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Government Takeover of the Church
Submitted by Samuel Howell Jr. on Mon, 03/31/2008 - 07:31
This is a must see video. Robin Wright speaks about Corporate 501 c3 Churches. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4096944125079342774 » |
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Good related
Good related article:
http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin392.htm
Trust in God, but tie your camel tight.
"Socialism needs two legs on which to stand; a right and a left. While appearing to be in complete opposition to one another,they both march in the same direction." - Paul Proctor
Worship God not the State.
Have your church in your home, you already have to pay taxes, so you won't lose anything. No need to have a building. Invite small groups and avoid the hassle.
grant
WOW! and there are other benefits...
such as the freedom to discuss issues (both theological and other) , freedom to choose your music, freedom to use your individual gifts in worship..... Read The Open Church or Megashift by James Rutz for more fun reasons to do this. (or check my post many moons back:)
Libera me, let the truth break, what my fears make--Leslie Phillips
But that man should play the tyrant over God, and find Him a better man than himself, is astonishing drama indeed!~~D. Sayers
There is no difference between an authoritarian government from the right or the left...F. A.Schaeffer
I have already been
I have already been considering this option, and I am surprised to find how prepared I am to do just this. We even have a sound system, instruments, a projector, and a lot of Bible reference books, Bibles, even hymnals. Sometimes I wonder if God leading me to prepare me for this time.
One additional benefit: by having home churches drawing from your local neighborhood, you will likely have attendees from multiple backgrounds -- a return to the unity that Jesus had originally prayed for in His church. The dogmatic Evangelicals balancing out the life and spirit of the Pentecostals combined with the reverence and awe of the Catholics. One can hope.
Lucily the congregations
of the church I attend did not do the 501c3. So were not bound by not for profit law. Our church only worships God. We run no business, we have no property besides the meeting house. Only take collection once on Sunday morning.
1Cor 16:1 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye. 2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.
I was just questioning
the relationship between National Council of Churches and 501c3. It is my understanding that they are in no way connected. The only thing that 501c3 does is give the church the ability to collect donations from people and report them so that the people then have a tax deduction. Nothing else. But to be a 501c3, the church must agree not to be political in the pulpit. Right or wrong?
What the NCC does is evil and it connects all the churches that join to the UN and to One World Religion, but not all churches know that is the agenda. Some are unaware of what they are doing.
That is essentially correct.
That is essentially correct. If a 501c3 church were to voice a political opinion, it could potentially find itself liable for a extremely large tax bill which it couldn't pay and would then have to forfiet it's property to the State. The 501c3 forever silenced the churches that have ignorantly moved into that domain.
Today, Patrick Henry would never be allowed to say the things he had - in a 501c3, that is.
Incorporation
Incorporation is to the church, what the State marriage license, is to the union of marriage, namely Caesar where Caesar don't belong ( presiding over would be Sovereigns ).
Check out this great link, for info on marriage license's: http://www.lawfulpath.com/ref/secularmarriage.shtml
Live for Liberty
www.patriotsadvocate.net
Live for Liberty
www.patriotsadvocate.net
NOT THIS MINISTRY!!!!!!!!!!!
In Christ,
Dave
www.lionandlambministry.com
www.lionandlambtv.com
Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.
In The LORD Jesus Christ;
Dave
"where the Spirit of the LORD is, there is liberty." 2 Cor. 3:17
http://www.lionandlambministry.com
Government didn't take over the church…
… The churches sold out for tax exempt status under 501 c3. Had they NOT done that, they would have been tax immune.
Most church people wouldn't drop a penny in the collection plate without being guaranteed a tax deduction. Today's churches are big business and have more to do with entertainment than with spiritual guidance.
In Tucson, Arizona, we have a chain of churches called, "the cool church." They are more like weekly concerts than worship services.
I haven't seen even one that was worth the powder to blow it to hell.
"It does not take a majority to prevail... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." Samuel Adams
“Just look at us. Everything is backwards; everything is upside down. Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, governments destroy freedom, the major media destroy information and religions destroy spirituality”
Church vaccinations
It looks like the government will use the churches as the sites for the government to vaccinate americans.
It looks like the people of the world that are at the Olympics will be given shots (and be secretly injected with the bird flu) and then come home and share the flu (not on purpose) with their family's.
Then the federal government will use the 100 million bird flu shots (they just received from China) to vaccinate the nation. (Under marshal law)
Liberty is our campaigns gift to the world it is our manifest destiny.
Freedom is a movement who's time has come. Our campaign will lead to world wide freedom.
Liberty is our campaigns gift to the world it is our manifest destiny.
Freedom is a movement who's time has come. Our campaign will lead world wide freedom.
Church's are incorperated
Liberty is our campaigns gift to the world it is our manifest destiny.
Freedom is a movement who's time has come. Our campaign will lead world wide freedom.
Liberty is our campaigns gift to the world it is our manifest destiny.
Freedom is a movement who's time has come. Our campaign will lead world wide freedom.
I'm gonna bump this just
I'm gonna bump this just because I authored this thread months ago.
What ever happened to the ..
'priesthood of the believer' ? Not to mention the duty to search the Scriptures for yourself? OR the use of every believer's gifts and talents to the benefit of all? www.megashiftministries.org ciick on starters, then on Take a Giant Step Up.
(if you want to read a good book on the topic, I recommend the book The Open Church by James Rutz)
Libera me, let the truth break, what my fears make--Leslie Phillips
But that man should play the tyrant over God, and find Him a better man than himself, is astonishing drama indeed!~~D. Sayers
There is no difference between an authoritarian government from the right or the left...F. A.Schaeffer
Interesting link
Dr. Paul cured my apathy
Ron Paul was right
Try the main article link for more interesting ideas
Libera me, let the truth break, what my fears make--Leslie Phillips
But that man should play the tyrant over God, and find Him a better man than himself, is astonishing drama indeed!~~D. Sayers
There is no difference between an authoritarian government from the right or the left...F. A.Schaeffer
Khomar
you said this:
This Calvinism vs Arminianism rivalry is exactly what Jesus Christ spoke so strongly against. He called the Body of Christ, His church, to unity, and this divisive talk runs completely contrary to this.
Why do you assume he was talking about this snake and this viper in your sentance. Why would Jesus Christ encourge his church to wait time fighting about either false doctrine. Oh I know just like everyone in this world you assume their must be a winner between this viper ad this snake who are fighting. I tell you this right now the fact that they are fighting is a clear sign neither one of them are the true church therfore why waist time fighting over false belief when you can just have the truth. It to is in your sentence only it is showing love and fixing and teaching that is the true church in your example. Do you not see the truth in your sentence. His name is right there. Do you not see it my friend. So why do you run after one of the to false gods in your sentence. what is your answer for that.
Not Sure I Understand
I am not sure that I understand what your asking here:
I think you are assuming that I am trying to choose between these two positions, but that is not my intent at all. I don't think that there is a "winner" between Calvinism and Arminianism. The "winner" is the truth which lies somewhere between these philosophies. The winner is he who seeks after God. The unity is the body of believers committed to obedience and faith in Jesus Christ.
Theological debate need not be divisive or wrong, but when it leads to division and judgment, then it is certainly not of Christ. The intent of the debate should always be to enlighten and draw closer to the church, and if it strays from this, it should be abandoned. Like Paul exhorted the church", we should submit to one another in love.
What I am calling for is to not allow these debates to cloud our view of why we are here and that we are being separated from fellow brothers and sister in Christ. We need to put aside differences that really do not matter as much as we think and cling to the cross and the hope of salvation through Jesus Christ.
some denominations are putting in ATM's
in the foyers, to make sure they get a donation.
Don't forget the coffee
Don't forget the coffee shops.
Culture is Religion externalized.
one denomination
I know of, in the Springfield, MO area, to become a member, you agree to an automatic deduction from your banking account each week.
A majority of churches in this country
are reaching out for power. They are part of the ideology of World Government because it will increase membership in the church because of relativism all churches will slowly be pushed under one head The leaders will have a cap on the amount of money they get but its a garranteed ammount plus the church will grow bigger than it is now (so they think) because they plan in the future to force everyone to go to one of these relativist churches. You will be able to pick from there huge assortment of churches. however any church that doesn't play ball and join in and worship the one great leader of the church will get of course we all know what the'll get the great and mighty savior of this world they will get sanctions put on them. This means they will declare war on them without declaring war and they will starve them to death by blocking them out from the government run markets. I hate to tell you guys this cause I know most of you are believers in some of these churches. If your church is trinitarian they are all good to go with this set up I don't care what they say when you ask them the Trintity church is a top down orginization just like the government The preachers in these churches will tow the party line when push comes to shove our the'll be out. It also follows exactly with the bible when it talks about the last days I know people don't like hereing the terminology but the european church is the mother of the modern day American trinitarian. The bible refers to the true church as the virgin the other churches where the whore and the harlot meaning the establishing church that sets up the false belief. and the harlot is the church that will perfect and spread that false belief. The diffrence in the churches is one comes before the other and the first one will knowingly decieve the world while the other would perfect it to the point they would actually believe the lie that her mother told. They can't help it they have played the knowledge word games and changed meanings of words in the bible that if read with just the mind you can't see the truth its like they made the bible for dumbies. There are two authorities on this earth only one Authority. The authority is the law. Inside the law God told moses to make a priest for the jews and a judges for the stranger that means one for the church and one for the sinner and the laws on the sinner where never to be made so hard he could not live by them. In other words the christian who follows the ten commandments could follow the law of man but the law of man was never to become like the law of the church no sinner can live by the ten commandments (As Jesus would later reveal to the priest of his time that the priest couln't live by it either the reason being they put the two divisions of law together thus forcing the sinner to live by a law he could never keep thus breaking the law). So there was an superior and inferior law all part of the one Law of God. This is why Romans 13 is going to be used against the people of the world. Europe and even churches in the United States are using it now. The phrase that policmen are the servants of God. They believe the authority in romans 13 means the leader of the nation not the law. They have messed that up from the beginning and they will till the end cause it serves their purpose. My point being the churces in America are pretty much all in on this however the bible says there is one group of people not saying religion but a belief that is the true church A goup of people that know the truth and it will cover every nation so there are some of them everywhere this does not inclued all these relativist churches thats not what I mean. I mean spiritual union not physical. There is no spiritualness in relativism it is a physical union not spiritual. This is why you see these churches moving the congregations to fight abortion to get more invloved in polotics and to fight the evil aclu. Its all a cover for what they are really doing The spiritual evil of false religion is positioning itself to prop up the physical evil the government to bring forth an all powrful leader of the UN and the anti-Christ. and the leader of theis movement called relativism will be his fasle prophet. this stuff comes right out of the bible. A book that use to make no sense whatsoever just 100 years ago almost has complete understanding just by opening your eyes and watching the world around you as you read it. Don't believe me try it. It helps to read daniel also.
I agree
I agree, and I also am very aware of this movement. This is why the division of the church concerns me so greatly. There are true believers that are being separated because of what are really minor philosophical differences -- they are both saying the same thing only with slightly different emphasis or phraseology. While the powerful churches are consolidating power, the true Christians are being divided and therefore more easily conquered.
We need to strive once again toward unity in the faith. We need to recognize that we have only one supreme authority to whom we owe our allegience: God.
Unfortunately
some denominations are for profit business using God to make a profit and hiding under the not for profit status.
No, ALL
"Doc" Holladay
Nashville, TN
www.reverbnation.com/docholladaymusic
Truth is treason in an empire of lies.
wrong again
To claim to be the one true authority of all churches proves your extreme ignorance. That's all I have to say about that.
Not True
That is definitely not true. My church is a small Wesleyan church with less than 100 members, and is extremely generous. The pastor has refused to take a higher salary; he actually fought against the board to cut his salary so that we wouldn't have to cut the budget for missions but they refused (making cuts elsewhere). Michigan is a depressed area, but our congregation continues to give generously to the community and to the spread of the gospel. It is by no means a wealthy church.
While I personally believe we should give up our non-profit status to avoid the threat from government, I understand why they do not. To do so would reduce the amount of funds available as our pastor is currently exempt from a lot of taxes. It is not always done for selfish gain as you imply.
the separation of church and state is for the church's own good
There are those of us who prefer a more libertarian approach to our spirituality, too. I will go ahead and take personal responsibility for my relationship with my creator, you don't need to legislate me any morals to save my immortal soul - I have that covered.
That is why we can AGREE that Roe v Wade is unConstitutional and have a beer together and be jolly fellow patriots. When you start condemning the souls of people who had abortions, I will be off to another table where the folks leave the moral issues out of the political debate. If I had a magic wand, I would make all the Christians stop getting their morals inflamed over abortion, it is being used to make them blind to rational discussion with people who have different views. We do not have to agree on everything, we have to seek the common ground. The Constitution is rock-solid common ground.
How is this for a different moral view? A woman, as bearer of life, is morally obligated to end the genetic line of rapists, should one impregnate her. Men's input on pregnancy begins and ends at the zipper. If he put "it" in her, it is now hers and her MORAL OBLIGATION to choose what is best to do with it.
Shall we get back to the Constitution now? Roe vs Wade is un-Constitutional, don't you agree?
Truth exists, and it deserves to be cherished.
Rainy
calvinism is to armanianism just as whores are to harlets. But the virgin is always mixed in with the younger harlets not the older whores
read church history
Arminianism is the theological belief that elevates mans reason and 'free will' above God's determinative predestiation. "Calvinism", "Luthernism", or Augustinism recognize the sovergnity of God and the responsibility of man. Calvinism is historically orthodox and Biblical. Arminiasnism is a false theology and the root of America's problems.
Culture is Religion externalized.