164 votes

Thread Summary: Recall Senator John McCain

Let it start.

The DailyPaul is due something like this.

Let it begin right here.

How about it Arizona... the timing couldn't be more PERFECT! He's just been publicly rebuked by his own party.
-----------------------------
SUMMARY OF FINDINGS 09/16/2013
► What I need are some PMs from Phoenix/Tucson/Flagstaff Paulers... contacts please.
Cheers,
G.

LET IT BEGINNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

--------------Thread Summary------------

This thread was birthed Thursday... not quite 4 days ago!
A LOT has been learned by DIGGING, Phone calling and emailing.
Much THANKS to DP moderators for keeping it front paged pinned.

The Short Answer is YES.. John McCain CAN be recalled.

What We Know (now):

1. In the HISTORY of the United States it's never been done...
recalling a Federal Senator or Congressperson by the People of the State who elected them to office.

2. The ONLY U.S. Constitutional provision is for the Congress itself (or their own party)
to remove them with a 2/3 vote... an impeachment process.

3. RobHino surfaced up 2 excellent links that cover it in depth.
Great Reading and includes case histories and court opinions.
Senate.gov (click Recall of Legislative and Removal of Members of Congress)
Heritage.org - Can U.S. Senators Be Recalled?

4. Would a Recall fall under a 10th Amendment 'reserved power' to the States?
Not in the opinion of the Courts (see above links).

5. Is recall specifically PROHIBITED by the U.S. Constitution?
No, it is silent. Rather, the process for removal is outlined in the U.S. Constitution and the Courts have historically interpreted this to be the vehicle.
(see links above)

Voluntary Contract / Contract Law

6. Each State has variations of Basic Contract Law
Real Estate 'Contracts' for example vary from State to State...
but all have the essential elements for establishing a valid enforceable contract.

7. The People of Arizona through their State Government has established by Statutory Law a VOLUNTARY CONTRACT (not 'required') by which each candidate, both Federal and State Candidates, may sign (or not sign,) that DECLARES to the People of Arizona whether (or not) they will abide by and comply with the decision of a RECALL ELECTION and resign their office. This happens BEFORE the primaries, the contracts are FILED with the Secretary of State, and remain in effect for the length of their term of office.

HERE ARE THE LINKS:
Arizona Law: title 19 statues (all)
Arizona Statute 19: 221 Statement(s)
Arizona Statute 19: 222 Pledge
Sample Pledge document
McCain Pledged in 2010 Election (filing)
McCain Pledged (also) in 2004 (news release)

8. Can a person 'give up' their Constitutional 'Rights' or 'Protections' Voluntarily?
Yes. It happens every day. Consider the 'rights' given up by enlisted soldiers.

One of the ESSENTIAL keys, recognized by the courts, is that it be VOLUNTARY.. without fraud or coercement.

9. Can John McCain be recalled from office by the People of Arizona?
Yes. He most certainly can if a recall election is held after the required number of signatures are filed with the State petitioning that a recall election be held.

10. In Conclusion... to this point in the efforts of this thread, concerning an Arizona Recall Election of John McCain...
(Note: there were 1,702,326 votes cast in the 2010 Arizona Senate Race.)

there is only 1 critical threshold:

(1.) The Filing of (approx) 425,582 valid Arizona voter signatures (which is equal to 25% of the number of votes cast in the Senate race of 2010.) HERE and HERE

What Happens when that is achieved?

A recall election is automatic and his name is placed on the recall election ballot (along with a self composed 200 word 'explanation' of WHY it's unfair... his excuses... can't wait to see THAT. :)

Below his name will be a list of qualified nominees to FINISH HIS TERM.

What makes a NOMINEE eligible? 2% of Total Voters for the Office or (approx.) 34,047 signatures on a nominee petition. HERE

So that's it folks.
ALL that separates us from making this a reality....
is 425,582 disgruntled signatures.

►RobHino has secured a website for a Recall effort (thanks Rob!)
www.FireJohnMcCain.com
and has put up a 'hold' page pending developers collaborating.

►An existing Committee (or one created) must initiate the recall
with the Secretary of State. HERE is the handbook. (thanks Mark Vette!)




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Now is the time!

The War Powers Act could easily pass through the Senate and quietly make its way through the House floor. What better way to raise awareness about it by initiating the recall campaign? Then it could be used as a threat to other establishment tyrants...and Obama!

I am a proud libertarian Muslim.

Here are some awesome Islamic Libertarian links:

http://minaret.org

http://muslims4liberty.com

AND TO GET OFF THE NEOCON DRIVEL ABOUT MUSLIMS: http://loonwatch.com

Amended Summary - Monday 9/16/13

--------------Thread Summary------------

This thread was birthed Thursday... not quite 4 days ago!
A LOT has been learned by DIGGING, Phone calling and emailing.
Much THANKS to DP moderators for keeping it front paged pinned.

The Short Answer is YES.. John McCain CAN be recalled.

What We Know (now):

1. In the HISTORY of the United States it's never been done...
recalling a Federal Senator or Congressperson by the People of the State who elected them to office.

2. The ONLY U.S. Constitutional provision is for the Congress itself (or their own party)
to remove them with a 2/3 vote... an impeachment process.

3. RobHino surfaced up 2 excellent links that cover it in depth.
Great Reading and includes case histories and court opinions.
Senate.gov (click Recall of Legislative and Removal of Members of Congress)
Heritage.org - Can U.S. Senators Be Recalled?

4. Would a Recall fall under a 10th Amendment 'reserved power' to the States?
Not in the opinion of the Courts (see above links).

5. Is recall specifically PROHIBITED by the U.S. Constitution?
No, it is silent. Rather, the process for removal is outlined in the U.S. Constitution and the Courts have historically interpreted this to be the vehicle.
(see links above)

Voluntary Contract / Contract Law

6. Each State has variations of Basic Contract Law
Real Estate 'Contracts' for example vary from State to State...
but all have the essential elements for establishing a valid enforceable contract.

7. The People of Arizona through their State Government has established by Statutory Law a VOLUNTARY CONTRACT (not 'required') by which each candidate, both Federal and State Candidates, may sign (or not sign,) that DECLARES to the People of Arizona whether (or not) they will abide by and comply with the decision of a RECALL ELECTION and resign their office. This happens BEFORE the primaries, the contracts are FILED with the Secretary of State, and remain in effect for the length of their term of office.

HERE ARE THE LINKS:
Arizona Law: title 19 statues (all)
Arizona Statute 19: 221 Statement(s)
Arizona Statute 19: 222 Pledge
Sample Pledge document
McCain Pledged in 2010 Election (filing)
McCain Pledged (also) in 2004 (news release)

8. Can a person 'give up' their Constitutional 'Rights' or 'Protections' Voluntarily?
Yes. It happens every day. Consider the 'rights' given up by enlisted soldiers.

One of the ESSENTIAL keys, recognized by the courts, is that it be VOLUNTARY.. without fraud or coercement.

9. Can John McCain be recalled from office by the People of Arizona?
Yes. He most certainly can if a recall election is held after the required number of signatures are filed with the State petitioning a recall election be held.

10. In Conclusion... to this point in the efforts of this thread, concerning an Arizona Recall Election of John McCain...
(Note: there were 1,702,326 votes cast in the 2010 Arizona Senate Race.)

there is only 1 critical threshold:

(1.) The Filing of (approx) 425,582 valid Arizona voter signatures (which is equal to 25% of the number of votes cast in the Senate race of 2010.) HERE and HERE

What Happens when that is achieved?

A recall election is automatic and his name is placed on the recall election ballot (along with a self composed 200 word 'explanation' of WHY it's unfair... his excuses... can't wait to see THAT. :)

Below his name will be a list of qualified nominees to FINISH HIS TERM.

What makes a NOMINEE eligible? 2% of Total Voters for the Office or (approx.) 34,047 signatures on a nominee petition. HERE

So that's it folks.
ALL that separates us from making this a reality....
is 425,582 disgruntled signatures.

►RobHino has secured a website for a Recall effort (thanks Rob!)
www.FireJohnMcCain.com
and has put up a 'hold' page pending developers collaborating.

►An existing Committee (or one created) must initiate the recall
with the Secretary of State. HERE is the handbook. (thanks Mark Vette!)

Summary now corrected...

to the 425,582 figure... thank you NowOrNever.
Cheers,
G.
btw... HERE is a site with a slightly different Senate race total of 1,713,334.
It is the Secretary of State who will determine the number needed.

Well, if you get 430 people

Well, if you get 430 people to get 500 signitures each, that would do it. Or 215 people getting 1000 each.

To climb the mountain, you must believe you can.

Next Step for us Non-Arizonians

Apparently www.recallmccain.com is already purchased, but here's a list of possibilities.
www.recall-mccain.com
www.mccainrecall.com
www.recall-senator-mccain.com

I talked about setting up a money-bomb to get McCain out of office and I'm going to buy the site now in preparation. I'm don't know the first thing about website design, but I'll either figure it out or get help from a fellow supporter.

My idea is to have all the info in this thread etc. in an easy to read format along with links/videos that will fuel the fire of disgruntled voters and finally information on a money-bomb etc. Please chime in with what you think is the best site name, ideas, etc.

As to McCain's replacement

http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/1...

A. Unless the officer otherwise requests in writing, the name of the officer against whom a recall petition is filed shall be placed as a candidate on the official ballot without nomination. Other candidates for the office may be nominated to be voted upon at the election and shall be placed upon the official recall ballot after filing a nomination petition that is signed by a number of qualified electors that is equal to at least two per cent of the total votes cast for all candidates for that office at the last election for that office.

Total votes cast in previous Senate election was 1,702,326, 2% of which is 34,047, so that's how many signatures we need to get somebody on the ballot to replace McCain. Any ideas as to who we should nominate?

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

I read the statute differently

We need 425,582 signatures, not 215,000.

http://www.azleg.state.az.us/FormatDocument.asp?inDoc=/ars/1...

A. Every public officer holding an elective office, either by election, appointment or retention, is subject to recall from such office by the qualified electors of the electoral district from which candidates are elected to that office. Such electoral district may include the whole state. A number of qualified electors equaling twenty-five per cent of the number of votes cast at the last preceding general election for all the candidates for the office held by the officer, even if the officer was not elected at that election, divided by the number of offices that were being filled at that election, by recall petition, may demand the officer's recall.

So, the number of signatures required is not 25% the number of votes cast for McCain in 2010, it's 25% the number of votes cast for all US Senate candidates in that election, divided by the number of US Senate seats being filled.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_election_i...

1,702,326 votes were cast in that election. 25% of that is 425,582. Divide by the number of US senate seats up for grabs (only 1), and we need 425,582 signatures to trigger a recall election for McCain.

"Alas! I believe in the virtue of birds. And it only takes a feather for me to die laughing."

the language (below your bold)

is confusing... but THANK YOU for pointing this out.
Reading (and re-reading)... I believe you may be right.
I would like to see this debated here BEFORE I correct the summary.
Anybody else???

I see your point

But in reading it again I noticed this:

"is subject to recall from such office by the qualified electors of the electoral district from which candidates are elected to that office. Such electoral district may include the whole state".

So my question is about this term:

"electoral district"

How would this apply in this case? we have 2 Senators, are they applied Districts? Or in this case the whole state is the district?

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

no... you can ignore the 'district' language...

The entire statute is crafted to (try) and cover ALL offices...
State as well as Federal/Reps as well as Senators... the 'whole state' verbiage was included to cover Senators as well.

Thank You!

Now all the information is laid out and static! fantastic! Well my refrigerator just quit so I have an emergency to go deal with! I will check back later, Thank you for all the work! Well done!

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

Lol, I thought so

But which one do I contact to represent ME, lol. They could throw this back and forth all day long! "Talk to Jeff" "No, talk to John".

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

"425,582 signatures to trigger a recall election for McCain"

Then get busy. And God's speed!

For Liberty!

Josie The Outlaw http://www.josietheoutlaw.com/

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

This is why term limits for

This is why term limits for Congress and the Senate are so important. IMO, the next great push that Americans must demand to break the decades long cycle of corruption.

Term limits could be a

Term limits could be a double-edged sword.

What if senators do all evil in their final term, because they aren't going to be around the next time. In a well-informed wide-awake society, term limits will only be a bad thing.

What do you mean "evil"? Why

What do you mean "evil"? Why is it good for the presidency, but not Congress or the Senate? Old-timers defending their foxholes are the problem. They shouldn't be allowed to die in office.

Thread Summary A/O Monday 9/16/13

Thread Summary A/O Monday 9/16/13

This thread was birthed Thursday... not even 48 hours ago!
A LOT has been learned by DIGGING, Phone calling and emailing.
Much THANKS to DP moderators for keeping it front paged pinned.

The Short Answer is YES.. John McCain CAN be recalled.

What We Know (now):

1. In the HISTORY of the United States it's never been done...
recalling a Federal Senator or Congressperson by the People of the State who elected them to office.

2. The ONLY U.S. Constitutional provision is for the Congress itself (or their own party) to remove them with a 2/3 vote... an impeachment process.

3. RobHino surfaced up 2 excellent links that cover it in depth.
Great Reading and includes case histories and court opinions.
Senate.gov (click Recall of Legislative and Removal of Members of Congress)
Heritage.org - Can U.S. Senators Be Recalled?

4. Would a Recall fall under a 10th Amendment 'reserved power' to the States?
Not in the opinion of the Courts (see above links).

5. Is recall specifically PROHIBITED by the U.S. Constitution?
No, it is silent. Rather, the process for removal is outlined in the U.S. Constitution and the Courts have historically interpreted this to be the vehicle.
(see links above)

Voluntary Contract / Contract Law

6. Each State has variations of Basic Contract Law
Real Estate 'Contracts' for example vary from State to State...
but all have the essential elements for establishing a valid enforceable contract.

7. The People of Arizona through their State Government has established by Statutory Law a VOLUNTARY CONTRACT (not 'required') by which each candidate, both Federal and State Candidates, may sign (or not sign,) that DECLARES to the People of Arizona whether (or not) they will abide by and comply with the decision of a RECALL ELECTION and resign their office. This happens BEFORE the primaries, the contracts are FILED with the Secretary of State, and remain in effect for the length of their term of office.

HERE ARE THE LINKS:
Arizona Law: title 19 statues (all)
Arizona Statute 19: 221 Statement(s)
Arizona Statute 19: 222 Pledge
Sample Pledge document
McCain Pledged in 2010 Election (filing)
McCain Pledged (also) in 2004 (news release)

8. Can a person 'give up' their Constitution 'Rights' or 'Protections' Voluntarily?
Yes. It happens every day. Consider the 'rights' given up by enlisted soldiers.

One of the ESSENTIAL keys, recognized by the courts, is that it be VOLUNTARY.. without fraud or coercement.

9. Can John McCain be recalled from office by the People of Arizona?
Yes. He most certainly can if a recall election is held after the required number of signatures are filed with the State petitioning a recall election be held.

10. In Conclusion... to this point in the efforts of this thread, concerning an Arizona Recall Election of John McCain...
there is only 1 critical threshold:

(1.) The Filing of (approx) 215,000 valid Arizona voter signatures which is equal to 25% of the number of voters that put him there in 2010.

What Happens when that is achieved?

A recall election is automatic and his name is placed on the election ballot (along with a self composed 200 word 'explanation' of WHY it's unfair... his excuses... can't wait to see THAT. :)

Below his name will be a list of qualified nominees to FINISH HIS TERM.

What makes a NOMINEE eligible? 2% of Total Voters for the Office

"Other candidates for the office may be nominated to be voted upon at the election and shall be placed upon the official recall ballot after filing a nomination petition that is signed by a number of qualified electors that is equal to at least two per cent of the total votes cast for all candidates for that office at the last election for that office. Nomination petition signers shall be qualified electors of the electoral district of the officer against whom the recall petition is filed."
HERE

So that's it folks.
ALL that separates us from making this a reality....
is 215,000 disgruntled signatures.

Cheers,
G.

oops...

Hate when I proofread, post, proof again and get the 405 ACCESS DENIED.
oh well... didn't mean to exaggerate.. but the thread "isn't quite 4 days old"... how that came out to be 48hrs was an honest mistake.
Forgive me? :)

Here we go!

That's it, great job! Thank you! Would you consider editing your OP and pasting all this in there my friend?

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

Uhmm...

I'd LOVE it... but
it would take up a LOT of Front Page space.. I put up a link to it.
However :)
I will leave it up to the moderators to do (for perhaps, maybe 24 hrs??)
They have been VERY generous with us so far... don't see why they wouldn't :)
Cheers,
G.

oh hell...

I'll do it.
Cheers,
G.

G ?

I'm pretty sure the program is set to limit the size of a post when it is placed on the front page. Or a mod can put a --More-- point in the post so that it only shows part of it and you have to click "More" to redirect to the whole article page?

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

"Recall your senator" is the

"Recall your senator" is the new "call your senator"...

Do we have a copy of his contract?

I misplaced the link you gave me to his contract, or did you? lol. How about resizing it and embedding it in your post to eliminate the questions about whether this can be done or not?

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

Gotcha covered

Look below at my next post.

"Trust, but verify"
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same."
- Ronald Reagan

The pledge signed by McCain - - -

{ Document abridged to limit the footprint in this comments section.
To see the full original press release please visit: http://www.azsos.gov/releases/2010/pressrelease37.htm }

For Immediate Release
June 8, 2010
Contact: Matthew Benson
Director of Communications
602-350-2834 - mobile
mbenson@azsos.gov

Sec. Bennett releases list of congressional candidates that filed recall statements.
Candidates that filed statement pledge “to resign immediately if not re-elected on a recall vote”

PHOENIX – As required by A.R.S. § 19-221(B), Secretary of State Ken Bennett has released the following list of candidates for the offices of United States Representative in Congress and United States Senator who filed a Statement on Recall.

The following candidates filed a Statement on Recall agreeing to resign if not re-elected on a recall vote:

U.S. Senator:
John Dougherty,
Rodney Glassman,
J.D. Hayworth,
John McCain,
Randy Parraz;

U.S. Representative:
CD 1;
Bradley Beauchamp,
Russell “Rusty” Bowers,
Paul Burton,
Paul Gosar,
Sydney Hay,
Jon Jensen,
Ann Kirkpatrick,
Steve Mehta,
Thomas J. Zaleski ;

The following candidates did not file a Statement on Recall:

U.S. Senator:
Jim Deakin,
Cathy Eden,
Jerry Joslyn,
David F. Nolan;

Copies of the statements are on file in the Office of the Secretary of State and are available upon request.

- 30 -

"Trust, but verify"
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same."
- Ronald Reagan

I sent an email request

I sent an email request for a PDF of the actual document. I can just hear him now " My wife was right, I shouldn't have signed that pesky thing, the Wacko Birds found it" Lol.

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

Right on!

See, this is the hard work I was talking about Mark. You have chased down a lot since we started this effort. Thanks!

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

Not so fast!

This recall effort may embarrass McCain but it will do little else. The Senate is the sole arbiter and punisher of bad deeds by its members.

It only takes one to KEEP AMERICANS FREE. Know your duties & rights as a juror. Stop the unconstitutional conviction of innocents in federal custody. The Fully Informed Jury CALL 1-800-TEL-JURY www.fija.org IMMEDIATELY if not sooner. It's that important.

Well ... Embarrassment not withstanding ...

We thought that as well, initially.
Upon further study we found ... well you can see for yourself.
follow the links below.

Arizona Supreme Court - Case Law which sets the precedent:
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/3199340
(You can just skip down to the sentence in bold script if you like)

That establishes the means.

Now, for the wherewithal -

There is the pledge. Every candidate, both challenger and incumbent, are offered the choice to sign or refuse a pledge to resign if recalled.
McCain signed it:
http://www.azsos.gov/releases/2010/pressrelease37.htm

You're right about him being embarrassed - especially when we overwhelming vote for his recall!

"Trust, but verify"
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same."
- Ronald Reagan