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Is it libertarian or anarchist to cross the border "illegally"?

I would really appreciate any thoughts on whether it is libertarian or anarchist to cross the border "illegally". Especially since the immigrants are being touted as future democrats. It sounds more like these immigrants are more anarchist than progressives based on the assumptuon they crossed the border without following the law with the intent to provide cheap labor without paying taxes. I look forward to your thoughts.

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Borders means a government...so libertarian

Governments create borders. They defend or expand those borders. Thus an anarchy, or lack of government would not have a border.

As for a libertarian, if the people are not infringing on anothers life, liberty or pursuit of happiness, then they can freely cross the border. There would thus be no illegal immigrants, only offenders of anothers rights.

At least that is how I see it.

It's a Property Rights Issue

This was fun for me to think about.

To answer, I believe Anarchy is a FORM of Libertarianism. Libertarianism being a societal structure centered around the Principle of Freedom, and Anarchy, the lack of any governing authority where individuals themselves protect that principle, is just one idea of how that structure would look. Construction of & adherence to a Limited Constitutional Government, a Minarchy that protects the principle of freedom, is another way.

Libertarianism: Adherence to the Principle of Freedom
Anarchy: The Individual Protects The Principle
Minarchy: A Limited Constitutional Government protects The Principle

The act of crossing a border without permission isn't enough information to tell us which form of societal structure you value. Both Minarchy structures & Anarchy structures recognize Private Property Rights, so whether the State defends that border or an Individual defends that border, in either case you are at the mercy of the Property Owner who has a legitimate Libertarian Right to defend it.

In short, the answer is: We Don't Have Enough Information. You may want to cross the border to commit a crime, or to find a better life as a healthy productive member of society. We don't know WHY you're crossing the border.

A Minarchist AND an Anarchist may BOTH understand and allow the illegal crossing if your purposes are just. I used to cut through houses on my way to school - that is technically crossing a border illegally, without permission - but as Thomas Jefferson would say: "It neither picks my pocket, nor breaks my leg." As long as you "Don't Hurt People, and Don't Take their Stuff" you are following Libertarian principles, maybe you're an Anarchist or maybe you're a Minarchist. You're at the mercy of the property owner, but if you follow the NAP, the Non Aggression Principle, your actions will likely be allowed by both Houses.

Your question reminded me of one of the Jan Helfeld debates where he poses the question to Larken Rose:

If you were stranded in the water, and a boat came within reach, but the owner of the boat didn't want to let you on -- would you abide by his wishes, respect his property rights, and remain in the water causing your death? Or would you ignore his property rights when your life is on the line?

Larken would stay true to his principles, and abide by the boat owner's wishes, while Helfeld would do what was necessary to stay alive.

What would YOU do ?

"If you always lean on your master, you will never be able to proceed without him." - Jefferson to his daughter Martha. March 1787

libertarian or anarchist is

about one's beliefs regarding what kind of political system one would advocate. People who would risk their lives to cross illegally and then live hear as a second class are just desperate. Getting dealt a rough hand in the way things are all too often doesn't produce an anarchist or libertarian. It's too easy for people to be convinced that such and such political system would work so much better and have prevented their rough deal if it weren't for those other guys, the other party, who keep getting in the way.

Defend Liberty!


To have a political identity, like anarchist or libertarian, you must first be part of the body politic. These people, God love them and protect them from all harm, cannot be nor will they be free people in the United States. If they have a political identity, it will be back in their place of birth, whether that be six months from now or twenty years from now. I hope that they are imparted while they are here with freedom loving values, but ultimately, the impact of that will be on their country of origin, and not here.

It's definitely NOT

It's definitely NOT progressive democrat, which they are trying to capitalize on with their propaganda!

Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves. - Matthew 10:16