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When Words Fail Us

For 4 or 5 years now the words "When Good People Do Bad Things" keeps bouncing in my head like lyrics to a song I can't let go.

Maybe, it would be better to say "When People Make Bad Decisions" or "When People Buy Into Nice sounding Words or Ideas" or "When People are Gullible".

I once read the devil wants GOOD people. I was rather amazed at that statement. How odd I thought, the devil wants GOOD people, why not bad people? It dawned on me that the devil could not trust bad people but GOOD people are TRUST worthy.

I had to do an honest appraisal of my own behavior over these many years and how I may UNWITTINGLY have done bad things with good intentions. Yap! I was sooooo gullible, soooo trusting in the words and presentation of ideas that I bit hook line and sinker. I question everything now, listening and watching how the words and actions line up.

I cannot help but also think of all the different professions people join with Good intentions. Young men and women who enter the military, police, politics, educational and medical fields with a desire to join a HONORABLE profession. Words like Duty, Honor, Service and Good citizenship draw our finest individuals into these fields and other occupations. There is nothing wrong with these fields but what unfortunately sometimes happens, these same people will be asked or pressured to do the bidding of corrupt individuals who pressure GOOD people to do bad things.

It seems, once in the organizations some individuals get used to the gradual corruption or in some cases threatened if they do not go along with the corruption.

Very sad indeed when we look back in history and how so many good people were used to do bad things and when asked why they did them, they replied "I was just following orders", "it was a means to an end" or " they made me do it". Any of us can be swept up into a cause or action with the right phrases or pressures.

Even now we are being painted with a brush of words by the media so the general public will view us in a certain way and respond to us in a certain way. We are likely being set up as their scape goat to further an Agenda.

I am not sure I have made myself clear because the subject is a very difficult one for me to consider. What I have observed is the the devil or evil or corrupted individuals do not do the dirty work themselves but rather get GOOD people to do the evil deeds so when lead down the wrong path they can say "they came willingly.

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Wow, this is so

well written and exactly what I am trying to express. The "Noble Lie" is still a lie and not a foundation in which to build trust. Thank you for sharing this with us. It would be nice if this had it's own thread and up for some discussion.

Darn it! I goofed again, this response is to Paul S below, sorry.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

Original posts are not my strength. Peanut gallery for me.

I suggest we continue in this thread. Maybe an update?

Thanks you so much for the "Wow".

We are free to trust? But the people in authority are lying.

Can they prove they are not?

Then they have no authority.

Free includes debt-free!

To thine own self be true.

I learned a lot about here about the religion of self-deception and it's priests
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article5010.htm

In the starts with a religion of self-deception.

It ends with deceiving all others.

"To thine own self be true, and it must follow, as the night the day, you cannot then be false to any man."

~William Shakespeare

Peace be with you.

Free includes debt-free!

Thanks

you have given me things to consider. I guess the purpose we are told of police, military and politicians is Defense and to carry out laws that are made by our elected officials.

Maybe no system works, that they all eventually become corrupted by those willing to deceive and manipulate others.

I goofed and this is a response to farmer below.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

You're very welcome.

Yes, we are told "defense." The word "defense" is much preferred. For example, the spending for the invasion of Iraq is want to be called "defense spending" rather than military spending. I think we all know that spending didn't have anything whatsoever to do with "defense."

Defense is really an important issue/topic, when it's teased out from the influence of authority. How can a free people repulse or otherwise defend itself from an invading military? Historically, the majority of people have been pursuaded to the position that constructing an opposing military which claims the same (illigitimate) authority is the only means to repulse such an invasion.

It's a big responsibility to take a different approach, but it is becoming increasingly clear that we need that different answer. The apocryphal statement that certain peoples' land can't be invaded because there will be a "rifle behind every blade of grass" was not a reference to any military.

distinction...

It would help to make a distinction among the employment/activities you suggest: military, police, politics, educational and medical fields.

It is absolutely true that most people doing all of these things consider themselves to be good people. Your assertion, however, that there is nothing wrong with any of these activities is, I think, incorrect. The ones based on nonvoluntary support structures *and* the notion of authority are specifically designed for the purpose of doing evil actions, whether that fact is recognized or not. If kidnapping someone for having a plant and killing them if they resist was OK for anyone, there would be no need for the authority of police to do it. In the same way, the uniforms and badges of the military are specifically designed to legitimize the actions of those who wear them because what they are doing would not be considered legitimate without them. And those things for which they need the uniforms and badges are, in fact, not legitimate.

Your first three, military, police, and politics fall into this category.

To emphasize the simplicity of what I'm saying:

The military is there so that people can kill others on the basis of an order without responsibility or having to make an evaluation of the legitimacy of that killing.

The police are there so that rules which no one has a right to impose on others can be enforced without responsibility or having to make an evaluation of the legitimacy of that enforcement.

The politicians are there so that those rules which no one has a right to impose on others can appear legitimate.

The others are different. Education and medicine can be pursued with voluntary support and no particular notion of authority is inherrent in them. It is the case, however, that they are often pursued in a structure of involuntary support, and this tends to have a specific corrupting influence on their practice. In particular, they can also be practiced with the purpose of maintaining the illigitimate exploitive non-voluntary support structure. For this reason, you can often see in those involved in these fields the same "good people doing bad things" phenomonon as well. In fact, the corrupting influence sometimes even leads to the introduction/manifestation of authority in these fields.

But there is no such thing as "legitimate authority" (to do evil---which is the only purpose of authority).

Life is mostly about

Life is mostly about reaction. How we choose to react to others around us and if we choose to "follow orders".

The ultimate liberty is the freedom of choice, freedom to react. I was just following orders, to me, is not a valid excuse. I am not a bible thumper because trying to read it reminds me of a long, boring version of the lord of the rings, but I do remember a verse that reads something like....... Prove all things for yourself.

Ultimately, it is the lone individual that will bear responsibility for their choice of actions/reactions in this world. I don't think God is going to be playing the blame game on judgement day.

There can be no good without bad, just as there can be no light without the dark. Yen and yang. People would never learn anything if we didn't make mistakes here and there. It's okay to make bad decisions, as long as one chooses to learn from that mistake and atone.

The devil does not force people to lie, steal and murder, people choose to do so. Sure, some people can be impressionable and deceived into making bad choices, but in the end it was still their choice to make.

Yes, I believe

life is about reaction, that is how Good people get used. Our reaction to words and how we can be manipulated by them.

I agree we are ultimately responsible for our choice of action thus it seems extremely important in how we process words and their real meaning that causes us to move or act in particular ways.

The devil may not force people to lie but he sure is good at deception and misrepresenting situations. I guess it is the doublespeak that bothers me and how to keep from being deceived and used.

Thanks, for sharing your perspective.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

You're welcome! In kind,

You're welcome! In kind, thanks for the reply. Doublespeak is dangerous and can alter ones perception of reality. It deprives us of the truth, the knowledge to make informed decisions. True educators present all sides of an issue and encourage discussion . Propagandists hammer hard on their view and discourage discussion.

The very “truths” we are told need to be examined. When they are examined, we learn the exact ways in which they are deceptive. We are responsible for asking questions and being critical to keep from being deceived.

When words should not fail us

Very heavy and beautiful post.. glad it made the top rack.. I like how you wrote about this difficult sybject as it made me think about a few things..

I have found that "opposites attract".. when you are happy or on top that's when you (me) will attract those who are not happy but seeking to be happy, and the most unhappy will pull you down if they can, and they will try. Or if you are unhappy, people will try to cheer you up, eh?

It's a facinating world we live in. I love it, even the bad, because that's the thing.. I don't believe good and bad exists to God.. It just is what we make of it and that perhaps, is how we are judged.

I guess

I was thinking kindda deep.

Bottom line, words ARE more powerful than the sword.

Words inspire individuals to either pick up or lay down the sword.

The words from a HONEST or DISHONEST individual or group will cause the sword to move or not move. So, I guess we must truly understand who and what motivates the individuals we listen to especially if it causes us to move in a particular direction.

I am not sure what I will face in the end but if I have to look in the mirror and see my sins.

I hope there are none that show I willingly and with full knowledge purposely hurt others.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

Yeah

I am attracted to deep thinking that I find organic, original, inspiring and thought provoking.

I have a theme song. It's like a movie score and I hear it from time to time, as I go about my life. It's beautiful music to me so I enjoy it when I hear it.

To hurt, or to be hurt, maybe that is the question? Everybody hurts sometime, and we all have our feelings and opinions about pain, physical, emotional, mental, fabricated (hyprochondriac).. some women claim Child birth was no big deal, and for some it brings pain causing death.. and none know until experiencing the moment.

Maybe the question becomes, "Is it better to hurt yourself than others?" And I think many people who lash out (sword beit tongue or hand/arm) have made a stand, some may or not understand, yet, run.. fight or flight (usually a combination).

Have you ever had to break up with someone who loved you with all their heart and it's not the same, it's just you KNOW that they are totally awesome, but not for you.. you don't see your life together.. the details drive you crazy and you do not want to hurt that person because you LOVE them.. but what can you do? Very hard place for anyone to be in, and many of us can at least watch movies about it, if they hadn't experienced it personally (psychopaths are not bad people, they just have no feeling or compassion. It's a disability, though some of them use it as a opportunity). Sometimes you have to hurt another person to grow yourself, so it's not like change is pain free for most. Many times what seemed like a great thing to do winds up not being the smartest thing we could have done.

If the person who was jilted becomes revengeful, or spiteful/vindictive, and says and does things to hurt us back because our pain, they assume, is not as much as theirs (for example), is it because they are evil? We're they provoked? It's all growing pains. I have hurt people, not because hurting them was my goal, but because I put my service to myself above my service to them. I do not feel that I was evil for serving myself first because it wasn't out of greed or fraud or deception, but following my heart, using my head, and having the guts to follow what my being thinks, feels, believes, accepts as the right thing for my well being, and I think that is a miral and ethical ground.

Thanks, Granger

You have given me some excellent points to consider. It sure takes a lot of courage to be true to yourself, I'm not sure I have that courage.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

Yes

I think it takes courage, and I believe you have that courage, because you're a deep thinker, and a producer.. that takes courage. I've got a beautiful ((((Liberty tree))))) flag that I love very much to prove that you have courage..

Thanks, Granger

That means a lot to me, Peace.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

ecorob's picture

Very nice, QS...

reminds me of the phrase, paraphrasing, all evil needs to triumph is for good men and women to do nothing.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

The path to hell....

Is paved with good intentions.

The road to a police state was paved with GOOD intentions

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZODSfs8RlJU

This clip sums it up beautifully. I wanted to call the producers of this episode and thank them for doing a public service.