9 votes

Seattle Elects a Socialist to City Council; MSNBC Interviews Her - Kshama Sawant

MSNBC Interview with Socialist Seattle City Council Winner Kshama Sawant.

AP article on the her.


http://youtu.be/SttJu5M-6MI




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I say the Eastern Washington

I say the Eastern Washington should just take the plunge and get with Northern ID and join Montana or create a new state. Politically and culturally those regions are more alike than the states they are attached to.

Spokane's roads are terrible as well becuase Seattle sucks away all the state tax revenue. Its conservative and dirt cheap to live there as well.

Free the 509!!!

We all share this eternally evolving present moment- The past and future only exist as inconsequential mental fabrications.

The Founders goofed

They should have written that every State, city, town, community must guarantee a Republican form of government.
It's just unthinkable that any American would embrace a system that is proven to fail.
I also blame immigration policies. The founders were pretty cautious about letting just anyone in.

"…the policy or advantage of [immigration] taking place in a body (I mean the settling of them in a body) may be much questioned; for, by so doing, they retain the language, habits, and principles (good or bad) which they bring with them. Whereas by an intermixture with our people, they, or their descendants, get assimilated to our customs, measures, and laws: in a word, soon become one people."
George Washington

"…But are there no inconveniences to be thrown into the scale against the advantage expected from a multiplication of numbers by the importation of foreigners?... They will bring with them the principles of the governments they leave, imbibed in their early youth; or, if able to throw them off, it will be in exchange for an unbounded licentiousness, passing, as is usual, from one extreme to another. It would be a miracle were they to stop precisely at the point of temperate liberty. These principles, with their language, they will transmit to their children. In proportion to their numbers, they will share with us the legislation. They will infuse into it their spirit, warp and bias its direction, and render it a heterogeneous, incoherent, distracted mass... Suppose 20 millions of republican Americans thrown all of a sudden into France, what would be the condition of that kingdom? If it would be more turbulent, less happy, less strong, we may believe that the addition of half a million of foreigners to our present numbers would produce a similar effect here..."
Thomas Jefferson, Notes on the State of Virginia

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
James Madison

Immigration red herring

Immigration policy issue may be a red herring. For a disgustingly brain-dead Trotskyite like Kshama Sawant, I offer you counter example of someone like Vijay Boyapati.

I believe both Nassim Taleb & Justin Amash come from immigrant backgrounds (Syrian or Lebanese?) - although in Amash's case he himself is not a direct immigrant.

Michael Nystrom, founder of this website is a direct immigrant. If I remember correctly by reading his other posts, rest of his family from wife's side are immigrants too.

I've run into some other immigrants on this forum. There was that naturopath businessman of Kurdish descent who worked tirelessly for Ron Paul campaign. (K Research or some similar user handle). There is another immigrant from France who is very active on this forum & mostly posts during late night hours (can't recall his user id offhand). The Blue Republican Robin Koerner guy is an immigrant. He's not even an American citizen yet, from my memory. (BTW, he has a Seattle connection too. ;-)

Personally, I'm myself a direct immigrant. But I can confidently claim I've perspective on American Revolution, Constitution, monetary system & rest of history better than 90% of native born population.

The fact of the matter is, disease of socialist statist control transcends across national boundaries, ethnicity, religions etc. Just as, love of civil liberties, individual responsibility transcends across national boundaries, ethnicity, religions etc. In this country, ever since Lyndon Johnson administration (Great Society, Vietnam criminal war) things started going downhill w.r.t. public education/brainwashing. Now they've gone downhill at a freighteningly accelarated pace.

Yesterday, I wasted some time watching video of a rally in Seattle of this brain-dead Kshama Sawant, among a crowd of about 200 zombie degenerates. Looking at nature of the audience, I could tell 99% of that crowd seemed native born in this country. But they all are totally lost. They've latched onto an immigrant communist for their false-guided hopes. But she could've very well been a native born communist, it's all the same.

Immoral funding of Military Industrial Complex by Federal Reserve and US taxation system must stop!!!! End illegal/unconstitutional wars! Preserve US currency!
http://facebook.com/NoPropagandaZone
http://twitter.com/the_chiefe71

What are you talking about?

My family immigrated here, too, starting just after the War for Independence until the 1920s if I include the various great (x's whatever) and grandparents.
The difference is that at the time those immigrants assimilated into the American culture and didn't try to overthrow it with clearly opposing ideology.
Despite the numerous ailments, America was founded as and still is a Republic. We have founding principes pertaining to individual property rights, personal defense, etc.
A sovereign nation has every right to determine who shall enter and be accepted just as I have every right to determine who shall enter my property.
I don't condone foreign troops training on US soil as much as I don't condone US troops acting as the Imperial Guard on foreign soil. Communism/socialism/fascism are not compatable with American Republicanism and are the 'foreign troops' destroying our liberties.
The fact is Americans have been complicit in electing those who erode away our founding principles bringing the country to the point that electing socialists is now acceptable but the Constitution says no. The are not following the law if the change their form of government. Just as we vet candidates, or at least are supposed to, I have no problem if the government vetted prospective immigrants to ensure compatability.
You erroneously mistook my comment for an anti-immigration stance and that couldn't be further from the truth. Ours should be a deliberate immigration policy and not just an open door.

If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy.
James Madison

OK, but can be still contentious

I understand your point better now. But I still feel there is contentious point in it. Before coming to that, first what I completely agree with you:

Your statement "The fact is Americans have been complicit in electing those who erode away our founding principles bringing the country" is 100% in sync with what I stated: Progressive decay & intentional top-down well designed brainwashing in American education.

But your theory of screening prospective immigrants for political compatibility is contentious & totally impractical. I say this from personal experience. I came here hardly as 20 year old kid during Ronald Reagan's time. Apart from basic values of social justice, I didn't have clue about many other things then. I didn't have clue about how monetary system works or free markets or any of that. Heck, it wasn't until gradual period from 2007 to 2010 that I decoded the Federal Reserve puzzle. Whoever wakes up, they do it on their own schedule. I claimed I understand these things better than 90% of US population now. But that's because I took the effort to learn all them just like everyone here. In earlier days before acquiring citizenship, I myself was lost in false left-right Democrat-Republican paradigm & a bleeding heart liberal.

[Ignore immigrants for a second. Even among native borns, there are countless stories of people caught in bleeding heart liberal or neo-con traps. Tom Woods has gone on record & admitted being a totally lost neo-con in his younger college days!]

According to your "political compatibility litmus test @ border": How could it have possibly worked on me? There was a chance I could've remained trapped inside bleeding liberal propaganda. I seriously doubt I would've turned out as brain-dead as Kshama Sawant. But nonetheless, I could've remained trapped as a brainwashed Democrat punching voter, like many of my friends & aquaintances still are. Or I could've become ingrained with constitutional republican (lower case 'r') values. How could some random immigration officers many eons ago during Ronald Reagan's time have predicted this about me? [Without patting on my back & banging my drum too much: I've contributed enormously to Ron Paul campaigns & related liberty issues.]

I feel the real solution lies in fixing the root cause: NOT letting Americans become complicit starting from childhood, & adults in electing those who erode away founding constitutional republic principles. This involves killing brainwashing & propaganda as part of public education system. When that happens, issues about facing native-born or immigrant communists would be all the same.

Immoral funding of Military Industrial Complex by Federal Reserve and US taxation system must stop!!!! End illegal/unconstitutional wars! Preserve US currency!
http://facebook.com/NoPropagandaZone
http://twitter.com/the_chiefe71

yep

I'm all for immigrants but the immigrants from yester year knew they had to work hard to attain success, more they just want it handed to them under the guise of human rights. ... oh well, our native born welfare whores possess the same entitled mentality. This Sawant lady's big plank is automatic amnesty no questions asked. Of course she doesn't want to have to pay for them. Those evil rich people have to.!

irony? not in this day and age

She's an economics professor! Her overt slogan was"tax the rich! "She has proudly declared a class war. So many idiotic goals she has shows a complete lack of understanding of free market economics. It's frightening. My landlord has been volunteering for this woman's campaign. He claims the youth are flocking to her party here. I don't doubt it. There's never been a tax this city hasn't liked. Full of the biggest self loathing Masochists this country has ever seen and they're all pleased as punch to die from a thousands cuts. My wife and I have a thriving established business here and sadly we're considering abandoning it just to get out of this city gone mad. Our business requires being located in a large metropolitan city but we're finding it hard locating one that isn't suffering from the same looter takeover.

Eastside

Move across Lake Washington to Snohomish County (anywhere from Bellevue to Everett). I understand, relatively speaking (compared to the city) it's more free-market friendly. Idiots like these from Seattle city council can't bother you there.

Immoral funding of Military Industrial Complex by Federal Reserve and US taxation system must stop!!!! End illegal/unconstitutional wars! Preserve US currency!
http://facebook.com/NoPropagandaZone
http://twitter.com/the_chiefe71

too bad

They're going to tax the I-90 bridge 5 bucks each way, forcing us to pay for a bridge that's already long since paid for! We work in high fashion here so a lot of our clientele is old money. That said Everett is too small scale and Bellevue is too neuvo-riche. Hence our dilemma. I feel a lot of angst like a shrugged character often.

Whatever the case, she is

Whatever the case, she is presumably an elected official. There have been many, many much more worse people in government.

Plan for eliminating the national debt in 10-20 years:

Overview: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2010/09/12/my-plan-for-reducin...

Specific cuts; defense spending: http://rolexian.wordpress.com/2011/01/03/more-detailed-look-a

Ah yes, the tyranny of the

Ah yes, the tyranny of the majority. This woman is two things: one, she is an idiot for thinking that all Boeing workers have to do is take over the factories and everything would be ok. two, she is a tyrant for advocating the seizure of private property.

______
"When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty."

It would be nice if these

It would be nice if these people even knew what true capitalism is. Then they could really do something to eradicate the government inflicted, corporatist controlled, poverty and ignorance.
Or should I have said... "the corporatist inflicted, government controlled, poverty and ignorance.

“Give a man a gun, he can rob a bank. Give a man a central bank, and he can rob a country and the world.”
www.dailypaul.com/donate

Trend

Yes, this is and will probably become a trend, because even though it is occurring slowly, we are seeing more non-democrats/republicans being elected into office. The people have had enough and want something different, even if it will have bad results (increasing government).

They say that people who

lie can blink a lot.

http://myweb.ncku.edu.tw/~p3896116/Blinking.pdf

"Endless money forms the sinews of war." - Cicero, www.freedomshift.blogspot.com

Disgusting Trotskyist

I wasted last couple hours researching on this disgusting Trotskyist, I want them back. It's truly a shame that this Communist is the gift to local city government, coming from India where she was born.

There are many other India born or Indian descent people I would rather look upto. There was one Indian guy who (came via some Australia connection thru Seattle as well!) used to work @ Google, quit his job & worked tirelessly for Ron Paul revolution. There are some more examples, but certainly not this Trotskyist.

That other guy's name is Vijay Boyapati. Here's more on him:


http://youtu.be/82T7TRju8YY

Immoral funding of Military Industrial Complex by Federal Reserve and US taxation system must stop!!!! End illegal/unconstitutional wars! Preserve US currency!
http://facebook.com/NoPropagandaZone
http://twitter.com/the_chiefe71

Michael Nystrom's picture

One thing of import in this interview

Which is why you should pay attention to things like this - these kinds of anomalies. Is it an anomaly? A socialist elected to public office in America? Or is this the start of a trend?

Fluke, or leading edge? This is the question that only time can answer.

At any rate, he asks her how she got elected in a city that is owned by the Democratic Party. He answer: They ran a true grassroots campaign.

Such a thing is possible on a small scale. That was my hope for the Ron Paul 2008 campaign: A true grassroots campaign, powered by average people, using the new tools of the internet. How it came to be supporting C4L and the GOP is one of the greatest bait and switch stories ever.

But what this shows: A true grassroots campaign can work on a small scale. If it can work on a small scale, it can work on a big scale. But maybe working together is better suited to socialists, who are all about 'the greater good.'

Maybe there is a flaw in libertarian ideology that keeps people from working together from accomplishing a 'common' goal like this.

All art is only done by the individual. The individual is all you ever have, and all schools only serve to classify their members as failures. E.H.

We just still need better communication, imho...

Thanks to you and the DP there is one more venue for providing some of that communication.

While the collectivist extreme is becoming more popular, so is the individualist/libertarian "trend". The latter I believe is a permanent state of understanding, whereas the former is indeed a trend.

The middle of the road is no longer a path that seems realistic for the future. As people discover the core, consistency behind their ideology, the further they follow that to the logical extreme. Many who had unknowingly chosen collectivism, are following their long held beliefs to their eventual ending. And while freedom lovers watch the world become homogenized, we are pushed to follow our beliefs to their extremes. (And that's a good thing. "Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue." - Barry Goldwater)

Our flaw is our strength...

Not force, but suggestion...
Not deception, but honesty...
Law, based Not for fear of thy neighbor, but for love of thy neighbor...

Both extremes may be trending, but liberty is still a relatively new concept, one that has succeeded tremendously when actually tried. Collectivism/Tyranny however, is not new, and is only trending, imho, because of the sleeping masses finally being awakened to the ideology of the system they've been worshipping, and they just plain like worshipping at the altar of collectivism.

The grass-roots were like a zombie horde, all working individually towards the same goal, I thought, during the 2012 campaign. It was the RP Campaign itself, that communicated poorly with the grass-roots, and imho, blew-it. Even possible some individuals sabotaged the campaign. Jesse Benton, ah hemm...

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

The principle is sound

The principle of anti-collectivism is sound but is sometimes taken to such an extreme that it can become self-defeating. Some goals require agreement and action in numbers. I have been trying to stress this for years now and compare it to hunting geese with a sawed off shotgun.

A shotgun discharges a numerous number of "individual" pellets that spread farther apart from each other as they travel farther from the barrel. Trying to shoot high altitude geese as they fly over is futile with a sawed off shotgun. This is because the spread pattern is so large and dispersed by the time it gets to the goose you will be lucky if even one pellet hits the goose. But if you use a shotgun with a full choke to concentrate all of these "individual" pellets into a much tighter, closer and more accurate pattern, many more of these individual pellets will hit the target and you have a better chance of bagging the goose. A choked barrel does not take away the individuality of each pellet, but it does concentrate them into a more accurate and effective number to hit the target at one time and actually bag the goose. Without one, goose hunting would be futile, as it is with extreme self defeating anti-collectivism.

If I disappear from a discussion please forgive me. My 24-7 business requires me to split mid-sentence to serve them. I am not ducking out, I will be back later to catch up.

It's the beginning of a trend

We are seeing more and more 'small government' (Tea Party, libertarian, etc.) elected officials while, at the same time, seeing more and more 'big government' (like this socialist) elected officials.

We will see more of this in the years to come.

This is a natural result of the line being drawn clearer and clearer.

The clearer the line, the closer to the serious clash.

Diamond Dog's picture

Polarization

It's the wave of the future.

The Diamond Dog is a real cool cat. | Reporting on the world from an altitude of 420.

I think it's a misunderstanding

The "political" question of the moment about health care from the talking heads is that the republicans need to advance their own plan, in response to the failure of Obamacare. But the freedom answer is, get government completely out of health care. The market will only work if people know the cost of medical procedures, and can shop, so that providers have to compete on price. The answer is to not do. The harm comes from people assuming they have to do something.

That's really tricky, because people are dependent on the money that flows from medicare, which completely distorts the market. It's difficult to imagine a free market if people have never seen one. It's similar to the utter misapprehension of what a gold standard would mean.

The Confucius quote is interesting. It says that what follows from imprecise language is that something is left undone.

Lao Tzu would say that the path is in not doing. Action and morality come about after the power(tao) is lost.

It seems like were at a pregnant moment before a widespread realization. If you were to substitute freedom, which is the absence of "official" actions on behalf of anyone, for the notion that something must be "done", then we would really have something. But it needs to be positive in emphasis as a political statement, not merely opposition to continually wrong action. That is RP's great power. (Liberty brings people together. What a line.)

Here's an interesting Lao Tzu passage:

http://terebess.hu/english/tao/waley.html#Kap38

The ironic thing, is that all of this harmful action from government is actually illegal! If people were more jealous of their powers, in our republican system of checks and balances, and saw to it that wrongdoers were dealt with, we would have something.

But most people completely misunderstand our foundation of law in restraining the actions of government. RP's brilliant positive take is "protecting our Liberty." I think the winning emphasis is constitutional more than libertarian, which is a sort of competing ideology in the dusty fray.

He asks an excellent

to start the interview. What she argues is capitalism, is tempting to say is socialism, banker bailouts, political insiders getting special deals, isn't capitalism, but it's actually fascism, because private companies are in bed with the government. So she's arguing that socialism is the cure for fascism, which she thinks is capitalism. There seems to be a lot of confusion. People don't know what they're talking about.

Michael Nystrom's picture

Your comment inspired me to create a whole new post

Confucius on Confusion. The words pretty much sum up what you said, and where it is leading (has led) us:

“If language is not correct, then what is said is not what is meant; if what is said is not what is meant, then what must be done remains undone; if this remains undone, morals and art will deteriorate; if justice goes astray, the people will stand about in helpless confusion. Hence there must be no arbitrariness in what is said. This matters above everything.”
-- Confucius

All art is only done by the individual. The individual is all you ever have, and all schools only serve to classify their members as failures. E.H.