28 votes

"Snowden is a traitor" and "The information he leaked isn't true" can't both be accurate!

Treason can only apply if Snowden's leaks are factually correct.

Someone can't be guilty of treason for making up their own fictional slides and handing them to the Guardian. That's not treason... that's just a prank.

James Clapper and everyone else in the intelligence apparatus denies the government is spying on you at all. Therefore, Snowden can't be engaged in "treason" because the information he leaked isn't real.
So, according to the NSA, Snowden is engaged in nothing more than a giant prank.

By claiming he's guilty of treason, people like Sen. Feinstein are actually admitting his leaked PRISM slides are, in fact, correct and true.


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It can't be treason if what

It can't be treason if what Snowden is pointing out is in fact treason against the constitution and the American people.

We should have a judicial ruling that all NSA and government collected private information data is inadmissible in a court of law because it was acquired illegally and without a proper warrant.

5Th Amendment and the Right to Not Incriminate Yourself, NSA or Not

TwelveOhOne's picture

Agree, but it should be dismantled also

Because just the existence of that database creates a significant incentive for abuse. Both internally, and by hackers.

Edit: And it doesn't matter if the information is inadmissible -- if they have it, they can use for fishing expeditions, and then "say" that they nailed the perp by observation rather than database.

I love you. I'm sorry. Please forgive me. Thank you.
http://fija.org - Fully Informed Jury Association
http://jsjinc.net - Jin Shin Jyutsu (energy healing)

To me this whole situation is analogous to a monkey throwing

feces at a wall to see what sticks.

The traitor high school dropout boyfriend of a pole dancing stripper stole all kinds of information on a prohibited thumb drive so he could defect to China while endangering Americans. Furthermore he posed for pictures on the Internet in his underwear and inflated his salary. There must be a link to Bin Laden in there somewhere. Maybe they are saving that for act two.


excellent thunks on said issue
talk about a wicked web, these cretins are drenched in silk !


Cause this deserves more bumps....

Because: Some animals are more equal than other animals. -Animal Farm-

What the? > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MTIwY3_-ks



What would the Founders do?

I like it.

Astute deduction.

Nonsense. Of course both can be true.

Aid and comfort can be given by lies told to discredit your country.

Leges sine moribus vanae

It is not my Country.

I am stupid. What are you trying to say?

I pointed this out

on a yahoo article. People were calling him a traitor and saying he should be executed. I asked how he could be a traitor if what he said was a lie? Then he would only be committing fraud. And if what he has said is true, don't you think we should be calling NSA and others to task? Are you not worried about loosing your privacy? IF not, then what is the address for your bedroom and bathroom web cams?

I really don't think any of the yahoo's there understood what I was saying!

Bump this article--Superb point!

If what certain politicians, certain military leaders, and others are saying about Edward Snowden is true that he is "lying" about the massive surveillance state, then, he can't possibly be committing their idea of "treason".

We seem to be finding out the "transparency" that we all have been yearning for in our leaders in this government now. Therefore, we need now to have "accountability" for their actions. Since it is very clear we are not getting what we need from our Congressmen, I say put all these people before Congress that are testifying under LIE DETECTOR TESTS, with the results of it immediately showing in Big Media at the end of their testimony.

How's that grab you for "transparency"! If all our politicians and military leaders have nothing to hide and are as virtuous as they claim, then, the "we have nothing to hide" crowd shouldn't have any objection to testifying with a Lie Detector test running---oh, did I say we, the people, would control WHO gives the test? LOL


Morning bump.

LL on Twitter: http://twitter.com/LibertyPoet
sometimes LL can suck & sometimes LL rocks!
Love won! Deliverance from Tyranny is on the way! Col. 2:13-15

Great Observation

I applaud your observations and analysis of these two statements.
Snowden is an American hero, however, the establishment feels threatened by his knowledge, so they make him out to be a very "bad" person.
Mr. Snowden needs to show this clip to the Chinese authorities in Hong Kong, where Clapper obviously is lying before Congress, and then show the information that he has to counter this.
I am looking for more and more information to be coming out over the next few days,
I am sure Snowden will reveal everything he knows to the whole world, not just the Chinese.
After all this, I can not understand how anyone can have any faith in what anyone in the Government says.

What has me somewhat baffled

What has me somewhat baffled is Glenn Greenwald's involvement in this matter. I know he's no different from any of us, insofar as we are all self-interested individuals, however he seems to have crossed that invisible line that separates a journalist from an active participant. Yes, it's expected that a journalist protect their source, however a journalist should never be a blatant advocate in the way Greenwald has chosen to milk this story. He should present the facts as he knows them and explain what is unclear.

His advocacy on Twitter makes me question his ethical boundaries quite frankly, which is a shame and a poor reflection on the wider importance of this story. The story is more important than him and Snowden combined. It's a story of government run amok in the zeal to carry out a duty, destroying the freedoms it was meant to protect.

I get the impression Greenwald has forgotten that he needs to lay out all of the facts as be knows them and not retain information to threaten others. It becomes more like blackmail than exposing corruption.

When he said this, my "caution" signal went off: “We’re going to have a lot more significant revelations that have not yet been heard over the next several weeks and months. How fast we get the next one out is something we’re deciding now. But there are dozens of more stories generated by the documents he provided.”

That's not something a person concerned about the story says.

Mind you, I think there is a place for advocacy and for advocacy journalism, but one must be careful to not confuse advocacy with becoming an accomplice, regardless of one's position on a story.

TwelveOhOne's picture

I disagree

This sounds more like when Wikileaks got the dump from Bradley Manning.

There's a lot to work through.

So the stories will come out one at a time, just like they did a few years ago.

This is nothing to be alarmed about. The truth is coming; nothing can stop it.

I love you. I'm sorry. Please forgive me. Thank you.
http://fija.org - Fully Informed Jury Association
http://jsjinc.net - Jin Shin Jyutsu (energy healing)

You might be right, I might

You might be right, I might be right... As you say, only time will tell.