Can anyone explain in plain English what the heck is going on with the stock market this week?
Submitted by ShannonOBrien on Tue, 09/16/2008 - 09:36
I can't find anything about the big plunges we're seeing that isn't buried in spin!
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insiders scamming
they boost it up so people will buy then short sell the next day and cause a panic sell. get out of the stock market!
Manipulation.
___________
Lisa C.
**This space is available.**
Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!
Its that History Repeating itself thing.
"October 19, 2007
America's Forgotten War Against the Central Banks
by Mike Hewitt
The Great Depression
From 1921 to 1929 the Federal Reserve increased the money supply by 62% thus fuelling the period known as the Roaring Twenties. Further fuelling the rise in stock market indices was a new type of loan, known as a margin loan, whereby an investor would only need to put down 10% of the value of a stock with the remaining 90% being loaned from the broker. Like today, these loans could be called in at any time and had to be paid within 24 hours, known as a margin call. This is typically accomplished by the selling of the stock purchased using the loan.
These two factors, loose monetary policy and easy loans resulted in a fivefold increase in the Dow Jones Industrial Average over the latter half of the 1920's.
The mass calling in of these margin loans by the New York banking establishment resulted in the devastating market crashes of October of 1929. "Black Thursday", the initial crash, occurred on October 24. The crash that caused general panic five days later on October 29 was known as "Black Tuesday".
Then, instead of expanding the money supply, the Federal Reserve contracted it, thereby creating the period known as the Great Depression. Congressman Wright Patman in A Primer On Money, reported that the money supply decreased by eight billion dollars from 1929 to 1933, causing 11,630 banks of the total of 26,401 in the United States to go bankrupt. This allowed central bankers to buy up rival banks and whole corporations at a deep discount.
"Obamney care," Nuff said.
In plain english ?
We are all toast and Bush has a huge ranch in Paraguay.
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Stop the NWO....It's just illumi..Naughty !
true
*
Who's killing US economy? for Shannon O'Brian
Q: Who's killing the US economy & not only?
A: The compounding unpayable interests are killing the US economy and not only.
This is global nefariously phenomenal event that is imploding under it's own weight and there is no salvation but MPE. Keep reading.
Shannon O'Brian read this note in it's entirety first, then go as it is structured, and you will learn. Go for it. COPY and SAVE the links.
"Start by doing what's necessary(READ), then do what's possible (LEARN), & suddenly (we the people together, mms)
are doing the impossible." - by Saint Francis of Assisi
Money as debt - this is what is going on without any leverage. It used to be 10:1, then 30:1, now - who know but
the Fed, and the Fed might not know it ether for sure.
Now, Shannon - figure it out on your own - for yourself - it is rather easy - but - just take your time.It's a
weird, peculiar & eccentric system void of any morality, the purest nefariousness. It's not in the best interests
to civilization at all, but to banks and banks owners only.
Shannon O'Brien - the website below visit daily for updates and after 40 hours of reading you will get a picture.
NOW
-----------------------------------------------
STEP ONE
See the Video Money as debt - (Fiat Money)
Problems - MANY
http://www.brasschecktv.com/page/135.html
"Start by doing what's necessary,
then do what's possible,
and suddenly "we" are doing the impossible." - Saint Francis of Assisi
=====================================
READ - STEP TWO
BUT READ THOSE FIRST
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article6250.html
http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article6259.html
----------------------------
STEP THREE
Solution - ONE
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/48187
******************************************
And
http://www.perfecteconomy.com/
PEOPLE For Mathematically Perfected Economy™ : the singular integral solution to
1) inflation and deflation,
2) systemic manipulation of the cost or value of money or property, and
3) inherent, irreversible multiplication of debt in proportion to a circulation.
http://www.perfecteconomy.com/pg-synopsis.html
-------------------------------------------
GO SHANNON GO - READ - LEARN - JUST DO SEE IT.
MPE is formed, visualized, thought out and put in words by Isaac Newton's offspring living today in state of Utah.
MPE is like the Copernicus type of an idea that in - one sentence - stopped the Earth and moved the SUN.
mms
economist entrepreneur proprietor
sound money economic policy advocate
google! PFMPE and prosper for ever & beyond
mms, economist, entrepreneur, proprietor;
abolish interests on debt policy.
what is mathematically perfected economy™?
Thanks for taking the time to recommend all of these resources!
I just watched "Money as Debt." Now THAT is chilling.
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"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
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"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
This may seem like a big ask...
but a full read of Rothbard's Man, Economy and State will give you a full understanding of economic theory: http://mises.org/rothbard/mes.asp
Alternatively, you could read Gene Callahan's Economics for Real People for a much shorter and simpler read: http://mises.org/resources/2031
Ron Paul's economic philosophy is deeply rooted in the Austrian School of Economics. To understand how he's been able to predict the economic crash you should read some of their literature. Economics with no math! Can it get any better?(I actually like math a lot...)
"My theories explain, but cannot slow the decline of a great civilization. I set out to be a reformer, but only became the historian of decline."
- Ludwig Von Mises
Financial companies are failing because of the mortgage debacle.
Several very large investment banks are no longer able to shuffle the paper around and dodge the consequences of all the mortgage defaults. As the financial stocks collapse, the whole market drops because of the need for investors to cover their losing positions.
-jcr
"The problem with trying to child-proof the world, is that it makes people neglect the far more important task of world-proofing the child." -- Hugh Daniel
Um? "crash" or "correction" or
I think they call it a stock market "crash" or "correction". The government is debating which of their campaign donors to bail out at tax payer and great grand children of tax payer expense. According to the skinny doctor from TX, it has something to do with the cost of the conflict or "war/wars" being fought with money borrowed from China and the resulting negative impact on the value of the U.S. dollar.
I hope this helps.
the dollar
is based on the good faith of the American people. As the faith of the people declines the value of the dollar plummets. not overnight but slowly and painfully. But the govt is here to help. They have a new currency that is ready when the dollar falls anybody ready for the amero? Over the years our leaders have caused a problem to create a change that they wanted in the first place. Look at the national ID. that is just a response to illegal immigration and terrorism. We will give up our constitution for plausible lies.
They are very good at this
The dollar is a "faith based" initiative
and Americans and maybe more importantly the Chinese are losing faith in the dollar. I knew we were in trouble when Brazillian fashion models were insisting on being paid in Euros.
In The News Today
In The News Today
Author: Jim Sinclair
Jim Sinclair’s Commentary
What AIG needs is $90 billion for a rescue package. WaMu and UBS might arrive this week, hat in hand.
AIG needs three times the Bear funds required to stay afloat.
The reaction to the Lehman failure, which was expected by Bernanke, Paulson and Cox to be modest since Merrill was purchased at a premium on the same day, fell flat on its ass. The market dropped 500 that day.
That can be described as panic city in the Fed and the White House as Mickey Mouse could be elected assuming the system unwinds before election date.
WaMu, our next most likely problem, will be saved. Maybe UBS will be given access to the Fed Begging Bowl Window directly (or indirectly) because they are principle to huge amounts of OTC derivatives in North America.
Between now and Election Day any bank or financial entity wanting rescue only needs to say the word bankruptcy. The Fed will put up the money, lend to, or accept a risky deal for a second party to take over WaMu.
All this is very gold POSITIVE. Creating so many new dollars will make the job of keeping the dollar rally going to Election Day quite difficult.
Fed Keeps Rates Steady; No Signal Of Imminent Cut
By Brian Blackstone and Maya Jackson Randall
Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES
WASHINGTON -(Dow Jones)- The U.S. Federal Reserve on Tuesday held interest rates steady and, in a disappointment to Wall Street, didn't appear to signal that rate cuts are forthcoming anytime soon.
Officials continued to warn about inflation risks, and they also suggested that economic concerns have intensified in the wake of the collapse of Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc. (LEH) and a steep sell-off in equity markets Monday.
"The downside risks to growth and the upside risks to inflation are both of significant concern to the Committee," the Fed said in a statement that largely mirrored its previous one in August.
The Federal Open Market Committee voted unanimously to keep the target fed-funds rate for interbank lending unchanged at 2% for a third-straight meeting. The Fed took no action on the discount rate for loans to brokers and commercial banks, which stands at 2.25%.
The Fed said it will "act as needed" to promote economic growth and stable prices. But it didn't refer to "timely" action, a word Fed watchers usually associate with a willingness to cut rates between meetings. Financial markets had also hoped that officials would adopt an explicit bias toward economic weakness, which they didn't do.
More…
I am more concerned about the return of my money than the return on my money. --Mark Twain
“A prudent man foreseeth the evil, and hideth himself: but the simple pass on, and are punished.” (Prov. 22:3; 27:12 KJV)
Hey McCain-----┌П┐(◣_◢)┌П┐
lol DAMNED IF THEY DO AND
lol DAMNED IF THEY DO AND DAMNED IF THEY DON'T!
I am more concerned about the return of my money than the return on my money. --Mark Twain
“A prudent man foreseeth the evil, and hideth himself: but the simple pass on, and are punished.” (Prov. 22:3; 27:12 KJV)
Hey McCain-----┌П┐(◣_◢)┌П┐
exactly
what has been predicted
found this comment on digg re: ron paul predicted this a yr ago
& the person in the 3rd paragraph below explains it better than i ever could.
in response to someone else's comment that rp wants "even more disastrous deregulation which is what caused this mess in the first place and to eradicate the tax system to force the country to borrow its way into the dark ages," another commenter enlightened w/this in response:
"Wrong. Deregulation is not what caused this. It was the government interfering in the markets in the first place that caused this. Artificially low interest rates set by the FED has fueled the mal-investment we are seeing unwind today. If it wasn't for the FED, we wouldn't even have the bubble we're in now. Listen to the people who predicted this."
i think that pretty much sums it all up. it's been a long time coming - all the way back to alan greenspan & the overinflated dotcom stocks & the overinflated housing prices.
you should also watch the peter schiff video - at least i found it educational.
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/62226
bump for
knowledge
Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.
Nobody know what is going on.
Therefore investors are confused.
Therefore you cannot make any conclusions based on what happens.
Do not attempt to understand any trends from the short term.
Great answers!
Thanks everyone who responded. I read every single one and it certainly helped to begin to understand the mess we are in.
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"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
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"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
"Last Gasp of a Dying Currency"
Peter Schiff
Some theory...
Some of the replies I've read seem to cover things pretty well but I'd like to talk about some economy theory regarding the nature of economic crashes(or busts).
It all starts with the artificial manipulation of interest rates. I don't have the time or the patience to explain where interest rates(briefly: how much people value present goods to future goods aka time preference) come from but suffice to say that they represent the "rate of return" of an economy. Generally speaking, the interest rate or "rate of return" will be roughly equal among all sectors of the economy. To elaborate, income derived(as a percentage) from investing in a chair company will be roughly the same as investing in an energy company(of course investing in a failing/inefficient enterprise will not yield this result). This has to do with bidding for factors of production... which I will not get into.
The interest rate that banks charge on loans is equivalent to the interest rate in the broader economy. By using government force to lower interest rates(e.g from 5% to 4%, this is accomplished through credit expansion), industries that could not afford to take a loan at the higher interest rate can now afford to do so(this also applies to potential home-owners *cough*). Thus the boom is created. Many new industries(or even old ones) can now exist. A lot of investment goes into these sectors - away from sectors that are actually productive.
All seems well. Many new industries are flourishing, we witness record home ownership(laugh!), most economic statistics paint a rosy picture and all the fancy Wall Street analysts praise the economic policy on MSNBC, FOX, CNN etc... Nothing bad could happen right?
Clearly, something isn't quite right here. How can money created from nothing create wealth? Why are previously untenable industries thriving? Isn't inflation supposed to be bad a thing?
Now I could spend all day talking about inflation, investment into the different stages of production, consumer time preference but it would just take too long and I'd probably get it wrong. Instead, I would suggest reading Rothbard's Man, Economy and State(available at mises.org).
How things are produced is dependent on the consumer time preference. The altering of interest rates results in MALINVESTMENT: overinvestment in certain stages of production(higher stages) and underinvestment in others(lower stages).
Eventually it all becomes clear. The credit induced bubble is shown for what it really is. These industries were able to flourish with credit created from nothing rather than savings - in other words they never really did well at all but they certainly gave that appearance to investors. The bubble has burst. Welcome back to reality.
A market 'crash' is a slight misnomer, a more appropriate term would be a market 'correction'. The markets return to reality and that's when people start to get nervous about the economy. There are calls for our beloved rulers to 'fix' the problem - instead of allowing things to return to sanity by leaving the markets alone which should have happened in the first place - our wise leaders decide to enact laws. These laws CANNOT fix the economy and they cannot stop the crash. They can, however, prolong the crash and possibly make it worse. We find ourselves here today.
My analysis could be off(but not by much I hope), but I think it's important that DailyPaul readers get some background into the nature of boom/bust cycles.
"My theories explain, but cannot slow the decline of a great civilization. I set out to be a reformer, but only became the historian of decline."
- Ludwig Von Mises
what a great post, JayPee
Thanks. My mind was sharpened.
I'm starting to finally understand this whole "financial sector" thing. Never paid it much mind; it seemed like a foreign language and culture to me.
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What is begun in anger, ends in shame.
Banks and Financials are upside-down
Perhaps an over-simplification but in the interest of a simple answer:
Banks and financials (insurers, investment banks) are simply upside down.
If you think homeowners went over their heads with debt, we are now seeing how the pros did it in spectacular fashion.
Lehman for instance was rumored to be leveraged 40 to 1 which would be the equivalent of a homeowner having a $400,000.00 mortgage on a $4,000.00 house. When their creditors called the notes there was no underlying asset to sell and cover the "mortgage".
Al the terms you have been hearing related to the housing mess like "liar loans", "equity strips", "mortgage fraud", "inflated appraisals", etc. can be multiplied by a factor of X (X being a mystery number) and applied to the thieves on Wall Street. Instead of bailing any of these clowns out, they should be out looking for bail money, the theft they perpetrated is astounding. Pensions plans, municipalities etc are all going to get sucked down the tube.
Socialists are Everywhere
Watch this
and a lot of questions will become clear...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVkFb26u9g8
investors have been suspect
investors have been suspect of the damage caused by the housing bubble since i believe the start of 2007. no one knew exactly how much damage the subprime crisis would cause but people began shorting stocks, particularly since the turn into 2008, like its been going out of style synopsis on what shorting is
Massive shorting has the effect of bringing its value down. The value of all of the major financial institutions have been in a steady decline since 2007 - 2008, until the head of the subprime beast raised its ugly head when these financial institutions began disclosing the bad mortgages (basically mortgages people were defaulting and therefore rendered either worthless or a fraction of its value), and investors began to get a glimpse of the real damage caused to the books of all these large securities firms in the billions. (the actual cause of how it got that bad is more complex, from my understanding there was a lot of selling of these mortgages as high value contracts when in fact they were bad loans and it turned into a tangled, scandalous mess). investor confidence is usually heavily dependent on quarterly earnings statements, and an unprecedented number of billions being written off in losses only assured that more bank stock shorting ensued and rightfully so.
As a company your books might show that you have loaned out billions and those contracts act as a guarantee of that wealth coming back with interest which gives a company value, and all of those loans default and youre forced to reposess and resell the collateral for a fraction of the value the contract was originally worth (and that takes time unfortunately so it might be that cant happen for several months so in the short term this value is worthless) or there is no way to recover that loan at all, your books will show that your company is worth X many billions, but in actuality those loans arent worth anything near what theyre valued at since people cant pay them back. With a bunch of bad loans comes a serious cash crunch which all companies need in some capacity to operate. so it seems that the hammer of dow justice is coming down on these companies so fast that they have no time to scramble cash together or their books are so badly hurt that no sane institution wants to buy their bad loans from them (unless there is some insurance that those loans will be covered by the FED ala bear stearns with JP Morgan, which relieves the purchasing firm free from risk, and leaves the tax payer paying for what should be a privatized loss). As this happens, rumors fly and the stock of these institutions which were valued at 15-20 dollars one day are dropping to about 2-5 dollars a few days later, and from there is pretty much game over.
All these firms are fortune 500 firms, so their tanking greatly reflects on the bigger measuring sticks (dow, s&p, et al), not to mention the back lash/ ripple effect that happens when these giants fail, all of the other banks lending money to those guys or people that depend on them for business also get badly burnt, and the damage kindof shockwaves through the rest of the economy.
so basically this week (and i believe this is what ron warned us about last month in that ominous prediction of his) is that the shit is hitting the fan at the same time. as we see giants fall, it is easier for investors to lose confidence in the whole sector. fears mount and whether they are warranted or not, the loss of confidence in investment are causing other banks that are kindof teetering to sink in value perhaps unfairly so. LEH was rumored to fall well before Bear Stearns even fell, over the past two weeks WaMu, AIG and a few others have been severely hurt on their stock price. (im not sure about the other institutions but WaMu was one of the more predictable failures, it had to sell off about 25% of its stock earlier this year to raise cash)
After some of these companies fall or are bought out, it might take another quarter or two to really see how badly this has hurt other companies/firms closely associated with these giants (not just abroad either, there is international repercussions here), so it wouldnt appear that we are out of the woods yet.
To my lame brain, there is no more senseless painful activity...
than trying to figure out what the stock market is doing. Brain..hurts. There are many factors involved that don't get talked about on the tube. Maybe even some that are not acknowledged at all.
Lighten up, :). Close your eyes, and say to yourself " I dont know what the %&^%#$%$* is goin on, and thats ok cuz no one does" take a breath, and resume your REAL life.
But, he!!, Im a lame brain...what do I know? Good luck on your posting.
banks lack capital due to massive mortgage losses
people fear that the banks are insolvent, so they are selling their bank stocks, compounding the problem (bank would not be worth as much with cheap stock). When the banks' rating drops (Moody's rating) because the are a high risk, they have to show more capital or the slide continues. The whole mess chases itself into a tightening death spiral until the bank closes its doors or gets purchased for a fraction of its worth.
In a word, "deleveraging"
In a word, "deleveraging" caused by less credit available and stricter credit standards.
The nightly news can say the 30 year mortgage rate is low - what they don't report is the requirement for a big down payment and the requirement for a great credit score.
Credit is tight or unavailable, which is causing deleveraging.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_housing_bubble
"Translated into plain English, risk-averse investors would demand higher yields on their investments, thus driving down asset prices especially highly leveraged assets such as real-estate. Therefore, homeowners must deleverage themselves by putting more equities into their homes in order to keep their homes and future homebuyers may have to deposit significant amounts of down-payment in order to get mortgage loans. The protracted period of Americans buying homes with zero down-payment and getting mortgage loans with no or little documentations has finally come to an abrupt end."
http://FlipFlopRomney.blogspot.com
And so they sold their stocks upon hearing about Lehman bros?
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"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
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"We will never give up. We will never give in." - Dr. Ron Paul
Their shareholders sold their stocks
People like you & me + institutional buyers like mutual fund managers.