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If you think RP should run third party... then you are obviously not listening to what the man has to say. He was elected 10 times as a republican congressman, and he wants to the GOP to return to its roots.

Instead of saying... Ohh, if he does bad, he should run with this party or that party...

Myself, I'm a competitive person, and I don't like LOSING, but instead of spending your time in here arguing with one another, you should be on someones doorstep talking to people who know nothing about Ron Paul. I'm not even a Precinct Leader and I talk to almost everyone I know or meet, about Ron Paul. It's a simple process, I say.. hey, have you been keeping up with the presidential debates..

They say, yes.. no...

Well, if yes, you may or may not know about Dr. Ron Paul, and the first thing I tell them is, he wants no more Income taxes and IRS.

If No... lol I pretty much tell them his platform including the above statements.

It takes 45 seconds.. and I always end the little spat with.. Yeah, the guy is a real straight shooter, and if you want to hear him talk, don't turn on the news, you'll want to go to YouTube and type his name in. The guy makes perfect sense and he's what our country has needed for a really long time.

So far, I have between 15-20 people who are voting for Ron paul, not to mention the ripple effect. My roomate... who is typically a hardcore democrat has recruited his family, friends, and aquaintances just by having the little 45 second talk with people.

Ron Paul doesnt have a hard message to sell... but if hes on a third party ticket.. Its going to be incredibly hard to turn non-progressives to Ron Paul.

My grandmother, and my mom, both were going to vote for John McCain. Heres the thing, they don't even like the war, they are just straight line Republicans... Infact, I dont think they've ever voted democrat in their life. I tell them about Ron Paul, and they changed their minds instantly. Infact, my Mom has a Ron Paul Bumper Sticker (and she didnt even get it from me)

You guys are making this MUCH harder than it really is... In sales, if you have a product that is incredibly awesome, you don't have to sell the product, the product sells itself... Just like Ron Paul.. but if you take that product and put it in a packaging people aren't used to seeing... (i.e. Make Pepsi and sell it as Off-Brand Grocery Cola.... but tell people its still pepsi) You may get some people to buy it, but the majority of people are still going to get Pepsi, because it says Pepsi. (I'm contrasting him Moving from Republican to Libertarian parties)

So PLEASE... NO MORE THIRD PARTY TALKS.. because heres the deal with me... Even if he isnt the nominee... I'm still writing him in... and if he doesnt make the republican ticket... Lets stage a massive grassroots campaign for a write in... We have too much of an organized base to not think we are able to do something like that... We will have all summer long... We have to keep flooding the MSM with emails, calls, everything.. DONT GIVE UP HOPE... Our founding fathers are proud of us right now, but they'll be even prouder when Ron Paul is the next president of the united states.

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We need a platform.

This was in a comment below, and I agree 100%. What is a RP Republican? RP has a lot of positions. Does someone need to agree with all of them? Should someone even use RP's name without his endorsement? Either RP can put together a certification process, or we can rename it as something else.

The Republican party already has the infrastructure to get on ballots. They have a group of people willing to listen to their ideas. I think we can be more successful over the long term by influencing the GOP than going alone.

Consider the fact that RP is the only congressman or senator that votes no on all these bills. If we can get that vote to 10 people in the next 1-2 years, then that's a significant increase.

This is going to be a long battle. The constitution has been increasingly ignored since the day it was written. We're not going to repair all of that damage in one election cycle.

The president isn't really supposed to be a very powerful figure in American politics. If RP doesn't get elected president and we can create a platform from it that elects congressmen and senators, then we are no worse off.

If he doesn't get the nom, then I'd rather see RP get a Republican Senate seat than risk a failed third-party run. His influence would go up substantially at that point.

You 3rd party folks are living a pipe dream

#1 - Ballot Access

This is the biggest one of all. NO 3rd party has automatic ballot access in ALL 50 states and DC. The Libertarians and Constitution Party each have about 20-30 various states. I don't think any party has any other state locked up automatically. Everyone else, and for the rest of the non-automatic states, has to file PETITIONS with THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS of signatures to be allowed to appear on the ballot and usually they also have to pay a FEE. Signatures are NOT free. It takes hundreds and hundreds of petitioners to secure those signatures. And while we do have plenty of grassroots, what we don't have is unlimited time. MANY of those signatures are thrown out by the respective Sec of States. Some states require that a petitioner have voted in the previous election for someone NOT in a recognized party (think about it - if they weren't on the ballot - how could they vote for anyone BUT a Democrat or Republican) Some states require the signer have voted previously in that election, or even in multiple previous elections. Some states require multiple TENS of THOUSANDS of signatures. AND they restrict the manner and timeframe you have to get them. Even if Bloomberg ran for example, I doubt he would make it on the ballot in every state. Some of those deadlines are as early as May. (and you can't start till March or April) 3rd Parties can't make headway because they blow their wad every four years on ballot access alone. There has been a huge push to simply sit out the presidential race and concentrate on local elections and registration drives. This would get you local people elected to state legislatures to change the access laws currently in a stranglehold by the Dems and Reps. But they can't seem to do it.

#2 - MSM

If you think the MSM is ignoring Paul now, wait till he runs independent or 3rd party. ESPECIALLY if he runs Libertarian. What coverage they do give him will be a "See, we told you he wasn't Republican." And many supporters and would be voters will leave in DROVES. Most people have a correct perception that most Libertarians are nuts. I know - I am a Libertarian, and that's what people think. True, not all of us are crazy, but the VAST majority of Libs I have encountered are. Just look at our Presidential field for that party. Seriously, are they kidding or for real? Look, Paul will not get one mention by the MSM - already they bitch slapped Tucker Carlson. Did you see how pissed off he looked last night on Chris Matthews? If I were him, I would have gone off on about how Dr. Paul was spot on in the debate, and then told America what MSNBC was doing to me personally, and then quite right there on live television. Sure they would cut my mike - but not everyone's and shouting loud enough - people would have heard something. The MSM WILL NOT allow Dr. Paul to get ANY air time. PERIOD. We can't boycott everything on the planet to make them do it either. Oh but wait, we still have the 'debates' you say? Surely America will at least find out about us then?

#3 - The "Bi-Partisan" Debate Commission

The League of Women Voters USED to run the debates. That was before 1996. They were so disgruntled with what the 2 major parties tried to do to Perot in 1992 they washed their hands of the whole mess. The new group running it is ONLY for the two major parties to work out the format, times, dates, places, etc. It IS NOT INTENDED to be a FAIR or BALANCED commission to run the debates for everyone who wants to run - ONLY FOR THEIR PARTY NOMINEES. They don't have to let ANYONE else into the debates if they don't want to. They have also made the deal that they will not participate in any debate sponsored or organized by anyone else. They have set limits for possible 3rd party/Independent inclusions at 15% polling nationwide. The trick is - if that candidate isn't included in the polling by the MSM they can't get 15% now can they? Ron Paul as a Independent or 3rd Party WILL NOT BE IN THE DEBATES for the general election. It just won't happen. NOTE: Bloomberg may be their ticket to ending ALL 3rd party/Independent runs. If he runs and wins, and then shows his Neo-Con colors, it will turn Americans away from anyone but the Republocrats for good. The arguments about 'they are both the same' will seem to prove false by an independent also being the same. Then the next Neo-Con to win in 2012 will outlaw all dissent in repsonse to the shambles the country will be in. Independents will be blamed for the destruction of the economy and or another terrorist attack. Game over folks.

#4 - MONEY

It IS possible to still compete going up against the problems outlined above. But it takes MASSIVE amounts of money. I'm talking HUNDREDS of MILLIONS if not BILLIONS of dollars. (crazy about billions you say - then why is Bloomberg even considering spending up to 3-4 BILLION on his campaign if necessary - why would he even contemplate that much if he didn't think it might take that much?) Perot was willing to spend about 1 Billion, and he got close, but no cigar. After inflation, that's about 2 billion today easy, and with a much less acclimating media. I promise you this, if Bloomberg wasn't an elite insider - he wouldn't get the time of day form the MSM. Of course, even with all the money in the world - the MSM can still refuse to sell Paul air time. They will do this if they have to. Finally, we don't have the money to donate to him. Look at our current Q1 fundraising - it's a far cry from last quarter and Dr. Paul needs that money last week. We're down to about $100,000 a day and that is not enough. Especially now that we have to fight the MSM too in multiple states at once.


The best and most effective thing we can do is to go door-to-door and canvass every single person in America. We have to wake them up PERSONALLY. That's it folks. Nothing else will do it for us.

While some may think if we could get the money it would be worth making an independent/3rd party run, I say that money and effort will be better spent by taking over Congress and our State and Local government. We could pour millions into one race, or into hundreds of races.

Without the good Dr as the Republican nominee, a Neo-Con will serve in the White House till 2013. But no matter what - we need to begin to focus our attention on the House and Senate and our States. If we take back Congress and the States, we can neuter the White House at the least and Impeach at best.

Here's the surest plan to get Dr. Paul President if this nomination bid fails.

#1 - Take over Congress with a 2/3 majority. Take all 33/34 Senate seats up for grabs that aren't friendly to our cause.

#2 - When the time comes, elect Dr. Paul as Speaker of the House.

#3 - Impeach the new President AND Vice-President. (I'm sure they will give us plenty of charges just by following the Neo-Con agenda)

#4 - Work the rest of the Senate HARD to get our guys into a majority to convict and remove.

#5 - Dr. Paul, now Speaker of the House of Representatives, is sworn in as President by virtue of line of succession.

Worse case scenario - we wait until the 2010 mid term elections and take ANOTHER 33/34 seats in the Senate and BUILD our majority in the house. We'd bide our time for two more years, all the while stonewalling the Neo-Cons with the House of Representatives and 1/3 of the Senate.

Any takers?

I agree. Although I may be

I agree. Although I may be libertarian in principle, I'm sorry, the LP is going nowhere...which is exactly what would happen if RP went third party. The system is too biased and would only be a gesture (a rude one) to the establishment. It would be advertising for the libertarian/constitutionalist message, which is good, but that's all it would be--spreading the message for future elections.

Paul's already done the 3rd party thing

Ron Paul already did the third party thing back in 1988, and it got him nowhere. He, more than anyone, knows that it takes an entire party apparatus to get a candidate elected president.

Now, he's leading a revolution. A revolution to drag the misguided, waterlogged party back to sound, responsible conservative values.

He not only needs to do well on Super Tuesday, he needs to go all the way to convention in September!

In September, it will be up to him to bring the revolution to the floor and win over McCain's or Romney's delegates, as well as pick up Giuliani's and Huckabee's.

It can be done! But only if his supporters keep the pressure on the opposition.

Ah, but the media establishment will blackout Ron Paul after Tuesday, which is why equal pressure must be put on him to remain actively campaigning until September.

A revolution can happen. It can happen at the Convention. Its up to Ron to clean out the pig sty our party's become! I think he's the only one who can do it.

"Cowards & idiots can come along for the ride but they gotta sit in the back seat!"

Yah, I agree.

Third party is a dead issue, until we hear from Ron Paul otherwise.

We need a platform

To keep the movement going beyond 2008, we need a platform. That can be either officially rewriting a third party platform (Libertarian, Reform, or Constitution) to match Ron Paul's ideals, or it can be unofficially writing a party-within-a-party platform to define precisely what it means to be a "Ron Paul Republican".

In particular, I'm concerned that without a platform written down, the movement may drift from Ron Paul's ideals, such as his pro-life position. If Ron Paul does not get the Republican nomination, then without a written platform of one of the above two types, I may vote for the Constitution Party candidate, depending on who that candidate is and depending on how many write-ins Ron Paul is likely to get.

We have a Communist election system

The globalists belong to the Dem and GOP parties, so only those two parties have a chance of winning the election. Ron will NOT win under 3rd party.

You don't seem to get it

I postulated months ago that while Dr. Paul might not seek a third party run, the third party run might seek him. The seeds for that have been planted and both Kansas City in April and Denver in May will see what develops.

But a third party run is about keeping the message alive and loud after Labor Day and beyond. It's not about the third parties, at least not so much. Those are just vehicles for the message, albeit not as good of vehicles as the major parties.

Dr. Paul going into St. Paul's brokered convention with guaranteed two more months of advertising and support through the LP and CP nods in his pocket not only makes him a kingmaker, but impossible to ignore. It also sends a clear message to the GOP that they will lose EVERYTHING without the libertarian wing of the party. They can have a shot of winning with him, or most definitely lose without him, but either way he'll come out smelling like roses and continue on whether they like it or not.

"Welcome to 2008: The Year of Ron Paul!"

If you think the media ignores

If you think the media ignores him now, just let him go for a third party run. Perot had to buy his own television time, I believe. As a very last resort but we need to concentrate on not allowing McCaint and Mutt from imploding the Republican party from within.

Give us clear vision, that we may know where to stand and what to stand for - because unless we stand for something, we shall fall for anything.
~ Peter Marshall, US Senate Chaplain 1947

I'm in COMPLETE agreement

I'm in COMPLETE agreement with you. In fact, I made a similar, although less articulate, post yesterday or the day before. I'm disgusted to see talk of a third party run here at dailypaul. We should be keeping our eye on the ball and leave the third party talk to the Old Media.

while i DO agree wholeheartedly with you

We can ride the party affiliation train as long as possible- I personally would LOVE to see Ron Paul save the GOP from itself- its all about timing. If he dosnt secure the nomination the 3rd party is plan B and write- in is plan C. Many of us are so new to the process that we dont realise that 3rd party is even an option. Its healthy to have that knowledge out there lest those unaware of that simply switch candidates. As long as he is a Republican candidate he's at least SOMEONE to the media- even if its the #4 red-headed stepchild. If we REALLY want to see him ignored, a pre-mature 3rd party candidacy is our best bet to accomplish that. We need to milk the Republican debate exposure etc right up until he is not nominated - the LAST possible minute before pushing a 3rd party scenario. For now we fight like hell to save the Republican party- when we can do no more- then we look at 3rd party- but people need to know there IS a plan B


After reading so many stupid and sometimes offensive posts on this forum today especially on yesterday's debate, your post is an excellent piece.

India for Ron Paul

Watch the Campaign Update

Dr. Paul is not ruling out a 3rd party run and neither should we. We need to keep him funded through Super Tuesday. I am a realist and I realize that we are battling vote fraud, a bias media, and the established neo-con machine. I hope for the best in terms of the Republican nomination but we must plan a contingency if Dr. Paul is going to continue this race.

“Remember that a government big enough to give you everything you want is also big enough to take away everything you have.” Barry Goldwater