bragging any more than you were. However I'm impressed that in one paragraph, you listed your credentials to be speaking about engineering as if it helps your argument but then you also insulted my credentials to be speaking about fallacies, as if it hurts my argument.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

ecorob's picture



Excuse me while I leave the room as I am laughing so hard now at your "credentials" that I can not possibly stand it for very much longer!

Please tell me where you teach so I can enroll in your class just so I can stand up in front of you and all of your captive listeners and tell you just where you can stick your "fallacies".

You hold children for ransom! You won't give them a good grade unless they buy into your BS. I would get a standing ovation in a minute and you would have a meltdown.

Academia, fallacies...? ROFLMAO Stop it man. This is a joke, right? Surely, you can't be serious?

What a waste of tuition money.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

Was any of this....

...supposed to refute the posts I've written. This is just one big insult. You didn't even attempt to debate any point I've made.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

Your fallacies

are based on other men's "peer reviewed" (or should I say politically reviewed) fallacies.

How can you debunk math when math deals in absolutes? Here, i'll give you, the teacher, an example:

2 + 2 = 4. I can physically count 2 fingers on my left hand and 2 fingers on my right hand to have a total of 4 fingers raised in the air. Everyone reading this WILL agree that two fingers plus two fingers is a total of 4 fingers. K, good.

When you tell me that fires brought down the WTC buildings, I have to say you are full of shit because it's mathmatically IMPOSSIBLE for fires (and ONLY fires, as per the NIST report) to bring down a steel-reinforced concrete buildling. The first time it ever happened was on 9/11.

You just can't beat science, Mr. Teacher. I still think that you believe 9/11 wasn't an inside job because you don't want to be labeled a "truther" or "conspiracy theorist," but that's my opinion.

If you don't know your rights, you don't have any.

Nobody has given me a math problem

which I've claimed to be a fallacy. Every argument which I've labeled a fallacy has been the commentors description of the argument. None of it has been a math problem which I've tried to label a fallacy. You, like many others here, have just made a claim that "math exists about this issue which you can't refute, because math is absolute". Yet none of you actually give the "math". You just make comments like "physics doesn't allow for a building to fall that way". But you never actually produce the physics.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

I have another question about the Pentagon

As many probably know they did find an engine in the debris of the impact site. From what I understand the engine from one of these planes are about 7' in diameter. But the engine they found was about 2' in diameter, was one of the fire fighters a magician or what?

for proof go to video in plane sight and start at 25 min.


Surviving the killing fields of Minnesota

Todays brainwashing: GMO's are safe

757 engine

Good, honest question. Now we

Good, honest question. Now we are getting somewhere.

Here is your answer.


Skip to the images for a short explanation =)

Thanks very good website

I will be going back to read more later, their description could be correct.

I noticed they talked about Zacarias Moussaoui the only terrorist to stand trail for 9/11. The problem he was arrested weeks before the 9/11 event in Minneapolis. The FBI agent tried to warn her bosses about the plot, but fell on deaf ears.

If I remember right she eventually was forced to leave the FBI. The only way I heard about it was because she was on the local news for almost stopping 9/11.

I am not trying to start any conspiracy, but just pointing out how incompetent our Government is.

Surviving the killing fields of Minnesota

Todays brainwashing: GMO's are safe

Wow whats the chances of that

Wow whats the chances of that lol.

What? The CIA gave you the

What? The CIA gave you the same link as me? =P

This Disturbs Me

There's nothing wrong with having a healthy distrust of the government. It's not unusual that the official version of an event doesn't add up. I think it's mostly due to government incompetence and the subsequent cover-up of said incompetence. But it's still a huge leap going from a healthy distrust and jumping to an absurd conclusion that the entire event did not happen as everyone saw it.

The promoters of said conclusions will take one discrepancy and seize on it to discredit the entire event. But they ignore all supportive evidence. For every one eyewitness that remembers something incorrectly, there are a hundred with a clear memory of the actual event. For example there are literally hundreds of people who saw the plane fly over Route 95 before it crashed into the Pentagon, but they are all discounted in favor of the one person who doesn't remember it that way. It's just a form of selective belief.

Maybe I'm psychoanalyzing here, but I think emotional immaturity is at the core of these delusions. Maybe deep down, the event is just too tragic for them to accept. Same goes with Sandy Hook. I live in the area and happen to have a friend who knows one of the families who lost a child -- and yet there are dozens of websites that insist the event never happened. We're told that there are discrepancies, but it's seems to be more of a selective belief than a rational conclusion.

Much more tactful than what I said.

Way to keep cool!

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

Great post though. I'm

Great post though. I'm disappointed in what the Daily Paul has become lately. I always thought of libertarians as more rational and now I see that I was mistaken. I think Dr. Paul would be embarrassed. I've been spending more time on Ron Paul Forums these days. Better source for actual news.

I characterized these forums

I characterized these forums as militantly christian, anti Semitic, a little racist and absolutely paranoid after the primaries and I think I'm spot on.

The thing is that I think there are a lot more rationalist out there but they are less willing by their very nature to be confrontational. Posts like yours will help them know they are not alone.

Has anyone else seen this video

from the official photographer (gov't) sent to ground zero? How can anyone deny what he testifies to? He's in exile because of the harrassment of our wonderful government.