-1 vote

What does Luciferianism have to do with Freemasonry... If anything?

"On July 14th 1889, Albert Pike (Civil War General accused of war crimes, Grand Master Mason, & alleged founder of the Ku Klux Klan) issued instruction to the twenty-three Supreme Councils that gave a full exposition of his doctrines and beliefs. Pike stated: 'That which we must say to the crowd is- We worship a god, but it is the god one adores without superstition. To you Sovereign Grand Inspectors General, we say this, that you may repeat it to the Brethren of the 32nd, 31st, and 30th degrees- The Masonic religion should be, by all of us initiates of the high degrees, maintained in the purity of the Luciferian doctrine....Yes, Lucifer is god, and unfortunately, Adonay is also God." (Occult Theocracy, p.220-221)

According to Albert Pike's own writings, his goals were to create a Communist Russia, start WW1 and the League of Nations, to create Nazi Germany to start WW2 and create the UN and political Zionism, use that to start WW3 to wipe out Islam and Judaism. This leaves Christianity with no roots, to be pitted against atheism and nihilism. When the world has become desperate for order and something to believe in, the Order will reveal it's true agenda, and it's secret knowledge that Lucifer is (their) god.

Click the short but informative video posted above to hear Pike's own words.

The question I am wondering, is Masonry (the Craft) inherently Luciferian / Satanic, or is that only a later development, or a faction of Masonry popularized by Albert Pike, or someone else?

Can we have an intelligent discussion on this?



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Here is the most intelligent discussion I've heard

http://www.whatonearthishappening.com/podcast?start=100

Podcast 37 will get you going, but the intro to Freemasonry is
show 52.

5+2=7 :) just sayin'

FreeMasonry is a voluntary, private organization...

Every member of Freemasonry makes a conscious CHOICE as an individual to join the Brotherhood. You can only join Freemasonry by choice. For many, the motivation for joining Freemasonry may be financial and political connections it's membership can potentially bring. For others it is the comradery. Others the secret knowledge they may assume they will receive. Some it's all of the above.

FreeMasonry is NOT an open organized religion. It is a secret society. If there is a FreeMason 'religion', they haven't told the rest of us what it is.

Jews, Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus etc...
You can go ask them what they believe, and they will tell you. You can go read their books and see what they preach. My G-d tells me to shout His message from the rooftops, and to tell His Truth even if it brings my body pain. FreeMasons, if they have a religion, keep it a secret. Only in their symbolism that is hidden in plain sight, do they give testimony to the world about their system of belief.

Whites, blacks, Hispanics, Asians, gays, straights, etc., etc. are born as that.

No one is born a Mason, they must choose it.
This is like joining any private organization or corporation. And like any other private organization or corporation, they are not excluded from criticism or questioning of their motives.

Those claiming I'm trying to attack or lump in a group of individuals as something they are not, remember, each FreeMason has sworn an Oath of Secrecy, and each has made this CHOICE as an individual!

In no way can this post be construed as a bigoted, or collectivist post/criticism. Unless Freemasonry is a race, or open religion?

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

WARNING! TROLL THREAD!!!

1.troll
One who posts a deliberately provocative message to a newsgroup or message board with the intention of causing maximum disruption and argument

2.troll
One who purposely and deliberately (that purpose usually being self-amusement) starts an argument in a manner which attacks others on a forum without in any way listening to the arguments proposed by his or her peers. He will spark of such an argument via the use of ad hominem attacks (i.e. 'you're nothing but a fanboy' is a popular phrase) with no substance or relevence to back them up as well as straw man arguments, which he uses to simply avoid addressing the essence of the issue.

Hypocrite alert!

You just posted a comment that was blatantly anti-Israel, and have supported the threads of others who have posted anti-Jewish sentiment on this site. I didn't hear you complaining about this thread, only jumping on the bandwagon...

"Why is it taboo to mention jewish involvement in any evil activity?"

http://www.dailypaul.com/314426/why-is-it-so-taboo-to-mentio...

And you were so eager to chime in on that one. I smell a big fat hypocrite.

Go ahead, keep attacking ME, the messenger, instead of the message.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Oh, please! This is a legitimate thread!

I have not ad hominem insulted anyone, but I am receiving much of that, such as your comment.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

The above quote

is an (admitted) hoax, written by one Leo Taxil. It took me all of two minutes to find that out.

JUst like the Russians on U.S. soil was all a hoax too, huh?

Just a Sorcha Faal story, nothing to see here move along....? Do they pay you to just go around "debunking" things?

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Try to stay on topic.

Since you're sure I'm wrong, can you please cite the actual book (with page number) in which Albert Pike states the alleged quote? The book you cite, "Occult Theocracy" was not written by Pike.

The quote is directly out of the video link in the OP...

..and the quote is cited Here....

The book "Occult Theocrasy" written by Edith Starr Miller.

https://archive.org/details/OccultTheocrasy

"Edith Starr Miller, the author of this book, was a British blue blood on par with Princess Diana. She understood occult religions and secret societies as she experienced them first hand--her husband was the 1st Baron of Queenborough, treasurer of the League of Nations and member of British Union of Fascists who helped secure oil monopolies for John D. Rockefeller. Shortly after the book's publication, Edith Starr Miller, age 45, died, as even as the occult Grand Lodge of Canada attested, "under suspicious circumstances." Modernists dismiss Edith as "anti-Semitic," a term used by the narrow-minded to end open-minded discussion. Miller's sin? She wrote that Judaism's goal (and secret societies) was to enpower the super rich by controlling education and the mass media. She felt such goals were Satanic in origin."

She sounds like an insider. She also sounds like she is confusing Judaism with whatever it is the Rothschilds and their ilk engage in. Which are occult rituals, if you know anything about that... Here is a vid of Rothschilds clearly Pagan Occult rituals, which rules out the Jew façade they put on, like one of their masks at their parties.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92Hqn_lKM34

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Come on, Jed.

Where did this Edith Starr Miller and the narrator in your video get this quote from? Can't you find it?

Come on Hannah...

Edith Starr Miller was a pretty well connected woman, ("on par with Princess Diana...(&) her husband was the 1st Baron of Queenborough, treasurer of the League of Nations and member of British Union of Fascists who helped secure oil monopolies for John D. Rockefeller") and she died a mysterious death, similarly, just after she published this book.

How would I get ahold of a valuable historical artifact, one that if indeed real is a well hidden secret? I'm talking about the correspondence letters between Mazzini and Pike. It's not as if they were published. That would kind of defeat the purpose, no?

I never claimed I "know" beyond a shadow of a doubt that you are wrong. You said that. But I strongly suspect you are. And even if so, it would not change the heaps of facts and information that supports my reason for asking the original question in the OP, regardless.

It seems like you are assuming that I am wrong, despite the information provided to you, in links and cited sources, in this thread and elsewhere.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Ah, ok.

So you're just talking out your ass. Gotcha. So how much do they pay you to spread that fear porn?

You got me how? By resorting to ad hominem, and breaking down...

...rational communication? If you can't think of anymore easy questions to ask me, in your quest to debunk everything I say, you can always try answering some of my questions to you.

I am a lone wolf for liberty. I definitely SHOULD be getting paid though. Spreading info about the NWO and getting called a 'tin foil' 'conspiracy theorist' for your efforts isn't all it's cracked up to be.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

.

.

"In Question" - My entire thread is a QUESTION!

I've struck a nerve apparently.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

hmmm....

A group of Masons want power - All Masons are bad.
A group of White people are KKK - All White people are bad.
A group of Black people are Black Panters - All Black people are bad.
A group of Republicans are Military Industralists - All Repubs are bad.
A group of Democrats are Socialists - All Democrats are bad.
A group of Americans start wars in other countries - All Americans are bad.
A group of Pickup Truck owners speed - All Pickup Truck owners are bad.
A group of Dads don't pay child support - All Dads are bad.
A group of Christians killed people - All Christians are bad.

Need I continue with the silly argument?

Luciferianism - is a belief system that includes both theistic and secular denominations, and is therefore heavily influenced by personal perspectives and experiences. Considered by many to be a religion and by all to be a philosophy or way of life, Luciferianism as a whole has no specific dogma to which its “followers” adhere. Rather, it is a deeply personal outlook with numerous variations ranging from the veneration of a literal deity and the practice of occultism to a secular set of principles, using mythological references as a form of symbolism and cultural tradition.

Satanism - is a broad term referring to a group of Western religions comprising diverse ideological and philosophical beliefs. Their shared features include symbolic association with, or admiration for the character of Satan, and Prometheus, which are in their view, liberating figures. It was estimated that there were 50,000 Satanists in 1990. There may be as many as one hundred thousand in the world

Masonic Bodies - There are many organisations and Orders which form part of the widespread fraternity of Freemasonry, each having its own structure and terminology. Collectively these may be referred to as Masonic bodies.

The basic unit of Freemasonry is the Masonic Lodge, which alone can "make" (initiate) a Freemason. Such lodges are controlled by a Grand Lodge with national or regional authority for all lodges within its territory. A masonic lodge confers the three masonic degrees of Entered Apprentice, Fellowcraft (or Fellow Craft), and Master Mason.
Whilst there is no degree in Freemasonry higher than that of Master Mason, the degree of the Holy Royal Arch is of great antiquity, and has a special importance in many masonic systems, including those of all three of the oldest 'Constitutions' (masonic authorities), namely the Grand Lodges of England, Scotland, and Ireland, in all of which it is considered (by varying constitutional definitions) to be the completion of the mainstream masonic structure.

The United Grand Lodge of England (which has no direct authority over other Grand Lodges, but as the world's oldest Grand Lodge, has a historical influence in terms of regularity and practice) defines "pure, ancient Freemasonry" as consisting of the three degrees of Entered Apprentice, Fellowcraft, and Master Mason, plus the supreme Order of the Holy Royal Arch.

A number of other organisations, most of which are known as 'masonic', or have a title identifying themselves as masonic, require candidates for membership to be a Master Mason in "good standing" (subscriptions paid, and not under any form of discipline). In some countries, notably the United States of America, the Scottish Rite and the York Rite are the two principle routes available. In other countries, notably England, Scotland, Ireland, and many of the countries of the Commonwealth, a large number of 'stand-alone' Orders and Degrees exist, without the umbrella organisation of a 'rite'.

Some of these masonic bodies use numbers as an informal way of referring to or identifying the degrees they confer, but the most important and therefore "highest" degree is always the third, or Degree of Master Mason. These other masonic bodies (sometimes known as 'additional degrees' or 'side degrees') are optional pursuits for those who wish to take their masonic membership and activity beyond the three degrees of Entered Apprentice, Fellowcraft and Master Mason.

No one said that so don't put words in my mouth...

This is asking about the history and intentions of a private organization. This is like talking about Bohemian Grove, The Bilderberg, The Knights Templar, Skull & Bones, etc... NOT an open religion or political special interest.

I am asking whether there is a religion behind the organization. And since Freemasonry plays a role in human history, yet is largely not discussed, I feel it is a pertinent question. Symbolism consistent with Freemasonry can be seen in occult rituals and pagan religions throughout history. Then there is the evidence presented in the OP.

I can tell by the hostile reaction, and pouring in of down-votes at 2:30 a.m. EST, that some people just do not want this discussed. But it's ok to do a similar post about Jews, an actual open religion, not a private secret organization? I see the writing on the wall.

There is far more legitimacy in this thread, as the FreeMasons are a secret, ancient, powerful, private organization, than the threads implying things about "Jews" or other groups.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Masonic bodies

There are many organisations and Orders which form part of the widespread fraternity of Freemasonry, each having its own structure and terminology. Collectively these may be referred to as Masonic bodies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masonic_bodies

My earlier reply answered how your post is asking the question.

So which Masonic body are you asking about?

According to Wikipedia...Albert Pike is still regarded in America as an eminent and influential Freemason, primarily only in the Scottish Rite Southern Jurisdiction.

Note that it says "only in the Scottish Rite Southern Jurisdiction."

Had the man gone delusional to write that stuff you say he wrote? Did someone else write it and say it was Pike? Like how Ron Paul was blammed?

Is your question for the purpose to understand Freemasonry in the USA? It's history or what it is now?

Good questions...

I wish I knew...

I guess I'm looking for the hottest Masonic body I can get.

Giuseppe Mazzini (allegedly) wrote this in a letter to Pike dated January 22, 1870...

'We must allow all the federations to continue just as they are, with their systems, their central authorities and their diverse modes of correspondence between high grades of the same rite, organized as they are at the present, but we must create a super rite, which will remain unknown, to which we will call those Masons of high degree whom we shall select. '

That must be one hot Masonic body...

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I have no clue who was watching over that Masonic body...

Their Lodge must have been rocking and rolling....

But, looking at the statement.... it looks like this Mazzini guy wanted to form a sub-group, giving it a high rank in the Fraternity as a Front...

Were they looking to form a business?
Were they looking to get hot chicks?

Hey...they didn't have the internet back then.
So I'm sure their methods of doing things were rather crude.
And no one else had the internet to do a Search.

It looks like these few guys wanted to do something they knew the rest of the Lodge wouldn't go along with....so they were looking to make a sub-group for themselves.

Did they ever pull it off?

Good questions... and good points...

I had a conversation earlier in this thread with a woman who posted a comment about George Washington's writings on the 'Illuminati', and his suspicions of their infiltration into Freemasonry in the Americas.

Could the 'Illuminati' have anything to do with Pike & Mazzini's alleged plot?

I like to look at symbolism to tell the story of history, when neither the written or spoken word can vouch. (Albert Pike is infamous for allegedly co-founding the KKK. The KKK and Jesuits and Knights Templar share some pretty interesting symbolism, including the triangle hoods. Knights Templar have long since been grafted into the FreeMason paradigm, or 'Masonic Body'. But that is a whole other 'rabbit hole', worth exploring but another time). We have written words and verbal claims galore alleging towards some nefarious element within Masonry. Some grand conspiracy.

Is Freemasonry inherently Luciferian? That was the title to the thread. A question I asked. I actually said I had received the answer when that poster posted her comment about George Washington's writings. And also I found Mazzini's letter to Pike (above) stating he had a plan to essentially take over Masonry.

Did it work is the question indeed? I doubt it did completely and thoroughly. But I'm sure it has become quite standard among many 'Masonic Bodies'.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

What makes you sure it became standard?

.

The fact the symbolism is so prevelant...

...as well as the methods obvious, when you know what to look for, or rather, when you know what it is you're looking at.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

bump...

even though for some reason this thread is being hidden... and systematically down-voted...

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I may have found the answer, straight from the horse's mouth....

http://www.threeworldwars.com/albert-pike.htm

"...Since the vast majority (of FreeMasons) never reach the 30th degree, they would not be aware of the real purpose behind Masonry. When instructing Pike how the tome should be developed, Mazzini wrote the following to Pike in a letter dated January 22, 1870...

'We must allow all the federations to continue just as they are, with their systems, their central authorities and their diverse modes of correspondence between high grades of the same rite, organized as they are at the present, but we must create a super rite, which will remain unknown, to which we will call those Masons of high degree whom we shall select. With regard to our brothers in Masonry, these men must be pledges to the strictest secrecy. Through this supreme rite, we will govern all Freemasonry which will become the one international center, the more powerful because its direction will be unknown.' "

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Albert Pike, Luciferian Masonry, behind NWO & WWIII conspiracy

http://www.threeworldwars.com/albert-pike2.htm

"Albert Pike received a vision, which he described in a letter that he wrote to Mazzini, dated August 15, 1871. This letter graphically outlined plans for three world wars that were seen as necessary to bring about the One World Order, and we can marvel at how accurately it has predicted events that have already taken place....

Following are apparently extracts of the letter, showing how Three World Wars have been planned for many generations...

'The First World War must be brought about in order to permit the Illuminati to overthrow the power of the Czars in Russia and of making that country a fortress of atheistic Communism. The divergences caused by the "agentur" (agents) of the Illuminati between the British and Germanic Empires will be used to foment this war. At the end of the war, Communism will be built and used in order to destroy the other governments and in order to weaken the religions.'
'The Second World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences between the Fascists and the political Zionists. This war must be brought about so that Nazism is destroyed and that the political Zionism be strong enough to institute a sovereign state of Israel in Palestine. During the Second World War, International Communism must become strong enough in order to balance Christendom, which would be then restrained and held in check until the time when we would need it for the final social cataclysm.'
'The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the "agentur" of the "Illuminati" between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion…We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time.' "

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I could be wrong, but I'm

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure the term "fascism" wasn't coined until the 1920s by Mussolini, so I doubt Pike would've used this word in 1871 so the apparent extracts are not so apparently his own words.

The 'fasces' is an ancient symbol.

It represents the powers to 'bind', and goes back at least to the ancient Roman Empire.

It is a symbolic term that tyrants and rulers have known about for centuries. It is probable that it did not become a popular political term until only a few decades after Pikes letters (1871), after Mussolini would have popularized it in the 1920s . I know Mussolini popularized the term 'corporatism', but given the ancient symbolic meaning of the fasces, I doubt he was the first to conceive of the term fascism.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

...

Are you going to assert that the term 'Nazism' also existed in 1871?

It's obviously not an authentic letter.