31 votes

First time Israel bombs somebody and nobody really cares.

On 10/31/2013, a handful of news outlets reported that Israel was first suspected and later confirmed to have bombed an airbase in Syria.

I caught the report on Business Insider and sought confirmation. They had found a breaking story.

Syrian sources said the attack came from sea but Lebanese security reported Israeli warplanes flying through the area towards Syria.

The strike, which is reported to have caused zero deaths, was directed at an airbase said to house antiaircraft missiles. And interesting target given their defensive role to Syria and their relative non-threat to nations outside of it. Unless that is if Al-Queda gets a hold of them which is the guaranteed outcome of the fall of the Assad regime.

Another note is these munitions are almost guaranteed to be of Russian origin and nobody really wants to find out what they can do using their own airplanes. Not the latest and greatest ones. Less recently Israel hit a load of "game changing munitions" that Al-Queda was transporting in Syria. The range of options on what those might have been are endless but Russian (and Chinese) antiaircraft and surface to surface (anti-ship) weapons have been on everybody's mind for a while now.

It seems in the Israeli and US REGIMES best interests to contain Syria and let Assad and Al-Queda burn themselves out against each other then strike a deal with a weakened victor. Al Queda might have regional ambitions but somebody is gonna want to sit atop Syria and from the second they take the pillow they are gonna wanna stay put and control it.

Regardless of the fact that this continuation firmly establishes that Israel is presently at war against Syria, the world has accepted this as business as usual. And Business Insider pulled it from front page in about 15 minutes.

It wasn't really insider information anymore. Their traffic analysis software also makes it easy for them to see when nobody really cares.

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You're pretty much

an Ass aren't you? just because we give foreign aid to Muslim nations which I don't approve of, means we should give foreign aid to Israel? That is what you were defending, do you support war crimes? Preemptive war like Granger? well Ron Paul does not, many of us on DP see the hypocrisy, crimes and double standard regarding Israel, but if other nations do what they do, we threaten to bomb them, or we just let Israel do it, like they recently did to Syria, do you support that?

Why do you keep INSISTING I support foreign aid? U that dim?

I NEVER defended ANY foreign Aid... EVER!!!

YOU misunderstood, or ASSumed that's what I said.

Obviously you are not familiar with me, or my viewpoints. I suggest you READ MY POSTS before you put words in my mouth and ad hominem insult me. You must SKIPPED this part, before you posted your BS...

"So it's just a rip-off of the American taxpayer, by the globalist MIC, not just in Israel, but in EVERY country that receives foreign aid!

I don't support foreign aid in any way!!!

But I support the existence of the nation of Israel, as the homeland of the Jewish people."

I support Israel's right to exist. That's what I said. That's what I support. I am NOT a FASCIST, in any way shape or form! That's what you said ANYONE who supports Israel is...

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Are you that Dim?

anyone who supports what Israel DOES is a Fascist, not their right to exist, you completely ignored most of my questions why? Being anti globalist and Zionist is funny, because The UN established the nation of Israel, hypocrite.

Dude... just go read some of my posts above on this very thread.

I am a Ron Paul supporter.

I am Jewish.

Of course I'm against unconstitutional wars, interventionism, etc. And I don't need to provethat to YOU... I have consistently defended the SAME ideals as Ron Paul for over a year on DP...

I support Israel's sovereignty.

Sorry I don't buy into your BS non-sense that Israel "has no right to exist"... Puh-lease, whatever you f---ing piece of shit.

People like you is EXACTLY WHY ISRAEL MUST EXIST...

If that is your standpoint you support violence and interventionism, DENYING SOMEONE ELSES RIGHT TO EXIST YOU IGNORANT CHILD!!!

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

You're one big walking contradiction

You support Israel, but are against interventionism, Israel does intervene often, including the latest bombing of Syria! Go F**k yourself you Zionist piece of S**t.

That is an overly simplistic, willfully ignorant outlook...

I support Israeli sovereignty and the existence of Israel.

I don't support all their actions, just like I don't support all MY COUNTRY'S Government's actions!!!

In this case, the situation Israel is in with Syria is no way analogous to that of the US.

Israel borders Syria... (See my post above in the thread)...

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

So because

we have so many deaths on the border involving the drug war for example I guess we should bomb Mexico, because they are on the border? that's your logic?

Ridiculous...

If rockets came flying over the border, and the Texas Rangers decided they were going to launch mortars, or a missile or something at where the rockets came from...? Yes I would.

BUT.... You should know that is not a good analogy because it is OUR WAR ON DRUGS that is causing the violence at the border anyway... And there HAS BEEN Hundereds of cases of MEXICAN MILITARY INCURSIONS INTO THE US, AND WE DID NOTHING!!! 50.Cal Machine Guns mounted on Hum-Vs pointed at Texas State Troopers!!! It is well known our CIA is complicit with the DRUG CARTELS... So... In that way the analogy is correct... OUR CIA is playing all sides against each other, funding all sides... Israeli people, like the American people, just want to be free and live a good life.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I will end this positive if possible

Texas Rangers are hardly equivalent to the Israeli military, come on get real, are you drunk? I completely agree with your last paragraph, the CIA is complicit and I do believe most Israeli people want to be free and live a good life, my problem is not with them it's with the Israeli Government, and unfortunately because of your emotional tirades you failed to understand my point, and others like me, and resorted to defending Preemptive strike advocates like the Granger, how sad, I am no racist, one of my favorite movies was Schindler's List, so please think first before you write, thank you.

I don't agree

Israel is not a dictatorship, the Mushavs have taken over the Kibutz, so private industry, small business, global trade, parlementary democracy, religious freedom, women's rights, homosexula rights, corporations independent of the state.. as many people seeking Amnesty to move there as already live there..

Unlike the hundreds of billions of FRNs that go to the UN and nations that regularly burn American flags and depend on America for any infrastructure, Israel produces technology, like that computer you are using.

I am not liberal for foireign aid, but if I was, Israel would be one of my top investments

So what if they had a trillion mega super nukes.. can't think of a better place for them. Can you? They exist.. not like you can make them disappear with a post on DP.

Isn't it great that we can openly speak up to agree to disagree?

I could literally

write a book on how full of S**T you are, everything you wrote is pure BullS**T, except the last sentence, which has nothing to do with Israel, your an Israeli troll paid by our Government I would bet my paycheck on that!

LOL. You WOULD make a point, but instead you'll just ad hominem.

...Right...

Please, do write a book...

No.. actually.. Just try to write ONE PARAGRAPH based in actual fact, with actual logical points that address and counters her (Granger's) argument/post.

The dumber, the more incredible the H-I-Fer post, the more upvotes it gets from their fellow TROLLS...
...WHO are likely PAID GOV'T employees trying to make the DP & Libertarians look like a bunch of RACISTS, like the MSM wants to paint us as!!!

GO AWAY, you are NOT Helping the cause of Liberty, NOR the cause for PEACE!!!

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I say

You're a troll and a Racist

Brilliant retort... (sarcasm, if you couldn't tell)

You're projecting.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I've

got a paypal account just let me know when you're ready to make that deposit.

Sure

I'll do that when you publish your bank deposits

Man up

Instead of whining like a bunch of little girls, why don't you all go join the Palestinians and fight. Get out of your mommies basement, take off your PJs and go fight. If you "don't believe in violence" then open your paycheck or ask your daddy for money to send to them - for the cause.

______
"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty."

What're you talkin' about?! They're in "Palestine" right now! ;)

;)

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

I don't see it like that at all.

The news, for what it is worrth is coming from the US. Neither Israel, nor Turkey who was alware what was going to happen) have spoken about the bombing.

Why is no one talking about it?

Because at this point, Israel has established relationships that have proven to be durable with Jordan, Egypt and Turkey, even while other nighbors are having Arab Springs and civil wars.

Israel has worked to make it very clear to the world:

They will respond to any form of threat immediately and ask questions later, even say they made a mistake, and when they do, apologise, even be remorseful and regretful, but unrelentless in defending Israel. From the USS Liberty to the Russian arsenal disposed of yesterday, Israel has repeatedly proven that they are not going to take a first hit. All they have to do is think there is a threat and they will take out what they think that threat is.

It's working.

The world is wising up, "Don't F with Israel". You want to trade? You have business? You want to make nice.. great, step right up, you have opinions, say what you want.. but the moment Israel feels it's not nice, they will show you what it is to not be nice. There's no second chance with Israel.

Instead of being the police of the world, I wish the USA was designed like Israel with local miltas, everyone been trained, on the same page, self defense and unity in national defense.

No one was killed! AWESOME! Right on Israel!!

You said

" All they have to do is think there is a threat and they will take out what they think that threat is."

That's the notion of Preemptive war, is it not? We think there MIGHT be a threat, so we're going to "take it out."

Granger, do you support preemptive war?

That's also what the DHS does and says to justify taking out patriot groups. It's what abusive police say to justify killing an unarmed black woman in DC. We THINK there is a threat, and so we take her out. No judge, no jury, no investigation...just take her out.

Do you really support these notions, or am I misunderstanding you? No hostility intended, I'm just not getting what you mean. Do you believe in preemptive war and preemptive strike?

It is the notion

and when you're dealing with your own country, it's a great policy, but when you're policing the world.. it's immoral.

I support the right for a sovreign nation to defend its self. I do not support the right for the USA to occupy the world and act as policement using pre-emptive stratigy. It worls for Israel because it's by, of and for Israel. It does not work for the USA because it's by US of something else (in the name of defense) and for someone else (not US).

So you DO believe in preemptive war?

The problem with it is that the country attacking can make ANYthing up to justify an invasion. Just like the US politicians did with Iraq. Lies lead us to a preemptive invasion which made the US the aggressor. Do you think it would be any different for Israel? They are not infallible, as they are led by politicians...just like any other country.

And are you defending their attack on the USS Liberty simply because they "apologized" for it?

It's not pre-emptive war if there is an imminent threat...

War is already upon you, you must kill or be killed...

Oh, and BTW, nobody was killed in this alleged airstrike on the Syrian airbase.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Yes

Yes, I believe that good defense stops offense, if the defense has the right intel.

All war is risk, so if Israel, or a sovreign state, because I would not like to see this policy employed by the USA or UN being both are global, but Israel is not global,, so they take the risk in pre-emptive strikes.. as long as they are not killing people and taking out WMD, there will be no complaint. But when people die.. there is a lot of complaints and little done because there were WMD, and if Israel had bad intel and wiped out a hospital (Assad has wiped out five) and there were NO WMD.. then Israel would be rightly accused of aggressive warfare and the better hope that iron dome can handle more than a dozen rockets a day from Hamas because I'm sad to say, millions of people will die and Israel will cease to exist (and since the majority hate Jews and want Israel wiped off the map, that should make a lot of people very happy in a sad way)..

So here's a hypothetical

If America was transporting WMDs to Israel so they could use them against Syria, and Syria decided to take out those WMDs and no one was killed, would you defend Syria's right to do so? According to your statement, there would be no complaint, and Syria would be justified...there would be, as you said, "no complaint."

Would this be an acceptable situation?

Yes

If the USA was shipping WMD to Israel to take out Syria and Syria found out and took out the WMD,, right on Syria!

Hmm. Interesting

Hmm. Interesting distinguishing between defending your own country and defending all countries, but what makes the preemptive principle correct in the prior versus the latter? If a standard were dropped and every nation had to abide by the standard of preemption then the world would have more warfare since no one would have to prove self-defense, rather, claim that their intelligence suggests that their enemies are planning a preemptive strike first. The world becomes much less peaceful when the standard is lowered to suspicion. The world becomes much less peaceful when every country has to destroy their enemies before their enemies destroy them. Actually, if this were the worldwide policy, the most aggressive and preemptive nation would dominate and the weaker countries would be forced to submit absolutely lest they risk annihilation by prompting paranoia in the empire nation. The empire would become the judge, jury, and executioner. The empire would usurp the King of Kings in his rightful role. Of course, Assyria, Babylon, Egypt, Media, Persia, Greece, Rome, Israel, all did this and were destroyed. They said "I am and there is no one besides me." This is the attitude in the heart at the bottom of preemptive warfare. A great pride of heart one that exalts itself above all other nations and against Justice, and against the Lord of Lords.

What makes it correct?

The only thing that makes it correct is the correct intel. If Israel was WRONG about WMD or a spy ship and attacked, it would not be pre-emptive, but an assult and I don't see where Israel would get much global sympathy if they ever do make a mistake.If this were worldwide policy, If all nations were created equally... I don't get the idea that Israel's mission statement is: "I am and there is no one besides me."

It's more like, "I am because the world hates Jews".

how can

you support the bombing of a sovereign country? that's just sad.

self defense

If my neighbor says he has one enemy and promises to God he will take out that enemy if it's the last thing he does, and then he gets a shipment of rickets to take me out.. and I know all about it, and I'm spot on, that he did recieve a WMD to take me out.. if I take out his weapons and not kill one person, who did I hurt?