We cannot let go of how slimy the Louisiana GOP caucus was...
Submitted by CFII4RP on Thu, 01/24/2008 - 07:08
I just read the release issued by LAGOP on the caucuses (grumblesnortsnarlgrowl) It is such a horrific example of political skulduggery that it would take too long to describe it...just go to www.lagop.com and read this travesty for yourselves!
We must fight this every way possible...anyone here reaaaalllly familiar with the bylaws of LAGOP??? Hoping breathlessly...so I dont have to read it all myself...:)
These kinda party operatives are usually smart enough to just barely NOT violate any LAWS...maybe...
But...I wonder if they are smart enough (maybe) or principled enough (LMAO) to think of "minutia" such as the Party Bylaws...
In Liberty,
Dave Goree
»
Why couldn't Pro-Life/Pro-Family be voted by the Pro-Pauls?
Couldn't this essentially be Paul's platform too?
Why jump to conclusions?
This platform was
This platform was specifically designed to pool together several candidates that had no chance. Those delegates will support one of the other four.
Basically, if support Huck there may be three of his guys there, but I'm supporting this whole slate that also includes supporters of the others, knowing that they'll do the same. It's dirty even if it's legal.
I posted this earlier, but what if the dems knew Obama was going to win, so Hillary and Edwards formed the "white slate." Or even the "antiwar" slate even though their opinions are all fairly similar. It would be very distorting and underhanded.
here is the answer, (posted elsewhere)
While the other campaigns didn't have a full slate of delegates, they were able to get more people to vote for their delegates by promoting them as a different slate. for example, each official campaign has supporters handing out sheets with their delegates names to vote for. In addition, someone gathered the non-ron delegates names and handed them out as the pro-life, pro family slate. Same names, different slate, still supporting their respective candidates. But who they support was not mentioned, just that it was a pro-life - pro family slate.
So here is what we do. At the next opportunity, we hand out our delegates names as pro ron paul as normal. We also hand out the list titled economic responsibility, small government pro life and whatever else sounds good and is true (unlike putting romney delegates on a pro life list) that way people that are FOR the positions, but wouldn't vote for the Ron Paul delegates get to vote for our delegates anyway. That increases the votes for our delegates, and reduces the votes for other delegates. Perfectly legal, and the tactic was just used against us, so we better step up.
Let me see if I get this right...
I'm a little confused with the whole LA thing, can (or has) someone explain this in detail, based on what I've seen this is what I am led to believe:
- There are a given number of delegate slots for Louisiana, these "delegates" go the RNC and vote for a certain candidate to get the Presidential nomination.
- The people turned out and voted for which delegates they want to go to the RNC based on "slates" or groups of people
- There were two "slates," one was people that support Ron Paul the other was this weird Reagan "Pro-Life, Pro-Liberty" ambiguous group that "didn't" support any one candidate.
- The people on the Reagan slate are in reality supporters of the other candidates and all grouped together to beat Ron. Or so we're speculating...
Is that about right?
Me too
This is as much as I understand, I'd like some more clarity also. I know I need to be upset about something that did or didn't happen in LA, but I'm not sure of exactly what. LOL
I WANT TO see a copy of the
I WANT TO see a copy of the actual ballot. Anyone?
Does the Pro-Life slate specifically state NOT RON PAUL. because RP IS PRO LIFE.
so...
if someone votes prolife that adds 1 vote for mccain, rommney, giuliani, and huckabee? or its just for the pro life platform and candidate totals are sep. why isnt ron paul listed as pro life he is pro life. thats his stated policy.
but when i read the announcement it sounds like the "pro life" is a sep category which does not effect the candidate specific totals.
so the horse race for candidates is still valid, these other votes can be seen as uncomitted.
The problem seems to be RP supporters were not registered, but that is only 500 out of 10,000 according to the announcement so that wouldnt change the vote unless they are lying.
"So... Who Won the Louisiana GOP Caucus?
Ron Paul finished second. His supporters reportedly mobbed the 11 polling places, but many of them could not participate because they were not registered Republicans. They were required to cast provisional ballots, many of which will not count. (The provisional ballots are part of the reason for the delay in tallying the results.)"
I'm confused what was slimy?
it doesnt matter if they list a "pro life" platform, there is still the candidate who got the most votes, and according to the site it was McCain who won not Ron Paul.
What is the objection?
We have to do our part
This will go to convention.
Let's look at the big picture here.
Giuli and Huck are out.
This will end with Romney, McCain, and Paul
That being said it will be harder and harder for the media to simply ignore Paul anymore as more people drop out.
Need an explanation about LA caucuses
on Pro-family/Pro-life bunch. Are they gonna run as one, I mean as a group in the primaries or individually? I can see why LA government is dubbed "dirty". It can't even impose on these election rulings and they allow this format to go on. Are they stupid or something? Ronald Reagan on the ballot? How dumb can these people be? Don't they know Pres. Reagan passed away many years ago? These idiots who perpetrated this should be banned from participating in the electoral process. They think its funny, they make a mockery of the elections.
"He who exercises government by means of his virtue may be compared to the north polar star, which keeps its place and all the stars turn towards it." Confucius
"He who exercises government by means of his virtue may be compared to the north polar star, which keeps its place and all the stars turn towards it." Confucius
Voter Manipulation and Fraud?
When this manipulation of definitions and rules happens it not only denies Ron Paul a standing in the election process but also (and more importantly) denies the good people of Louisiana their access and right to legitimate vote and say in their own government. I would think an honest lawyer (there really are a few!) could find the LA voting laws to see if voter rights are not being denied and the voting process corrupted - not to mention RICO, etc.
I love the smell of a good class-action law suite in the morning.
Democatic version
Let's say Obama is winning (but less than 50%) so Hillary and Edwards created the "white" slate. They would win the delegates and ensure Obama doesn't get any.
This is as slimy as it gets. I don't think I could vote for any of these losers after this. They're more concerned about Paul winning than they about themselves losing.
One more thing, by being uncommitted, they could all go the the one or two that are still around at the time and further dilute RP's votes.
Thanx for my morning laugh...I reeeeealy needed it...
Giuliani and Huckabee fusing sounds obscene on so many levels.
ROTFLMFAO !!!!! whatta scary picture eh?
Dave
Teaching Flying...and talking Ron Paul...and Liberty!
Teaching Flying...and talking Ron Paul...and Liberty!
yeah huh...
what was it that Huck said after his win in Iowa? "we need to love the man who is behind us". so I guess in defiance to the rules at Daytona- Rudy gets the drivers seat afterall.
Those who make peaceful
Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable.
John F. Kennedy
By the time Feb 9th
comes around the "axis of Pro family" is going to be missing 2 out of 4 candidates.
What happens to those delegates?
Also, what happens to Huckster's delegates from Iowa when he tanks it?
America is sick, call a doctor! Dr. Ron Paul.
Good Point...but
On January 24th, 2008 soulmantim says:
Let's think this through.
What are the final results and how many delegates did Paul get?
Answer?
We dont know yet...they are still counting provisional ballots...(or working more tricks)
but...even if the provisionals mean we win even after their tricks...that doesnt change the facts that LAGOP engaged in multiple manipulations with only one purpose...to deny the Ron Paul campaign the ability to say we WON a state...thereby PERMANENTLY removing us from MINOR candidate status to most...this was the whole point of this exercise...
Dave
Teaching Flying...and talking Ron Paul...and Liberty!
Teaching Flying...and talking Ron Paul...and Liberty!
We
We were all wondering what would happen if Paul came in first.
Now we know.
LA set the precedent. The NonRon ticket. It will be repeated wherever Paul wins.
I am curious, though, if this IS a precedent. First time in U.S. history? Anyone know if rival candidates have ever "fused" at a caucus or primary before?
Giuliani and Huckabee fusing sounds obscene on so many levels.
Well it shows their stripes once and for all
An interventionist foreign policy in general and the war in particular is ALL that those candidates really care about.
The fact that Huck is pro-life and Rudi isn't doesn't really matter to them.
The fact that Huck is pro-gun and Rudi isn't doesn't really matter to them.
The fact that no one knows where Romney stands on anything save government mandated health insurance doesn't matter either.
All that matters is that they will continue the war machine (and maybe do nothing about the Fed is important too.)
By the way how on earth does any supporter of Rudi support him on the pro-life, pro family ticket? He's neither, his own daughter won't support him, I'm sure at least partially because of the way he's cruised around New York for all these years.
ewwww
Giulihuckabee does sound obscene.
Now hold yer horses
Let's think this through.
What are the final results and how many delegates did Paul get?
Answer?
What happened in LA is: ( )
What happened in LA is:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
OR
( ) Pro-Life/Pro-Family Ticket, which consisted of: McCain, Romney, Huckabee and Giuliani.
Pro-Life/Pro-Family is an impulse vote. It sounds good. We all love life. We all love family, I'll go with that.
Unfortunately it seems for worse than that...lots of the delegates listed for this amalgam of candidates are LAGOP elected officials or party operatives...this was an blatant theft by LAGOP likely with the complicity of the RNC...if not the RNC should step in and censure LAGOP for their actions damaging to the Republican Party!
Not that I think they actually will...because I believe that they are involved...
In Liberty,
Dave Goree CFII
Teaching Flying...and talking Ron Paul...and Liberty!
Teaching Flying...and talking Ron Paul...and Liberty!
An interview
with the architect of that underhanded plan would be interesting. I wonder if his/her name is available.
That worries me....
that the MSM all had positive things to say about RP yesterday. We KNOW they are corrupt and vile and trying to subvert American politics. It scares me that all of a sudden they are now touting him. Watch out Dr. Paul. Watch your back! They may just want to be seen as someone who really did give you credit, after all. You know, in case something terrible happens. It is very disturbing for me to say this but I have to be a realist. They are NOT coming around. They are greedy, sorry bast**** that deserve not the time of day from us. The revolution has started and it will not end until the people once again control their government of the people, by the people, and for the people.
its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
Legal?
You are kidding me?
How is that even legal?
referring to whomever posted this:
When you go Caucus you can choose:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
What happened in LA is:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
OR
( ) Pro-Life/Pro-Family Ticket, which consisted of: McCain, Romney, Huckabee and Giuliani.
Pro-Life/Pro-Family is an impulse vote. It sounds good. We all love life. We all love family, I'll go with that. The problem with this ticket (or slate) is that no one really knows how many delegates went to each of the candidates from the Pro-Life/Pro-Family slate.
What's worse is that Giuliani and Romney are NOT Pro-Life. Which means (I have an idea) they made a fraudulent claim and may be open for lawsuits from the voters? Hmmm.... They also made fraudulent ads for the poll. Can someone look into this. Is there a lawyer in the house?
Legal?
You are kidding me?
How is that even legal?
referring to whomever posted this:
When you go Caucus you can choose:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
What happened in LA is:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
OR
( ) Pro-Life/Pro-Family Ticket, which consisted of: McCain, Romney, Huckabee and Giuliani.
Pro-Life/Pro-Family is an impulse vote. It sounds good. We all love life. We all love family, I'll go with that. The problem with this ticket (or slate) is that no one really knows how many delegates went to each of the candidates from the Pro-Life/Pro-Family slate.
What's worse is that Giuliani and Romney are NOT Pro-Life. Which means (I have an idea) they made a fraudulent claim and may be open for lawsuits from the voters? Hmmm.... They also made fraudulent ads for the poll. Can someone look into this. Is there a lawyer in the house?
LA scum
You didn't think they were going to fight fair now, did you? It's time to fight back.
I'm still wondering
I don't think the total results are in yet, are they?
How many delegates did we get?
I'm wondering how McCain won
I'm wondering how McCain won over RP if the pro life/pro family got more votes.
ok I'll try to explain....
When you go Caucus you can choose:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
What happened in LA is:
( ) Paul
( ) McCain
( ) Romney
( ) Huckabee
( ) Giuliani
OR
( ) Pro-Life/Pro-Family Ticket, which consisted of: McCain, Romney, Huckabee and Giuliani.
Pro-Life/Pro-Family is an impulse vote. It sounds good. We all love life. We all love family, I'll go with that. The problem with this ticket (or slate) is that no one really knows how many delegates went to each of the candidates from the Pro-Life/Pro-Family slate.
What's worse is that Giuliani and Romney are NOT Pro-Life. Which means (I have an idea) they made a fraudulent claim and may be open for lawsuits from the voters? Hmmm.... They also made fraudulent ads for the poll. Can someone look into this. Is there a lawyer in the house?