4 votes

Adam Kokesh slams Rand Paul and Business insider.

Calling it likes he sees it.


http://youtu.be/viMm9Q9xTJE

I agree with Adam, personally. What do you think?

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Vote the record, not the rhetoric.

A president sets the "tone". In order to do so, one must be elected first.

See my sig.

"What if the American people learn the truth" - Ron Paul

Good One!

This is the same as "We have to pass the bill to see what's in it".

We have to elect him to see what he TRUELY beleives in.

I'll pass.....

I'm done with Rand. Anyone

I'm done with Rand. Anyone who continues the stupid and cruel meme that the Palestinians are the problem, and Israel, the illegal occupier and Jewish only colonizer is our greatest "ally," is not for me.

Here come the Rand bots.

Son of Ron always gets a pass because after all he is just playing political football.

Just shows me again and again exactly how stupid people can be.

It don't matter what he does or says the fake libertarians want the son of Ron so desperately.

Wake up guys the elections are rigged and son of Ron is a lemming.

sovereign

...

I agree ~ It is time to wake up to the FACT that we have lost our last best hope. We now must resolve,in at least our own minds,that it is indeed 1775 The tea has been thrown over board and ( It is sad that I myself have such a unhealthy fear of my government that I can not complete this thought )

Life is a sexually transmitted disease with a 100% fatality rate.
Don't Give me Liberty, I'll get up and get it myself!

conalmc

I agree with you, but don't you know that any criticism of Rand Paul will not be tolerated here. It's okay though as long as we still have courageous men like Adam Kokesh and Ben Swann standing up.

You can't even up vote on this thread. LOL

Disagree

This is kind of shortsighted, naive and lacks all nuance. While I agree with the philosophy, it's not working and it's not practical.

I don't understand why we have to attack our own. Sorry Rand Paul isn't perfect but he is changing government and society for the better.

Check out http://ronpaulforums.com for activism and news.

I was really dissappointed with Adam on this one

Adam wants to move too fast, well I can understand if he feels we don't have much time, but this really gave me a more slightly negative view on Adam Kokesh, almost made me feel like he sold out. I am gonna be watching Adam more closely now, he burned some of my trust with this rant.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

Seems like people around here

Seems like people around here value truth far, far above life itself. I find this incredibly tragic. Truth without life is nothing. Life without truth is life. Some things are more important than life, but certainly telling truths 100% of the time even if it costs you everything isn't one of them.

Freedom in our lifetime! - fiol.us

Dear Adam

I can't get on board with you here.

Don't worry so much about Rand comes off and how he presents himself at the current time. Do YOU REALLY THINK that Rand's MAIN AUDIENCE is the puny libertarian movement at this time?

He HAS TO PLAY POLITICS! To get a slot on WWE Raw, you have TO PLAY PRETEND and act like the punches are real. That doesn't mean that the wrestlers actually mean what they say when in the ring, IT'S A SHOW; and we know it; but the masses think it's real.

So let him play politics and I THINK YOU WILL BE MORE THAN PLEASANTLY SURPRISED with the stuff Rand would do should he reach the office.

You know how politicians ALWAYS CHANGE THEIR TUNE AFTER they get elected? Like Obama (and all politicians) not living up to any of his campaign promises?

Well.... I believe THE OPPOSITE WILL HAPPEN with Rand. What he does when he reaches office WILL BE UNHEARD OF. The things he will do will not be on his campaign promise list, because he would not get elected by the sheeple if they were!

The problem with your

The problem with your argument is that people like Rand have the opportunity to change the thinking of Americans, by telling the truth about matters such as Palestine vs. Israel. When Rand lies about it, or distorts the issues, it just strengthens the old societal meme that has led to such bad foreign policy. This is not the time for craven leaders who are afraid to tell the truth.

He won't be ANY KIND of leader

If he doesn't first get elected. Ron Paul had NO CHANCE of getting elected and he knew it. He was just out to educate, and he did that well. Now for round 2.

This time, we don't just want "a Ron Paul clone" that will ALSO HAVE ZERO CHANCE OF GETTING ELECTED!

This time we want Rand to do what he has to do to get the seat in the office THEN... he can start being genuine.

Sorry, but you have to make some sacrifices along the way for the end that we desire.

RIGHT NOW is not the time to judge Rand's actions. AFTER THE ELECTION is the time to criticize!

Just help us get him in there!

Who else are you gonna pull for?

NO THIRD PARTY CANDIDATE STANDS A CHANCE! That is just the reality of it. We could "stick to our principles 100% of the time" and vote only on a libertarian candidate.... BUT THAT IS SHOOTING YOURSELF IN THE FOOT with an absolutist philosophy, it handicaps us if we are not flexible in extreme circumstances.

The RARE CHANCE that we have a candidate that STANDS A CHANCE is an extreme circumstance.

I try and look at it like this

We know what kind of person Ron Paul is, and knowing that we have to consider multiple things, first: we know that Rand is his own person, but, we also have to consider to ourselves what kind of person did Ron Paul raise? He obviously raised him in his way of thinking. Also, Rand has been there for every election is father went through, and having to see how the establishment treated him, how they called him a racist, A Jew hater, and a crazy old man. Now put yourself in his shoes, would you blow all that stuff off and just run how you want to run and support similar positions that those same people that attacked your dad supported? Now, I don't pretend to know what Rand is thinking, and I hesitate to say that he is just playing along until he becomes president, but I would say that he does love liberty as much as his father does, and cause look how much of an impact Ron Paul has had on all us, and we aren't his flesh and blood.

Kokesh really sounds ridiculous here

How can someone as smart as Kokesh be that against Rand? Who else is fighting for liberty in the senate and has even an outside chance at becoming president. Yes, you can be naive and claim to be a pure anarchist and say that you're going to simple withdraw from the system, not participate, etc. However, if you open your eyes for more than a minute you'll realize that simply isn't possible anymore. Where can you go that the state will not follow? You could confine yourself to a cave in the middle of nowhere and there's still a good chance they'd try to monitor you somehow. Don't pay your taxes? End up in prison. Don't get the right permit? End up in prison. If you're going to attempt to have some semblance of a normal life you can't just ignore everything. That means it's going to take some people playing the game. Rand can't openly call himself a libertarian on Hannity because that's still considered a dirty word for the majority of republicans. If you walk, talk, and act like a libertarian, who really cares how you label yourself? I guess we'd be better off to just roll over and let Jeb Bush or Hillary Clinton run the country for the next 8 years.

The idea's time has come.

Kokesh

knows the system yet he he thinks he can win an election. Ha! I respect Kokesh but some times he makes me wonder. He should clearly know Rand is playing the game. And he should clearly know a guy like him has no shot to ever be President.

SteveMT's picture

Kokesh: I support Rand Paul, but he is not a libertarian.(video)

Further details are warranted relative to the video above.
----------------------------------------------------------
Libertarians need to get over Rand Paul 4-21-14

http://youtu.be/2zNA1YSMrug

Rand Gives "Economics In One Lesson" To All His Interns

He is indeed a follower of Austrian economic thought. One vote for Iran sanctions does not negate as much.

Also, Rand made clear his position to eliminate all foreign aid. He couldn't get anywhere with it, so he's doing everything he can to reduce it (oh the horror).

The entire rant on the word "tangible" speaks more poorly of Adam than it does of Rand.

To call Rand an "arrogant central planner" is a stretch (don't you think?), as is the claim that he "doesn't understand freedom."

Adam recently had a debate with Stefan Molyneux on civil disobedience. In that debate, Adam said that minarchists are not libertarians.

On his show, Tom Woods recently asked Ron whether he is an anarcho-capitalist. Dr. Paul said he is more amenable to that position than he was 30 years ago but at present, no, he is still a minarchist. Adam may wish Ron Paul were an anarcho-capitalist, but unless he was lying to Tom Woods he is not one.

So Adam, are you prepared to acknowledge that by your standard Ron Paul is not a libertarian? And regardless, given that Ron is a minarchist, mustn't a good deal of what you just said of Rand apply to Ron as well?

___________________________________________________________________________
"Bipartisan: both parties acting in concert to put both of their hands in your pocket."-Rothbard

You may have a point or two

You may have a point or two there, but assuming what Adam said came out of Rand's mouth, we can stop calling Rand a libertarian. Rand has called himself a conservative, and rejected the libertarian label. So if Rand got in the white house, we still can't say there is a libertarian president.

from an Anarchist's point of view

Rand is kind of a central planner. Government I'd say is a pretty centralized control mechanism. And if you participate in that, then you are complicit. So in that same way Ron is complicit as well. Before anyone starts getting all mad, just hear me out.

There is certainly some hypocrisy going on as many of the people bashing Rand were supporters of his dad. I am guilty. But You gotta understand that a lot of people Got into (L)ibertarianism through Ron Paul and then through further research and adherence to NAP, reached Anarchism. We supported Ron (and I still do, especially since he is out), but many DPers and Ron supporters have changed since 2008-2012. In fact, its because the experience with Ron and his campaigns that we've been able to more easily make the extra steps from Minarchism to Anarchism. Ironic as it, if I had known what I do now back in 2008, I probably would not have supported Ron. At least not in the sense of voting and sending money. I'd have respect for him and admire his good traits of course. Just as I do Rand. I don't support Rand and definitely don't like some of his decisions. But I still respect him and admire his many good traits. But I am done with the system and many others are as well. Especially the younger generations.

I Am An Anarchist Too (Thank You Larken Rose)

And I certainly take your points, and have had a journey similar to yours.

But why must Adam insist on pretending that Ron and Rand are miles apart? It undermines his credibility. Ron uses the word "volunatrism" in a sentence five years ago and Adam feels fit to blind himself to the reality that, like Rand, Ron also believes in "the most dangerous superstition."

___________________________________________________________________________
"Bipartisan: both parties acting in concert to put both of their hands in your pocket."-Rothbard

i don't share Adam's exact view.

They obviously have commonality as any father and son would have and also in some areas politically and philosophically. But I don't think anyone will disagree that Rand doesn't quite do it for them like his father. For many, not all, but for many it was Ron's defiance of the GOP and establishment which partly attracted us to him. If its a "game" Rand is playing with the GOP or not, no longer matters to me personally. I don't think he is going to get the results he thinks he is going to get. Rand sucking up to the GOP for whatever reason makes hium un-trust worthy for me. And its not because he isn't an honest man, he obviously is a good guy. But the GOP can never be trusted quite frankly and they are probably aiming to use Rand, just like they probably used Reagan or any other Libertarian leaning president.

To be fair to Adam, Ron has used the word voluntary quite a bit in some books if I am not mistaken.

Adam threw Ron under the bus

Adam threw Ron under the bus in 2012, sadly:

"I am not a Ron Paul supporter anymore," -Adam Kokesh

Adam threw himself under the bus several times.

While I started off being a fan of Adam Kokesh when he first ran for congress, he quickly degenerated into an attention-seeking buffoon. He lost me a while before the 2012 election, and I haven't looked back. Then again, I've never been an anarchist.

“My attitude toward progress has passed from antagonism to boredom. I have long ceased to argue with people who prefer Thursday to Wednesday because it is Thursday.” - G.K. Chesterton

Forgot about this guy

Bet he's scurred to debate Jan the H-Bomb Helfeld.

yeah Adam

looks real scared, smiling and giggling all the time....lol

I like Jan, but an interview between them would be nothing more then 2 people trying to talk over each other most likely.

Jan doesn't budge on Minarchism and Adam doesn't budge on Anarchism. What do you think is going to happen. lol

As long as the format was organized and enforced

in a competent way, it would become clear quickly that Adam's only out would be to refuse to engage in order to avoid contradictions. He would have to avoid answering honestly, resort to violating the rules of the format, or committing argumentative fallacies.

You are scared to answer my question about land property...

You don't see me putting your business out there.

Séamusín