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My gosh, it's time to believe, this is scary, for Christians, or all believers. A must for nonbelievers too

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Just a correction. Henry VIII

Just a correction. Henry VIII actually wanted to subvert the Truth as to Christ's directive on marriage. Marriage is a covenant which is for a lifetime as in no divorce. Henry wanted a male offspring not a barren wife. The Pope refused to grant him a divorce. Henry proceeded to declare himself the head of a new church, the Church of England and he, it's new "pope". He granted himself a divorce, and went on a rage hunting down priests loyal to Rome and Catholics who refused to submit to his religious tyranny. Most of the Catholic bishops of England folded like a house of cards trying to save their skin. St . John Fisher was one bishop who would not capitulate to this madman and was exiled to London Tower until beheaded. Henry eventually had 6 wives: 2 died, 2 beheaded, 2 survived. Hence. that "glorious" reformation from Rome was based on pride, lust and blood. Google who founded the Catholic Church. This is the only explanation of how the Church could have survived for over 2,000 years!

Babs

I googled it. It seems like a

I googled it. It seems like a long study with a lot of possibilities, can you give me the short version? Seriously, I am not being glib, was there a definite start?

Can someone summarize the point of this?

The video is kind of long and the subject matter rather arcane.

What is the big deal? Curious ..

Before you write this off as another "religious" thread...

This has profound historical significance. It is undeniable the the Roman empire under the Caesars ruled the world for hundreds of years as did the Holy Roman Empire under the Popes for a millennium. This Roman one world government and religion was derailed as a result of the Protestant Reformation. The book on the OLD world order looked like it was closed forever. You may be thinking we will never again go back to those times ... Think AGAIN!

One of the self described objectives of the new world order is the formation of a one world religion (didn't we just shut that down?). The ghost of ROME is back with a vengeance! But this time instead of coercion by military conquest it is by subversion and infiltration. By slick propaganda and sleight of hand tricks. Make no mistake this attempt to unify Christianity under the Pope is a diabolical scheme to usher us back into dark ages - high tech style.

It can't be...can it?

Soli

you are dead on, this is getting downvoted like crazy, which makes me realize the falling away is happening as we speak or type or whatever. This is getting downvoted because religion no longer holds any lifestyle advantages. The political realm brought me back to the spiritual side of all of this because it fits like a glove. It's a shame that some on here aren't willing to dig deeper, or are they afraid that they may have to change to make it to the other side? Being a Christian is hard, it gets harder everyday. I pray the down voters will dig deeper, because this is not all about politics, in fact it isn't at all about politics. When you get to that point and that state of mind, it gets a little tougher. Glad you are here with me on this one, may God hold you and keep you strong. God bless.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

The Protestant Reformation...

...Was all about Henry VIII not wanting to have to take orders from the Pope in Rome anymore, and having the muscle to back it up...

Protestantism kept Sunday worship. They kept the ties to the Jewish roots separated, as the Roman church made it so. They kept the pagan rituals hidden within Holidays.

Why don't Protestants and other Christians (besides Messianic Jews) celebrate the Passover (last supper), or Hannuka (Feast of Dedications) as Yeshua himself did?

Why don't they keep the Sabbath Holy, as G-d commands, which is and has always been Friday night to Saturday.

Jesus/Yeshua said he came not to change one yot or tittle of the Law (Torah) but to fulfill it.

Why do Christians not study the Torah/Old Testament in it's original form, as Yeshua himself did?

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

they all stand lawmanjed

the ordinances are valid still today, but current lifestyle has done away with that. I know Christians who keep all that you stated above, most don't keep them because they aren't taught. The Biblical Sabbath is Saturday, you can find proof that the Catholic Church changed it, as Daniel stated would happen, as he stated they would think to change time and law. We do follow the Gregorian calendar which is a Catholic made calendar. Compare the original Ten Commandments with the Catholic Ten Commandments, you will find them to be quite different. God bless.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

Not Exactly

Henry VIII was part of the reformation but not the main issue. If you want to boil it down to one thing it was really TYRANNY vs. THE TRUTH. The papacy was a tyranny and Luther stood up against it. Is the Bible for the common man or should it be controlled by the religious elite? Once the power of the tyrannical papacy was weakened, it opened the door for freedom of worship, the enlightenment and so on...

Not sure what you mean about Sunday vs Saturday worship - aren't the Adventists protestant? In fact they seem to be the fiercest in their opposition to ROME.

Reformation: Freedom from Tyranny!

It can't be...can it?

You're right...

The Monarchy was not all it was about, and it was good to break off from the Roman hierarchy.

I agree with your points. Though I don't agree with Luther's 'replacement theology'.

No doubt it was step in the right direction, though.

The point I was trying to make is that it is not complete. Sunday worship is pagan Sun worship. The Sabbath that G-d commanded (10 Commandments) His followers to observe is Friday Night - Saturday sundown. Never in the Old or New Testaments does that change. The early church and the Messianics for hundreds of years after Jesus's death and resurrection all kept the Friday-Saturday Sabbath, as G-d commanded, and that did not change until the Roman Church proclaimed themselves above Scripture itself.
The Protestant Reformation moved away from that Roman based hierarchy but kept the blasphemous changes and omission made by that Roman hierarchy, and did not correct those changes. The Roman Church literally switched around the scriptures, putting Chronicles before Malachi.
King James Bible (which I tend to like better than many other versions) did not fix that.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Therefore do not let anyone condemn you in matters of food and

drink or of observing festivals, new moons, or sabbaths. These are only a shadow of what is to come, but the substance belongs to Christ.
Colossians 2:16,17

if you read this Bible

verse carefully, it is actually saying to true Christians, don't let anyone pervert your ways with the traditions they are following that come from man, not from God. This statement can be read two ways, and the Sabbath was never to be changed, it says remember the Sabbath and to keep it holy in the Ten Commandments. This is not a verse saying you can disallow the Sabbath, drink or eat what you like, etc., etc.. That is if I get what you are trying to say by this comment.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

Well ...

... I'm an atheist, so I really don't care how many religions there are.

But if the claim is that the NWO gangsters want to have both one world government and one world religion, then duh! Of course, they do.

Government and religion have been the two tools of control for thousands of years. You didn't think a bunch of psychopathic control freaks would forget about one of the major tools of control, did ya?

you cannot control people without religion

and if all religion unites, you get the Antichrist, because it cannot be based on the Word, Bible doctrine itself cannot unite with all religions, and then bada boom, you have the Antichrist.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

The Truth was co-opted...

Yes, religion has been used as a tool for control for thousands of years.

But G-d is real, and is the Spirit of the Messiah.

His philosophy, His Way, and His Truth are all real.

Roman Empire was the enemy of Christ. How did they end up being the center of the Messianic movement, over 300 years after His death and Ressurection? Well, they co-opted it, of course, and changed it around and omitted just a few key points and pieces that it was a good control mechanism.

The Truth is still the Truth, though, even today.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

Everyone has the right to practise whichever

Voodoo one wishes. I considered myself agnostic before I watched this and I still consider myself agnostic after watching this.

It is because of the Reformation that you have freedom...

When the Popes reigned supreme you would have been tortured and burned at the stake as a heretic for being "agnostic". Up until Vatican II in the 60's ROME said it was forbidden to read the Bible! It is through mass publication of the Bible that the dark ages were unlocked and we enjoy the freedom to whatever faith we choose. The Reformation moved the power from the "centralized" rulers and gave it to the common man.

Centralized and unchecked power in the church, the state, finance and business will be the tools of our destruction.

It can't be...can it?

The Renaissance ...

... the Age of Reason and the Enlightenment are the reasons that western societies are relatively free. It has nothing to do with religion.

Without the John Lockes and Thomas Jeffersons (and Thomas Paines) of the western world, the Judeo-Christian world be the same today as the Islamic world.

The Islamic world does not have any history of secular free thought, which is why they are still stuck in mysticism.

Forbidden to read the Bible? Seriously? Absolutely not!

I attended a private Catholic school both pre and post Vatican II and we read the Bible in religion class every day. The nun even asked us what our favorite passages were.

In fact, when I was a little child, my mother used to read to me the children's version of Old Testament Bible stories at bedtime. She would also tell me some of stories in the New Testament.

Too often people let their prejudices get in the way of actual facts concerning both Roman Catholicism and Judaism. I can certainly sympathize with Lawmanjed! Both religions are filled with love, beauty, and very deep, mystical, spirituality that is lacking in Protestantism.

“It is the food which you furnish to your mind that determines the whole character of your life.”
―Emmet Fox

History disagrees...

For centuries the laity (regular people)were required to get a license from the church to read the bible and even that was primarily the Latin Vulgate. (Even the current authorized Douay-Rheims version is a translation of the Latin Vulgate and not the original texts) Those who translated the Bible WITHOUT Papal approval into the vernacular (native language e.g. English) were burned at the stake. See William Tyndale and many others. Because of overwhelming pressure as a result of the Reformation the laity was finally allowed to read and posses a bible in their own language. This was in practice allowed in the 19th century but was not canonized until Vatican II.

Canon 14. We prohibit also that the laity should not be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books."- The Church Council of Toulouse 1229 AD Source: Heresy and Authority in Medieval Europe,Scolar Press, London, England copyright 1980 by Edward Peters,ISBN 0-85967-621-8, pp. 194-195

The Council of Tarragona of 1234, in its second canon, ruled that:

"No one may possess the books of the Old and New Testaments, and if anyone possesses them he must turn them over to the local bishop within eight days, so that they may be burned..."- The Church Council of Tarragona 1234 AD; 2nd Cannon - Source : D. Lortsch, Historie de la Bible en France, 1910, p.14.

"Opened on Thursday alongside the Inquisition archives was the infamous Index of Forbidden Books, which Roman Catholics were forbidden to read or possess on pain of excommunication. They showed that even "the Bible" was once on the blacklist. Translations of the holy book ended up on the bonfires along with other ``heretical'' works...The Index of Forbidden Books and all excommunications relating to it were officially abolished in 1966. The Inquisition itself was established by Pope Gregory IX in 1233...."-Vatican archives reveal Bible was once banned book By Jude Webber ROME, Jan 22, 1998 (Reuters)

I was raised a Roman Catholic too and on the rare occasions that we read the bible at home it was the "protestant" version. I'm sorry I don't see any love or beauty or deep spirituality in the inquisition, the crusades and the volumes of excommunications handed out to those who disagreed with the Popes.

It can't be...can it?

I do remember hearing that there was a time

when Catholics were told not to try to read the Bible by themselves, since errors in understanding would be made. (Judging by some of the comments made on DP about what is Biblically correct, I can understand the Church's concern about that.) You made a claim that we were forbidden to read it until after Vatican II. That's what I was disputing. You made a blanket statement to the effect that Catholics didn't know what was in the Bible and I objected, since anyone who wanted to know, did know, without condemnation from the Church. Even during the readings in Latin at Mass, there was the English translation right next to it.

Catholics had the Douay-Rheims Bible and we always had that in our home long before Vatican II, complete with the seal required to show that it was "approved" by the Church. You are correct about changes having been made to the current Douay-Rheims Bible. I remember the one that had Jesus telling the apostles that John was the reincarnation of Elijah. When I was much older and revisions had been made, I noticed the word "reincarnation" was quickly removed. Entire passages had been changed.

I'll go along with you in that the Church did not teach Bible studies to the laity at the parish level, until after Vatican II when so many people were leaving the Church to take Bible studies elsewhere. Having attended a private Catholic school (not a parish school), we were taught the Bible. It was a requirement for us.

“It is the food which you furnish to your mind that determines the whole character of your life.”
―Emmet Fox

Twelve years of Catholic

Twelve years of Catholic school here, in the 60's, don't remember being forbidden to read the Bible. There was even a Bible in our house (we did not read it) and my parents were very observant Catholics. The Bible was read at Mass and there was probably one in every classroom. We did not read it, we studied Baltimore Catechism. Sometimes I think the Catholic Church is not as impressed with the Bible because institutional memory in the church knows it is responsible for much of the Bible.

Twelve years of Government School

Twelve years of Government school here, in the 60's, don't remember being forbidden to read the Constitution. There was even a Constitution in our house (we did not read it) and my parents were very observant Citizens. The Constitution was read in congress and there was probably one in every classroom. We did not read it, we studied Civics. Sometimes I think the Government is not as impressed with the Constitution because institutional memory in the government knows it is responsible for much of the Constitution.

My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee...
- God (Hosea 4:6)

It can't be...can it?

Very good point. We Americans

Very good point. We Americans live in a nation that, though imperfect, developed into the freest and most prosperous, ie. the most blessed nation in the history of the world, yet sadly most of us are functionally illiterate when it comes to understanding our basic founding documents: the Declaration of Independence with its spirit of dependence on God and independence from man's rule, and the Constitution, with its spirit and structure of limited government based on individual sovereignty and guaranty of those individual rights from the encroachment of an ever-present and overbearing government.

PEOPLE OPPOSING TYRANNY - Real Grass Roots!
Are you a POT or a PET - Person Embracing Tyranny?

See Walters " Total Onslaught " series...

105 one hour lectures that exhausts the anthology of who, what and why we are where we are in history. Using PRIMARILY their OWN WORDS and WRITINGS, Walter systematically exposes the NWO to its core. If you are skeptical now, you won't be after taking the time to watch this series.

Like I said, he uses the enemies own words and writings to expose who's behind the curtain of the NWO. I took the time, it was a several week long peroid of one lecture every evening, had friends over, made popcorn and drank root beer. We all came out of this time very impressed and shocked.

Stēkō

Drew, by the very grace of GOD through the blood of Christ Jesus.
"there shall come after us men whom shall garner great wealth using our system, and having done so shall seek to slam the door of prosperity behind them." George Washington

yep if you are an atheist before you watch this series

you won't be one afterwards. This guy backs it all with facts. I agree Steadfast.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

Background: What is the Reformation?

To understand this topic clearly we need to understand what happened during the reformation and what the "protest" was about. Here is a short and by no means complete video to whet your appetite. It is worth noting that before the Reformation the world was ruled by a "one world government and a one world religion" that resided in ROME.

http://youtu.be/EFqWnEpZvjs

ref·or·ma·tion
ˌrefərˈmāSHən/
noun
noun: the Reformation

1.
the action or process of reforming an institution or practice.
"the reformation of the Senate"
2.
a 16th-century movement for the reform of abuses in the Roman Catholic Church ending in the establishment of the Reformed and Protestant Churches.

It can't be...can it?

This thread is misclassified.

This thread is misclassified. It should be under Religion.

The Orthodox way

The Orthodox Church is the true Catholic and Apostolic Church, It will never sell out, absolutely never. I recommend to those who are fleeing their church to come and see what Orthodoxy is about. Just go one Sunday to an Orthodox church of your choice and hear the message, see and feel the surroundings, I guarantee you will feel the ancient faith. That's what I did and I've never looked back! Also, priests can be married and I have to tell you they are some of the most educated people I have ever met.

http://youtu.be/Y4xL0cDKWUs

The Catholic Church

readily admits changing God's Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday, hence changing the Ten Commandments. Sunday is the first day of the week, you can even look at most calendars to see that.

Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must. like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it.-Thomas Paine

The R3volution requires action, not observation!!!!

One sabbath he was going through the grainfields; and as they

made their way his disciples began to pluck heads of grain. 24 The Pharisees said to him, “Look, why are they doing what is not lawful on the sabbath?” 25 And he said to them, “Have you never read what David did when he and his companions were hungry and in need of food? 26 He entered the house of God, when Abiathar was high priest, and ate the bread of the Presence, which it is not lawful for any but the priests to eat, and he gave some to his companions.” 27 Then he said to them, “The sabbath was made for humankind, and not humankind for the sabbath; 28 so the Son of Man is lord even of the sabbath.”
Mark 2:23-28