33 votes

Grow Up

"Why I'm Staying" "Why I'm Leaving" "I'm Coming Back". Guess what - NO ONE CARES. Leave, stay, do whatever you want and stop being a baby crying out for attention all the time.




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LOL

Reading this post again reminded me of this:

http://youtu.be/d2cTX81ZpL8

Michael Nystrom's picture

Seriously - what did I miss?

First this, and now this.

Anyway, in the big picture of things, I don't really care if (some) people stay or go. Whatever is going to happen is going to happen.

Everything passes / everything changes / just do what you think you should do.

Obviously there are some people that I care about. But I have offline relationships with many of the people that I really care about here.

You should too. Build your relationships. Nothing in this world is guaranteed. This place could disappear tomorrow, without notice.

All art is only done by the individual. The individual is all you ever have, and all schools only serve to classify their members as failures. E.H.

I believe I may have stoked the fire a bit...

when I saw the 'why I'm leaving' post I dug up my 'I ain't goin' nowhere' post and temporarily retitled it 'why I'm not leaving.' http://www.dailypaul.com/261819/i-aint-goin-nowhere

they both ended up getting bumped a lot and next thing I knew a hubbub had turned into a hullabaloo and all heck had broken loose.

oops.

And someone else posted a thread specifically attacking yours truly and saying I should be banned because they keep falling for my Onion posts and forwarding them to all their buddies as gospel truth and they were tired of being fooled over and over and over again.

"Home is where it's hardest."
-Tommy

OMG PANDAS!!! LOCK UP THE CHILDREN!!!
-me

jrd3820's picture

Ahem, let me fill ya in

Someone posted about leaving because of x,y,or z. This naturally brought up a bunch of these types of posts about people who don't care if people leave, which brought up a post about why people stay here, which brought up posts about why people who post about these things are immature. For someone who is as broke as I am right now, it was fun few days here on the DP :)

Michael Nystrom's picture

jrd, you are the best

I figured as much. I was going to ask you for a link, but I guess they're all the same, aren't they?

Someone posted about leaving because of x,y,or z.

The reasons aren't relevant, are they? The reasons are personal. Others might resonate with those reasons. Others might resonate with the opposite.

Here's the bottom line: Do what you want! That is the libertarian (small l) credo! "Do what you want!:

I came to that conclusion intuitively, before I knew what libertarian was, or even that there was a Libertarian Party.

Do you need a Libertarian Party to do that? To do what you want?

Me thinks not.

Do you need to announce it?

Me also thinks not.

Do what you want.

jrd, you are the best. But I told you that yesterday (or the day before). Did anyone tell you today?

I think I just did. Again.

All art is only done by the individual. The individual is all you ever have, and all schools only serve to classify their members as failures. E.H.
jrd3820's picture

I wanted to point something out with all these posts

But I wasn't quite sure where to do it so I'm going to do it here because I know you will eventually read this.

But really quick a few other things first.
The reason whoever it was decided to leave (and came back the next day anyways) is irrelevant and I was going to look for the link, but I thought it didn’t really matter.

Yes, you told me I’m the best a few days ago and again today and it made me smile both times. Funny though I told my roommate that she was the best the other day and she laughed and said ‘j, you just told me that a few days ago.’ I said ‘I did? Oh, well…. It is important that you know that’ and she said ‘Sometimes I think you just think everyone is the best’ lol Which brings me to my comment in the ‘why do you stay at the dailypaul thread?’

http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/3268183

I felt compelled to comment in that thread because as I have explained to you before it is actually out of character for me to hang out at an online place as much as I do here and for as long as I have here which I realize is not nearly as long as some of the seasoned vets. This is my comment in that thread. The 2nd paragraph explains the beginning of the jam session thread as the guy that told me to leave because I don’t belong here inspired me to remind him every day that I was here and I think I made myself heard quite nicely as the thread was unavoidable for months on end.

But the third paragraph is the truth. I just like these people and I can’t help it. That being said.... what I thought about pointing out a few times with all these dramatic posts is the following:

For being what I have come to understand is a group primarily composed of grown adult men, it can become all sorts of mellow dramatic around here sometimes. My current living situation is with 4 other girls my age ish. That makes 5 females in our mid to late 20s that share close living quarters, we work together in a very small school with 56 students and 4 classrooms, we commute to and from work together, we socialize together, we grocery shop together, we make lesson plan together, we travel together and so on and so forth. None of us knew each other before we got thrown into this situation. However, again…. For being 5 females in our mid to late 20s we manage to keep the drama and theatrics to a minimum. Why can’t these boys do the same? Like I said though, it did provide for some entertainment in which I was called a sock puppet or accused of having sock puppet accounts which I didn’t know what that meant so Chris had to explain it to me. It can be like a soap opera in here sometimes. And when people aren't being dramatic about leaving there are the occasional 'who downvoted me?!?!' comments and threads about being downvoted.... I once received a few downvotes for simply saying 'I love Judge Nap.' That was all there was to the comment. It got downvoted. I laughed. However some here take such things quite personally.

I have learned some really great things from the Dailypaul, and sometimes I email some of the articles I pick up here around to some of my friends, in fact someone from the DP sent me a really cool article a week or so ago about the tremors people feel as they near the age 30 which I had to share with another friend who is on the threshold with me. But I think if nothing else I have learned some internet terms such as the meaning of the word ‘stormfront’ and now ‘sockpuppet.’

I have also learned that these guys act like tough guys, but they are sensitive and I love them for that. It is endearing.

Hope all is well your way or as well as can be. Tell Samantha and May I say Hi.
Sincerely,
Your Neonazi Stormfront Troll Sockpuppet friend who is about to go country hop the Asian continent for a week or 2 before I head back home and I will have right around a penny in my pocket and one suitcase in my hand.

skepticism

Do you think the liberty movement suffers from a lack of critical thinking in general? There seems to be a lot of confirmation bias and parroting of myths. Ignoring the hysteria of people posting about leaving or staying, I'm just trying to encourage people to be more skeptical of their own thoughts.

I personally have wasted a lot of time and energy believing misinformation. And the 100+ people I know in the Ron Paul movement, not one ever encouraged me to question what I was saying. It was fun to finally meet others who'd read/thought what I had.

And people who did question certain claims of the "liberty doctrine" were met with incredulous condescension, "Oh you haven't read X, Y or Z. You just don't know!"

Most of the time I'm arguing against how people reason not their conclusions. And I'm not saying I know anything special only that I'm very unsure what I do know and I'm constantly questioning myself and others.

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

I think the human race

I think the human race suffers from lack of critical thinking in general, especially Americans. I would say the level of critical thinking among people who identify with liberty is higher than average, and lower than it ought.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

When the day comes

and you leave a post saying "screw you guys, I'm gone!", that will be hilarious, and scary. lol

http://youtu.be/MTc3zcnIZOw

jrd3820's picture

:)

lol

I remember that. lol that made my day

Michael Nystrom's picture

Scary? I feel like it at least

once a day.

Don't be scared. Be prepared.

My teachers are Don James, who resigned as head coach of the University of Washington (my alma mater) Huskies football team. It was a complete surprise to everyone.

and Lou Pinella, who, after winning an AL record 116 games with the Mariners in 2001, abruptly quit the team in 2002.

I was there for both events. I watched it all unfold with my own eyes via the sports pages of the Seattle Times, and the local news. I learned a priceless lesson:

When it is time to go, it is time to go.

Don't think I'll be here forever. I doubt I will.

But I do agree with your assessment. It will be both hilarious and scary. For me too.

But when it is time to go, it is time to go. That is the only course of action, if you're going to be true to yourself.

That means you, too.

All art is only done by the individual. The individual is all you ever have, and all schools only serve to classify their members as failures. E.H.

Michael Nystrom cares.

Case in point: Granger

Wowee

When I saw this post, I began to respond: "I care". And then I wrote about how I care and I think caring people are the worth caring about, blah blah blah, and then I thought, "what am I doing telling someone who doesn't care about caring?"

And then I saw you post.. and I did a double take..you're right on! You are smack dab right on!! Michael cares.. he's not worried, or weird.. he cares about us and this community, and he's got a life on top of it.. but thank you for posting what you did ((((nothappy)))). Right on!

Granger.

You have no idea about Ron Paul's message. I think you are an abused female of the most dangerous kind.

I think you lie about your chickens and I think you have lied about a bunch of things.

I don't know yet why you are here, but like Michael I'm glad you are. This post shows me you are ... let's just say that you have overcome your broken wing. ;)

Base

Base

I look forward to meeting you at the RNC in 2016 where Ron Paul Republicans will be continuing the rEVOLution.

I can accept that to you I would be the most dangerous kind of child abuse survivor and you would think that I have no idea of Ron Paul's message because if I see child abuse, I report it. YEP! If Ron Paul's message means that I become deaf, blind and dumb as a witness for a child who is being abused, than I want no part of Ron Paul's message.. but that is not Ron Paul's message. Ron Paul is not saying that liberty is for child abusers to do what they want. I am not going to shoot the abuser on sight, as I don't believe that is Ron Paul's message either. But I am not going to walk away. I will walk to the manager or police or whoever and REPORT IT.

Why would I lie about chickens?

Why are you worried about why I am here? Why are you here? Where do you get the idea that Michael is happy I am here? My being here is not about Michael's happiness. We wound up going in different directions.. I went GOP, Michael didn't.. I went Rand, Michael didn't.. but that does not remove any RESPECT. I totally RESPECT Michael's choice and his tolerance for mine, and I believe, though I could be wrong because I have not discussed this with Michael, but I believe that there is a mutual curiosity where the rEVOLution is going.. where we are going.. after all, we do share common goals.. Peace, Sound Money, Love (caring about people and life).

Sometimes Base, things that are broken get rebuilt better.

peace

Haha. You just posted one

Haha. You just posted one too. Must be a slow month for news.

Come on man you're taking

Come on man you're taking away from my upvotes

Also the posting about not caring about people leaving is become just as a nuisance as the reason we posted in the first place. Lets just stop Ok? Cool

Hand me down that Can o Beans

Libertarians drunken dancing ignoring the call of a statist


http://youtu.be/oMSK_ByKns8

They just need attention.

Don't feed the trolls.

Freedom is my Worship Word!

I do care...

I do care because this site is the largest Ron Paul site on the Internet despite the banner change. And I spent thousands of hours working for the Ron Paul campaign. And I've been on this forum for 7 years.

But the people posting are largely misinformed. They parrot discredited and false information, twist and take things out of context and make jumping conclusions. Even though I'm a "conspiracy theorist", I find the lack of critical thinking here depressing. And the amount of confirmation bias and sanctimoniousness is beyond comprehension.

The problems are a common result of anonymity and the Internet. It's not unique to the DailyPaul but it shines bright here.

Maybe I'm wrong. But maybe what some believe here are wrong. And that possibility, that self-reflection, is lost on most people posting.

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

"...the people posting are largely misinformed."

I'd say at least 90% of posters here are more informed than those posting on the msnbc/cnn/fox forums.

Okay...

We've recently disagreed on three topics: 1) The Navy SEALS' statement on not recognizing Bin Laden, 2) That the Jesuits are politically corrupt or influential in geopolitics / Rothschild Family is political / Rothschild Family involved in central banking, 3) That Shimon Peres allegedly said he was against Israel killing Arafat.

All three of these things are demonstrably false and I believe you'd agree if you researched it more. We could switch positions and I could try arguing your side and you could argue mine. In a general sense, that's all I was asking; for us to be critical of our own thoughts and beliefs.

We should all agree to consider that we may be wrong or mistaken.

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

Right, go ahead and blow my socks off then, please.

If you cared at all to prove your point, I don't see why you've yet to. Because you can not refute you choose to condemn? Or do you have some proof to back up that talk?

Okay...

There was a reason I didn't expand on issue #2 when you first asked me.

As for #1, we aren't debating other evidence or if Bin Laden died prior to 2011. We are analyzing what the Navy SEAL said on 60 Minutes. While the two clips edited together seem compelling, in the full interview he states that both a woman and a child confirmed it was Bin Laden. He also said he emphatically took two sets of photos and DNA samples for both helicopters to ensure the evidence would get out. He never once said they didn't kill Bin Laden. He wrote an entire book about it. All he said was he looked different than he thought. Watch the full 60 Minutes episode - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djCuC5E32bM

As for #3, just read the few paragraphs prior to the question about Shimon Peres not supporting assassinating Arafat. They were talking about Peres' general stance on assassination, which he said he was against except for a Hamas military commander who had attacked Israel. Clearly they were talking about potential Israeli plans to assassinate Arafat (prior to his death) that he said he was against. Israel has denied they kill Arafat. Despite the polonium poisoning report, if true, this could had been someone within the PLO or Israel, but there's no evidence of either supplying the alleged poison. Again, Arafat was 75 years old when he died. The evidence of polonium poisoning was exaggerated by Al Jazeera and corrected by a Professor involved who said it only "moderately" supported it. Many other forensic scientists said the evidence wasn't representative of polonium.

To be clear, I'm not attacking your conclusions, only the reasoning you are using at arriving at them. As for issue #2, I'd be glad to discuss that in-depth sometime. I simply didn't want to post about it publicly at the time. Though you can read Men of Wealth on Mises or read a skeptic-centric site that debunks those theories about the Rothschilds.

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

My reply

1) "...both a woman and a child confirmed it was Bin Laden"

- Uh-huh, and so did the national media, which I have no reason to believe. A lot of this "news" is literally MADE UP by people like Rita Katz, the daughter of an executed Israeli spy who runs SITE, or "Search for International Terrorist Entities" (but never in Israel). SITE is the group responsible for releasing the dubbed Osama tapes and the poorly Photoshopped postmortem Osama image. SITE is reportedly funded by the US government to the tune of $500,000 a year and is, in effect an arm of the Departments of Justice, Treasury, and Homeland Security. Moreover, what the SEAL says at around 25:10 in that interview is unambiguous: he did not recognize Bin-Laden. It's clear as day; no editing to twist his words is apparent.

2) I'm not sure what you are attempting to get at here. The Rothschilds DO have vast amounts of wealth (trillions) and control the stock market and much of the economy. Basically, they are War bankers, market manipulators and money launderers for the NWO. They're working on behalf of the Jesuit Order and the Vatican as is apparent from their title of "Guardians of the Vatican treasury," acknowledged in the Jewish Encyclopedia and the fact that they are all Masonic-Papal Knights.

3) "They were talking about Peres' general stance on assassination, which he said he was against...Clearly they were talking about potential Israeli plans to assassinate Arafat (prior to his death) that he said he was against"

- I am not in contention with you here; it seems we both agree Israel did indeed have plans to assassinate Arafat. Like you say, it is not set in stone that he was assassinated by Israeli agents. I am not sure about scientists saying Arafat wasn't poisoned though; I've read otherwise.

1) Despite that, "Mark Owen"

1) Despite that, "Mark Owen" confirmed it was Bin Laden. He never said it wasn't him. True, he did say he didn't recognize him but you are taking his words out of context.

2) No Rothschild has trillions of dollars. There are a few worth multiple billions. They do not control the stock market. The war financing they did 200 years ago was largely sensationalized. The Jesuit conspiracy theories of the 19th century were not accurate. Even if they were, in 2013 the Jesuits exercise no geopolitical power in the context you are suggesting. There are specifics claims that can be shown to be false but I don't want to go into them. Search Google and read about the other side to your arguments.

3) Mossad probably has theoretical plans to assassinate Jesus if he ever returns. Sure you've read scientists that support your beliefs but you ignore or discount others that contradict them. Regardless, the point is you are intentionally misconstruing what Peres said in order to support your claim. It's not a controversy that the IDF or Mossad considered killing Arafat. But to claim that Arafat admitted in the New York Times that Israel killed him despite his wishes is absolutely wrong and undermines everything else you say.

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

Oh dear.

1) Who is this Mark Owen and what reason do I have to believe him? Like I said news stories are made up all he time. This is not taking anything out of context, it is what he said verbatim!

2) "Retired management consultant Gaylon Ross Sr, author of Who’s Who of the Global Elite, has been tipped from a private source that the combined wealth of the Rockefeller family in 1998 was approx (US)
$11 trillion and the Rothschilds (U.S.) $100 trillion." That was years ago and I'm sure it is much more than that now.

And ever heard of Algorithmic trading using supercomputers? Yeah, the Rothschilds are big into that. That is controlling the stock market. They are into the manipulation of precious metal prices, too.

3) Now you are just being a joker or attempting to libel me as far as I can tell. Am I to take seriously the notion that "Arafat admitted in the New York Times that Israel killed him"? That is not even logical, for a dead man can not speak! And how dare you attribute this farcical comment to me?

so you're just a troll I see

1) "Mark Owen" is the Navy SEAL. Sure, it's what he said but the implication you draw was not what he intended. He never ever once said that the man they killed wasn't Bin Laden. And if your counter is, news stories are made up, then we can never empirically understand what is true or not. Nothing is real, so how can we debate?

2) I know a bit about algorithmic trading and the biggest ones have no connection to the Rothschilds. Gaylon Ross Sr. is not credible. Neither the Rockefellers nor Rothschilds are trillionaires. See-http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-02/its-1-world-who-owns-what-223-trillion-global-wealth

3) Okay, you're just a troll. Clearly it was mistake, I meant to write Shimon Peres. Kind of like when Bhutto inadvertently said Omar Sheikh killed Bin Laden. By your logic and my statement, Arafat is still alive! Conspiracy!*%$%&!%

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

You must be looking in the mirror then

1) What implication is that? I am merely saying it is not surprising that Owen did not recognize Bin-laden because the man was already dead and it was some other guy in that compound that was killed.

2) Then you don't know enough apparently; the banks which the Rothschilds and their associates own are doing algorithmic trading with supercomputers linked directly to the NYSE on a daily basis.

The article you link to does not account for total assets, and so does nothing to support your assertion.

3) Apparently I am also believed by you to be a reader of minds; because according to you I must have known you made an error.