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Off Topic - buying a firearm need advice

Never owned a firearm before (with the exception of air rifles) and I was hoping to get one before the SHTF. Defense is my primary concern, hunting secondary. I can't spend much more than $500. What would y'all recommend?



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Keep it simple

Buy yourself a 12ga. shotgun. Ammo is cheap. Very effective weapon and you can hunt most game.

The rest of these guys are just confusing things.

I personally own a 12ga, 20ga, 9mm pistol, AK47, AR15.

Buy the 12ga. as your first weapon of choice.

Check out this site

Here is a new site were you can buy the firearm that you decide on an maybe get a used one a little cheaper.

www.thearmslist.com

its like craigs list only for guns!

Strength and Honor

RJ Harris
Constitutional Libertarian
www.rjharris2012.com

Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/RJHarrisOfficial

GET youself a cheap uberti

GET youself a cheap uberti cattleman 45 colt Very accurate for the price only 269.00pistolweee

Remington 870

Remington 870 ought to do it. Buy a variety of shells from bird shot to slugs depending on the application.

Otherwise find a good used Glock 19 9MM.

Ron Paul is my President.

I like short barrel shotguns and I have a cross bow.

The cross bow is just really cool , like in a brave heart sort of way :)
~Mikael / Peace, love, Light and unity ~

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Stop the NWO....It's just illumi..Naughty !

Just finished buying

From prior years, I already had a 22 rifle (small game, varmits) & 357 revolver (friggin cannon & way too much kick).

Bought a used 12ga pump ($300) and 200 rounds (33c each). ok
a used Taurus PT101 40sw semi-auto pistol ($390) and 1,000 rounds (23c each). sweet
a uses AK47 (Mak-90) 7.62x39 ($$375) and 1,000 rounds. (22c each) very sweet.

Still on the list is a scoped highpower (30 cal) rifle for large game - in case the need for meat arises.

For those that haven't been paying attention, ammo cost is rising rapidly, so...

I live in a very rural gated community with 16 housholds, consisting of 28 adults (most of whom are 2nd Amendment and personal property advocates and most of whom will be voting for Baldwin) on 2500 acres, and I am by far the least armed. But, I intend to become very competent with the firepower I have and am considering the process for permitted concealed carry (relatively easy, here). Challenges -1. convince horses that it's ok for me to shoot from their backs. 2. convince dogs to stay with me while shooting.

Ron Paul - Hope for America

Ron Paul - Hope for America

My firearm wishlist

I've been looking at guns on the Internet and here are the guns that I'm considering in order of priority:

1) Ruger LCP or the small Kel-Tech that fires 45 acp
2) 1911 Colt 45 or equivalent or Springfield XD 45 acp
3) Taurus Judge or equivalent
4) Some kind of rifle. 30-30? 30-06? 303? Lever action or bolt action?
5) Mossberg 500 12ga shotgun
6) SKS? Maybe? Do I need this?

I'll probably be buying these one at a time. Maybe one every two weeks or one per month.

What do you guys think? Lever action or bolt action? What caliber? Is 45 acp a good choice?

I'd really like for all of them to fire the same round, but we can't have everything. :)

Some kind of rifle. 30-30?

Some kind of rifle. 30-30? 30-06? 303? Lever action or bolt action?

Lever-action: Superior handling at close range.
Bolt-action: Superior ballistics with more powerful calibers.

Personally, I'd choose a Marlin 30-30. Fine rifle at a comfy price.

SKS? Maybe? Do I need this?

Only if you subscribe to the philosophy that a survival gun is one that shoots fast and in large quantity, and requires high-volume 'training'. I think a survival gun is one that shoots accurately and precisely, with a powerful slug, one round at a time.

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

Place around your hole/house 3 staggered sets

of M18A1 Claymores and/or OZM-72 mines combined with a damn good bug out route and your 1911 45acp on your hip.

Wow, I think you have raised the bar here.

"The strongest message can be sent by rejecting the two-party system, which in reality is a one-party system with no possible chance for the changes to occur which are necessary to solve our economic and foreign policy problems." -- Ron Paul, Sept. 10, 20

Ron Paul is my President.

Isn't this a simple equation?

Bigger = Better 8]

www.umake.it - The online forum where people help people live within their means

For the primary purpose

of "defense" and with a $500 budget, then there's a few options, based upon specific needs.
IF you need some moderate distance capability like 100+ yards, ability to penetrate most(not all) bulletproof body armor, want decent accuracy and reliability at lower cost, and feel comfortable with a 10-round magazine capacity, then the SKS would be a good choice. Use the remainder of the money for ammo and cleaning/maintenance supplies for it. You can get them under $300, and sometimes as low as $200. They are all "surplus" and even if new, they look old and have dents and dings and not real pretty usually. But they work. Do NOT change the magazine to the 30 round type, because the 30 round aftermarket magazines do not work well without alot of fiddling, and even then might not work 100%. Just use the factory fixed 10 round magazine, load from the top with stripper clips, and get the sight adjustment tool to sight it in. Alot of the older ammo is corrosive or mildly corrosive, so cleaning as soon after you use it as possible, is pretty important if you want it to keep working. Disassemble the gas system above the barrel(easy to do) each time and clean it thoroughly. along with the barrel chamber, bore, and bolt areas.
IMPORTANT!: If you get an SKS, chances are good that it is very heavily coated inside(and possibly outside too) with "cosmoline grease" to protect it from rust in long term storage. You MUST clean ALL of that stuff out of the gun with a bath and scrubbing with mineral spirits before attempting to use the gun. Clean all the metal parts real good inside and out. You can take the major functional assembly out of the wood stock quite easily for this kind of cleaning. It is very important to get all this cosmoline out of the SKS before you shoot it. It's in there because it was a stored military surplus weapon. It needs to all be cleaned out before use.
Then, just lightly oil the pins and moving parts with a little oil when you reassemble it. Wipe the whole gun down with a slightly oily rag on all the metal before putting it in your closet.

You can get similar performance with a reliable 30 round magazine from a Romanian WASR, for about the same money. It won't be quite as accurate as the SKS, but still within combat accuracy. Same cleaning requirements because it uses the same ammo type.

If shorter distances are the norm, and you don't need to penetrate body armor, and you might want to shoot birds for survival, a good pump shotgun from most any of the name-brand manufacturers would be fine. 12ga, would be the most popular and useful selection. With a shotgun, it's the selection of shells which define the purpose of the gun. You can get ammo for birds and squirrels, all the way up to buckshot and slugs for large game/defense. Very versatile. Kicks pretty hard.

If you must use the gun primarily in concealment under a jacket, then a pistol would suit that need. A pistol is not nearly as competent a weapon as a rifle or shotgun, but sometimes special needs dictate concealability.
Pistols as a general rule, will not defeat body armor, except for some very specialized types. Caliber is personal decision. I like .45ACP, but others can be just as good.

Whatever you get, make sure you have enough money left over to get at least 500 rounds of ammunition. And some cleaning and maintenance stuff.

LEARN HOW TO USE IT before the SHTF!!!!!
Trying to learn to use the gun when somebody is trying to kill you is not the approved method.

There really isn't any right

There really isn't any right or wrong choice. There really isn't any consensus on what does or does not make a "powerful gun".

A lot of people think a powerful gun is a Colt AR-15 with ten thirty-round magazines, backed up by an autopistol with three extra fifteen-round magazines. They are aficionados of the paramilitary firearm concept.

I think a powerful gun is a bolt action or lever action hunting rifle that can score a potent hit at 300 yards, backed up by a magnum revolver loaded with semi-wadcutter hollowpoints. I believe being 'loaded for bear' means carrying something you would use to hunt a bear.

A lot of people swear by the versatility and power of a .12 gauge pump shotgun. A shotgun is not a long range weapon, but very little violence--or hunting--generally takes place beyond 100 yards in 'real life'. Most combat takes place at a range of less than ten yards. At that distance, the pump shotgun is a fearsome weapon. It has the bonus of being the best weapon for hunting small game and birds for the cooking pot; something any survivalist should care about.

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

I think I've been convinced to look at "The Judge"!

I think I've been convinced to look at "The Judge"pistol! You can get a lever action rifle in 45 long colt and get a 410 shotgun, 3 guns and you'll have it all. Just two calibers to get and you are set. No long range ability but a good start for a beginner.
I just went to look at "The Judge" http://www.taurususa.com/products/product-details.cfm?id=638... what and impressive gun, 2lbs of total H*LL. I'm going to get one for my wife. She likes guns, but this one she should love. I might not even give it to her.

____________________________________________________
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You're all bankrupt corporate trusts under the S.S.N. and because the bankrupt government created corporations they, the banksters(receivers) have the RIGHT to control you. Go back to your private Christian names or natural names, if you will, and live in the REPUBLIC.

JonQ.Publik

Live Free or Die, because if you're not FREE you're dead already!

JonQ.Publik

Resistance is not futile, what's futile is non-resistance.

Live Free or Die! Because if you are not free you’re dead already!

What I found on the AR-15

Very motivating!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhtTHAv0HSc
__________________________________________________________
"The real terrorist's are in this country and they are not planning to blow us up, but rather, take our money, our freedom, and our country."

__________________________________________________________
"The real terrorist's are in this country. They are not planning to blow us up,......... but rather, take our money, our freedom, and our country."

Nice

"The strongest message can be sent by rejecting the two-party system, which in reality is a one-party system with no possible chance for the changes to occur which are necessary to solve our economic and foreign policy problems." -- Ron Paul, Sept. 10, 2008

Ron Paul is my President.

I just want to make one point here

If you are worried only about home intruders... as in... normal, "peaceful", every day crime times like right now... Then it really is a situation where pretty much any gun will do the job... even a .22 lr rifle. Most people in times like now, will turn away at the sight of any firearm in your hands.

If you're talking about home intruders, in a scenerio where there is chaos, mobs roaming the street, martial law type stuff... then I think the .22 lr is a horrible suggestion... for anyone. You aren't going to be worried about overpenetration... going through walls. It may come down to kill or be killed. Don't take a BB gun to the fight. And yes, a .22 lr is considered a BB gun in my opinion against the threat you'd face in this scenerio. I don't care how many people have been killed with one.. I wouldn't want to bet my life one on in that situation.

And honestly, you weigh 250 lbs. Learn the proper stance, lean into the shot, and you can easily handle a good amount of recoil. You have enough weight to absorb it good. I don't even weigh 190 lbs and firing slugs and buckshot are no problem for me. If you get a shotgun, I highly suggest replacing the recoil pad with a LIMBSAVER brand recoil pad. Get one that has the speedmount coating... such as this one.

http://www.limbsaver.com/products/Firearms/speed.php

That pad will make it easier to mount the gun to your shoulder, and it will not catch your clothing and stick to it. The top and bottom are cut down a bit so it's not square, and it has a slick coating on it so it slides easier on clothes. I'm tellin you, these reduce recoil so much it's not even funny. It turned my hard kicking 12 guage into just a firm push. Remember, it's all about how you hold the gun, how you stand, and whether you lean into the shot so your body absorbs the recoil properly. They make these for many shotguns and rifles too. They say they reduce felt recoil by something close to 70%, and I believe it.

In the end, buy what you want. All I am saying is don't buy less than you need, and don't feel like you have to get the absolute most powerful gun either. I just know that too little, can leave you in a dangerous situation if shit really hits the fan.

For Home defense get a ....

Shot gun, and try and get yourself a 357 revolver.

You know, I have a lot of different weapons

but the one that I find myself carrying the most is a snub-nosed Smith and Wesson 5 shot .38 special with low recoil hollow point ammo.

--------------------------------
"the only thing that keeps the banking system from failing is general ignorance about how the banking system works."
----------------------------

Thats my....

favorite also. It carries well, packs a good punch and would be hard for someone to take it away from you, even if they are stronger than you. +p ammo makes it hard to hold on to. You and I must think alike.

affirmation: President Paul

affirmation: President Paul 2008

Mossberg 590

affirmation: President Paul 2008

the absolute best rifle for

the absolute best rifle for defense and hunting is a Springfield M1A. I hit 800 yard targets with crappy 1950's ammo and Iron sights consistantly!
If I were dropped on a Hostile planet and could have only 1 weapon that would be it! this is also the professional opinion of a navy seal sniper friend of mine! but you are lucky to find one for under 1200.00. the magazines are 30.00 apiece and 308 ammo is expensive. but this rifle will work in any condition! I love my m4 also ... but the M1A rules!

"When governments fear the people there is liberty. When the people fear the government there is tyranny."
-Thomas Jefferson

I am more concerned about the return of my money than the return on my money. --Mark Twain

pump shotgun

can get them for cheap, no registration needed usually...plus rounds are dirt cheap.

"Truth is treason in the empire of lies." - Ron Paul

Buy one at a gun show and

Buy one at a gun show and there's no paperwork at all--I think at WalMart and other stores, you will have to fill out a form, won't you?

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

Not necessarily!

I think most gun shows require paperwork. If you managed to find a private seller there wouldn't be any paperwork.

I bought a Mossberg 500 20-gauge shotgun in February at a gun show. I had to fill out paperwork and he had to call in and have a background check done on me.

I wouldn't have submitted to

I wouldn't have submitted to a background check for a pump shotgun.

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

SUPPORT OUR FOUNDERS' AMERICA
Support the Constitution of the United States

I asked.

a friend of mine who is a hunter as well and for someone who is wanting an affordable but reliable rifle he said Winchester model 94 30-30.
Good Rifle and reliable. Fun too.
SKS he said are cheap but for someone who wants a little more precision, the winchester is a good one.
He told me Marlin makes them too.
__________________________________________________________
"The real terrorist's are in this country and they are not planning to blow us up, but rather, take our money, our freedom, and our country."

__________________________________________________________
"The real terrorist's are in this country. They are not planning to blow us up,......... but rather, take our money, our freedom, and our country."

If you are going hunting

and want to bag a deer, then the 30-30 round would be more effective. If you are in a defensive situation, then the added firepower of a semi-auto and faster reloading capability of the SKS will prove advantageous. Any combat veteran knows that engagements are usually within a 50 yard range. At close ranges such as this, firepower can make all the difference between life and death. An added benefit of the SKS is the numerous after market high capacity magazines available. Also, I don't know the experience that your friend has with the SKS, but the ones I have fired would match with accuracy against any rifle and especially against a Winchester. In fact, most SKS rifles of European manufacture are at match grade accuracy.

Yeah,....

I agree,........I was debating with my friend about it, and eventually told me I might as well get an AK-47 in a situation that is more tense and I agree with you, pumping more rounds out is more effective in a "chaotic" atmosphere.
I told him though we also got to think budget. Another friend of mine who is a collector said SKS's are fun, so..........SKS seems like a rifle I will go with!
Not only that, I saw all kinds of options for it.
Man, we had a chance to get a bunch of AK's in Iraq but there was this stupid order about pillaging and spoils of war.
Instead they burned/ blew them up.
It sucked because all the officers got to take some home as "War Trophies"
We did all the work and they get the spoils, another reason why I hate the politics of the military, especially in the Marine Corps.

__________________________________________________________
"The real terrorist's are in this country and they are not planning to blow us up, but rather, take our money, our freedom, and our country."

__________________________________________________________
"The real terrorist's are in this country. They are not planning to blow us up,......... but rather, take our money, our freedom, and our country."