4 votes

I'm frustrated with the anti Bitcoin crowd and their vitriol against it.

Bitcion is not a New World Order tool. However the US Dollar is. Bitcoin is not a threat to Gold, nor does it replace the value in saving in Gold. Rather, it gives us the ability to buy and sell goods in services free of the control of central planners, governments, and banking monopolies.

What self respecting Libertarian, Anarchist, or Freedom supporter would be against a network of individuals coming together to build a tool that enables free exchange?

The Bitcion network has intrinsic value as it eliminates banking fees and simplifies the transfer of funds from one person to another. Bitcoins are just a unit of account within that network.

If you don't like Bitcoin, continue earning money in US Dollars and spending US dollars. See how that works out for you in the long run.



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ecorob's picture

Bitcoin is a distraction...

ignore it and focus on what is important.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

have i supported it, not

have i supported it, not really, but one thing i wont do is ignore it.......i wish luck to those who follow that route, the most important thing for ANY currency is the willingless of people to use and to some degree trust the "currency".........i dont just wish luck for bitcoin, i wish luck for them all, i want the best solution to win.........and those who want to edge their bets on bitcoin or any other currency is their own choice, as well as their own responsibility

Just because someone doesnt speak up against bitcoin, doesnt mean they express other commodoties to fail, like precious metals, some of them I THINK wouldnt mind seing someone blend the idea that is bitcoin, with real world, in your hand commodities like PM

Seems like the default

Seems like the default position would simply be anti-govt fiat money. Ultimately, the Constitution doesn't prohibit people from using whatever they wish as money or currency. It only limits what the govt itself can use.

Tell that to Bernard Von Nauthaus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernard_von_NotHaus

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A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history.
~Mahatma Gandhi

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Is bitcoin too volatile to be money.

Debate here
http://www.dailypaul.com/307174/bitcoin-down-50-in-a-day-is-...

www.SuccessCouncil.com
Protect your assets and profit from the greatest wealth transfer in history.

The main problem I have with it...

... is that, like having money in the bank, I won't have access to any of it if and when the grid goes down.

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"The greatest mystery of all is truth." - Me, 2009

If the grid goes down,

If the grid goes down, everything in your bank accounts and investments would be inaccessable as well.

ecorob's picture

BINGO!

We have a winner!

This is an excellent argument for physically holding precious metals.

its 'cos I owe ya, my young friend...
Rockin' the FREE world in Tennessee since 1957!
9/11 Truth.

Except as you try to flee the

Except as you try to flee the country, your gold and silver are confiscated. Ohhhhh. Gosh, maybe crypto currencies ARE good for something.

when the country gets to that

when the country gets to that level of fuckness, you honestly think the internet won't be shut down "for our own good"?

That's a valid concern.

It's a good idea to hold on to precious metals (and ultimately food) for this scenario.

I definitely don't recommend selling your silver for Bitcoin, but consider diversifying some of that money in the bank into Bitcoin.

Sure it is. LOL! Maybe people

Sure it is. LOL! Maybe people should also keep a spacesuit handy in case the moon crashes into the Earth.

How to not look like an idiot:

Believe that Bitcoin is backed by nothing? Alright. Believe that Bitcoin is inferior to gold? Alright. Believe that Bitcoin has no intrinsic value? Alright.

But it is not FIAT.

Fiat means:
1.
[by] an authoritative decree, sanction, or order

You may hate Bitcoin... but they ARE NOT FIAT.

Some of these comments... really? Words have meaning... you can't just categorize a currency you don't like fiat.

Sorry just plain wrong

It is so because I say so. If you make such a claim you must give some evidence why its true. So if you claim its not ([by] an authoritative decree, sanction, or order) then if you have a valid point you must show that bitcoin is not controlled.

I see its controled by those who control the government. I am not sure but I would bet that its controled by those who started and own the internet controls. If not just by those who make the rules. They can and will change the rules at any whim with justification that the Government made me do it.

So try again.

sovereign

"by an authoritative decree,

"by an authoritative decree, sanction, or order"

sort of like when the original programmer only allowed 21 million coins to be mined?

what a fallacy!

This is akin to saying counterfeit money should not be called "funny money" because the definition of 'funny' is humorous, and there is nothing humorous about counterfeit money.

It is so annoying when I hear this argument. Fiat is also a name of a car. This petty symantec does nothing to disguise the fact that BCs are not "sound currency." And before you even start - no I don't mean sound like a sound argument, or when you hear a sound. I am comparing "sound money" (backed by a commodity such as gold) to its' opposite - "fiat money."

Even by the loosest definition BC is fiat until it hits its' pre-programmed maximum. And even then, if the majority of users agree to raise the limit then they can. That means it is "fiat currency."

coupons

Are a Fiat currency. ITs not the government that creates Fiat currency, its Financial and commercial organizations. My Giant Eagle coupons are fiat money given value by the fact that Giant eagle accepts them. Bitcoin is essentially the same, just different commercial and financial interests accept them.

...

Who is the issuing authority of Bitcoin?

We used to call bits, data. Now we call data money. What's next?

All rights reserved and no rights waived.

Who cares?

If Bitcoin floats yer boat, buy it.

If not, don't.

Isn't that the free market solution? No hand-wringing necessary.

This is what Ron Paul is talking about when he talks about competing currencies and permitting them.

If some "competing currencies" are shyte, they'll fail because no one buys them.

If some are perceived by the market as valuable, they'll succeed.

Either way, who cares? Buy what you like. Avoid what you don't. Let others do the same. The "invisible hand" will sort it out.

What you say may be

What you say may be true...but I've lived too long to think anything comes for free. Anyone using the new technology amid the technology wars as to who is going to be the king pins will be subjected to the whim of anonymous owners, players and controllers. I get the concept of bitcoin. What I don't get is allowing your wealth, fiat or not, to be salted away in cyberspace under the control of unknown players. I think we're incredibly naive to think we can trust the Internet for honest transactions and full access when needed. LOL

It's safer to use a paper

It's safer to use a paper wallet, not to use an online account. A paper wallet is offline and cannot be touched electronically.

How is BTC NOT a fiat

How is BTC NOT a fiat currency????

Also, didnt the creator of BTC admit to working with the feds?

Second questoin.

no, where are you getting your info?

That is bizarre to even come up with. Seriously. Do your own search don't listen to everything people post... geez!

"We’ve moved beyond the Mises textbook. We’re running in the open market." - Erik Voorhees

Michael Nystrom's picture

The definition of 'fiat'

Fiat: an arbitrary decree or pronouncement by an entity having absolute authority to enforce it: e.g. The king ruled by fiat.

The US dollar is a fiat currency not because it is backed by nothing, but because it is decreed by arbitrary law that it is "money" and you have to accept it on penalty.

There is no such law with regards to bitcoin.

That is the answer to your first question.

As for your second, what is this word 'didnt'?

He's the man.

Thank you for replying

Thank you for replying Michael.

I believe that BTC is a "proxy" fiat. For the same reason why I believe Gary Johnson was a fail proxy to Ron Paul.

With so much uncertainty in the market and the eventuality of a major correction coming, people are trying anything they can to feel secure and some are just trying to make a buck off others. Just because BTC isnt the reserve currency, doesnt meant that people dont have to jump into it.

Gold down, silver down,....must go to btc.
silver up, gold up....must go to stocks and bonds.

After reading zerohedge for a while now, Ive come to understand that the people are being pushed around into buying and converting their wealth into whatever tptb need them too.

Ergo, fiat.

Bitcoin is not fiat currency

BItcoin, like the US dollar is unbacked currency.

The dollar's backing is the force of law-because the government says so=fiat

Bitcoin's backing comes from the users' voluntary use not because the government or anyone else forced them to use it

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FIAT, practice. An order of a judge, or of an officer, whose authority, to be signified by his signature, is necessary to authenticate the particular acts.
-Law Dictionary, John Bouvier, Revised Sixth Edition, 1856

FIAT, A short order or warrant of a judge or magistrate directing some act to be done; an authority issuing from some competent source for the doing of a legal act.
- Black's Law Dictionary, 1st Ed.

FIAT, n.
1. an authoritative decree, sanction, or order: a royal fiat.
2. an arbitrary decree or pronouncement, esp. by a person or group of persons having absolute authority to enforce it: to rule by fiat.
- Webster's College Dictionary 2010

If there is an issuing authority than it most definitely is fiat. The constitution is clear on what lawful money is and what the consequences of producing counterfeit money are.

All rights reserved and no rights waived.

wolfe's picture

Ummm...

Did you miss the main point that to be by "fiat", means the force of law, and not just some guy or even group of guys saying, "hey, let's do this?"

The Philosophy Of Liberty -
http://www.thephilosophyofliberty.com/

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The word "law" or "force" is not included in any of the definitions of Fiat.

Who is the issuing authority?

All rights reserved and no rights waived.