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ZEITGEIST WAS RIGHT !Check this out! Earthaven Ecovillage, Zeitgeist was right, HOPE

This is a great place, full of great people. They have a wonderful community. A great cafe and great homemade beer!! There is hope.

http://www.earthaven.org/

*please note, a small group of members are angry Mike (creator of this website) and I found Zeitgeist "interesting". They are now attacking the concept of an ecovillage. Real freedom loving Patriots.



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No one is telling anyone how to live

This is done one house at a time. Its all your own choice. If it's done with enough mass then maybe the people who are sucking your wallet dry will shrivel up and die. And you have to realize the movie didn't go through a transition period where people would use gold and silver and any other hard currency until the infrastructure was in place for a redesigned community the way the community wanted it to be made.
If you don't want to do anything no one is pushing you, just don't do it.

Ok. That's fine. What about morals, values, norms

culture, heritage, family, all the things that really matter in life. Will those be imposed upon people universally? No one is will to talk about anything buy money. What about humanity?

I don't know where people get this idea

The movie said nothing about restricting your thought process or your ideas. The movie encouraged people to explore whatever they wanted and to use the time left from not working to do anything they wanted. If you want to hold a church service no one is going to stop you, or if you wanted to trade goats for cows it wouldn't matter. I'm guessing the idea of IOU slips for real assets would be dead and buried though.

Yet again, prattling on

Yet again, prattling on against money. Simple question - how can modern industrial societies "know" how to efficiently use resources without monetary prices to indicate where there is greatest need for investing those resources?

marlow

marlow

What resources are we talking about?

Sunshine? Waves? Geothermal Energy? Lawns? All those sound pretty close to infinite (except of course lawns, but the world could supply food for everyone many times over with the land it has)

As for "modern industrial society" well, that has to get worked out. You see, there's gonna be an awful lot of people like yourself who don't like the no money system-for good reason they don't want all their hard earned money taken away. But then there are the REALLY wealthy people who absolutely ABHOR a system without a way to swindle people like yourself with a money scheme and these REALLY wealthy people are going to try with all their might to make people use money with every means at their disposal. These REALLY wealthy people also today control most of the industrial complex and that is who most of us are fighting when we say "END THE FED". So, the only way to defeat these REALLY wealthy people is to rob them of their money supply, vote their cronies out of office and hope they don't have sway over the military.

The "modern industrial society" will be brought back into full swing once we actually get ahold of our economy again. And there will be a sound money economy for awhile, until people learn that being prosperous is natural and having continous abundance with infinite resources means money is obsolete. This is a VERY long plan and it needs to be worked out, but thankfully homesteaders have already started the transition.

Why not smile somewhere else?

It's obvious you are a more highly evolved being. Please stop wasting your time by trying to educate us fools.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

Now this is getting nasty

I've seen alot of homesteading sites come and go on this forum. It is a shame the people who say they stand for liberty and free thought to disrespect the highest form of sovereignty by living off the grid.
Attacking people for wanting to free themselves by having a sustainable system of energy and agriculture is a noble cause and if you don't understand it then you don't have to attack them for having different ideas.

No one is forcing you to agree with anything anyone on this forum is saying, but attacking without a point to someone who is showing examples of people who have lived off the grid is the basest insult to freedom.

You want to "live off the

You want to "live off the grid", fine. Go for it. Just stop this "moneyless" society BS. Without money to finance the immense chains of production to produce the enormous array of products that even you "off the grid" people will be needing - you will not have access to nearly everything you rely on, and will be reduced to a primitive subsistence lifestyle, if you are one of the lucky ones to survive the "transition" to a world of no money.

marlow

marlow

Where's your crystal ball?

I didn't know you were the amazing Kreskin. What else will happen if I do something no one in the history of the world has ever done before?

You have no idea would could happen in a society without currency and I don't either. Why do you want so many people to die in a no money society? Your money system sounds so deadly to me cause that's all you talk about is reducing the population if there is no money.

You are being dishonest

Did I say I want people to die in a no money society? No. And you know very well I didn't. I predicted what economic theory (Read Mises Human Action, chap. 26) proves will happen and what history has shown to happen - as when Lenin tried to do away with prices. Too bad you have a problem with me pointing out your moneyless ideal would necessitate mass death because it would destroy the productive capacity of society.

After reading your multiple posts it is clear you are well meaning but ill informed on economics. Mises ends his masterwork, Human Action with these words:

"The body of economic knowledge is an essential element in the structure of human civilzation; it is the foundation upon which modern industrialism and all the moral, intellectual, technological, and therapeutical achievements of the last centuries have been built. It rests with men whether they will make the proper use of of the rich treasure with which this knowledge provides them or whether they will leave it unused. But if they fail to take the best advantage of it and disregard its teachings and warnings, they will not annul economics; they will stamp out society and the human race."

marlow

marlow

Now you're lying

Here's your quote "80% reduction in population" Where in the world did you pick that number from? You're the one who is talking about reducing the population. The movie and the proponents of a no money system all have never talked about reducing the population. That's why I wrote your money system sounds deadly because you're the ONLY one talking about culling the population. Good luck with your death cult. Oh yeah, mises isn't my savior and neither is peter joseph-but I know a good idea when I see one-especially an idea that's being demonstrated around the world today. Mises might have a great economic model, but it leaves out the humanity kind of like our current system.

This isn't a "homesteading site".

This is just one more Zeitgeist thread and it was meant to be divisive from the get go.

If you're serious about homesteading, why not start a homesteading thread?

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

Did you even read the OP?

It was about a homesteading community. If you'd take a second and look down at the posters below the OP posts all about homesteaders who are living off the grid.

I have made several homesteading threads, and several other people have too, but they disappear cause everyone wants to complain rather than get some constructive work done.

This is the one thread about something constructive that's managed to stay on the homepage for awhile.

Good luck complaining about nothing important.

I found the discussion on geothermal power very interesting

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_(geology)

This is very exciting stuff. Unlimitied power.

Is there something wrong with an existance without greed ?

Money = greed

~Mikael / Peace, love, Light and unity ~

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Stop the NWO....It's just illumi..Naughty !

Money is a tool.

It does not equal greed.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

unless it = debt then it's a bomb

take a look around

Debt is not money.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

What about this movie?

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=debt+is+money&emb=0&aq=f#

(note the title: Money as Debt-explained pretty plainly the money situation since ancient times)

Are gold and silver debt?

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

that's not what we're against

gold and silver are not fiat currency. This is what gets people upset-they can't see the positives all they see is this horrible communist endgame. Gold and silver are commodities used to trade. They are real assets.
When people don't need to trade cause all their needs are taken care of then there won't be a need for trade to survive.

Like our forest-dwelling, animal-skin-wearing, ancestors?

You assume all will live in areas with plenty of water, good soil, and adequate hours of sunshine AND 80% of us are already dead.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

WTH?!!

I don't want to kill anyone-that's your words and I see your words appearing all over the place from other posters who want to use money still.
If you don't know about solar cells, wind energy, geothermal plants or wave farms then look that up. If you don't know that most of the manufacturing of anything can be automated then google it-there are printers that can make 3-d models of anything. Would it happen tomorrow? From these forums probaby not because people don't have the vision yet. Would it happen in sections? Yes, it already has. If you look down this forum the poster has pointed out alot of different communities that don't need money anymore for most of their needs.

Whatever misconceptions you have about living off the grid you don't know cause you haven't lived that way. Don't judge until you've done.

Exactly. Fiat money not printed by the government is debt

Money itself is, well, money.

"unless"

"Unless it"

Money = gold and silver. It is not debt -- ever.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

How many stores now

can you use gold and silver to buy with? You're living in a fairyland if you can go to your local grocery store and exchange your silver dollar for anything approaching the actual worth of that silver dollar in money. How many silver dealers are parked next to a grocery store?

I don't need to buy with gold and silver at the moment.

It hasn't come to that -- yet.

I'm ready, are you?

Seems to me that you are living in "fairyland" if you don't think at some point merchants won't accept hard money.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!

Oh I'm ready

But that's beside the point. Using gold and silver is a goal that's been stated repeatedly on this thread. As you mentioned you can't use gold and silver anywhere for its value except among precious metal dealers and friends. Using metal everywhere is a transitional goal and can be surpassed to no need for trade if we have our needs met by using the resources available. Green things in your pocket issued by a private corporation are always debt owed by you.
Until we get to sound money we always be debtors.

Good luck with that "no need for trade" thing.

I won't be around for your utopia. However, chances are, within the not-to-distant future, I will be using my junk silver to buy bulk goods.

___________

Lisa C.

Boston Tea Party
"Time to Party Like It's 1773!"

Charles Jay 2008.

Ron Paul "Sign Wave Across the USA" -- November 5th!