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Divergent. Anyone else see this movie?


Thoughts? Very interesting movie. Are Ron Paulians todays divergents?

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Your test is inconclusive

sounds like my 'occupation interest' test given to me in high school. It gave you an identifier to match to one of the occupation categories on a sort of a pinwheel. The idea being that you should match to that category or to one of the touching categories. Occupation numbers were various numbers from 10 to 50.
Seems pretty cool except my identifier is a "99". Whoa, what's going on, my number cannot be found. Hmmm, what's this asterisk statement say - "If you're identifier is a "99", the test could not identify an occupation interest category for you OR you would be equally capable in any of the occupation categories." Guess that explains why I had to cram 4 years of college into 6 and a half - thankfully it was still cheap at the time.

I read the series

but haven't seen the movie yet. The books were pretty good. Divergent was the best of the three.

If you want to read a very good YA dystopian series, try Legend, Prodigy, and Champion, by Marie Lu. It is being made into a movie.

Another decent dystopian is Shipbreaker, by Paolo Bacigalupi

Little Brother, by Cory Doctorow is good as well.

“The only way to deal with an unfree world is to become so absolutely free that your very existence is an act of rebellion.”
― Albert Camus

**Spoiler alert**

I just saw the movie today found it to be quite brilliant... Many parallels to our current reality..

The most telling part, and also my favorite, was when the Erudite lady had called on the Dauntless soldiers to go into the Stiff's faction to kill them all and said something like " We're here to maintain the peace." And then the Divergent guy (in their captivity) said something along the lines of the fact that, "the peace has already been breached" referring to this armed raid of the neighborhood. It was all very telling...

"Truth is treason in the empire of lies"

all about control.

all about control.

I wonder why...

Violence is seen as the solution. I have not seen this movie but from the trailer it seems to have the same presupposition as "The Matrix", that those who will defeat the System will be those who are physically stronger and more adept at inflicting death on others.

Even taken as a metaphor I believe it misses the mark. The way that Force is finally defeated is not by Force but by its antithesis, Gentleness. God is compassionate, kind, humble, gentle and patient.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

The thesis of the movie is more complex than 'might makes right'

Might, without morality, is handmaiden to tyranny. Intellect without compassion is prone to overreaching hubris. Perfect selflessness leads to helplessness and victimhood.

A fully functioning human thinks, feels, judges, and acts. He is a moral actor.

Ironically, at the climax of the movie it is LOVE, not force, which turns the tide.

Force, even when "justified" is still Force.

As I said I have not see the movie and am simply commenting on the trailer. The emphasis appeared to be on the ability of the "Divergents", both male and female, to overcome their opponents in physical combat, using death dealing weapons.

Even if this violence is given a moral justification the temptation in life is always to construct an a priori justification in order to inflict violence on others. This is the nature of the rationalising human mind and indeed is founded upon what we know as Justice that is based upon an eye for an eye retribution, in itself merely a divine stepping stone towards true Love.

However this present understanding and practice of Justice is not the way in which we shall ultimately overcome our final enemy, Death, which is the cause and consequence of Force and Violence. This is the lesson we still have to learn.

I would be interested to know in what way the film portrays Love as being the ultimate solution to our dilemma.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

Certainly there are moral dilemmas

The movie puts characters in positions of making moral choices in life-and-death situations. Thought provoking.

If not force, what?

Obviously "voting" doesn't work. "The will of the people" is no more.
Our system is broken at its core...it needs to be destroyed and rebuilt from the ground up...and how is something destroyed? With force...that's just grade school physics.
It would NEVER be enough to simply try and incarcerate the current batch of criminals, as the tentacles of this awesome monster are far-reaching. These elements must be done away-with in their entirety in order for us all to regain the liberties we were meant to have.
I have not seen this film, nor have I read the book. From the trailer I am reminded of "Brave New World", also...in which force and rebellion was the solution to the corrupt system. Mr. Huxley included LOVE as a principle ingredient of their victory, as well.
In conclusion, I argue that force is OUR solution. I don't want it, I don't welcome it...but I believe we are left without options.

Silence isn't always golden....sometimes it's yellow.

"The liberties of a people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." - Patrick Henry

Destruction may be accomplished in different ways.

We tend to think of destruction as being the result of violent upheaval whether inflicted by men and their technologies, or by natural phenomena like floods and volcanic eruptions.

There is another alternative that is revealed in scripture and this "destruction" is what I believe will be the result of divine intervention in the affairs of men in the near future.

This alternative is transformation, which replaces the old with the new simultaneously. So the old is destroyed at the same time as everything is restored to the original design and purpose that is latent in everything.

This is what is revealed in scripture and in the life and testimony of the Lord Jesus Christ which is the meaning of all prophecy.

"Jesus answered them: 'Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is a slave to sin. The slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed.'" (John 8:34-36)

Saw it yesterday

Loved it.

Much more intellectual than "Hunger Games". The artifice of breaking society into factions based on traits is a cool way of isolating the things that corrupt our society....the intellectual hubris of the chattering classes, the drone-like mono-thought of the enforcement agencies....and the danger that a thinking, feeling, acting person represents to such an order.

May we all be like Tris and Four.

Michael Nystrom's picture

Ok, I'll check it out.

That part about breaking society up based on traits reminded me of Brave New World, but it has been a long time since I read that.

I did enjoy the Hunger Games, both the books and the movies.

Thanks for the perspective.

He's the man.

Saw it.

Anyone who doesn't believe in corporate murder or thinks for themselves is now considered an enemy. I keep feeling like it's not normal to be normal anymore. It's now cool to shirk responsibility on all levels especially because you can cry "lawsuit" or "racism" to make your way in the world. It always seems to come back to GOV vs GOD. Sorry for the rant. I hope most people have some Divergence in them.