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Ancient Confession Found: 'We Invented Jesus Christ' Why governments create false histories and false gods.

I know, this is like the fart in church. I'm not posting this to be antagonistic. I happened to be one of those that don't believe in Christianity but accept that this is what most people in my community believe. I get along just the same....Since we like to question institutions around here then whats wrong with questioning this?

Anyway, check this out as point of conversation:

Ancient Confession Found: 'We Invented Jesus Christ'
Biblical scholars will be appearing at the 'Covert Messiah' Conference at Conway Hall in London on the 19th of October to present this controversial discovery to the British public.

London (PRWEB UK) 8 October 2013

American Biblical scholar Joseph Atwill will be appearing before the British public for the first time in London on the 19th of October to present a controversial new discovery: ancient confessions recently uncovered now prove, according to Atwill, that the New Testament was written by first-century Roman aristocrats and that they fabricated the entire story of Jesus Christ. His presentation will be part of a one-day symposium entitled "Covert Messiah" at Conway Hall in Holborn (full details can be found at http://www.covertmessiah.com).

Although to many scholars his theory seems outlandish, and is sure to upset some believers, Atwill regards his evidence as conclusive and is confident its acceptance is only a matter of time. "I present my work with some ambivalence, as I do not want to directly cause Christians any harm," he acknowledges, "but this is important for our culture. Alert citizens need to know the truth about our past so we can understand how and why governments create false histories and false gods. They often do it to obtain a social order that is against the best interests of the common people."

Atwill asserts that Christianity did not really begin as a religion, but a sophisticated government project, a kind of propaganda exercise used to pacify the subjects of the Roman Empire. "Jewish sects in Palestine at the time, who were waiting for a prophesied warrior Messiah, were a constant source of violent insurrection during the first century," he explains. "When the Romans had exhausted conventional means of quashing rebellion, they switched to psychological warfare. They surmised that the way to stop the spread of zealous Jewish missionary activity was to create a competing belief system. That's when the 'peaceful' Messiah story was invented. Instead of inspiring warfare, this Messiah urged turn-the-other-cheek pacifism and encouraged Jews to 'give onto Caesar' and pay their taxes to Rome."

Was Jesus based on a real person from history? "The short answer is no," Atwill insists, "in fact he may be the only fictional character in literature whose entire life story can be traced to other sources. Once those sources are all laid bare, there's simply nothing left."

Atwill's most intriguing discovery came to him while he was studying "Wars of the Jews" by Josephus [the only surviving first-person historical account of first-century Judea] alongside the New Testament. "I started to notice a sequence of parallels between the two texts," he recounts. "Although it's been recognised by Christian scholars for centuries that the prophesies of Jesus appear to be fulfilled by what Josephus wrote about in the First Jewish-Roman war, I was seeing dozens more. What seems to have eluded many scholars is that the sequence of events and locations of Jesus ministry are more or less the same as the sequence of events and locations of the military campaign of [Emperor] Titus Flavius as described by Josephus. This is clear evidence of a deliberately constructed pattern. The biography of Jesus is actually constructed, tip to stern, on prior stories, but especially on the biography of a Roman Caesar."

How could this go unnoticed in the most scrutinised books of all time? "Many of the parallels are conceptual or poetic, so they aren't all immediately obvious. After all, the authors did not want the average believer to see what they were doing, but they did want the alert reader to see it. An educated Roman in the ruling class would probably have recognised the literary game being played." Atwill maintains he can demonstrate that "the Roman Caesars left us a kind of puzzle literature that was meant to be solved by future generations, and the solution to that puzzle is 'We invented Jesus Christ, and we're proud of it.'"

Is this the beginning of the end of Christianity? "Probably not," grants Atwill, "but what my work has done is give permission to many of those ready to leave the religion to make a clean break. We've got the evidence now to show exactly where the story of Jesus came from. Although Christianity can be a comfort to some, it can also be very damaging and repressive, an insidious form of mind control that has led to blind acceptance of serfdom, poverty, and war throughout history. To this day, especially in the United States, it is used to create support for war in the Middle East."

Atwill encourages skeptics to challenge him at Conway Hall, where after the presentations there is likely to be a lively Q&A session. Joining Mr.Atwill will be fellow scholar Kenneth Humphreys, author of the book "Jesus Never Existed."

Further information can be found at http://www.covertmessiah.com.

About Joseph Atwill: Joseph Atwill is the author of the best-selling book "Caesar's Messiah" and its upcoming sequel "The Single Strand."

http://uk.prweb.com/releases/2013/10/prweb11201273.htm?utm_s...



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No actual evidence presented.

No actual evidence presented.

Ventura 2012

Seriously?

"This is clear evidence of a deliberately constructed pattern."

" Atwill maintains he can demonstrate that "the Roman Caesars left us a kind of puzzle literature that was meant to be solved by future generations, and the solution to that puzzle is 'We invented Jesus Christ, and we're proud of it.'"

This is the best you can do to discredit Christianity? I expect more from you dexter.

This post is an absolute insult. If someone dared to offend Jews, Muslims, women, gays, etc. this way on this site, all of the liberal Atheists who hang out here would be up in arms for posting such divisive subject matter. However, as long it is Christianity it's fine. You show your true colors...

Come on Clint

Its an article up for debate. You don't have to subscribe to it or even be insulted. I simple thought it was interesting.

I thought it would be interesting to see everyones thought on this.....

Geez

For Freedom!
The World is my country, all mankind is my brethren, to do good is my religion.

It's weird how people think details

would never get hashed out after the fact and rewritten to make cohesive sense. Must never happened, especial when it comes to important things like religion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea

Welcome to the Deep South.

if you REALLY want to honk such types as this, just mention the Geneva bible.
and ask them what that had to with Guy Fawkes.

I find it best to talk trash about democracy itself. try it. it has the same effect on folks.
you really should move this to the.... protected area.
be prepared to protect yourself.

peace.

Why is this topic...

not in the "religion" forum?

Squabbling about religion is harmful to the Liberty movement and to Daily Paul. At least have the decency and respect to move the squabbling to the forum created for it.

.
~wobbles but doesn't fall down~

What a load

Makes Dan Brown seem like a genius.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Seems to me there's more comments about God

than Jesus. The name "God" is a very general term. The Bible uses the word generically more often than not. I gave an earlier post and don't want to try to convince anyone of my beliefs because there are very few who relate Sumerian writings with biblical stories.
But I'd like to know from those who've read the Bible, who do you say is Jehovah/Yahweh? I have read almost all the posts but not one word was mentioned of Jehovah/Yahweh.
Who was it that spoke to Abraham, Moses, who marked the gene of Aaron, who gave Moses language, and took Enoch, Elijha away in a ufo?
Who gave the plow for farming to Earthlings, electricity to Egypt, who impregnated virgin Mary, and countless baron elderly women? Who created the Giza pyramids and originated astrological designs for ziggurats all over the world, and who mapped the heavens first and named the Zodiac constellations? Who created man in his image and likeness and what does that mean to you?

People speak of God so philosophically, but isn't he real? Who is Yahweh/Jehovah?

Christianity originated with

Christianity originated with Zarathustra.
Most biblical dates are wrong.

Are you talking

Giorgio Tsoukalos?

For Freedom!
The World is my country, all mankind is my brethren, to do good is my religion.

He's not saying

it was aliens

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."-- Albert Einstein

Way too easy for people to call themselves an expert or scholar

these days. Kind of reminds me of that scene from 'Tommy Boy' when he's talking about a guarantee on a box. A guarantee makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside, kind of like someone saying they're an expert or a scholar. Well if they claim to be one well then surely what they're saying couldn't be wrong.
Skip to 0:58


http://youtu.be/mEB7WbTTlu4

This will be a very interesting conference indeed...

Perhaps this guy has nothing, and perhaps he has something that others have missed, but in the end it will be interesting to see how this plays out. I will definitely look out for the video from the conference. Thanks Dex.

Always remember:
"It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds." ~ Samuel Adams
If they hate us for our freedom, they must LOVE us now....

Stay IRATE, remain TIRELESS, an

Reading the Bible.

I have read the Bible as an unbeliever and as a believer. These were two completely different experiences.

It is therefore my belief that the Bible is a closed book to the natural mind and that the spiritual Truth it reveals can only be seen and heard by the spiritual mind under the leading of the Holy Spirit.

There is a very concentrated attack on the Christian faith today, just as there has been for two thousand years, but today the attack is focusing on the identity of Jesus and casting doubt on His very existence. This confirms to me that we are living in the very last days of the present form of the Christian Church whose purpose has been fulfilled and is now passing away just as did the ancient Church in the first century, the one that gave us the Law and the Prophets which prophesied of the appearing of the Messiah in due time.

Just as the High Priest Caiaphas spoke prophetically of the mission of Jesus to "die for the people" so it is my belief that these attacks on Christianity and the assertions of Christianity's demise are prophetic.

"But one of them, Caiaphas, who was high priest that year, said to them, You know nothing at all. Nor do you understand that it is better for you that one man should die for the people, not that the whole nation should perish. He did not say this of his own accord, but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the nation, and not for the nation only, but also to gather into one the children of God who are scattered abroad. So from that day on they made plans to put him to death." (John 11:49-53)

We are living in the time of the casting down of satan and his messengers from their place in the heavens to the Earth. This is happening in the lives of individual believers who have been chosen for this purpose and is happening everywhere on Earth as these spiritual events are physically manifested. Among the consequences are the persecution of the saints and the concentrated attacks on the Reality of Christ in the minds of men. Many will no doubt fall away, as has been happening for some time, and many will be deceived into believing the adversary's lies. This has been prophesied and will be fulfilled.

"Indeed, all who desire to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted, while evil people and impostors will go on from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived. But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be competent, equipped for every good work." (2 Timothy 3:12-17)

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

That is about the most honest

That is about the most honest point of view ive seen on the matter in some time. If you read the bible with a mind capable of reason, you'll see a laughable pile of ridiculous stories, bloodthirsty medival garbage and peasant control. Naturally you'll think to yourself: "How can anyone in their right mind believe this shit!? You'd have to be either completely insane or dumber than a bag of hammers!"

HOWEVER! If you read it as a "faithful" person who already pre-believes that god is loving and good and perfect... the bible is going to sound just awesome as you mind numbly blocks out all the info that doesn't jive with your dogma, filing it under "God works in mysterious ways" ... then you'll be amazed by the occasional amazing & heart-warming scripture found here and there within.

I esspecially like where you say that the bible must be a closed book to smart people. Aparently, god ONLY wants to surround himself with that certain demograph of people incapable of questioning scary authority from the cosmos, and who are incapable of reason.

Amen brother.

Lost Sheep

Notice how in his comment, there is no vitriol or hatred, yet your comment is filled with hate. You're a terrible person. I will pray that the Lord will show you the way.

I think hate is a closed book

I think hate is a closed book to faithful minds. They simply can't see the hate they are spewing because they often confuse the term Hate with love and vice versa. The "natural" mind however percieves statments such as: "only the faithful go to paradise whilst the poor nonbelievers go to hell" as pure hate.

Christians have been threatening me and my family with being locked into a firey cage and tortured for eternity if we don't submit to their omnipresent king for as long as I can remember. And worse they've been doing it while pretending to be good and loving. You call me a terrible person, but you're the one who serves a giant, authoritarian sadist. You're the one who condones the cosmic torture of billions of people for eternity in a flaming pit simply for not worshiping someone. You're the one who believes in a system of super-natural monarchy where no one has rights, is under 100% serveilence and are ruled by coersion.

I don't want anyone getting that kind of treatment. Who is the terrible person?

Good news.

The orthodox Christian teaching on eternal punishment in hell is completely false. The apostles never taught this. The teaching of the Church for the first three centuries was predominantly the doctrine of universal reconciliation and the restoration of all things. It was only when the Church became an institution of the State that doctrines became dogmas created to control believers and eventually heretics were executed. This is all the work of the adversary of God who took up his seat in the Church and permeated her with leavened doctrines designed to perpetuate his control.

These events were prophesied in the Kingdom parables of Jesus because He knew that the Church of the past two thousand years would fail in her mission just as the first Church had failed in her mission. The final Church into which we are now transitioning will complete the work of restoration into the Kingdom of Heaven on Earth, the Paradise of God. Just as the crucifixion, resurrection and ascension of the Lord Jesus Christ had been predetermined and foretold in the Spring Feast of Passover, the Feast of Unleavened Bread and the Wave Sheaf offering so the coming of the Holy Spirit and the leavened nature of the second Church was foretold in the Feast of Weeks or Pentecost. The final Feasts of Trumpets and Tabernacles and the Day of Atonement remain to be completely fulfilled and their meaning was hidden.

However, this latter truth and others were revealed to the Church in the great revivals that began in a small Bible College in Saskatchewan, Canada in the Spring of 1948 and spread all over the world. These revelations given by the Holy Spirit were largely rejected by all the churches but they continued to be taught by scattered ministries around the world.

This all happened at the same time as the State of Israel was coming into being in Palestine. The doctrine of the State of Israel being the prophesied regathering of the ancient people of Israel and a harbinger of the second manifestation of the Lord Jesus Christ then took hold in the churches and the Lord gave them over to this strong delusion because they had rejected the truth.

Those who continued to believe in the revelations given by the Holy Spirit and to teach them were often driven from the churches and persecuted by their former brethren. This doctrine of universal reconciliation and the restoration of all things is clearly taught in the scriptures but due to the spiritual blindness that has been visited upon the churches by God it is still rejected by the majority of Christians. However this is a temporary condition and the time is near when this blindness will be healed and all believers will come to a knowledge of the Truth.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

Once again...

...you ignore Theology 101. If you're going to criticize God's actions in the context of His existence, then you've got to put that in context.

Hell is inevitability. It is what we deserve; think of it as a quarantine chamber. God does not destroy His ultimate creation, and yet imperfection *cannot* exist in the presence of God. Therefore, Hell is a place where God is not present - the TOTAL lack of His presence *is* the horror.

In addition, there's also the issue of free will; God does not override people's minds. We are created in His image, and He allows us to make our own choices. If you choose NOT to accept the Gift, then He will not force you to.

I don't understand how you accuse us of threatening you. If you were standing on a rooftop in a rapidly rising flood, and I fly in with a helicopter and toss you a ladder, yelling, "Grab this so that you don't drown!" - is that a threat? No, of course not. "Leave Germany now, or else the Nazis will slaughter you!" Threat? No. It's a warning and a plea.

Here's the thing: Christians don't WANT anyone to go to Hell! At what point did it become hateful to tell someone that they are wrong, and that they need to do something to escape the otherwise inevitable?

You are absolutely free to choose whatever path you want. You are free to do literally anything; Hell is less being thrown into prison than it is almost a stage of life. Birth, life, death, Hell. Human cycle, right there.

Rhetoric today likes to make it sound like it's a choice between two "unnatural" after-lives, for lack of a better phrase, when in fact, Christianity is best described as the way out of an otherwise inherent aspect of human existence.

Even worse, some today make it sound like Heaven is the inevitability and God throws you into Hell if you didn't die on His terms. On the contrary, God sticks out His hand as you're about to fall and, should you accept it, yanks you out of the Pit. Christianity is a rescue mission.

Praise the Lord

Well done!

Maybe

he's just been jaded by religious people who cast down judgment from a high horse that only they can see.

Well said

Amen brother!

Even if it were true

Thank God for the second covenant, and for the Constitution and Bill of Rights in the USA, because it provides the opportunity to believe or not believe, have faith or not have faith, embark on a spiritual and or religious experience or not.

rights

Because they defend rights that are real or fake, only with God can they be real, they may be lost, but at least there is an option that they are TRUE. Without God, no such reality exists, no ethical "ought" for anyone to follow, except "empathy" that the Atheist like to talk about, until they deal with the religious, then the empathy is out the window. "Have we all heard the wonderfully loving teachings of Richard Dawkins", said no human ever.

Granger

This may be the first time I (mostly ) agree with you...

For Freedom!
The World is my country, all mankind is my brethren, to do good is my religion.

'We Invented Jesus Christ' .

Who is/was WE?

Emperor Constantine, Hebrews, Romans, Greeks, Egyptians, or other?????

beesting

I've been to seminary and I am currently a pastor...

And I am no scholar, and I don't claim to be, and I feel pretentious and lame even writing that subject line out. But maybe I have your attention. I do have some education in this field (Cairns University, Institute of Jewish Studies [I am no Christian zionist though!], Moody Bible Institute). And if you speak with anyone who has education in this field, they will tell you of a long list of people who have been trying to discredit Jesus and Christianity through historical studies for many centuries. Time or space isn't sufficient to even name them (most recent famous one being the Jesus Seminar, or the Zeigest films. An ancient one being Gnosticism).

I once had a professor say this, and I think he knows what he is saying (and this could or should go true in most fields, even in the sciences) - "If someone comes around and says 'I've discovered something new that no one else has ever discovered before' - especially in a field of study that is thousands of years old, chances are they are wrong."

So much arrogance is shown in this guys words. Christianity has been filled with some of the brightest and most intelligent men and women and scholars and scientists the world has had to offer (Jonathan Edwards, Paschal, CS Lewis, Augustine, Luther, Galileo, etc.) and somehow this guy found new things, a 'puzzle' left behind by the Roman Empire and the Caesars, that no one has ever discovered before? Sounds more like a good novel than non-fiction.

Christian or non Christian, this simply follows in line with the many people who through scholarship have attempted to prove that Christianity is false for many many centuries (think of the documentary hypothesis, just as one more example). The church is still around. And yes, her past is incredibly rough and shameful. But as Augustine once said, "The church is a whore, but she is still my mother" - don't let the church's failures dig into your emotions to get behind this guy's words. Here on the Daily Paul we are all about "thinking for yourself" - one of the basic tenants of liberty.

So just think about it... this is just goofy.

Amen

Amen brother. You're speaking with a level head and some love, better than I can. Humbling.

Hum, Let me decide

Should I side with people that must accept that a snake once talked, a vigin gave birth and remained a virgin, a man was buried underground for 3 days and magically came back to life, and an invisible "being" hovers over us OR that kings and rulers created a mythlogical story that played on the natural human fears of the unknown to control them? What makes more sense considering all we know in the year 2013?

Straw

Straw men are easy to make. Now go read the Scriptures and encounter Jesus without hatred in your heart. See if you can, even the hatred should teach you something.