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Robb Wolf discusses the Paleo diet and health issues

I urge everyone to actually listen to the clip.

Robb Wolf - “I became very ill eating a vegan diet. I had ulcerative colitis, IBS and a host of other problems. I had started eating a vegan diet thinking this was a healthy way of eating. At the time, I was a research biochemist, and someone suggested that my problems might be resolved with the adoption of an ancestral (Paleo) way of eating. Within a few weeks of adopting a Paleo diet, my ulcerative colitis was gone, as were my other health concerns. I’ve been eating this way for 15 years now and have experienced better health than at any previous point in my life. Although the Paleo diet advocates the consumption of animal products, it is a thoughtful way of eating congruent with both ethics and sustainability, and I make this a large part of the education I provide.”

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water is one of the 6

essential nutrients and one of the 4
macronutrients
http://www.foodpyramid.com/6-essential-nutrients/

H2o

"Do not wait until you feel thirsty. It may already mean that you may be slightly dehydrated."
according to Amy Lowy RD
http://www.shapefit.com/why-water-is-important.html

Fat Metabolism, Glycerol, and

Fat Metabolism, Glycerol, and Improved Hydration

Alongside these factors, the foods typically consumed within a paleo-template are what I would label “wet” foods – foods that tend to have an inherent amount of water contained within them. All of the starchy root vegetables, bananas, and berries that I eat contain water, and I no longer consume foods, such as grains, which don’t.
.
.
.
So if consumption of glycerol directly allows for an improvement in hydration status, and an increase in fat metabolism that goes with eating a diet more consistent with our evolutionary biology also releases glycerol directly into the bloodstream, then it only seems to follow, in my mind, that such a diet can also enhance hydration status (in the context of the other factors I’ve discussed above). When a fatty acid, such as palmitic acid is metabolised for energy, the net result is the gain of 16 molecules of water for every molecule of palmitic acid metabolised. It could be that the glycerol released from fat metabolism helps hold this water in the body – something that perhaps doesn’t happen to the same extent when the system is heavily geared toward carbohydrate metabolism.

It also wouldn’t stretch the brain too far to imagine how such a system may have been advantageous from a natural selection stand point. And it is a system that is seemingly advantageous in a modern context too… carrying a drink bottle everywhere is just so tedious…

if that works for you great

but from what i'm seeing there are many disadvantages to the paleo method, the most obvious is that the paleo gurus bloat and fall out of shape as they age. from what you're saying perhaps water retention could be part of the problem.

LOW CARB PALEO PRIMAL WAPF diet gurus: why they get fat eventually!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8L10cNeABbA

Ron Rosedale, MD, age: late 60s,


Ron Rosedale, MD, age: late 60s, early 70s

http://carbsanity Say no

http://carbsanity

Say no more. Just as you shouldn't stand up a doping vegan as the model of vegan physique, you probably shouldn't stand up someone who has spent her entire blogging career trying defying nature and her own metabolic hormones and failing to lose excess body fat.

To your original point, Ron Rosedale is a long term low carb adherent who is old and not fat. Yet another example disproving the base rate fallacy you committed claiming low carb/paleo gurus become fat over time.

i don't care to be told

what i should or shouldn't do. and i don't believe rosedale would appreciate being called old regardless of his age. & again (see other post) many of them do get fat. BTW do common manners come with the paleo approach because the pushy tone to most of your comments, accusations, and your either/or philosophy all smacks of being infected with the right virus.

http://www.amazon.com/Carbophobia-Scary-Truth-Americas-Low-C...

BTW do common manners come

BTW do common manners come with the paleo approach because the pushy tone to most of your comments, accusations, and your either/or philosophy all smacks of being infected with the right virus.

Maybe it would help if you were more informed on the intervention you advocate rather than being dismissive of those you don't understand? It's fine to be vegan or vegetaarian or whatever, but at least know metabolically what part works and doesn't work. If you're tired of being called out, stop making hasty generalizations.


Christopher Gardner, PhD, Stanford Univ, self proclaimed vegetarian

January 17, 2008 presentation by Christopher Gardner for the Stanford School of Medicine Medcast lecture series.

The case for low-carbohydrate diets is gaining weight. Christopher Gardner, PhD, assistant professor of medicine at the Stanford Prevention Research Center, has completed the largest and longest-ever comparison of four popular diets using real-world conditions, which he discusses - the lowest-carbohydrate Atkins diet came out on top.

when you are called out

you simply ignore it, so why shouldn't i? i came here interested in hearing about various eating plans and health advice, and batting it all around, but after these exchanges with you i'm mostly turned off by your approach due to your negativity and poor manners. you come off like a know it all, my way or the highway type advocate. and although you seem not to want to admit it various approaches work for different people, and a lot of it is common sense. this little tiff goes back to when i called you out for having an obvious chip on your shoulder, and evidently you've never gotten over that because since then you've only added to it.

you simply ignore it, so why

you simply ignore it, so why shouldn't i? i came here interested in hearing about various eating plans and health advice, and batting it all around, but after these exchanges with you i'm mostly turned off by your approach due to your negativity and poor manners. you come off like a know it all, my way or the highway type advocate. and although you seem not to want to admit it various approaches work for different people, and a lot of it is common sense. this little tiff goes back to when i called you out for having an obvious chip on your shoulder, and evidently you've never gotten over that because since then you've only added to it.

Negativity and poor manners? Is that's how you rationalize your cognitive dissonance? I have no chip on my shoulder, certainly not related to your personal diet and nutrition choices. As long as your choices do not affect me, you're free to make the best choices you can.

have it your way

nice to know i'm free to make my own choices though. gee thanks.

here's a snippet from a conversation with a real nutrition expert, dr. joel fuhrman. in moments he cuts through a ton of BS IMO.

http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/dr-joel-fuhrman-reveals-top-5...

"Dr. Oz investigates the

"Dr. Oz investigates the popular protein-packed diet that promises big results!"
http://www.doctoroz.com/videos/paleo-diet-craze-pt-1

S Boyd Eaton 74 years old


S Boyd Eaton 74 years old

contrast

s boyd eaton
contrast
"So after reading Cordain's the Paleo Diet, I did a little looking into the history of the Paleo Diet. I got a hold of the original NEJM article, The Paleo Prescription and The Stone-Age Health Program (all from the 1980s).

"What Eaton/Konner recommend is quite different from what most people here would call paleo:
60/20/20 carbs, protein, fat
Pretty much no red meat/pork unless its game meat.
Diary such as skim milk, cottage cheese is fine.
Whole grains are good for you. Whole wheat toast is not a bad thing.
Eat all the night-shades you want.

"Of course, there are plenty of places where everyone would agree:

"Refined carbs are the tool of the devil.
You should eat more polyunsatured than monounsatured, and satured is to be very limited in quantity

"I guess when I have time I'll read through it all and maybe give a review, but I found the contrast interesting. From wiki:

"In 1985, Melvin Konner and S. Boyd Eaton, an associate clinical professor of radiology and an adjunct associate professor of anthropology at Emory University, published a key paper on Paleolithic nutrition in the New England Journal of Medicine,[30] which allowed the dietary concept to gain mainstream medical recognition.[31] Three years later, S. Boyd Eaton, Marjorie Shostak and Melvin Konner published a book about this nutritional approach,[32] which was based on achieving the same proportions of nutrients (fat, protein, and carbohydrates, as well as vitamins and minerals) as were present in the diets of late Paleolithic people, not on excluding foods that were not available before the development of agriculture. As such, this nutritional approach included skimmed milk, whole-grain bread, brown rice, and potatoes prepared without fat, on the premise that such foods have the same nutritional properties as Paleolithic foods.[27][33][34] In 1989, these authors published a second book on Paleolithic nutrition."[35][36]

-the noble savage

and at the end

of the video i posted were a whole slew of older fit and healthy vegans and vegetarians, and most, i notice from both schools are big on exercise, that certainly makes sense, since exercise, along with previously mentioned water is another of the 8 principles of good health. now i'm going to go have some chocolate chip cookies, but not as a guilty pleasure, but, as like ron paul says, because they're so darn good.

77 year old vegan
http://www.examiner.com/article/unbelievably-ripped-77-year-...

(except for fish)

http://www.examiner.com/article/unbelievably-ripped-77-year-...

Morris started eliminating animal protein from his diet (except for fish) in 1974, and then converted to a 100% vegan diet 13 years ago.

Morris, who gets a weekly injection of vitamin B-12 and testosterone (it's unclear if these are from plant-based sources), says ethical reasons are the key drivers for his vegan lifestyle.

T-therapy... he's doping.

Excessive protein to build muscle is a bodybuilding folklore. Protein requirements are actually quite modest, even for a gifted bodybuilder.

I'm not sure I would have used a doping vegan as a model for the lifestyle. FWIW, Art Devany claims his T-levels are on par with an 18 year old. No doping, just diet. No need for B-12 injections, either.

13 years ago

he gave up fish and i don't blame him, unless one
can get wild fish, like sockeye salmon. doping? i guess. i've never
had an interest in body building. i just threw that link up from a quick
search.
here's another on a quick search:
http://vegetarian.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=00...

so how about some paleo women now? here's 10 vegan/vegetarian. let's see
10 paleo beauties.
http://www.starpulse.com/news/index.php/2012/09/19/10_hot_ce...

but from what i'm seeing

but from what i'm seeing there are many disadvantages to the paleo method, the most obvious is that the paleo gurus bloat and fall out of shape as they age.

Base rate fallacy...


Art Devany, 75 years old


Stephen D. Phinney, 66 years old

from what you're saying perhaps water retention could be part of the problem.... LOW CARB PALEO PRIMAL WAPF diet gurus: why they get fat eventually!

Wait, isn't one of the criticisms of low carb weight loss is that it's all water weight?

let's dig a little deeper

De Vany

"...at least some Paleo ideas contradict leading thinking about the biomechanics of human evolution. Modern advocates of paleo-style exercise argue for the value of short bursts of cardiovascular exertion that may also include hauling a heavy weight, as you might after a successful hunt. "[N]o caveman ever jogged for miles while pursuing dinner or being chased by a predator," writes De Vany. "You either or sprinted or starved, or were dinner yourself."

"But that's not true, says human evolutionary biologist Daniel Lieberman, who runs a skeletal biology research lab at Harvard University. In fact, it's "demonstrably wrong," he insists. The human talent for long-distance running is unique among primates, and it's one we came by out of necessity. Some two million years ago, we began to develop a suite of adaptations, key among them sweating, that allowed for sustained exertion and were fully in place by Paleolithic times.

"Meta-data on nearly 500 hunter-gatherer tribes analyzed by Lieberman's Harvard colleague Frank Marlowe indicates that your average Paleolithic hunter probably ran up to 14 km (9 mi.) a day during persistence hunting, in which the group tracked and chased prey until the beast collapsed from overheating."

http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,2044343,00.html

i've also read on various blogs that he's a big bragger. too bad. i don't care for braggers, or people who are all full of themselves, fit or not.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,2044343,00.ht...

He's old and not fat...

i've also read on various blogs that he's a big bragger. too bad. i don't care for braggers, or people who are all full of themselves, fit or not.

Not sure how that's verifiable. But, he is 75 years old with body composition and metabolism of an 18 year old without T-therepy. And, he's an example of a long term paleo adherent who is not fat, disproving the base rate fallacy you committed.

i don't think he'd

appreciate you calling him old, especially with his rep.

no denying he's a very fit man up in his years. of course there are plenty who look like that who are vegan too, but back to my statement. let me revise: there are a number (enough for an entire youtube clip) of low carb gurus who bloat and fall out of shape. remember i based the first assessment on what i'd seen so far, and those examples are all plenty damning, and all are well known spokesmen, and one woman.

did you watch the video by the brit?

pretty jaw dropping, and one case after another..
now these guys you present are terrific, and it's interesting one is considered the grandaddy. they could be the types who would flourish on various eating/exercise plans, but agreed they look great.

i don't know about that criticism but i do wonder why so many get fat. even paleo fans are wondering:

paleo followers frustrated and confused
as to why their gurus have fallen out of shape.
some of the excuses are pretty funny, like:
"they get a pass because they're researchers"
http://paleohacks.com/questions/77266/is-anybody-else-frustr...

...

http://www.dailypaul.com/283421/judge-andrew-napolitano-lose...

Resist the temptation to feed the trolls.

the article you link to

at the paleo page has no mention of factor 4, which the judge says is an appetite suppressant that he takes a bunch of times every day.

it's also interesting that they put down mackey who is already lean by eating a plant based diet.

Why You Got Fat

i do wonder why so many get fat


Why You Got Fat

Dr. Michael R. Eades in that video is at least in his upper 60s if not into 70 years old.

and to hell with everybody else

you guys are too much.

When the Iranian Revolution broke out in 1979, Dr. Batmanghelidj was placed in the infamous Evin Prison as a political prisoner for two years and seven months. It was there he discovered the healing powers of water. One night, Dr. B. had to treat a fellow prisoner with crippling peptic ulcer pain. With no medications at his disposal, Dr. B. gave him two glasses of water. Within eight minutes, his pain disappeared. He was instructed to drink two glasses of water every three hours and became absolutely pain free for his four remaining months in the prison. Dr. B. successfully treated 3,000 fellow prisoners suffering from stress-induced peptic ulcer disease with water alone. While in prison he conducted extensive research into the medicinal effects of water in preventing and relieving many painful degenerative diseases. Evin proved an ideal "stress laboratory," and despite his being offered an earlier release, Dr. B. chose to stay an extra four months in prison to complete his research into the relationship of dehydration and bleeding peptic ulcer disease. The report of his findings was published as the editorial of the Journal of Clinical Gastroenterology in June 1983. The New York Times Science Watch reported this discovery on June 21, 1983.

On his release from prison in 1982, Dr. Batmanghelidj escaped from Iran and came to America. At the Foundation for the Simple in Medicine he began to research the effect of chronic unintentional dehydration on the human body. His findings were published in the Foundation's "Journal of Science in Medicine Simplified" in 1991 and 1992. They can be read on the web site www.watercure.com.

Nobody mentioned wine or car insurance either.

Most curious.

Resist the temptation to feed the trolls.

i guess you could make a case

for wine. i definitely enjoy a glass at a special meal, but on a regular basis i'd recommend grapes, and the red ones. cheers!

neither wine

nor car insurance are essential nutrients or one of the 4 macronutrients.