30 votes

May I Please Post The Article On Rand From The Front Page Of The NYT Or Will I Be Called A Troll?

In Liberty Defined Ron Paul explained how political correctness was a subversive way to limit free speech. I consider smearing as a troll a longtime member who has nothing but libertarianism in his heart and soul to be just this sort of political correctness, and I don't like it.

During my two years of participation on this site I have clearly been an enthusiastic supporter of both Ron and Rand Paul. While everyone else was swearing him off, I stood by and defended Rand in the wake of the infamous Romney endorsement.

I am clearly a libertarian through and through.

And yet I was recently called a TROLL for posting some recent news stories on Rand. My posting them was not an endorsement of their point of view.

For the record, I will exercise greater discretion in the future, but is the rule going to be that if a story says anything at all negative about Rand or Ron it cannot be posted here? That certainly wasn't the standard during the campaign of 2011-12, and no one ever gave me the memo that the standard had changed.

When I saw Rand Paul on the cover of the New York Times (I read it; I also read Krugman; I don't believe in consuming libertarian-friendly media only), my first thought was to post the article here.

But then I thought, because the article may contain a half a sentence or more about Rand that would not sit well with someone on this site, maybe I better not, lest I be ostracized.

I rarely take offense -- not just here (you may notice I don't tend to get into fights) -- but in life generally. "It is as bad to take offense as it is to give offense" is my motto.

That said, this is not right. I respect anyone's right to free speech, including use of the word "troll", though I must say I think it can be a low blow, like "racist" or "terrorist", and perhaps should be used with at least as much discretion as what I am being asked to exercise.

Anyway please check out the NYT article on Rand and Ted Cruz and let me know if I can post it, or if it crosses the line.

Because I wouldn't want to attract the wrath of the troll police, even though I find their behavior to be a disturbing and, quite frankly, anathema to the principles this site seeks to espouse.

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Oh, brother.

My advice would be if your intent is to please every single person who ever visits here, you'd best be gone. If the word "troll" has some special significance to you, maybe you'd be better off to keep it to yourself lest you give your foes ammunition.

Hassan i Sabbah

"Nothing is true, everything is permitted."

Where is it anyway?

I most certainly support Ron and Rand 110% and always have. Mr. Benton is the one I have an issue with...and probably always will.
I could care less what anyone on any site has to say about what I post. Heck...I have been kicked of many a "self proclaimed" TEA party site. And I wear that with honor.
I like to believe most of the people here are a little better educated than to display any sign of ignorance with name calling. But I am sure there are some that have a bit of trouble when it comes to control of emotion. Particularly if they have had a beer or two. LOL
So where is the link anyway?
Here is one I am now including in my email e-signature.
https://www.facebook.com/randpaul2016
There is nobody else we should support, particularly Ted Cruz.
Anyone buying into that and openly supporting Ted? That would be your troll. The party is working on a bait-and-switch that would include Cruz and Jeb. Mark my words. You heard it here first.

RAND PAUL or NOT AT ALL

Here Are The Links

Please bear in mind that the first story came to my e-mail that day. I thought it was breaking news, and didn't realize it was from an enemy source (I was tricked on that front via e-mail).

I had up till now refrained from posting the relevant links because I *don't* want anyone banned (I let Michael know that), and I don't want anyone thinking that I got someone banned.

My purpose here was never to whine or complain, but rather to encourage my fellow Daily Paulers to refrain from jumping to conclusions (and Michael clearly agrees with me on this front, as per his post below).

Anyway the links, from the "douchebag extraordinaire" himself:
http://tinyurl.com/kgkvu96
http://tinyurl.com/labgzbd

___________________________________________________________________________
"Bipartisan: both parties acting in concert to put both of their hands in your pocket."-Rothbard

troll

your headline makes you a troll

Don't worry about the name calling.

I get called a troll all the time. I welcome it as evidence that I am making waves in the pond of centralized thinking discrepant non-individualized recalcitrant ipsumism.

That said - gerp!

Pandas eat bugs.

I Appreciate All The Comments Below

And I absolutely *don't* take anything personally.

But when Michael specifically THANKS ME for bringing up the issue, I feel that I have done the right thing in doing so.

I would encourage people not to jump to conclusions, and not to suppress freedom of speech by imploring others to concern themselves with "what will the newbies think?!" (which, as I say, is in my view on the order of laws aimed at "protecting the children").

Posting negative press about Ron or Rand is not something to be censored or scolded, in my view. I will do so with greater discretion, and will welcome downvotes as well as upvotes. I am merely asking for the civility of not being called a troll or, as I also was recently called, a "douchebag extraordinaire."

To the extent that civility is not extended, I will do may part by understanding it is out of my hands and by refraining from taking offense.

___________________________________________________________________________
"Bipartisan: both parties acting in concert to put both of their hands in your pocket."-Rothbard

Post a Link That Nobody Likes...

...and it's gonna get down-voted. Moving on.

------>

Answer to the second half of your question:
You'll only find the answer by posting the article.

Answer to the first half of your question:
You are pathetic.

Personally, it would never have occurred to me to call you a troll until I clicked here to your post and found no Rand article, no link to it, and not even any mention of its content.

Only the pettiest of trolls would post such trivial nonsense.

I've never known you to be this inane.

Snap out of it! :D

---> my short answers: yes, and who gives a sh¡t

I don't have a problem with

I don't have a problem with it. I think too many people are over sensitive when it comes to these types of articles. I have personally posted plenty of articles that instantly got down voted even if I said I didn't share the same opinions.

If

    some

of the people here want to instantly down vote I really could care less. That just tells me that they are too quick to judge, not open minded, and irrational. Sorry but if you can't slowly read through a post that has a small paragraph and then a link to an article and jump to down vote without even stating a reason then you should have your privilege to vote revoked.

Homeland security statement: patriotism is now considered terrorism.
I love www.isidewith.com shared it with everyone I know. If anything they realize its not just a red and blue idiot running for reelection.

There are trolls here who bash everyone

The ones who bashed Ron Paul for 'giving up', the ones who bashed Rand Paul for selling out, others bash Kokesh, Amash, Ventura, Schiff, Judge Nap and pretty much everyone under the sun.

You can tell the ones, they NEVER bash Lindsay Graham, Dianne Feinstein, John McCain and the real enemies of us all.

They are the trolls, don't let yourself be subverted by intimidation of either a troll or paid schill.

And yes, paid schills have been around at least since the Nixon era, paid straight out of the same types of funds used for Watergate. Don't believe me, look it up for yourself.

Back in the 70s they called it rat-phucking.

Allowing yourself to be intimidated is an act of violence against yourself. Don't let it affect you. Understand to overcome.

it's SHILL

...not Schill

Trust me I know :)

If you're still learning

If you're still learning about contrary viewpoints, great, but these articles that people post here don't even have real arguments. They have maybe a couple sentences of bashing mixed into a mindless 3 paragraph article that regurgitates current events. I don't see what's productive about posting those. It just annoys people. When an article mentions Ron or Rand, there's almost never any substance to it. They are designed to rile people up and get them "engaged", and the reposters fall for it. Some posters seem to be motivated to create threads that get lots of comments a lot more than they are motivated to post things that are helpful or encouraging towards the cause.

I don't remember ever seeing a lengthy article or video posted here explaining the merits of modern liberalism or why we need to bomb more brown people. That's the type of thing that would get posted if the goal were really to educate others on contrary viewpoints. I would imagine such things have been posted here but got no comments, because so many people here are unfortunately just here for the infotainment, late breaking conspiracies, he said this, she said that...

Garan's picture

It's easy to call someone a Troll.

It takes more time and consideration to make a post.

Generally, people who call posters "Trolls" are stretching or simply abusing the definition of "Troll".

If you have felt wrong by being labelled a troll, you are most likely dealing with a person who has an inflated sense of confidence and an unrealistic view of what a silent majority of people think on this site.

This site is probably like most rooms of people, you have mostly well behaved people and a few loud mouths who occasionally get rowdy.

Don't let other people suppress your good actions. Post away.

It's the people who quickly

It's the people who quickly jump into a post and down vote and don't even comment why. That's another form of trolling.

Homeland security statement: patriotism is now considered terrorism.
I love www.isidewith.com shared it with everyone I know. If anything they realize its not just a red and blue idiot running for reelection.

Garan's picture

That describes other things as well.

That describes people who dislike a post and do not want to take the time to explain themselves.

I think the key to defining an action as "Trolling" is if the person in question is disingenuously trying to incite contention.

I respectfully disagree with some of your sentiments here.

There are some things that you may want to keep in mind when posting stuff that may have negative content towards Ron or Rand Paul, particularly if it's a publication like the NYT, or something overtly hostile like MSNBC or Salon.com

1. Unless you add a little caveat/disclaimer saying that this article doesn't represent your viewpoints, some people are going to assume that you endorse the article, regardless to what your beliefs are or your history as a Libertarian. The reason for this is that people tend to post things that they believe in or endorse, and being silent on that point will bring that assumption with it.

2. A lot of the time the publications in question post stuff that has been done to death and has already been dealt with here. I know everybody loves free speech and all that other cute stuff, but when I hear idiotically false arguments like "Somalia is a libertarian utopia" or "libertarians hate poor people", my inclination is to close my ears and not acknowledge anything else the person has to say, because that stuff has always come along with a lot of close-minded ignorance that is willful and, in nearly all cases, unchangeable. It might be a good idea to read whatever you post and if it's something along the lines of what Paul Krugman said after he lost that debate with Ron Paul, you might want to word the title of your post or describe it in such a way that doesn't give any appearance of you endorsing it or giving it any level of credence.

3. This kind of goes along with point #2 but I think this bears repeating. There is a lot of media out there that just isn't really worth anyone's time on here, particularly when it's something that is rehashed crap from a couple years ago (Ron Paul's racist newsletters, for example). You can say that I hate free speech if it suits you, but I have zero time for some article that continually insists that 2+2=5 and that circles have corners, which IS an accurate analogy to how the MSM comes off to me in most cases, and like most others whom you might be complaining about. Usually I don't assail the OP when stuff like this gets posted though, but I definitely let the author of the article itself have it in this comment section.

A word of advice, don't take it personally when someone calls you a troll. It is a knee-jerk reaction, but it's usually the result of what I would call righteous indignation, even if it is being misdirected. It's a good idea to display the patience that you expect in others.

“My attitude toward progress has passed from antagonism to boredom. I have long ceased to argue with people who prefer Thursday to Wednesday because it is Thursday.” - G.K. Chesterton

Thanks

All good advice.

Just bear in mind that I didn't know my first post was old news, or from an enemy source (I was tricked on that front via e-mail).

I will exercise greater discretion in the future.

___________________________________________________________________________
"Bipartisan: both parties acting in concert to put both of their hands in your pocket."-Rothbard

downvoted. troll.

downvoted. troll.

wear it with pride

“With laws shall our land be built up, but with lawlessness laid waste.”
-Njal Thorgeirsson

Dude don't worry. Just don't post glenn beck stuff.

That is like trolling with troll articles. A double negative.

Man, don't even worry about it, especially if it's just one tool

calling you a troll.
I personally try not to call anyone a "troll." Too many troll hunters out there already:

Man, I kinda want to see this movie now.

“With laws shall our land be built up, but with lawlessness laid waste.”
-Njal Thorgeirsson

If you want to 'publish' grow

a thicker skin.
OR
If you continue publishing you WILL grow a thicker skin.

I don't

understand why posting "negative articles" (usually) is greeted by some as being the work of a 'troll'.

How can 'we' 'change hearts and minds' if 'we' don't know how the opposing side thinks, feels, believes, etc.?

I think I read the article to which you referred. I found it a good read. My only complaint is that newspapers/other MSM are irresponsible and promote NON-natural born citizens (Cruz)as viable Presidential candidates--so I expressed those thoughts on Twitter and linked to the article.

Chin up, hon!

O.P.O.G.G. - Fighting the attempted devolution of the rEVOLution
Ron Paul 2012...and beyond
BAN ELECTRONIC VOTING!!

Cruz

Is not American born?!?!

No, he is not:

http://www.dailypaul.com/300348/senator-ted-cruz-and-wife-he...

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Very interesting

So why does he seem to be talking like he'll run??

Why?

Cuccinelli lost. Do the math :-(

The corrupt do not follow the law [Constitution], for if they did, they would not be corrupt.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

lol on the comments sidebar

lol on the comments sidebar your comment just appeared as

Cruz
The Baptist