66 votes

Are we all gonna let Adam Kokesh rot in a jail cell?

We need high powered lawyers on this chit, is there anyone on this site who is a lawyer, or is there anyone on this site who can start a paypal account to pay for his lawyer. I am chit at paypal chit and I am not a lawyer, but I will donate, how do we free him people?
How can we let one of our own rot in a prison cell and think we are making any move towards freedom? We need to get him the hell out of there.

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Non-sense! The MSM will try to discredit all freedom advocates!

Just look at what they did with Ron Paul. Find someone cleaner than Dr. Paul and I assure you they will spin some made up story to make him look bad. People please don't be fooled, Adam will be celebrated for his bravery and he will inspire more people to peacefully protest.

Deep down everyone is Libertarian.
Live and Let Live, form of government.

Standing at a podium swearing

Standing at a podium swearing at the cops professing your love of drugs certainly doesn't make the MSM job of "spinning" difficult.

With so many factions seeking freedom for the pet cause total liberty is clouded. If all the raw milk, Gay, Gun, drug, internet, and every other cause united for individual liberty there would be much more of a chance for the pet cause to bare fruit. People can all unite under liberty and tend to divide with all the other. By default all the other causes win if liberty wins.

I think

there are many other lessons to be learned from this as well.

But certainly, setting yourself up for a swat raid while having a shroom stash rates as a dumb move.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Yes we are. Adam is less

Yes we are. Adam is less dangerous to himself, and others, in jail.

That's a hard answer

but I agree. His plan would have surely backfired. Wisdom was lacking.

Money bag?

Methinks your moniker would be more appropriate and satisfy truth in advertising codes by invoking another kind of bag...better used for personal cleanliness.

Wha? .....hey....who stole my country?

The man is a menace. We're

The man is a menace. We're talking about a man who wanted to take armed patriot group members into Washington DC. What horrible consequences would of those actions, if undertaken, have had for the whole country.

It is unfortunate that we have such wicked laws, which put people in jail for things that should not be illegal. He ought to be free. And yet, it IS safer for us, and him, that he stays put in his cell, where he cannot brew mischief.

What about house arrest?

Your response is very upsetting, harsh, and thoughtless; even if partially true.

I am continually surprised more people don't have more loyalty - to people, causes, and ideologies. Saw it with Ron Paul and saw it with Ben Swann.

I can tell you I'd rather have a brave soul like Adam on my side than on theirs. Wish "I" had more courage (and less fear). Thanks for the dose you just gave me!

I'm not a libertarian so it

I'm not a libertarian so it is easy for me to keep my objectivity in this situation.

Not trying to scare you, but Kokesh is dangerous to this movement, and to freedom. The NWO elitists would love some nut like Kokesh to give them justification for their plans.

Libertarians need to work on undermining the system, by removing statist justifications, instead of giving them all they need to go for freedom's jugular.

You are ignoring the fact

that no crime has been committed by Kokesh. No valid cause of action exists for a court to hear the case because there is no accuser alleging actual injury.

I think wisdom is indeed severely lacking by Adam but the fact remains that no crime has been committed by him. If you want to set precedent to enable a gang of criminal thugs to just break into someone's house and haul them off to jail without consent of the governed issued through a valid cause of action derived from a principal accuser who is a member of the governed that invokes the agency of government acting on their behalf then YOU are the menace and a danger to maintaining the rule of law.

Your baseless opinions outside of law and demonstrated ignorance here of the rule of law are exactly why America's system of laws has succumb to all out tyranny over the minds of men. You demonstrate the exact same ninniness here of nanny staters who sit around and say 'there ought to be a law for that'.

Are YOU accepting liability for allegations of actual injury to you? If any man or woman of the governed alleges actual injury as the formal accuser then let Adam face his accuser in court in a speedy manner or let him go. Anything else at this point is only more criminal acts demonstrating mens rea by the men and women who falsely claim to be agents of the governed.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

boo hiss more gibberish

Look, even Adam acknowledged he was breaking hte law, intentionally, and was doing it as a form of civil disobedience.

Yeah, I know in your make believe world where you get high on woodrose seeds and post nonsense, that you believe there should never be any police and never any crimes and never any state action of any sort whatsoever, and that all anyone has to do is say some magical mumbo jumbo about "consent" and that gets them out of it - voila! But that just isn't the real world.

So back down here on Earth, and wihtout the benefits (and detriments) of your mind altering substances -

The dude committed a crime. He knew he did, did it intentionally, etc. Now go get a rubber mallet and hit yourself in the forehead with it, then read this again, slowly. Repeat as necessary.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

If Adam acknowledged he was breaking the law

then he is indeed his own accuser the government now has consent of the governed thus now they can and will move forward and Adam will lose. See how consent of the governed is currently working in our "courts". This exactly why the court has told me and others in the past that as a defendant "you are your own accuser". That is how the court is gaining "consent of the governed" If one stands under the claims before them then that is the mutual understanding required in the elements of a valid contract for one to be the "citizen". That is indeed why you point this fact out. The law needs consent of the governed because consent of the government would not be lawful.

You make this claim about Adam but I have not seen him state this explicitly anywhere so I don't know if your claims are true. The real problem here, when considering a claimed consent by Adam to code application is a couple of things. They charged him for something based on evidence that the psychos did not have a warrant to get. The other issue is that the related rules for guns in DC were already ruled unconstitutional. So even in the criminal code game the psychos have problems with their own insane interpretations. But in the current "real world" of confusions of idiots and psychos, "courts" and "law enforcement" are psychotic terrorists who wish to make an example out of someone very public over this type of behavior. They knew he was stupid enough and they went after him. Now they will demonstrate their psychotic tyrannical despotism upon him for all the world to see as is their intention. However the fact remains that the only lawful powers of government are derived from the consent of the governed, period. Any other interpretation is simply wrong and inconsistent within all other valid laws.

I do not consent to code application without consent of the governed so that is the precedent I seek because of its root implications but I am also fully aware of how to play their code games as well.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

blabber gibber "code application" gibber gibber

The founding fathers created a representative republic. You vote for representatives, they legislate. Do you remember the legislative branch in your civics class, or did you skip high school? Ok good. So there is a branch that legislates. Further, there are these things called "states" that have these things called "state governments' which include (gasp!) legislative branches. Yes, they pass laws. And you don't get to after the fact decide if you "consent."

Even if you think that would be a superior form of government, that is not now, nor has it ever been, our governmental system, nor the system anywhere but other than in your (and some others') fantasies. Sorry to break it to you, bub, but you just don't get it.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Are you a fan of ...

the teen age mutant ninja turtles ...

by any chance?

Wrong!

Representatives get instructions from delegates hence representatives re-present as instructed by their constituency delegations. This process has been usurped by democracy.

If a representative republic with delegates was intact the representatives would be simply be following instructions not being the ultimate decider. If the delegates do not instruct with a presentation then the representative abstains. This process is dead because of tyrants usurping the law and the people devolving into idiocracy. This does not prohibit us individually from rediscovering the law and collapse the possible interpretations into a constrained finite set of lawful possibilities through real law.

The thing is that I totally know your entire interpretation of how it works. I was brainwashed once to. They attacked me, harmed me and many others I know and I studied the law and history in detail and continue to do so and I found what I found. What I found was that my previous interpretation, the same as yours, was wrong. I studied the law and history and my studies revealed what I speak of now. My key insight that I attained AFTER I went through the legal interpretations you speak of was that no law can violate any other law. When this was applied to my study of law and case precedent something happened to the way I can see the interpretations. It becomes clear what is actually lawful and what is not. It also becomes perfectly clear that the law has an inherent logical hierarchy of applicability to it. This applicability can be applied as logical weights of possible patterned energetic stimuli to find the order of interpretations to conflicts in law. Finding the order to conflicts enables one to reduce the possible outcomes of response stimuli to a finite weighted set which can then be used to find multidimensional logic paths to all conflicts in law. This order of paths then provides the means to ensure all law is maintained by laying a path for the tyrants to conflict in law through facts demonstrated. One can get them to directly conflict themselves on the record and can just keep repeating this process until they either give up or sufficient evidence of their crimes are collected on the record. It is logic and it is real law. The logic governs the interpretation because the logic applied to the mind results in the movements of all motor functions of the human body. Logic is the interface between Natural and Common Law. Conflicts in logic within a human mind have major implications on resulting motor function of a human body. This is where real law and its logical hierarchy become crystal clear once attained.

Believe it or not I have even conducted an experiment with you that has proven successful as hypothesized. I hypothesized the woodrose seed comments would go to the highest logical weight in your mind when electrically connected to the previous topic stimuli and you would repeat this as a way to attempt to demonstrate lack of credibility. You did exactly as predicted. The number of things that had to happen in your mind for this take place is many but the neurons that drive the electrochemical impulses operate in a very specific way based on logical weighted input stimuli that are summed and fed to the next neuron into a net of experience that then instructs which formation of polypeptides will chemically communicate the motor function machinery to pattern your movements and produce the words on the page. This process is weighted with your experience and given certain defined sets of logical weights you remembering this and performing this predicted action tells me more than just the hypothesis is confirmed it tells me much more but I will keep that to myself.

I don't think you have any idea of how far real law goes. But I was where you were at so maybe there is hope that you will humble yourself before the law and find its protections within no conflicts.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

wrong again

the fact that you said you "calculated" some kind of alternative dimension while high on woodrose seeds is amusing, nothing more. It is anecdotal for your thought process.

But the "highest logical weight" is the fact that you don't know what the hell you're talking about. You claim to have discovered this alternate reality of law, which just (coincidentally!) happens to be a perfect match for the recycled sovereign citizen scam nonsense. Nothing new or creative or valid there. Whether or not you are high on woodrose seeds.

But you have a great future writing gibberish ahead of you. I suggest you study hard and become a patent lawyer.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Don't flip the bozo bit

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_neural_network

ANN is modeled on the same resulting response stimuli measured from a real neuron. ANN may be artificial but the fact remains that the patterned stimuli of the human mind operates on logical weighted stimuli summed with weighted experience. A skilled programmer can understand why and how this is so. Understanding that the details of ANN one skilled and clear of its implications as the possible governing mechanics of a real human mind can begin to conduct highly controlled experiments to gain insight into actions and reactions of the human body. One needs to gain vast amounts of similar information and then tap the subject with similar weighted stimuli to get their attention and then begin to apply the weights of stimuli appropriately to the subject. One can hypothesize stimulate and evaluate. Repeating this pattern can enable one to see how conflicts will react in a human beings movements and response stimuli. This is the foundational law of nature of how the informational logic in the human brain actually operates. The thing is that the need for similar attention getting weighted information is supreme and it just so happens that the Law is all written down. This means that one can freely obtain vast amounts of information that is highly weighted in subjects practicing "law" orders of magnitude beyond the random man on the street because you don't the weights in a random man's experience but you do in one studying law. Courtrooms happen to be the perfect laboratory for such an experiment. Gaining the information forms the informational experience of the information logic and divine inspiration can enable vision into the probable weights of importance to the probable subject. Through envisioning the weights of probable outcomes the path of informational stimuli can be filtered and ordered into paths of targeted self-conflicting logic of the subject and the resulting motor functions can be observed and determined if they are within the probability network hypothesized before the experiment was conducted. Taking this approach to law is one attempting to utilize ALL laws from divine through natural, common, organic, constitutional to statutory code to find out what real law actually is. I have conducted MANY experiments and my results are absolutely amazing. I found law to be something on a whole other level of clarity from where most people's consciousness is currently at. There is absolute precision in law accessible to man. Of course the rulers have known this all along.

So you can flip the bozo bit if you want to but you might just be the bozo here, dude....

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

oh my gawd such gibberish

"This means that one can freely obtain vast amounts of information that is highly weighted in subjects practicing "law" orders of magnitude beyond the random man on the street because you don't the weights in a random man's experience but you do in one studying law."

Yes, translated to English, lawyers know more about law.

The rest of your gibberish is just that.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Your intellectual bankruptcy is total

It is clear you are incapable of comprehending deeper facts of our existence. Sorry you will never attain comprehension of the supreme beauty of the interworking's of ourselves and our universe.

Our individual equal sovereignty will reign supreme regardless of the ignorance and forces of corruption. The jury will determine both the facts and the law. Logic weights will determine the juries decision and corrupted reaction will ensue. The trap will be set and the psychos will walk right in. Justice and transparency will be had and the darkness of ignorance will flee into the shadows as the illumination of awareness births consciously shaped common law from logic tools designed for vectoring towards non-conflicting law. We now have the capability for multigenerational strategies to take form as a goal orientated asymmetric crowdsourced tool that outpaces any awareness information systems built by the usurpers for it is perfectly clear that randomness is their biggest opponent. The conclusion can be determined mathematically and randomness in our path towards lawful congruency will ensure victory. Isn't that why you seek the answers here? You seek to reduce randomness so that you can have your prepackaged rebuttals ready for your protection of tyranny. You need this because you are not a lawful man; this much is clear.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

wowsy wow

"Justice and transparency will be had and the darkness of ignorance will flee into the shadows as the illumination of awareness births consciously shaped common law from logic tools designed for vectoring towards non-conflicting law. We now have the capability for multigenerational strategies to take form as a goal orientated asymmetric crowdsourced tool that outpaces any awareness information systems built by the usurpers for it is perfectly clear that randomness is their biggest opponent. "

It's a NEW GIBBERISH WORLD RECORD!!!

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

From what I understand he had

From what I understand he had an illegal weapon in DC. He violated the law.

He wanted to play games with the government, and they bit him. Be thankful he didn't do what he had originally intended to do.

Where is the accuser?

Where is the valid cause of action? Where is consent of the governed?

Shall we ignore these aspects of law and supplant them with code that is in conflict with our organic laws? Shall we apply code that was never intended for application to the people? Shall we ignore the roots of our laws? Shall we sever these roots of our law that require lawful acts of government to be derived from the consent of the governed? Shall we sever these roots so that we can drift into a tyranny of men acting without accepting liability for their own actions?

Recipe for tyranny:

Allow a group of men to make "laws" upon other men

Remove all liability from those men enforcing those "laws" and require that every "law" they write be enforced upon everyone

Add prosecuting attorney who is the single decider of who the law is applicable to and make that person immune from liability also.

Add judge who is paid in an unlawful tender thereby sitting in direct conflict applicable law themselves being the decider of the case itself

Mix

This recipe will give you tyranny every time.

The current recipe is not lawful. It is the result of usurpations by corrupt criminal men. One can clearly see what is lawful simply by looking for consistency of ALL applicable law not just whatever they say it is. The "courts" and "law enforcement" are criminals already because they are and have been using violent force to force the use of an unlawful tender (that is a private bank's mathematically guaranteed to fail debt note) upon We the People for a very long time. They are also claiming their authority from the Constitution while their pay for that capacity is this same unlawful tender. Being paid in unlawful tender puts them in Breach of Duty to their constitutional contractual capacity and thus they stand outside their lawful capacity with no jurisdiction in any matter at all. They are sitting criminals who are blatantly violating the tender law. They will claim that issue is settled but the fact remains that they are simply lying corrupt criminals who's actions outside of real law is the single biggest threat to National Security and because of their failure to uphold the law America will experience a total economic collapse. How can we expect criminals unlawfully claiming to be government to uphold the law? They will point to some words on a page and say hey you, you must be punished for this. What happens when we point to the words on a page that says they must only use gold and silver coin as tender in payment of debts to lawfully maintain the defined legal capacity? They will ignore this because they are criminals who are unfit to uphold the law and then they will proceed to demonstrate their criminality by harassing people who have not harmed anyone. It is official at this point; we have a total breakdown in the rule of law. The people do not understand the law and the system using law as a weapon upon the ignorant. This is why America has the most people in prison over all other countries. It is because we do not understand that lawful (just) powers of government are derived from consent of the governed means for every single act that interferes in anyone's life or liberty ever.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

How ridiculous. We have

How ridiculous. We have lawmakers, in fact the constitution expressly allows this. You can't simply not consent to follow the law of the sovereign, whether the sovereign is a king or state. You've read some really strange stuff online, so let me clue you in; it's not real.

Brown-noser. Will your representative care?

-

Free includes debt-free!

I guess Article 1 section 10

of the US Constitution is not real. I guess the Declaration of Independence stating explicitly that governments derive just powers from the consent of the governed is not real either. I guess case law stating definitively that it is We the People who are sovereign is not real either. I guess there is no such thing as unconstitutional code and everything corrupt criminals write is indeed lawful. Hell, lets just throw out all knowledge and law and just make the idiocracy of Mens' opinions supreme law.

You said: "We have lawmakers, in fact the constitution expressly allows this."

Yeah, Walmart has a board of directors who makes employee rules also but these rules have no application to the shareholders of Walmart because the shareholder's already have a shareholder's agreement that is governing law of the relationship to Walmart. Same goes for government. We the People are the shareholders who have the DOI and Constitution as our shareholder's agreement and Congress has the power to make code regulations for employees and entities under Government created capacities. Remember our law also states that rights are endowed by the creator. We the People created government and defined the contractually bound capacity. We made the Law for government because we already have common law. You seemed to have missed this fact in our law along with all other opinionated idiots in this country.

So let me clue you in; you are an idiot who has been deceived by your own ego into accepting criminal activity as lawful governance.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

please cite one source

that says your interpretation of "consent of the governed" means what you think it does. Any legitimate scholarly treatise or historic document will do. Sovereign citizen websites will not do. Go!

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

The Common Law of Agency

The DOI. The US Constitution. Lysander Spooner: No Treason

These are only the start. The thing is I can find it in all the American case law I have ever read. It is easy to see if you understand how consent works. As I said before the fact is so consistent that it is now the only thing I am looking for in case law. You consent you lose, You don't consent you win. It is 100% both sides in all case law I have ever read or experienced.

All laws that are valid must be non-conflicting with all other valid laws. Why do you think they call it LAW?

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

you lose then

Lysander spooner is just another hack, like you, only smarter. He doesn;t count.

The Constitution doesn't describe that "consent of the governed" means what you say it does. Quite the opposite in fact.

The "common law of agency" does not, and cannot possibly be a source for that, as it has little relation to the subject.

Show me a real scholarly source, a legal hornbook, one of the federalist papers, caselaw, whatever, which says that "consent of the governed" means that after a law has passed it is up to everyone individually to say whether they consent. Just one.

If you can't, will you please drop it?

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

You are really not getting it

You think the consent I am talking about here is for someone charged for a crime and they consent to whether or not the charge is applicable. I am talking about any government action that interferes with the liberty of any man/woman must be derived from the consent of the governed. This consent can come from the accused and/or the accuser. For the government "agents" lawful actions can only come from consent of the governed because in order for any agent to be an agent there must be a principal that the agent is acting on the behalf of. This is the only way the agent can have limited liability and maintain any form of agency. The principal is the one liable for the actions (within their defined legal capacity as an agent) of the agent. Follow liability and make sure the liability is enumerated and that for government agents this liability is held by one or more of the governed. This will maintain true agency and maintain congruency within the DOI. Understanding the clear requirement of the accused's inherent common law right to face their accuser (laws of nature permitting) the law of agency, the DOI's explicit requirement of consent of the governed, the constitutional enumerated purpose of securing the blessings of liberty and domestic tranquility all must never be violated to maintain real lawful procedures. Otherwise a law will be broken and the law breakers can easily be exposed by truly law abiding men.

When I say law abiding men I mean men who never lie cheat steal kill or intentionally harm another in any way at all. This is the first thing one must do to discover real law otherwise the divine inspiration needed for maintaining the protections of law will be inaccessible to the law breaker. One cannot hide malicious intent from the true sovereign of the Universe. Hiding one's intent from the divine source of order is impossible.

For you to say Spooner was a hack demonstrates your ineptitude. He is the only other man I have ever seen who maintains perfect logical congruency in his interpretations of law. He is literally an Isaac Newton or Einstein of legal law. I found Spooner after a deep journey into law and history and found he is the only other human being I can find who clearly understands the requirements for all law to be maintained at all times for all actions whether criminal or civil. Others were very close such as TJ and Bacon but none achieved the epic enlightenment of Spooner.

The most powerful Law of Nature is Time. It is finite and we all will run out of it. Use this Law to your advantage, for it offers you infinite possibilities...

more babble

nothing you say makes any sense. Not even your approach to the issue makes sense.

A smart person would realize that law is not the study of physics. It is not a field where the concepts are so rarified and difficult to understand that only a few can understand them. You've built up this idea that you and Mr. Spooner are the only ones who understand the law. Instead, you're just a couple of idiots fantasizing about stuff that has no application in the real world.

A smart person who is not insane would also realize the best way to learn about a topic is to get instruction. guided learning is very important in this subject. You, sitting in your basement (or loft, whatever it is) reading random crap and trying to come up with common threads between the declaration of independence, the law of agency, and some whackjob websites is not learning the law, or studying the law. It may or may not be an effective cure for boredom.

But sorry, you get no Nobel prize for your legal scholarship, or your hairbrained ideas that one has to have a "cause of action" to be a criminal defendant, or that the "common law procedures" (which you claim to be the only one who knows) explain all of your illogical ramblings.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein