30 votes

Humbug ... July 4th

The images of Egypt teeming with protesters, fireworks and announcements of "re-do" create an ironic backdrop to our own "Independence Day" celebrations.

Today I awoke thinking that instead of celebrating today, I feel like mourning. Celebration is something a person can do under the knowledge that the reason for celebration is still a true condition; in this case, liberty from tyranny. But this is not a true condition for us anymore.

How is it that Egyptians can rally themselves to topple a government and we just keep watching the tyranny roll over us?

The only reason I feel I can engage with the meaning of this day anymore is to try and use it as a "hope for recovered liberty" but NOT an annual marker of what was gained and maintained all those years ago. Because that gift given to us by our founders has been snatched away, for now -- and has not been maintained.

I hate to be a downer on this day, but it just doesn't feel the same anymore. We are celebrating the ghost of our liberty. Am I the only one thinking this way today?

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Let me ask you some questions gsneil:

1. Are you able to deploy a force of armed individuals in an area of operations? Do you have a leadership position for such a group?

2. Do you have a political plan of action? For instance, have you been a delegate for primaries and such? Do you have ANY political plans?

3. Do you have any idea how to resist currently peacefully such as buying gold and silver in good quantaties for your friends and family? Have you done other non-violent resisting activities such as switching to a credit union?

4. How many guns do you own? How familar are you with tactical movement?

5. How organized are you and your network?

I don't need details. I don't even need you to answer these publicly on this forum to respond to me directly. Just think about those in this country that are able to address my questions quickly and with out hesitation.

THOSE are the people that are already in a position of thinking the way you are. However their burdens are that they actually have to worry about this on a responsibility level. They aren't likely the type to say "why don't we?" Because they know for a fact that if something starts, it is going to get a whole lot of ugly real quick. Do you actually think even if Liberty wins it will be a definitive clean cut win like the Civil War?

That is why you need to relax. Peacefully resist, prepare for a bad outcome in case it happens, and don't jump the gun. Let the pros worry about this. Remember our political opponents are doing their damnest to set up false flag attacks like Boston and pin them on us. They want you to get angry and go mcveigh.

Prepare, get your local community prepared, and sit tight. If it happens it happens.


“Let the pros worry about this.” LOL.

Look, I know you mean well and most of the stuff you have lined up here as a thoughtful approach to the current situation makes sense, but it was a bit presumptuous in that you address these questions and proscriptive advice directly to me. I think you might have a) misjudged what I may or may not already have “done”; b) supplied an orange answer to an apple post. My reflection yesterday was more philosophical than tactical; the question of the Egyptians more of a rhetorical device w/ ironic imagery than a concrete comparison or literal challenge that needed strategic address.

So it's great if you have tackled each of the enumerated elements that you pose as questions. And fine for you to hold the expectations and approach outlined in the rest of the comment. Maybe I have as well – maybe not – of course, you can’t possibly know unless I tell. ;-) And it’s also fine if your intent was not particularly to me, but more for everyone’s benefit here. Each is on his/her path. It takes all of us in our various states of sleep and wakefulness, doesn’t it? Thanks for your sincerity.

As long as the hand keeps

As long as the hand keeps feeding...

I'm thinking

the same way bud. I see every one praising this day but it's coming from the same people who support Obama. The same people who sit and let Tyranny topple all over them

Can you imagine what one 4th

Can you imagine what one 4th of july would look like if there was hardly anybody celebrating, and the people still demanding for their liberties........that would probably be something they'd wanna avoid, i know, i know, they'll play it as they have replaced it with something better, but that would be hard to do, if people arent attending, because their to busy speaking up

Celebrate your independance

Celebrate your independance in your own timeframe, celebrate it in the way you WANT to celebrate it, .......after all, is that not the spirit of independance, as long as its in remembrance for what your independance stands for, the day does not matter, it is the remembrance, and the thankyou to those long past, that is the spirit of independance day..

lindalsalisbury's picture

This grief too shall pass.

When it turns to anger, maybe one day we will all meet in a pub, as our founding fathers did, and design a plan of action.

Remember, at one time the Egyptians were 3500 years ahead of the rest of the world. Not so today.

See you at the pub!

We need to be walking like those Egyptians.

They now have more use of the 4th of July than we do. But their win is our win. Hurray of Egyptians!!!

Falling like the Egyptians

Falling into a military controlled martian law and preparing for a UN NWO. NO THANKS

I wish our military would do what they get paid for:

supporting and defending the Constitution. That would result in a coup here as well.

I don't disagree

That said, I also understand that as long as wee the people refuse to drill and produce oil that we are dependent, we will continue to be dependent on foreign oil and that is why we are over there defending our investments.

I don't know about the coup part.. I believe if there was a military coup here, it would be a UN false flag as it is in Egypt.

I am not sure how you supported Ron Paul

With an attitude of continuing entangling affairs to defend our interests. A cornerstone of Dr. Paul's platform for as long as I can remember has been to defend this country and bring our troops home. Are you drunk when writing this stuff?

It was a learning curve

I agree that we should not "entangle" ourselves in the name of protecting OUR INVESTEMENTS IN FOREIGN OIL.. or protecting the opium trade in Afghanistan to continue a war on drugs.

Did you join the GOP as Ron Paul asked when he needed delegates to get the nimination?

How well did you listen to and follow Ron Paul?

I have been part of the GOP since I could vote

In my state, delegates were voted on and we had plenty running in the election. None of which got enough votes to be selected. I helped get them hundreds of votes though. In many minds including Dr. Paul's, it is destructive to have our troops stationed around the world. There was a video RevolutionPAC made during the primary. It was a little over the top, but the point of Ron Paul's message couldn't be any clearer.


It is over the top

And the problem is that it goes after countries.. while the problem is not the countries in themselves, it is the collective of countries in the UN and their UN Agenda for global government.

You seriously need to spend some time

Doing some rational thinking. I have no idea what you are even talking about. You certainly are NOT like me nor do you speak for the liberty movement. I hope that you don't go into committee meetings talking like this because you make no sense whatsoever. It is actually embarrassing. Be consistent. At this point, our back and forth discussion has proven that you don't even know what side you are on. To me, you sound like a typical neoconservative or a "tea-o-con".

Achieve, it seems to me that Granger

runs from one gang with a flag, to the next gang with a flag.

While I see her as a disruptive personality that I really know nothing about other than her 18,000 posts here (and have learned that she runs businesses, Volunteers, raises her own food)....

And, her dad beat her.

It's the absolute Zionist thinking and mind control.

I think she is either Insane, or is being paid to make others insane. She doesn't respect logic or truth.

That said, it's nice to have a Zionist around a forum for example. Her hate of the truth is obvious.

Truth is

Truth is like an elephant in a living room surrounded by blind people who tell us what part of the elephant they have a hold on, but none have ever seen the elephant.

Sp tell me, what part of the elephant do you have a grip on?

My guess you have a hold of the ear.. the truth is a fan you wave around.


I joined the Ron Paul rEVOLution. The Liberty Movement is disenfrancised Obama supporters who hate the GOP and refused to join the Ron Paul rEVOLution, hijacked the message, and supported REPUBLICAN GJ because he stole the nomination from a real libertarian. The LM talks of Ron Paul, but sisn't help him win and I bet you don't even attend Ron Paul's Institute. Liberty Movement is body snatchers of zombies.

I am a Zionist Tea-o-con who supports Rand (bet you don't).

Who told you this?

Michael Savage? Obama supporters? Are you that stupid? Do you even know what a libertarian is? Or do you know what actually BEING conservative means? Seriously, I have no idea what you are talking about and I think that you are delusional. I do support Rand..why do you say things like "bet you don't"? Are you trying to point fingers? Do you seriously believe the things that you have just wrote? Ron Paul was up against every power figure(zionists) during the election. The people that supported him(you and I) were able to shift the GOP to grow a stronger libertarian wing. Unfortunately, Ron Paul was not going to be allowed to win the nomination. As much as it hurts to say it and I didn't want to believe it during the 2012 primary, its the truth. The disenchanted Obama supporters that you ridicule have been opened up to the idea of freedom, small government, and non-interventionism. In addition, it had turned liberals to libertarian conservatives. If you do not appreciate that, than you mine as well spit in Ron Paul's face. You are not a very good supporter of limited government and there are many fallacies in your way of thinking. But, whatever, keep doing what makes you feel good inside...even if that means being a hypocrite.

No one TOLD me this

I'm telling you MY EXPERIENCE.

I joined the Lobertarian Party in 1976 under the influence of NORML ads in my Dad's Playboy magazines. He was an Ayn Rand fan, got all her newsletters, read all her books when I was a teen. I remained a Libertarian until 1992. I then met Ralph Nader, and though I didn't agree with him 100%, many Libertarians like myself, sick of a third party that never got in debates and had to fight for ballot access each election, joined Nader to open debates and ballot access. I was an Indy from 1993 until 2011, when Ron paul asked me to join the GOP and become a delegate.

Don't blame the Zionists. I am a Zionist and it's NOT Zionists Ron Paul is up against (talk about delusional). Ron Paul was up against a LIBERTY MOVEMENT of people who refused to join the GOP and take the party. they didn't want to bew connected.. in other words they are idiots who would rather the GOP remain as it is than get in a fight, even for Ron Paul... they want something brand new.. not that they know a flipping thing about how to operate a party, they don't.

It'as not about FEELING good. It made me feel SICK to join the GOP, but there was a job that needed to be done, so I did it. And yes, I believe in limited government.

What I don't believe is sugar coating, conjolling and buttering people up gets them to actually do something. If you want something done, ask a busy person. You want small government ask a conservative, not a liberal.

I like Rand WAY better than Ron. I thank Ron for his inspiration. I would not be where I am if not for that. He has moved onto a new business and I have moved on to a new candidate. Good to know that Rand can attract from a braod spectrum.. zionist me and liberal you.


If you are trying to get DPers all motivated to go join the GOP, you are doing a poor job. I actually considered it when you were first pushing it. But now, you are a neo-con extraordinaire. You believe that theft and murder is okay if you need oil. I see China building infrastructure and doing business with all those countries where she desires their resources. You will never ever get me to agree that killing and stealing is the answer to resource acquisition. If going to GOP meetings has resulted in your transformation to neoconservatism that we have witnessed, I will never ever set foot in a meeting.

Nope ((((dducky)))))

I am NOT working to get DPers motivated to join the GOP.

I have not pushed for anyone to join the GOP, that was Ron Paul's job, and he didn't do so great, but he did get some of us to join to get him the nomination process, which included far more than I thought.. it wasn't easy, that's a FACT. But once in, after all that HARD work, I wasn't going to abandon that, especially since I was in, I saw THE TRUTH he was speaking, which many here don't have the guts, inspiration, or motivation to do anything.. rather, they continue on their apathetic trip to hell of destruction of America in the name of principles (based on UN propeganda they ironicall say they reject). I am happy they are where they are, and where I am.

I'm a zionist, which is not to be confused with a Neocon. A Neocon is someone who deceives.. they say they are for israel, but as Ron Paul points out, nothing could be further from the truth. They want to blackmail and destroy Israel (which is also Obama's intent) to give us a UN NWO and keep us dependent on oil which they make the profit.

I believe it is important that we move away from oil, like Israel, and invest and find better ways for energy, transportation and production, through free trade, not UN controlled trade.

I see China working hard to get in with Israel. China is a huge supporter of Israel, sans the religious aspects, they admire Israel's Intel, engineering, agrculture, technology, weaponry, fashion, husbandry, and determination to lead rather than be swallowed up by the Muslim religious. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rv1otWoeaHA

If you do more reasearch you will see the leaders of China say that Israel has the smartest people on Earth. I don't disagree.

Since China has become the world's producer of goods, they NEED Israeli tech to sustain..

I have no intention to get you to do anything. I support you doing what you want, even if I don't agree with you.. that's what freedom is about.. supporting each other even when we don't agree, and being open and honest about it.

It's not my GOP meetings.. my GOP is Liberty, and not everyone agrees with me, especially on Israel, that's a fact, but they have not done the reasearch I have.

Israel is leading the way to freedom, and if all you're watching is UN propeganda from RT, Press TV and other half trush propeganda machinines.. your'e not seeing the truth.

What do you KNOW about Palestine? What do they produce? What is their culture? Music? Art? Religion? What human rights do they have? Women rights? Rights for homosexuals? Rights for Religious freedom other than Islam? Do you know? Will you answer?

I'm not one to lead people by words, but by action.. I encourage people to think for themselves and dare to challange the boxes they feel comfortable. That's what I do here on DP. It's truth that I have changed since I joined DP, but that was my own interest in learning truth, and I don't expect anyone to change because I did. I'm not a groupie or collectivist. I'm very Independent.

Finally, one reason I would not encourage anyone to join the GOP is because I'm not running for an office. I don't want anyone to tell me.. YOU got me into the GOP, when I leave.. and one day, I will leave. There is already competition for who will go to the RNC in 2016.. that is how much support Rand has already.. he doesn't need me... but I would like to throw a Toga Party.. All this said.. the fact remains, I am in the GOP and way ahead of all those who are not because I do have a party, with candidates and issues and they do not. ((((dducky))))

Let me get this straight...

Let me get this straight... Now you're calling yourself a Zionist, yet you previously gushed on and on about cuddling up to Louis Farrakhan.

Madam, you are confused to say the very least. Good evening.

sharkhearted's picture

Wow....that she would admit to being a zionist....is laughable

And catastrophic....

How anyone remotely human would admit to being a mouthpiece for AIPAC is beyond me.

Buit then again stranger things have happened.

Norfolk, VA

Time to INVESTIGATE the investigators of 9/11. PROSECUTE the prosecutors. EXPOSE the cover-up.

I am a zionist

I am part of the Ron Paul rEVOLution.. the folks who joined the GOP.

I am not part of the Liberty movement, the folks who refuse.

I asked why LF was not part of the LM. I wasn't gushing up to LF.. I was ponting out that what he was saying is what many in the LM were saying.. he is not saying what those in the rEVOLution are saying. There is a difference between the rEVOLution and the LM. rEVOLution now supports Rand, LM is waiting for a republican to run as a libertarian so they can lose another election and try to spoil rand.


are you labeling yourself? We are human beings.


someone around here needs to make a stand, a fearless stand, FOR Israel, and being I am FOR Israel, sincerely, and accused/labed of many things, there are some lables that I will wear.. RepubliCAN (that's not well accepted here, but I am one) Zionist is another that is not respected here, but IMO, it should be. I believe the people of Israel should have a state, where they can be themselves, be free of racism, free to prosper, debate, LIVE, work, play, raise children and trade globally.

We are ALL human beings, to err is human.

It is very hard to find good information about Israel.. just a moment ago I did a search for the UN and Israel. I got 15 web sites about "Israel, Palestine and the UN" before I came to web sites that were about Israel and the UN, and all were against Israel, explaining all the greivances the UN has against Israel. I had to settle for an AIPAC (not respected here) web page to make my point.

Good thing I like challenges, it's a hard one, but a very worthy one, because what is happening in Israel is amazing.. and while I have never been there, there is much I want to see and do when I do go there, because there is so much that is going on to advance the human race.

Fortunately, I'm finding myself part of a movement of people who LOVE Israel.. and so I don't feel alone, but that I am lucky to be among those who are so full of LOVE, they are not afraid to say what they LOVE.

I support Israel

Didn't they just let Kerry come into Israel and promote fake peace. ?

Why wouldn't they let Kerry in?

Hopefully Kerry learned something about how to protect freedom.