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When Ron Paul lost (some) moral authority

In the wake of Ken Cuccinelli's squeaker loss Tuesday the interwebs and local Virginia and DC political events are tortured by conflicts between Republicans, Libertarians, and Ron Paul and other libertarian Republicans.

For example, a former staff economist for Ron Paul's Congressional office, and an executive at Paul's Campaign for Liberty, not only defriended me on FaceBook, but banned me from the Virginia Campaign for Liberty group, for a tweet I made in reply to Ron Paul and for my posts defending Robert Sarvis against the Paul's and others. (My posts in the Virginia C4L group and those of other Sarvis supporters were being censored for weeks anyway.)

The tweet that got me banned was in response to Ron Paul's statement at a Ken Cuccinelli rally where he called all Sarvis supporters "insane," kind of a nasty and loose and sloppy charge from a medical doctor. (Did he intend to have them committed so they could not vote?)

He apparently thought we should bow to the Pauls because of their contributions. Uh huh. As we all know from Ayn Rand and Murray Rothbard, lots of great people get a little nutty, abusive and full of themselves in their dotage. My tweet he got hissy about was this: "Ron Paul says voting for Sarvis is insane, which is a subject some would say he is an expert on." He thought that I was claiming that Ron Paul is insane.

He doesn't see it as a claim that Ron Paul's experience should make him wary of charging that (other) people are insane because they disagree with his position, since that is what happened to him his entire career. I don't think anyone in the Paul camp realized that's what they were saying, because they share the general GOP delusional mentality that not only do libertarian voters belong to them, but that we are their children whom they may abuse. (And did Dr. Paul never pay attention to his own fans - did he really think calling us names and telling us "No!" would make us follow along?)

Overall I think the Paul supporters behind Cuccinelli, with their propensity to parrot lies, betray exactly this type of (I hope temporary) rashness and lack of subtlety and intelligence. The Paul's wanted to centrally plan the liberty movement, and collectivize our libertarian eggs, and put them all in the Cuccinelli basket. It was a bad investment. The Libertarian spent less per vote than Cuccinelli did since all spending for Sarvis was $380000 and Ken spent $15 million. The GOP spent almost 45 times what the Libertarians did. But they got less than 7 times their vote. And the GOP didn't have to first spend money to collect 18,000 signatures to get on the ballot. So apparently Republican candidates aren't cost effective.

The result of Ken Cuccinelli acting as a spoiler to keep the LP from getting ballot status is that now Libertarians will have to concentrate their resources again next time on getting the 10% required by the GOP coauthored ballot access law in the next gubernatorial race and do it all over again. And Rand Paul doesn't have have a reliable governor to support his next race. And Ron Paul has lost his credibility with libertarians. It's bad timing for the Paul's, coming in the same week when Rand Paul faces a second wave of plagiarism charges

This campaign may be a kind of watershed moment, when Ron Paul lost his moral authority and dug a new hole for Rand Paul 2016.

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As the BM fun and games of the moment continue whatever run

they have please do not lose sight of the reality here when engaging it in respectful dialogue as if it was the least deserving of any respect or any engagement. When doing so you are aiding it to distract, divert and weaken our efforts and slow the rate of our ascension to the level we must achieve in order to return LIBERTY to our land.

You confuse newbies that have no experience to see it for what it obviously is and even fog the thinking of those with the experience to know better.

The pages of the DP will be (dis)graced with many more BM's going into the mid-term elections.

Best to quickly get back up to speed on best practices when BM ilk blow through.

LIBERTY would have had a NET GAIN in VIRGINIA. Would have were it not for the efforts of both the people that currently control the GOP vehicle and the BUSY BOX Party being championed above all other considerations by this latest BM plopped in our midst by those that seek to to maintain the status quo of Top Down World, rule by phoney baloney hierarchies created from the same origin as our forced standardized medium of exchange.

"You are a den of vipers and thieves."

I mean to rout you out!

-Just because you are among us, does not make you with us

-The door is wide open, anything can slither in

Bowel Movement?

That was my first thought so looked everywhere to try to figure out what you were talking about. Then I realized it was the guy's name which I had, thanks to my dyslexia, transposed to Bruce Jamors so was thinking the guy's initials were BJ!
Thank you for clearing that up for me. Now lets flush the BM posts down the toilet of DP history.

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
James Madison

And once again you are unable to rebut the evidence

That you lied and smeared a decent person because you feared competition. Are you people all just trash when push comes to shove? Good to know.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


Vehicle miles driven taxes...something we can discuss


4 minutes in...Sarvis claims this is something that can be discussed. He did not say that he fully supported the notion, but said simply that he was willing to discuss...a position that I disagree with when it comes to a mileage tax b/c of all too obvious reasons.

The Libertarian spent less b/c he raised very little...the two party system is going to prevent almost all 3rd party candidates from being able to really make a move into the top two spots in major elections. The curiosity for me is that there are zero spots held in the GA by the LP in Virginia...how many positions at the local level in Va can the LP lay claim to? That is not a shot across the bow, just an honest question. Another question would be, and again it is an honest question, why did Robert not reach out to those in the liberty movement in Va or those working within RPV in 2011 when he ran under the R banner? Was he simply not involved during the 2008 or '12 POTUS elections?

Btw, I disagree with your comment about RP losing his moral authority b/c if you were willing to give another some type of authority over your decisions that is your own failing. I do however agree that a new hole has been dug and will make it more difficult for Rand to be nominated, but in the state of Va there were a lot of hands on that shovel.

So then you admit it was a lie that he said anything about a GPS

Device. And you also have not shown that he was talking about government roads, which libertarians don't believe in. Or that anything related to this was something he had as a campaign plank.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor



I simply posted a video showing that he was open to discuss the idea of a mileage tax...which I disagree with for obvious reasons (or so I thought the reasons were obvious). The idea of a mileage tax has been tossed about but will require a device to be placed on a vehicle.

You have managed to avoid answering any of my questions which I would say is telling. Fortunately, it does not matter any more and I am focused on working to get Warner replaced by this time next year.

Cuccinelli was not a bad

Cuccinelli was not a bad Republican, he was not a lesser of two evils. He was decent(not perfect or even good). No reason not to support him. This is from someone who has never voted for a major party candidate in a national election.

Ventura 2012

One needn't think Ken is evil, or even "insane" to...

...support Sarvis. But voting for him achieved nothing.

While the Sarvis people were trying to create something new and will now be doing it all over again, maybe during the Senate 2014 race.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


How many times...

do I have to make this comment before it sinks in. The Paul's endorsed Cooch because they are looking at BIG PICTURE politics here. Sarvis was not ready for primetime and like it or not he IS the spoiler here. Cooch closed the gap on Fast Terry from 12 - 2 points in less than TWO weeks. The momentum was clearly on his side. Even though he was outspent 10-1. Cooch may not have been the PERFECT candidate but he WAS the anti-establishment candidate. The current Lt Gove Bill Bolling was the establishments boy and when he lost the bid they had a hissy fit and decided then and there to defeat Cooch. You see, it's wasn't a Dem against the GOP thing. It's was a small, limited government against the BIG Government/Establishment crowd fight. The Paul's understood what was at stake here and those of you who couldn't understand that will see the error of your ways in 2016. Rand is going to have an uphill battle in Virginia now. Fast Terry is VERY good at one thing: fundraising for the Democrats. He WILL deliver Virginia for Hillary in 2016 and deprive the GOP Nominee of those electoral votes. A defeat in VA would have been devastating for Hillary. Now it's a springboard. I'm already starting to see "I'm ready for Hillary" stickers in Virginia. As one Democrat opined after the election results were finalized: "Virginia has proven to be reliably blue." We now have to deal with a socialist who loves big government and ObamaCare and wants to bring in NY-style gun control. Our excellent unemployment rate of 5.5% is about to get much higher. This will impact Virginia for decades. The GOP may have just lost Virginia forever.

Endorsing is one thing...

...calling people insane and repeating lies is another.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


You should go away. Nobody

You should go away. Nobody here cares to read your rubbish here.

What a bossy little bitch.

If you airheads could explain why your leader wasn't repeating lies or if you dumb cows were human enough to apologize for smearing decent people, pest extermination wouldn't be needed. You idiot sows.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor



Now I see who you are. You are a troll. How and why are you on this site>? People like you really do suck. You are a sponge to the liberty movement...sucking up the resources and intelligence.

I have no regrets about leaving the LP.

As much as I can't stand the Neo-cons, it's stuff like this that really makes me glad that I cut ties with the Libertarian Party. You guys yammer about us treating Ron Paul like some sort of cult figure and then suggest that we partake of your version of a cult by slavishly voting LP regardless of what your joke candidates believe and say?

No offense, but seriously, F.U.

“My attitude toward progress has passed from antagonism to boredom. I have long ceased to argue with people who prefer Thursday to Wednesday because it is Thursday.” - G.K. Chesterton

You have a subtlety deficiency.

I have supported both LP and Paulian candidates.

I am mainly complaining about the repeating of lies about Sarvis.

This is what diminishes the Paul's morally.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


There's just one problem with your argument here...

There was nothing said about Sarvis by Paul or anyone on here that was a lie. The guy said some dubious stuff on economics and never backtracked on them, and calling your opponents liars or saying that they are misrepresenting you doesn't change the fact that he openly denounced the Austrian School of Economics.

If Sarvis runs for the Senate seat in 2014, I will personally send money to whatever PAC ends up attacking him and I won't lose a second's sleep over it, particularly if Cuccinelli is running again and it looks close. Sarvis squandered any cred he had with that Reason interview, and even if he takes it back now, his credibility is shot.

“My attitude toward progress has passed from antagonism to boredom. I have long ceased to argue with people who prefer Thursday to Wednesday because it is Thursday.” - G.K. Chesterton

Nope you are wrong.

You are just to stupid to be able to make distinctions.

Sarvis never said anything about a GPS device and then denied he favored them when you peeps propagated that smear.

And then you charge he is funded by a Democrat, when that guys contribution was 3% of what was spent on Sarvis and less than what Sarvis donated to his own campaign.

What we see here is that many Paul peeps are amoral, sheeple, and really dumb.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


You couldn't be anymore incorrect...

Ron Paul didn't lose moral authority. Paul gained it... by questing the sanity of any Libertarian voting for Sarvis and his morally repugnant, anti-liberty GPS car tax scheme.


He lost it with me and I've donated more than you to his causes I bet.

And some of his own workers secretly voted for Sarvis!

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor



He lost zero credibility, but if he's smart, he might want to lose some of those workers if what you say is true.

“My attitude toward progress has passed from antagonism to boredom. I have long ceased to argue with people who prefer Thursday to Wednesday because it is Thursday.” - G.K. Chesterton

Uh, I know you people are thick but

He lost me. He lost control of people who voted for Sarvis. You twits are in denial.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


"He lost me."

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul


"anti-liberty GPS car tax scheme"

Except Sarvis listed it as one of many user fee models to fund the government roads. See, the problem in Virginia is that the gas tax was supposed to pay for the roads but they havent increased the gas tax in 20 years while increasing spending a couple fold. So now they pay for roads from general fund. I support user fees for all government services. Mileage tax is plausible without GPS trackers since in VA we have annual inspections.

But I do not support demogoguing issues - that was what Ron Paul railed against all those years.

I'll take someone who is open to user fees before someone who has been dogged by corruption and gifts from businessmen that do not pass any smell test.

Nope. You are sloppy.

You can't find a mention of a GPS device. And he specifically opposed them when asked.

I am not sure you can find him saying the roads should be government owned either.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


So now you are just

actively hostile against the Pauls because they endorsed a candidate you don't support?

What odd behavior.

"Once you become knowledgeable, you have an obligation to do something about it."- Ron Paul

Wow you people are as thick as the concrete they poured into ...

Your empty skulls.

I am complaining that the Paul's repeated lies, because the ends justified the means, much more than I am at that they endorsed someone they thought would help Rand Paul's career, and maybe liberty.

Maybe they should have checked to see if the RNC was going to support Ken so he would have a chance of winning first?

I am beginning to think some Paulians may have intellectual as well as moral deficiencies, since they can't read.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor



Or it could be the trashing of another candidate based on establishment falsehoods created due to popularity of 3rd party candidate.

It is unnaceptable for the liberty movement to react as described above in the article.

This is a story about brother fighting brother because one is threatened by another.


It's the amorality I am objecting to, much more than the disagreement about whom to support.

I see and socialize with Ken's Paul supporters and gave them virtually no grief until the lying started in the last minute smear campaigns after all the debates were over 36 fours before the election. Sh*tty major party tactics.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor


I live in Virginia

trust me Sarvis was not "popular", he got 7% of the vote and most people voted for him simply because they didn't want to vote for the other two. It was more a vote against the other two than it was a vote for Sarvis.

Also, since when is Ron Paul personally responsible for twitter accounts? Establishment? referring to who? the RNC? Well they didn't back Cuccinelli that has already been shown.

"Once you become knowledgeable, you have an obligation to do something about it."- Ron Paul

Wow, what a bright bulb we have here...

... Most Ken and Terry voters voted for Ken or Terry because they hated the other candidate too.

So what's your point peaches?

And I am in Virginia almost every day of the week.

Bruce Majors, Libertarian for Mayor