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Does Cliven Bundy Have Something Called “Prescriptive Rights” (Ben Swann)

By Ben Swann.

In this ongoing story surrounding cattle rancher Cliven Bundy, there are a series of questions media has ignored. For instance, in the 20 years Bundy hasn’t been paying his fees, why hasn’t he been taken to court? Why this year, spend nearly $1,000,000 of taxpayer money to round up 400 cattle that ultimately have to be returned? Why didn’t the BLM just place a lien on the cattle rather than attempting to take them by force and then auction them off? The Bureau of Land Management has suffered a huge black eye this week because of their response to the Bundy situation. Perhaps though, there is a reason the BLM chose force over the courts.

Among the questions Devlin asked of the BLM, “Is it possible that this guy (Cliven Bundy) has prescriptive rights?” The response from top officials at the BLM, “We are worried that he might and he might use that defense.”

So what exactly are prescriptive rights? Prescriptive right to property is an easement that gives some one the right to use land owned by someone else for a particular purpose. An example is using a path through Party A’s land to get to your land, a prescriptive easement is allowed which gives the user the right to get to his land through A’s property.

In most states, if a trespass or use of land occurs regularly for at least 5 years without the “owner” of the land taking legal action, prescriptive rights come into play. Because Bundy stopped paying his grazing fees to the BLM in 1993 but continued to use the land for over 20 years, it is possible he now has prescriptive rights to the land. That might explain why the BLM has not taken this issue to court and never bothered to file a lien against the cattle.

Read more: http://benswann.com/exclusive-does-cliven-bundy-have-somethi...

I have sifted through and found the actual nevada laws..

NRS 11.070 No cause of action effectual unless party or predecessor seized or possessed within 5 years. No cause of action or defense to an action, founded upon the title to real property, or to rents or to services out of the same, shall be effectual, unless it appears that the person prosecuting the action or making the defense, or under whose title the action is prosecuted or the defense is made, or the ancestor, predecessor, or grantor of such person, was seized or possessed of the premises in question within 5 years before the committing of the act in respect to which said action is prosecuted or defense made.

[1911 CPA § 10; RL § 4952; NCL § 8509]

NRS 11.080 Seisin within 5 years; when necessary in action for real property. No action for the recovery of real property, or for the recovery of the possession thereof other than mining claims, shall be maintained, unless it appears that the plaintiff, his ancestor, predecessor, or grantor was seized or possessed of the premises in question, within 5 years before the commencement thereof.

[1911 CPA § 11; RL § 4953; NCL § 8510]

http://leg.state.nv.us/NRS/NRS-011.html#NRS011Sec070



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meekandmild's picture

The Bundy Family has been on the land since the 1870s

They made improvements, they have used the land for useful purposes, Should they not have squatters rights?

Judge Napolitano

was talking about this, the Bundys should take it to State Court. The BLM filed suit in federal court. Interesting.

adverse possession

its sounds like adverse possession somehow ..

The Possibilities are Endless

...IF Justice is exercised and administered.
American Frontier Justice.

something all the world longs for, and admires.

GOOD SUGGESTION!

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

LittleWing's picture

Thanks Repo

Could you please help with this?
http://www.dailypaul.com/316767/an-american-original-wayne-h...

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

Thank You Ben Swann

...I have been "heralding" this "defense" for a few days now.
And yes, it's obvious that you read the DP.
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/3384795
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/3384782
http://www.dailypaul.com/comment/3384771

CLAIMING A RIGHT OF WAY BY PRESCRIPTION:

"How are prescriptive rights acquired?
There are 3 ways in which prescriptive rights can be acquired- under the Prescription Act 1832, common law or the doctrine of lost modern grant. The latter is the most commonly used, as once the 20 year period is established, the prescriptive right is acquired and cannot be lost even if the use is stopped or prevented. Under the 1832 Act, the 20 year period must be immediately before any court action or application to the Land Registry is made to crystallise the easement."

http://www.shoosmiths.co.uk/client-resources/legal-updates/C...

Bundy has been fighting "them" for 20 years...his family has been "continuously" on the property since 1832.
HIS Rights pre-date any "claim" made by any federal agency.

To Mike Nystrom: NOW you know: "Who's Online and Why"

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

LittleWing's picture

The use of 'Premises' vs. 'Property'

Repo, thanks for the post! I have some interesting information for review regarding the use of the word 'Premises.' Please review the following and read then the full article:

Our Land - Collateral for the National Debt by Derry Brownfield 2007

"In terms of the NAIS, a premise is any geographically unique location in which agricultural animals are raised, held, or boarded. Under this definition, farms, ranches, feed-yards, auction barns and livestock exhibitions and fair sites are all examples of premises.” That may be the definition some government bureaucrat will give you, but the word “premises” under the “international Criminal Court Act 2002- Sect 4, states: The word “premises” includes a place and a “conveyance.”

Throughout the entire Draft National Animal Identification System -NAIS Users Guide, land is referred to as a premises and not property. A “Premises” has no protection under the Constitution of the United States, while property always has the exclusive rights of the owner tied to it. Property rights are protected by the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments of the Constitution.

The word “Premise” is a synonym for the word tenement. A definition of the word tenement in law is: Property, such as land, held by one person “leasing” it to another. Webster’s New World Dictionary 1960 College Edition defines “Premises” as the part of a deed or “lease” that states its reason, the parties involved and the property in “conveyance.” Webster then defines “conveyance” as the transfer of ownership of real property from one person to another. It is quite obvious that the bureaucrats in Washington had a very good reason to use the term “premises” and never mention “PROPERTY.”

"I am convinced that the word “premise” will put an encumbrance on your deed. The bankers say they want to monetize land. It’s your land and my land they want to monetize."

The bankers are in the process of accumulating the wealth of the world. Very few privately owned assets can be termed “real wealth.” According to scripture, God made Abraham very wealthy, giving him LAND, CATTLE, silver and gold. (Genesis 24:35) Four thousand years later, wealth continues to be LAND, CATTLE, silver and gold. I don’t know where the world deposits of gold are stored, but I’m sure the bankers have them in their control. That only leaves LAND and CATTLE which I believe could be next on the list."

see: Our Land - Collateral for the National Debt by Derry Brownfield 2007
http://www.newswithviews.com/brownfield/brownfield59.htm

I had just included as UPDATE to my post here: Government's Shocking Interference in Rancher's Life -The Wayne Hage Story *UPDATED* Please also review this for a wealth of interesting info!
http://www.dailypaul.com/316686/governments-shocking-interfe...

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

(((LittleWing))) Do You Rent? ..or Own?

....although you mention the NAIS and the:
"INTERNATIONAL Criminal Court Act 2002- Sect 4", I question this:

This is a US State Case, not international nor subject to "international laws" , it's out of that jurisdiction.

The word "premises" is used in almost ALL leasing & rental agreements between landlords and tenants.
Common language to describe "a place" or "an address".

I may be wrong, but aren't you stretching the definition a bit?
Let me know what you think as far as this "international law thingy" being out of jurisdiction...thanks!

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

LittleWing's picture

Danton, to clarify..

The excerpt is taken from the Derry Brownfield article. Perhaps I am taking it out of context for it's pertinence to the BLM land grabs, I'm not entirely sure but think it is worth noting!

The article is stating "Title to the lands will go to the World Wilderness Land Inventory Trust.' This Trust will float into the World Conservation Bank. This bank would refinance by swapping debt for assets." ( like U.S. Debt to China?)

"The United Nations World Commission on Environment and Development was created in 1982. The commission published the “BRUNDTLAND REPORT” setting the stage for unlimited enactments to take over ecology, and environmental and pollution laws throughout the world." ( in Bundy's instance, endangered turtles as front cover for land grab)

" Why check with the International Criminal Court Act? Because on June 8, 2007 under Secy. of Ag. Bruce Knight, speaking at the World Pork Expo in Des Moines, is quoted as saying, “We have to live by the same international rules we’re expecting other people to do.”

http://www.newswithviews.com/brownfield/brownfield59.htm

The US. Dept of Agriculture along with Conservation groups such as World Wilderness Congress work together to funnel land assets to the World Bank.
"World Bank, the International Monetary fund and how the world bankers planned on collateralizing the world debt with land. Not just the U.S. national debt, but the “WORLD” debt"

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

International "Rules" Be Damned

..and for the Sec'y of Agriculture to state:
" “We have to live by the same international rules we’re expecting other people to do.”???

"Rules" are not "Laws"
And unless there is a pertinent treaty, that has been "properly ratified" by Congress, said rules are non-existent.
The Constitution......THAT is the law.
People are starting to realize this...and the rascals are scurrying around attempting to poison the MSM and public perception.

And so,to you, and to Mike Nystrom..."Who is Online and Why" is answered, and I thank all who have kept this in the forefront of discussion and communication.

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

P.S. That Update on the Derry Brownfield Article

...IS relevant....and alarming.
HOWEVER:
Upon clicking the link to his website?
Nothing but JAPANESE...NON translated (yes I hit the translate button)

Check it out...weird?
http://www.derrybrownfield.com/

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

LittleWing's picture

Danton, Well that WAS strange!

I just tried yours and it is in Japanese then I tried the one in my comment and it is the actual article! hmm.. I'll try again

http://www.newswithviews.com/brownfield/brownfield59.htm

ok back to normal! weird huh?

Now, I know you are busy and doing a great job too but I really want you to read this next one in full when you get a moment. You will see why!

An American Original: Wayne Hage
http://www.klamathbasincrisis.org/Grazing/hageinterview1998.htm

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

In an Age of "Situational Ethics"

...there are still a few people with principles.

Principles are based upon "absolutes".
Moral Relativity is destroying the fabric of the society...and the latest twist in this Bundy scenario?

Rare Earth metals pledged to China...the "colonization of America", all accomplished without setting a foot on our soil.

Keep up the good work LittleWing, the eyes and ears of the nation are viewing the info we can share....yes the good guys...and the bad guys both read the DP.

DAILY PAUL: America's Think-Tank.

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

LittleWing's picture

Hey Danton, you were right!

Infowars just picked up the Hage story today and I bet they got it right here at Daily Paul! see: http://www.dailypaul.com/317092/federal-judge-blm-engaged-in...

At least it is getting this historic and timely Case out there for more people to see! yay! for the Daily Paul Think Tank and Detectives!
P.S. I sent the links to Carol Bundy this morning too!

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

LittleWing's picture

Believe me, I know

they watch DP! ( Shhhh..I've been here longer than it appears and know from experience ) The good and the bad guys are here watching! Speaking of the bad guys BTW BLM site is down for maintenance http://www.blm.gov/ How convenient. Probably cleaning up archives lol!

I have a motherlode of good info I am looking at now to sift through that is very, very interesting and immensely helpful regarding property rights, grazing, BLM, conservation groups ..it's overwhelming me!! You wanna see/help? Of course you do! Where should I put the links so you can review ..on your Property Rights post or here in this post by Repo, Tommy Paine post or my post-this one:
An American Original: Wayne Hage - NV Rancher Wins Case Against Feds!
http://www.dailypaul.com/316767/an-american-original-wayne-h...

? Aghhh! lol!

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

This Subject May Require an "Open Thread"

...remember?
...during every primary?...all the election events?

Man-oh-man..I am treadin' water just to keep up with all the info!

The Daily Paul is the Short-Wave Frequency in an otherwise commercial radio spectrum.
It is the "FM" that replaced "AM" of online forums.

73's to all you "hams" out there!
(that's special-secretive-code-talk, people)LOL!

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!

LittleWing's picture

Yes, I sure do remember!

I never did ham radio but I used the CB once when I (illegally) drove a semi thru Texas! My handle was 'FreeBird' lol!

I put a call out for help with the Bundy case info here:
DP Think Tank and Detectives- Bundy Case- Help Needed! scroll thru that comment and you will see it at the bottom 'the motherload link' I was telling you about:
http://www.dailypaul.com/316767/an-american-original-wayne-h...

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

A+ !!

Fantastic work! LittleWing, Repo, Ben Swann - Your efforts are priceless. Your time is so well spent. Well done! The more information that just keeps coming the more it will stay in the News, and the more people will hear and learn what is really going on. Thank you so much.

time is wasted in minutes not hours

LittleWing's picture

TY eslynn

The word 'premise' in the the Nevada Laws posted in Repo's OP jumped out at me after recently reading the 'Our Land - Collateral for the National Debt' article! Here and there, we all add bits and pieces of info and understanding. Together, we shine the light with our input for a larger view!

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

As long as

we keep electing 'attorneys' to office they will always twist the original words in laws, and evolve them into something with a more vague meaning. This way their 'brothers' in Law can use greater strategies to either prosecute the law and/or defend agaisnt the law, and who ever the greatest salesman to the jury wins the case. When the laws were cut and dried it was difficult to argue against. But, when the attorneys elected in Congress started evolving words like 'property' into 'premise', so they could evolve for their 'brothers' several means to argue each case.

Unless, a candidate has a track record of arguing law based on the principles of the Constitution, I will not vote for him. I didn't vote for Cruz, because I know he being a US Attorney, helped to evolve the laws to benefit the State, not the people. If the Constitution if followed it, except for a few Amendments, always benefits on the side of the American people, not the government or the corporations who are normally the greatest beneficiaries in the eventual end.

No Wonder We have so many attorneys in office. You just gave us

a good reason why we should not trust Cruz. Alex Jones seems to be a little on the fence with Cruz. I am surprised he isn't aware of his track record. All we have to do is look at how Obama with his law degree has taken advantage of executive orders, etc. Bill Clinton and Hillary were attorneys too who have also taken advantage of it. Good points, and like you said, we have to look at their track record to ensure that they support the Constitution.

A.Hansen

LittleWing's picture

Yes, and their 'brothers' include the Banksters

and the politicians and crony corporate minions!

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

LittleWing, you have put a lot of time and effort in providing

us more information on the Bundy situation. Thank you for educating us here at DP. I also would like to thank Repo too.

A.Hansen

LittleWing's picture

TY, there are many Daily Paul Detectives ! ;)

working a variety of 'cases' lol! Just want to say Stonewall Jackson is my detective partner on this case too! He found the Derry Brownfield articles and put them in my Government's Shocking Interference in Rancher's Life -The Wayne Hage Story *UPDATED* post!
http://www.dailypaul.com/316686/governments-shocking-interfe...

Thanks for the support and kind words. You know this all ties in with the NWO and Agenda 21!!!!

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

I recall when President George W Bush mentioned the NWO. It was

before I was awake but it sure stuck out in my mind when I heard it. Now as I look back on it, it is proof he has been a part of it along with all the others we know about.

A.Hansen

But this trickery will only work if they use it correct?

and judging by the past court documents they do not state he has violated their premise, but their property.

"arose out of Bundy’s unauthorized grazing of his livestock on property owned by the United States and administered by the Department of the Interior through the BLM and the National Park Service."

The repeatedly use the word trespass land.. but in the first page they did call it property directly in the court documents.

LittleWing's picture

I hope that is correct!

Trickery indeed! The Nevada Law you posted does use the word premises. Be on the look out for it in future litigation with this case! I sent the Brownfield articles to Ben Swann just now for his research/review. ;)

If Wars Can Be Started by Lies, They Can Be Stopped By Truth.

Cliven Bundy said he had received 5 certified letters the other

day. From the interview with Alex Jones I gathered it was from attorneys whom are wanting to represent him. He hadn't had time to open them yet. I don't recall the day he interviewed him, I think it was this past Monday.

A.Hansen

That's Good News

...and it will require the "wisdom of Solomon" to sort through those "helpers", who must be thoroughly vetted.

"Beyond the blackened skyline, beyond the smoky rain, dreams never turned to ashes up until.........
...Everything CHANGED !!