Man Kills 5 Kirkwood, Mo City Council Members
After receiving 150 citations for "contentious remarks", this man was banned from speaking at council meetings. He filled a lawsuit on the grounds that his constitutional right to freedom of speech was being violated.
The Federal Judge hearing his suit ruled against him, saying "any restrictions on Thornton's speech were reasonable, viewpoint neutral, and SERVED IMPORTANT GOVERNMENTAL INTEREST".
And there it is, Governmental interest trump The People. Our rights are only allowed when these rights do not conflict with Governmental Interest.
This man's brother is quoted as saying, "The only way that I can put into context that you might understand is that my brother went to war tonight with the people, the government that was putting torment and strife into his life".
You folks
are sick. That creep was a cold blooded murderer. Period.
Just like the U.S. Foreign Policy..
Officials will use this event to go.. THE WRONG WAY in setting future policy...
Instead of realizing that while this man's actions were totally abhorent.. so were the actions of the City Council..
And instead of allowing future access to all.. they most likely will FURTHER RESTRICT ACCESS IN THE FUTURE..
Citing safety as the issue...
Someday our children will wake up in a TOTAL POLICED STATE...
One with.. "govenment officals" and those that benifit them....... and then the rest of us..
I do not justify murder in
I do not justify murder in anyway, but..... This man was excersizing his right to bear arms period.
The Judge whom ruled against him
It could easily be argued that the Judge whom rules against him had committed an act of Treason against the Constituion of the US. Honestly I think his shooting started at the wrong location. Its unfortunate that he did not seek help taking it to a higher court, but understandable. Going to the lengths to see it to a Supreme Court hearing often means sacrificing you entire life to see it through. So this is what he ended up doing, but it only took a few minutes to see it through to the end, as opposed to several years.
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"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence
I grew up in this area
this is a very nice area. Older homes but a very desirable area to live.
The are pretty strict in this area, wow as time goes on this could become news.
Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.
this is horrible
But episodes like this will continue to happen will an increased frequency, as the government makes all men into emasculated servants who must depend on the graciousness of their ruling masters for their freedoms. People are going to start exploding like this, with tragedy all around. This is why we must have a smart, peaceful revolution on behalf of the people in this country NOW- because an animal that gets kicked and backed into a corner will eventually react in a fenzied explosion of violence. With the current contempt that our government displays for the citizens in this country, there will be many more episodes of violent outbursts like this. It's certainly not right, but, like suicide bombing, it is an inevitable consequence of occupation. Episodes like these are the last refuge of the insanely frustrated and impotent. And it is our own government that has made us so.
Any government that claims first ownership over our beliefs, our relationships, our families, our religious worhsip, and our personal speech, and then only "allows" us to have what it deems we should have, should expect blowback. Like Ron Pau says, it doesn't excuse the murderer to examine the killer's motive. And it's safe to say that our own government is making many citizens into direct enemies, by exasperating them.
The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt
Unfortunately
I believe that is exactly what our government wants. They can't wait until Constitutionalist lose their compure or sanity, if you will. They desire to sift us as wheat, which is much easier for them while we remain enslaved to their corruptness and expendable pawns for their unjust, aggressive wars. Soon the dollar will collapse and FEMA camps will be popping up everywhere and you, me, and the rest of the citizens of the Republic of the United States of America will have absolutely NO rights. They will not permit citizens to keep their weapons, nor will they allow anyone to remain in their own homes, unless of course, you're an neocon elitist.
The accumulation of all powers, legislative, executive, and judiciary, in the same hands, whether of one, a few, or many, and whether hereditary, self-appointed, or elective, may justly be pronounced the very definition of tyranny. James Madison
The accumulation of all powers, legislative, executive, and judiciary, in the same hands, whether of one, a few, or many, and whether hereditary, self-appointed, or elective, may justly be pronounced the very definition of tyranny. James Madison
so so true
jblackpost I don't think I could have written this any better, right on man.
"Endless money forms the sinews of war." - Cicero, www.freedomshift.blogspot.com
Yes, it is horrible. Those
Yes, it is horrible. Those people didn't have to die. They could have respected this man and his constitutional rights.
Vid Clip
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/23068471#23068471
MSM biased, but there ya go
~Live life to its fullest, with an open heart, open arms and most important... an open mind~
Government = Force
I don't think violence is the answer. But remember that all government action is force. If this guy didn't pay the fines armed men would eventually show up to imprison him by force or kill him in the process. I don't agree with his actions but it was the town council and judge that initiated force.
dup
sorry
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"You know how people are. They only recognize greatness when some authority confirms it." Calvin & Hobbes
one sick dude...
glad to see that he's taking a dirt nap.
Yeah maybe but I worked in
Yeah maybe but I worked in Municipal government for too many years to recognize that this guy probably got shit on, BIG TIME. What comes around goes around.
What do you expect? Sooner
What do you expect? Sooner or later this shits gonna happen. As long as the government continues to oppress the people. Where it happens there will be resistance. You can only expect more of the same. What will you do when you are backed into a corner? What could be so terrible it would drive you to kill? We might all say if we were being attacked, but would we know it if we were?
"But, indeed, no private person has a right to complain, by suit in court, on the ground of a breach of the Constitution. The Constitution it is true, is a compact, but he is not a party to it."
There are a lot of people
There are a lot of people out there extremely angry at their government.. I hope we can change our government peacefully before we ever get to this stage, because if we do.. it will be the bloodiest revolution in human history.
I would suggest the absence
I would suggest the absence of a quorum...
I wonder if they'll release a video of this. It should be interesting.
This proves why you should carry your Glock at all times.
Go President Paul!
’In accordance with the principles of double-think it does not matter if the war is not real. For when it is, victory is not possible. The war is not meant to be won, but it is meant to be continuous.’ (George Orwell, 1984)
’In accordance with the principles of double-think it does not matter if the war is not real. For when it is, victory is not possible. The war is not meant to be won, but it is meant to be continuous.’ (George Orwell, 1984)
...or two!
Tyranny aside, he didn't help the bigger picture doing that. It's all over the news and they will paint it like they painted the 'gun rights activist' Timothy McVieg (sp)
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"You know how people are. They only recognize greatness when some authority confirms it." Calvin & Hobbes
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"You know how people are. They only recognize greatness when some authority confirms it." Calvin & Hobbes
He's a murderer....period
He was a murderer and not even worth listening to. Forget about his complaints...at this point they are irrelevant. He took into his own hands to destroy 6 people with no just right to do so. His name should be buried along with other fools in history.
I agree he was wrong..
I agree he was wrong.. but.... when your a citizen and an overstepping government pushes you ... I say tough chit.. they issued him how many tickets at how much money?? because he wanted todo with what he wanted on his own PRIVATE property! the government is a joke.. they abuse there power.. unfortunetly some people snap much more quicker then others.. I hope other morons who are in government to grab power over your fellow citizens will see this and wisen up.. you are there to serve us.. we are not there to serve government! ITS THE CONSTITUTION STUPID!
“A prudent man foreseeth the evil, and hideth himself: but the simple pass on, and are punished.” (Prov. 22:3; 27:12 KJV)
Hey McCain-----┌П┐(◣_◢)┌П┐
Typically....
you'll find guys like that murderer are complete slobs messing up the look of land and creating an attractive nuisance (as they say). Let's say you and I are neighbors. One day you decide to start playing really loud music all day long so that I can hear it. Also, let's say, you dump a bunch of old wrecked cars on your property that I can see from my property. Also, let's say you allow your kids to ride their motorcycles all over your yard making all kinds of noise. Do you think I'm going to be happy and just say, "well, that's his property and he can do whatever he wants on his own property? Absolutely not!
The "property rights" issue and the "I can do whatever I want on my own property" is simply not true; there's a higher law that simply says, "do unto others as you'd have them do unto you." Without just cause I'm not going to do anything to you that is going to harm you or what you own. And I'm not going to take the law into my own hands.
So many problems in our lives and country could be solved by people being kind to one another. And that's the law of love.
Another notion that should be laid to rest is this; "I own me". It should be more correctly stated, "I am responsible for my own actions". The "I own me" nonsense is false; you DO NOT "own you"- God does and He is the only rightful owner of us and only He can tell us definitively what we may and may not do.
Another problem are atheists. To what law can they ultimately appeal as absolute? None. Nor could anything they say be considered credible as a point of law; in the final analysis an atheist can have no basis for property and life. Ultimately the atheist is a fool no matter how fancy the language they use. Someone once said (was it Madison?) "our Constitution was made for a moral and religious people: it is entirely unsuited for the governance of any other". Moral and religious people were understood at the time to be Christians.
Now back to the killer....if he got 150 tickets (or whatever it was) he should've realized, "hey, these people aren't going to leave me alone until I fix this problem". Someone should've taken that guy aside and said, "look, clean up your mess and stop being such a slob".
Peaceful solutions are the only solutions to be taken. Don't think you're gonna' play "tough guy" with a town and win.
"well, that's his property
"well, that's his property and he can do whatever he wants on his own property? Absolutely not!"
The government is obligated, as mandated by the Constitution, to PROTECT our individual freedoms and liberties. The government does not have constitutional authority to take any of those rights away.
So, regardless of the fact that you might not like to see old cars at your neighbors house - you have the choice of not looking. That is your right to do so. But, you have no right to force your views upon your neighbor in an attempt to make them live the way in which you want to live.
You are entitled to your own life and your own rights. You have no claim on the life or liberties of your neighbors.
...
I'll bite my tongue
This post by RS should be flagged as offensive. There are many atheists on this site, including myself. To say "Ultimately the atheist is a fool no matter how fancy the language they use" in this forum is not related to the point of DP and is divisive. What if the shoe was on the other foot, and atheists attacked "Christians" or other religious groups on DP? Would that be tolerated? I don't think so. I could tell this individual why he is wrong, but I feel it will lead to a divisive debate. To be divided at this point, is not what real RP supporters need or want.
I think you mean well.
But I'm going to take your last statement "Don't think you're going to play tough guy with a town & win." to task.
What if the town was wrong, and the shooter was right? Would you have had him stand down, and simply accept their unjust rule? Or would you have stood beside him and fought (not physically, mind you) in defense of his rights? What if his opinion differed from yours, but was still legal? What then? Would you stand with him in spite of the difference?
We don't know the whole story. The shooter was absolutely, tragically wrong in the actions he choose to take. Based on what has been reported, I'd say he's certainly guilty of murder. But the facts about what triggered the entire tragedy aren't yet known. All I'm suggesting is that we take a step back from what we've been programmed to feel about these incidents, and begin to THINK in broader terms.
Where did you learn
that this guy was a slob? Or are you just assuming he was?
Property rights do come with responsibilities. But Local government here and in MANY towns and cities have made laws the do not allow people to run a business out of their homes. Thorton ran a Concrete business from his home and that was illegal in his town of Kirkwood. I agree that one should not be allowed to park junk in there front yard, if your neighbors object to it. But this is different than making home business illegal. Laws can be written to protect against a trashy looking yard without taking away the right to run a business from ones home. Many towns have laws against running a home business, period. I lived in North Richland Hills, TX and ANY home based business was illegal. Its seems pretty obvious that this is done to force people to rent or buy office space, which increases revenues for the town. In Thorton's case he was operating a Concrete business from his home. Now I dont' know what his home looks like, but I do know about a Concrete business. It requires a few tools like rakes, shovels and a finisher. Items that could be kept on a trailer and stored in a garage, out of sight. Or in a storage space, out of sight. The rest of the business is merely laborers. And I don't know the details of Thorton, he may have been a "slob" as you say. But from what I understand, the city was not telling him "clean up your mess", they were telling him "you can not run your business from your home".
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"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence
Sad
This is so sad.
As usual with newspapers, half the story is missing.
What was happening to the man's property rights that caused him to attend so many city council meetings?
When the media fails to ask logical questions, it usually due to the truth getting in the way.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
It Reminds me of the guy with an Armored Bulldozer
He welded himself into a homemade armored truck or bulldozer and started knocking over the homes of the council members until the police killed him.
It was property rights there, too. City Councils are the worst about property rights.
IMissLiberty
IMissLiberty
to bad he did not get the judge
.... He was the real nut
Yes
Had the Judge not taken away his freedom to speak, Thorton would have been able to continue to petition the local government and would have likely not cracked had he been allowed to continue to "vent". "Shutup and do as I say" kinda unconstitutional. Its "UnAmerican".
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"Ehhh, What's ups Doc?" B.Bunny "Scwewy Wabbit!"E. Fudd
People's Awareness Coalition: Deprogramming Sequence