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Skeptical Libertarian: "The Four Dumbest Conspiracy Claims About Boston"

I'll be vilified by some for sharing this, but....

As libertarians, many of us embrace the credo: "Question everything." But "everything" means everything, including the theories advanced by our fellow libertarians. To put it another way: If something comes from the mainstream media, we're justified in giving it deep scrutiny, but just because something didn't emerge from the mainstream media doesn't make it true.

Here's my favorite excerpt from this article:

This is how conspiracy theorizing works: anything can be interpreted as evidence for the “theory.” Bomb dogs present? Government was in on it. Bomb dogs not present? Government was in on it. High security? Government knew. Light security? Government knew. No photos of victims? No victims. Photos of victims? Fakes and actors. Police don’t catch a suspect? They let him escape on purpose. Police caught suspect? Framed patsy. Security cameras show suspects? Photoshop. Cameras don’t show them? Cover up.

For some healthy skepticism about some of the week's Boston theories, read on:
http://blog.skepticallibertarian.com/2013/04/17/the-4-dumbes...

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I too am a methodological skeptic

But I agree with the post below conspiracy enthusiasts do us a favor. They expose this stuff and I personally don't have time to. They may be driven to do so in a way that we aren't, but if they weren't there's a lot of stuff we might never find out about.

To skeptics I say, rock on, but having a bias in favor of the official story is just as wrong as having one in favor of the unofficial. It's not wrong just because an overeager person gets excited and post the info in all cap.

To enthusiasts I say, "Thank you!", but I would remind them once the excitement is over, that everything is not always a set up. Sometimes you might need to look at it and think, well maybe this one wasn't a set up, the dots don't connect enough. Doesn't mean you have to give up completely but back burner it pending further data.

And don't take it personally and get bent out of shape when everyone doesn't come along as quickly as you think they should.

For myself, I may not always see it, but I do very much appreciate the work.

The point is...

The public should look close and ask questions. It is every public servants duty to do their best to answer them.

The article seemed to me to take on only the most ridiculous statements, or weakened and simplified versions of what could be sensible questions. The hat with the skull on it for one, it would mean nothing if there had been one in the crowd, but what about MANY on individuals all dressed identically with backpacks which look like what the Government and Media are showing being used in the attack. Its not exactly proof, but doesn't it bring up a few questions?

The idea of a drill being conducted isn't proof, but there is a pattern here: 911, the UK subway bombing...

Drills have been reported being conducted at nearly all attacks in the last decade, apparently practicing for the very thing which then happens. Maybe this is coincidence? But doesn't the public have a right to know something about it? The government is becoming less visible not more, and whistle blowers go to prison for informing the public...

It is good to examine the questions being asked, and it is good to be critical, but the article seems more like an attack ad than anything bringing clarity and focus.

Just My Opinion.

That is why I was trying to

That is why I was trying to offer a perhaps more balanced, and more appreciative, take from a skeptic.

I do agree the public should be at least skeptical of official stories in general given the historical record. It's not unreasonable to assume anything the rulers say is probably a deception, but this needs to be demonstrated in each case. Occasionally the bad guys tell the truth on accident:)

It is error alone which needs the support of government. Truth can stand by itself. - Thomas Jefferson

I think we all have talents and skills to help each other. Conspiracy enthusiasts as well make their valuable contribution.

The Unintended Consequences of the Boston Massacre:

THE SPECIFIC INDICTMENT of Bush Jr/Obama/CIA/US Military “Torture of 9/11 Prisoners” at GITMO—FINALLY CONFIRMED as a “WAR CRIME”-- Equivalent to Prosecuted Nazi War Crimes and the Torture/ Internship Of Japanese Americans During WWII. Nothing beats a sensational front page news story like a Boston Marathon Massacre! Most readers would miss the incidental but far more serious implication for the moral compass of America than the NY Times story by Scott Shane, entitled, “U.S. Practiced Torture After 9/11, Non Partisan Review Concludes”.In this article, both Asa Hutchinson [Republican/Bush Jr Administration] and James R. Jones [Democrat, Congress] indict the interrogation and tortures committed by Presidents Clinton [Rendition], Bush Jr [full menu of tortures], Obama [Bush Jr in Black Face]. In essence, this bipartisan report, along with 6,000 pages of still classified docs IMPLICATES THREE ADMINISTRATIONS of INTERNATIONAL WAR CRIMES—RENDITION, TORTURE, ENHANCED INTERROGATION. this report came out on the same day as the Boston Massacre: http://pieczenik.blogspot.com/2013/04/the-unintended-consequ...

jhon

Conspiracy Theorists Actually are Doing us a Favor

You are correct that everything must be questioned. Conspiracy by it's very nature does not readily give up it's secrets. So any suspicions about the veracity of what we are presented as "truth" about an event must always begin as "theory". All of us have a different "life's experience". So some of us may "see" things in an event that match up with the experience of "smelling a rat". Hence the beginnings of a "theory" is born. As with any theory the hard work of careful and meticulous research is needed to move the theory to the point of fact or to disprove it altogether.

The important thing about all these "theorists" sounding all these alarms (and this is key) is that their theories may fall on the ears of someone capable of initiating methodical research that may actually prove something.

Here's a case in point with 9/11. Early on, everything rumored about 9/11 was theory. In fact 9/11 created the most incredible rumor mill ever seen in our generation. Some of these rumors fell on the ears of Steven Jones who happened to be a nuclear physicist. Initially, he blew it off, but after being approached several times he decided to see if he could do some scientific research into the matter. It was his research with the help of other key people that lent strong support to the fact 9/11 actually was a real conspiracy (and now no longer "theory") that involved the U.S. government. I covered his research in my article here:

http://www.dailypaul.com/280404/its-time-to-put-this-9-11-co...

Yet there are still no shortage of theories on 9/11. Even though we now know as fact that 9/11 really was a conspiracy involving elements within the U.S. government there are aspects of 9/11 that still remain inconclusive. Was the Pentagon hit by a missile or was it hit by a plane? There are credible theories that can suggest either. A lot of research has been done on this aspect of 9/11 yet there is still insufficient evidence to prove one or the other. The research on that marches on. Thanks to the heads up from the conspiracy theorists we may finally learn the truth about what happened at the Pentagon.

Yes, the Alex Joneses and Jim Stones of the world are doing us a real service by promoting these theories. They have a life's experience that we don't have and, just maybe, they see something that we should take a closer look at. They are giving us a "heads up, that there may be something wrong here". It's up to the rest of us, if we are capable, to do the real research.

-Bloatedtoad

You've made an excellent point

...but I must question your motives. What else can I question?

We all want progress, but if you're on the wrong road, progress means doing an about-turn and walking back to the right road; in that case, the man who turns back soonest is the most progressive.

-C. S. Lewis

Cyril's picture

"Government is guilty until proven innocent."

As much as I'm not fundamentally anti-government, a priori, I do agree with this, oft-quoted by a fellow Daily Pauler - he'll recognize himself, just giving my own view angle here, maybe not his:

"Government is guilty until proven innocent."

The sole rationale for that, on this end, is also from a well-known quote (correctly attributed or not):

that's simply because government is NOTHING but FORCE.

It is not reason. Or right. Or morality. Or law. Or justice. Or art. Or science. Or "Hope".

Indeed, government is only, purely, strictly, just... FORCE.

On that basis, and in the very specific case of "terrorism" (*) I find actually MUCH MORE far fetched to think, upfront, about an enemy AMONG the people against other people, than an enemy AMONG the government against the people - much more consistent with the essential nature of government and in which direction it can go wrong.

But sure, just IMO.

YMMV.

Peace.

(*) as opposed to, say, bank or home robbery, etc

"Cyril" pronounced "see real". I code stuff.

http://Laissez-Faire.Me/Liberty

"To study and not think is a waste. To think and not study is dangerous." -- Confucius

I guess the FBI must be full of conspiracy theorists

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/feds_have_men_in_sight...

FBI wants to pull in and interrogate the two men all those 'conspiracy theorists' have been pointing at for two days now.

Apparently the men that the 'skeptics' have been assuming to be emergency response or security personnel can't seem to be identified so far.

Real skeptics shouldn't hide behind faulty logic or ridicule. Then you aren't a skeptic you are just an idiot.

The "responses" to this are sad.

The article is pointing out the utter lack of substance behind the theories, and you immediately confirm the author's opinion by accusing them of being a paid stooge.

How about you actually address the four points made in the article instead of saying "we can't trust the government?"

I agree we can't trust them, BUT THEY HAVEN'T MADE ANY CLAIMS YET. Good Lord, what has the DP come to? There ISN'T an official narrative to examine!

I'm ALL FOR proposing explanations, but PLEASE back them up with something that's at least vaguely substantive.

The official Narrative...

Thus far is this: The government did not stage a terror attack.

Should we wait to ask questions in the aftermath of a tragedy until bureaucrats put forward some kind of explanation and the media and public move on calling us all Un-American?

Something happened, we ask questions in a disorganized organic way, then we are shot down because someone attacks a few silly things said and misrepresents the core of our concerns...

And then we all move on and kill innocent people in a foreign country to possess their resources and territory.

Seems to me it is much better to be vigilant and demand answers, even if you don't know all the facts upfront. Remember, there are events where history has shown the Government to have lied to the public, and even harmed our own to get the desired outcome. By its nature it is not crazy to consider the Government one of many suspects to a crime.

FAST AND FURIOUS?

So we should just trust the official words from known liars?

How old are you?

That is something my 7 year old would use as a rebuttle. Obviously the author didn't say anything remotely like "We should just trust the official words from knon liars". Your extremely weak distortion of the original argument is a perfect example of why many conspiracy theories are looked on so negatively. If you really believe in some of the conspiracies out there, you owe it to yourself to argue your point from a more logical place, not from complete fallacy.

Free market capitalism isn't right for America because it works better. It's right because it's free (and it works better).

True,

But the article over simplifies and misrepresents many people who fall into the category of "conspiracy theorist"

what you are seeing is simply the emotional backlash. No one likes to be marginalized for asking questions.

i believe it's blowback...

you know all those children and women who died for no reason from undeclared drone attacks that left fathers brothers and relative broken hearted. People who followed the law and keep to their own business. Now how do we deal with hundreds of thousands of relatives seek revenge?

Its almost a non issue at this point

Its almost a non issue at this point whether or not these events are "false flags" or not... the real issue is that they become so polarizing (from the MSM coverage) that people and governments trip out becoming irrational.

I say non issue because we know 100% that governments have done FAR worse things to justify even worse events. IE gulf of tonkin and Vietnam.

whether its real terrorism or a false flag... the only thing I know for certain is that people will become irrational and fearful which lead to the frantic search for a scapegoat.

Read my sig below V

Tools of war are not always obvious. The worst weapon is an idea planted in the mind of man. Prejudices can kill, suspicion can destroy, and a thoughtless, frightened search for a scapegoat has an everlasting fallout all of its own.

OP, from someone who doesn't follow the Alex Jones show.

Don't forget to look for answers when you question everything. Because if you don't have the answeres, then why should anyone listen to you to begin with?

This is why I don't listen to progressives, they only complain, they can not answer or understand. Before you lambast the 'conspiracy' theories, keep note that IT WAS NOT infowars that discovered this information. It was people that used a process of elimination and fact discovery. It was 4channers and reddit user internet sluthes.

1. They found images of the backpack used to conceal the explosion device.

2. They poured through images relating to the scene of the explosion.

3. They found through a process of elimination people that had similar concealment backpacks that matched the description of the device.

4. They found further evidence that the backpacks certain individuals had did infact have enough volume to conceal and have a IED device protruding.

5. They found evidence of those backpacks no longer on certain individuals in later photos before the bomb went off.

6. It so HAPPENED to be that two of the individuals were dressed in similar para-military gear. (Tan boots, cargo pants, black windbreakers, logo/moral patch paraphanelia (punisher patch)

7. They noticed odd behavior such as the lack of focus/interest in the race.

This is EVIDENCE son. In a court of law, if they get the wrong guy, the defendant has THIS evidence to back his case. How about before you question everything, do some minor investigative work on the source and don't build a bias because of the news that broke the news to the public. You question everything, but don't investigate anything. Don't expect ANYONE to take you seriously with that childish mentality.

EVERY time the FBI "thwarts" a "terrorist" it turns out

they recruited, trained and supplied them. So, yes.... dogs or no dogs, the investigation will show the government was in on it. If you could provide ONE LINK to a story where a "terrorist" was caught and not shown to be an FBI dupe, I'd consider the skepticism warranted. As the evidence continues to pile up against the government, calling it a "conspiracy theory" to suspect the government is just plain willfully stupid. If the government hits you in the head 20 out of 20 times that you were hit in the head, when you get hit the 21st time.... is it a big, mysterious "whodunnit" for you?
Sadly, the rational question is no longer IF the government is involved, it is HOW were they involved.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

Wow

So I guess you are saying that nothing bad ever happens without the government knowing about it. There's no such thing as a bad person who just acts alone. The same government that is so completely inept that they can't balance a budget, run a health care system, or keep a secret has managed to cover up countless events with little or no evidence that doesn't require some stretch of speculation. Events that would require hundreds of conspirators, but never any whistle blowers.

Just the thought amazes me.

Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.
John Adams

Try reading what I say instead of guessing.

I was quite specific. Every time they claim they thwarted a "terrorist" attack, it turns out they set the patsy up. That actually also includes at least one of the so-called "Lone Wolf" types. The Unibomber was used as a lab rat in college, pretty much trained to become who he did.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

I agree, it is possible the

I agree, it is possible the FBI let this one get out of control (see 1993 world trade center bombing) but we should also be willing to accept that this may be a real act of terrorism and not a false flag. Hopefully the perp(s) are caught alive so they can be questioned. None of this "we shot Osama Bin Laden and dumped his body out in the ocean and released only one photo of his corpse" BS.

not

Can you provide a link?

I am willing to stand corrected, I just cannot think of an exception.

Love or fear? Chose again with every breath.

Witness: Alastair Stevenson of University of Mobile, who was

there to hear and see police telling the participants "Please Stay Clam. It's only a drill," interviewed by Anthony Gucciardi, colleague of Mike Adams at NaturalNews.com:


http://youtu.be/FWp9ZH2rTQA

Proof of Drills at Marathon: Eyewitness Speaks Out

TheAlexJonesChannel
Published on Apr 18, 2013

In an exclusive interview, I just finished speaking with key Boston Marathon eyewitness and running participant Alastair Stevenson, who has confirmed to me that drills were taking place the morning of the Boston Marathon complete with bomb squads and rooftop snipers.

Anthony is an accomplished investigative journalist whose articles have appeared on top news sites and have been read by millions worldwide.

Read more: http://naturalsociety.com/author/anthony/#ixzz2QoazBBnT
Follow us: @naturalsociety on Twitter | NaturalSociety on Facebook

Alastair's initial statements towards the Alabama news publication regarding the Boston Marathon training exercises ignited a firestorm within the alternative media, despite being only around two sentences in length. Now, Alastair has been given a forum to voice the entirety of what he saw as a participant and coach during the Boston Marathon — something that Alastair says he has never seen before despite participating in much larger races around the world.

As you can watch in the video above, Alastair detailed what went on before the race began:

"At the start at the event, at the Athlete's Village, there were people on the roof looking down onto the Village at the start. There were dogs with their handlers going around sniffing for explosives, and we were told on a loud announcement that we shouldn't be concerned and that it was just a drill. And maybe it was just a drill, but I've never seen anything like that — not at any marathon that I've ever been to. You know, that just concerned me that that's the only race that I've seen in my life where they had dogs sniffing for explosions, and that's the only place where there had been explosions."

And Alastair is speaking from serious experience. As a veteran of marathons and a coach at the University of Mobile in Alabama, Alastair knows about how marathons traditionally go down.

The interview with Alastair clarifies his former statements regarding the presence of bomb squads and bomb sniffing dogs that went mega viral on the web, and also serves to better understand what the reality is behind this situation. As Alastair details, there was definitely a drill taking place the morning of the marathon, and it appears police were likely aware of a dangerous threat that required a large degree of action to counteract.

and, former State Dept spook, and negotiator Dr. Steve Pieczenik's take:

Dr. Steve Pieczenik: Boston Bombing, Fog of War on Steroids


http://youtu.be/iUT4PU5tzmI

TheAlexJonesChannel
Published on Apr 18, 2013

The Unintended Consequences of the Boston Massacre]

http://pieczenik.blogspot.com/2013/04/a-call-to-action-to-al...
https://stevepieczenik.com/docs/constitution-project-report-...

THE SPECIFIC INDICTMENT of Bush Jr/Obama/CIA/US Military "Torture of 9/11 Prisoners" at GITMO—FINALLY CONFIRMED as a "WAR CRIME"-- Equivalent to Prosecuted Nazi War Crimes and the Torture/ Internship Of Japanese Americans During WWII.
Nothing beats a sensational front page news story like a Boston Marathon Massacre! Most readers would miss the incidental but far more serious implication for the moral compass of America than the NY Times story by Scott Shane, entitled, "U.S. Practiced Torture After 9/11, Non Partisan Review Concludes". (posted earlier)
In this article, both Asa Hutchinson [Republican/Bush Jr Administration] and James R. Jones [Democrat, Congress] indict the interrogation and tortures committed by Presidents Clinton [Rendition], Bush Jr [full menu of tortures], Obama [Bush Jr in Black Face].
In essence, this bipartisan report, along with 6,000 pages of still classified docs IMPLICATES THREE ADMINISTRATIONS of INTERNATIONAL WAR CRIMES—RENDITION, TORTURE, ENHANCED INTERROGATION.
What does this mean in the midst of our frenzy to find 'supposed terrorists' of the Boston Marathon Massacre?
It means that, as I have previously repeated time and time again, we have had and still have Presidents who have willingly committed acts of International War Crimes Punishable by Death and / or Life Imprisonment.
Furthermore, to make matters even worse, the extensive investigations showed that the abominable, criminal activities of interrogation, torture, water boarding committed by the CIA, US military, US mercenaries and sanctioned by three presidents were like the wars themselves- totally useless.
In short, the USA is GUILTY of COMMITTING USELESS WAR CRIMES!!!
Have I, an experienced counter --terrorist expert with thirty years experience who had never had to touch even one detainee, let alone torture or 'interrogate' anyone, suddenly had a fit of righteous indignation or just decided to vent his RELENTLESS FURY for UNREPENTANT SINS of our THREE PRESIDENTS and their MINIONS?
The answer lies not in the headlines nor in the hysterical media distractions of a tragic occurrence which I might have been able to predict (I think Patriarch did predict this), had I known beforehand that this report would come out on the same day as the BOSTON MARATHON.
That's right! You've got it! Once again, Obama in concert with FEMA, CIA, FBI, and other National Security minions—the usual 'choir boy suspects'—decided to OFFER A DISTRACTION. https://stevepieczenik.com/

Predictions in due Time...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGDisyWkIBM

"Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it's realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy." - Dr. Ronald Ernest Paul

Great videos!

Too bad its hidden in this lame thread.

Everyone should watch that 20 min infowars vid. It covers a lot of things including those seals were actually from "Craft International" and how those pressure cooker bombs have long been used in Afghanistan. I also found it pretty interesting that dead seal Chris Kyle was the president of Craft International.

oopsie, silly me,

here's the link to the separate thread post:

http://www.dailypaul.com/282386/boston-massacre-witness-anth...

Predictions in due Time...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGDisyWkIBM

"Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it's realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy." - Dr. Ronald Ernest Paul

I'm skeptical

about the skeptical libertarian.

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
James Madison

Hey it's Jack Hunter, all over again!

http://www.dailypaul.com/242232/oh-jack-hunter-say-it-aint-s...

Predictions in due Time...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGDisyWkIBM

"Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it's realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy." - Dr. Ronald Ernest Paul

with this government, you

with this government, you need to view every event with the assumption that someone has/is committing a crime...and then go from there.

You'll find truth this way at least 90% of the time.

“Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy.”
― Ron Paul

ecorob's picture

Make it five...

Add, "the skeptical libertarian" with confusing, distraction-type narrative.

Nice add-on of the word "conspiracy", btw, in your title. You should get a bonus for that. An extra $25 next week, a little something extra in your pay check.

EVERYTHING, Mr. Skeptical, means you boil down EVERYTHING and, in the end, you have ONE neatly, undisputable, based on the evidence, answer.

You don't have two opposite answers, sherlock, for each question. That only means you have answered nothing!

You losers are just too damn easy.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

What I find interesting is

What I find interesting is that this Skeptical Libertarian is the same individual who was complaining about Gary North teaching part of the Ron Paul Home-schooling Curriculum. Going so far as to imply that he(Gary North) is going to try and force Christianity on people(students) and that Ron Paul and Tom Woods had done themselves a disservice associating with him.

Another interesting tidbit; you also posted that for the Skeptical Libertarian. One may question as to whether or not you are the Skeptical Libertarian; question everything and all that.

Here is your previous post about Gary North:The Libertarian Taliban