Alternative Answers for Improving Education in Poor Communities
Dear Fellow Revolutionaries,
I had a very heated conversation with a college professor who lives in my neighborhood in Brooklyn, NY. He is a die hard socialist and is proud of it. He thinks that any argument that involves a movement toward less government is immoral and completely wrong. In his mind, wherever there are problems within government, the correct solution is more government, more regulation, more control, etc... Among many other topics, we got into a heated conversation about the education system. He is posing me with a simple question and I need all of your most thoughtful answers. The more references you can use the better. Here's the question:
In poor neighborhoods where families can't afford alternatives (i.e. Harlem, NYC), what immediate, practical solutions are there for improving the quality of education other than providing better public schooling and more government support.
This guy is incredibly stubborn in his views. He needs some serious convincing. I asked for a few days to do some research. Your thoughts are very much appreciated. Also, if you have links to any material I could give him concerning the corruption of the Federal Reserve that would be quite welcomed.
Thank you so much,
Jesse
Several premise problems with his question
1. The assumption of poor. People in the poorest parts of the USA still have access to better education opportunities than other countries do...and yet some of those other countries out perform us. Why? They have a culture that values education. If the government can change the culture of poor communities to value education more, the problem would be solved. The government knows this and still, purposesly, does not do this. They actually create a culture that devalues education.
So ultimately, if we just get the federal government out of the way, the culture would improve. That is why Ron Paul wants to eliminate the Department of Education.
2. The premise that the quality of education opportunities/facilities motivates children to learn. Sure they should be secure, but if the children are raised in a culture that devalues education, the children simply will not learn.
Also, professors, like most people, tend to want others to be like them. Thus, professors, who would take advantage of great education facilities, actually believe that everyone else would (or worse, should) too.
Again, mostly this is a cultural problem. And not one that a staff of well-intentioned teachers can solve...especially with the current of anti-education propaganda pushed by the federal government and the waves of enablers: the NAACP, entertainer/athletic role models, news and music media, and parents of these children.
I believe this culture was created by the fed government, but it was perpetuated longer than the fed gov wanted. Thus, the rise of Obama. Obama's success has already substantially undone much of this social engineering. The Civil Rights, victim-based, anti-white (thus, anti-white's education) culture has lost its grip...thus, Jesse Jackson's disdain for Obama. Obama's rise is obviously forced, thus the powers that be (the fed gov) are pulling strings once again...and it will probably work.
So the fed gov actually has begun to effectively undo what it did to these cultures...without throwing money at it. Just propping up a decent role model...a token.
But still, all the fed gov wishes to do is add blacks to the hyper-productive culture that whites, asians, latinos, etc. are subject to. So another premise of the professor's question is: why would we want to prepare them to join the "work your life away for others" culture. Please know that most professors are people that saw this hyper-productive culture and stayed the fuck away from it.
He'll probably say that education is a good thing...and it is...but government schools are NOT just education facilities, they are also indoctrination centers...largely due to the federal government's department of education.
Lastly: Before government education was forced on us, those that really wanted an education got one. Nothing stopped such people.
Public education was not meant to create thinkers, just a skilled labor force...and that has never changed! US public education was created by the massive corporatations of the late19th century (Rockafellers, Carnegie, etc.). In 1906, the first mission statement of the General Education Board read:
"In our dreams, people yield themselves with perfect docility to our molding hands. The present educational conventions [intellectual and character education] fade from our minds, and unhampered by tradition we work our own good will upon a grateful and responsive folk. We shall not try to make these people or any of their children into philosophers or men of learning or men of science. We have not to raise up from among them authors, educators, poets or men of letters. We shall not search for embryo great artists, painters, musicians, nor lawyers, doctors, preachers, politicians, statesmen, of whom we have ample supply. The task we set before ourselves is very simple ... we will organize children ... and teach them to do in a perfect way the things their fathers and mothers are doing in an imperfect way."
If you have a hard time believing this indoctrination intention, it's time to meet William Torrey Harris, US Commissioner of Education from 1889 to 1906. Listen as he speaks in 1906:
"Ninety-nine [students] out of a hundred are automata, careful to walk in prescribed paths, careful to follow the prescribed custom. This is not an accident but the result of substantial education, which, scientifically defined, is the subsumption of the individual."
-The Philosophy of Education (1906)..
Some of you recognize these quotes as from the Underground History of American Education.
If you think that only poor parts of our country have been subject to horrific social engineering, you couldn't be further from the truth. Everyone please read this free book online:
http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/underground/toc1.htm
What I don't
understand is why aren't these people marching? Why aren't they demanding accountability? I say get the federal government out of the way and let the local districts take over (parents). If I was in their situation I would make sure I read to my child every day. I would utilize the library. If I as a parent couldn't read, I would make sure I could. We all have choices to make. If we make our child's education a priority, they are going to succeed. I think what it comes down to is everyone believes the government should do it all. They should feed me, educate my children, pay me not to work, etc.. There has to be a fundamental shift in these people's beliefs. Why aren't they listening to people like Bill Cosby instead of Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson? There are lots of people who homeschool on very little money. Even if you are poor there are ways. You have to make it a priority. Where there is a will there is a way.
Where there is a will
there is a way. My husband came from a VERY poor large family. There was a lot of arguing in the family and he would ride his junk bike to the library and stay all day long. He graduated top of his class, he went on to get a engineering degree. His only government help was having a small town library.
Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.
Where there is a WIll, There is an A
Due to my upbringing, I used to be a solid B student.
I took the Where there is a Will, There is an A course and became a solid A student.
The course taught me some important study skills, but the real change came from my decision to change my ways...the course merely was a safe vehicle from which I confronted and overcame my cultural teachings. From then my relationships changed, what I watched/listened to changed, how I thought changed. I started valuing principles over people. And that change in thinking is what led me to Ron Paul.
I hear lots of Ron Paul supporters saying that we have to educate people. And that is true, but we also have to provide that safe vehicle for people to doubt their Democrat or Republican culture. The reason they ignore us and call us kooky is to prevent the Revolution from being a safe vehicle.
You have to remember that the US government schools have created a nation of nervous, whining adolescents in adult bodies...we are literally denied the understandings needed to escape childhood. Observe how the Dem and Pub's media creates a safe environment for those that have joined and how they use childish peer pressure to make fun of those that don't join. People don't care much about the truth...only that they will still 'fit in' with others the next day.
Observe how you or others react when a 'boss' comes down on someone. What happened to an equal trade of service for money? Instead, we have a master/slave relationship. Why don't more people say "If you don't like my performance, you can end our business relationship whenever you want. But you will not speak to me as if you have some kind of upper hand on me. If you do that again, I will end this business relationship." People don't say such things because they really think they can't live without being dependent on others...cuz they sure as hell can't take care of themselves...they still think they need a mommy and daddy. Thus, people put up with government crap, crap at work, crap from spouses and other family members, become hyper-productive for others and never themselves...for themselves they become hyper-consumeristic, get into debt, and thus further into bondage.
I have researched this quite a bit and there is really only two
reasonable solutions to accountability. The lack thereof is the root cause of poor urban education. (Reasonable with respect to doable. This does not denote the best solution. The best solution would be found by the marketplace.)
1. Vouchers is the easiest to impliment, but the hardest to get passed.
2. Most states restrict school district size to the size of the municipalities. For example; here in Cincinnati, we have 7 very large neighborhoods, but the school district encompasses the entire city. If it were legal to split the district into 7 individual districts there would be a huge increase in accountability. Every single study that has studied this has cited the large size of urban school districts as one of the root causes.
So there are two battles. One against the dug-in education beauracracy and the other is at the state level and state law.
WAHOR!!
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/48994
WAHOR!!
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/48994
Accountability
Accountability can never come from above, it must always come from below. If bigger governments are de facto better, then perhaps he would advocate the UN deciding the zoning for your neighborhood.
Heck, even Obama (sort of) has the right idea:
"One of the ... tragedies of the civil rights movement was, um, because the civil rights movement became so court focused I think there was a tendency to lose track of the political and community organizing and activities on the ground"
I think the reason that most people are socialist is 1) our parents, because they love us no matter what we do, inculcate us with the Marxist labor theory of value - that if you work hard (even on hopelessly useless works), you will get just desserts. 2) because neocons - who advocate managed, mercantilistic markets anyway - have bastardized the Adam Smith's "invisible hand" precept into saying "greed makes everything work out". That is not what Smith says, Smith says that individuals seeking optimal value for an object of acquisition or dispensation, acting selfishly in the arena of transaction, will together but independently, correctly set the net social exchange value of that object, if they operate in a free market environment.
That is to say, markets are not the optimal way to solve all of society's problems: Markets are simply the optimal way to set the price/value of something.
I am a hard core defender of capitalism but every friday, at expense to myself, I go and feed people who are suffering; that's because it has personal value to me in a way that exceeds the material cost. And, I want government to get the hell out of my way when I do stuff like that. I also don't want government competition. When you are indirectly forced to be charitable (through taxation) it means less, in a spiritual sense, than when you give it of your own free will. If anyone wonders why people aren't charitable anymore, it's because a) inflation makes people have to keep running the rat race to survive, and b) because government, after taxation, and direct competitive action, leaves very little room for the individual to be charitable.
PS We all should have no fundamental problems with Obama's notions of redistribution of wealth. We just don't want government to do it. We want citizens to do it of their own volition, and, through the marketplace of charitable organizations, achieve stronger oversight of how their own money is redistributed, so that it might get redistributed somewhat responsibly.
PPS I have an essay on the fed that is simple comprehensive, and from the point of view of "how the fed hurts the poor". If you want it to send to your friend, just email me at (my handle on this forum) at yahoo.
Stop stealing from people to fund one size fits all
education programs and let the parents decide how best to help the kids learn. Cirricula are widely available and even free on the internet. Socialized education has proved itself a failure and is distorting the cost of education in a free market.
Shut it down.
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
Very well said!
HYDROMAN
"Since 1789 the only government on Earth that has the power to crush the American people`s liberties across the board is the government of the United States"
Robert Higgs
ditto.
take away all the regulations and education will flourish both public and private
h-daddy
what immediate, practical
In my opinion, the solution to this problem does not originate in the schools. The best quality of education cannot replace the lack of desire of the individual to be educated. It's sad, but true. The desire to become educated is on the front lines of this issue.
Next, I believe that creating a free market type education system would do wonders. This can be accomplished via school voucher systems where parents could choose which schools receive the education tax money that is allocated for their children.
Force these schools to compete. When competition is introduced the poorest performing and least efficient schools/teachers will not be able to keep up. The failing schools will fail, as they should, and will be replaced by school systems that actually deserve the payment for the service provided.
I do not have any sources to cite for this information as it came directly from me.
...
You are 100% correct. Here
You are 100% correct.
Here is the problem though, you only get one chance at childhood, and any mistakes, while not necessarily irreparable, can be, and people do not seem to want to take that risk.
So, what happens is that instead of letting a school fail here and there, screwing over a few hundred kids once in a blue moon, we let all of the schools sag together, and screw over everyone, but, thankfully, not as much as those few hundred kids would have had to screw up.
I don't know how to feel about public schools. I went to a public school and turned out pretty phenomenal (If I may say so myself). But, I was also really lucky.
At the very least, control of the public schools should be localized. It it a surprise that NYC has one of the highest per pupil spending rates but has some of the worst schools in the nation? of course not. Most of that money gets lost in the rediculous mountain of bureaucracy sitting on top of the schools. Of the top 10 per pupil spending districts in the nation, all of them are atrocious, except, as it turns out, my school district, which operates fantastic schools because there are only 3 high schools of 1000 students each in the district (and the district is an even mix of poor, wealthy, and middle class). Basically the reason why it works is the district is incredibly responsive to its needs. And it has a school board (instead of a commissioner) so that bureaucracy is slowed down. There's still petty politics and BS flying around (but that happens at private schools, too) but it gets taken care of fairly quickly.
lack of desire to educate themselves
Our society and culture is based on convenience. Most people would rather not use thier minds if they had a choice. Let the sheeple run off the cliff. It benefits all in return!
“Everyone wants to live at the expense of the state. They forget that the state wants to live at the expense of everyone.” - Bastiat
I think you'd be surprised
how many people would have their testicles descend suddenly when their government teat was taken from them
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
Unless more government is offered
which is what they will eventually beg for
“Everyone wants to live at the expense of the state. They forget that the state wants to live at the expense of everyone.” - Bastiat
Refer to signature line below
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
'Live for yourself, there's no one else more worth living for,
Begging hands and bleeding hearts
Will only cry out for more...'
Also, go to Charlotte Iserbyt's website...
Here is the link...http://www.deliberatedumbingdown.com/index.html
Make sure to click on "video clips" and watch her interviews! Very enlightening!
Info on corruption of the FED
http://www.fdrs.org/federal_reserve_fraud.html
The Federal Reserve System is nothing but absolute corruption.
In fact, on May 23, 1933, Congressman, Louis T. McFadden, brought formal charges against the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve Bank system, the Comptroller of the Currency and the Secretary of United States Treasury for numerous criminal acts, including but not limited to, CONSPIRACY, FRAUD, UNLAWFUL CONVERSION, AND TREASON.
“Mr. Chairman, we have in this Country one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board and the Federal Reserve Banks, hereinafter called the Fed.
Just tell him to look around
in Harlem to see what a splendid job the centralized department of education has done. For a good introduction to the Federal Reserve, show him Money as Debt--you can find it on YouTube or Google video--it was created by a socialist, he'll probably enjoy it.
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"the only thing that keeps the banking system from failing is general ignorance about how the banking system works."
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Your neighbor lives on tax money.
It's not at all surprising that he advocates more government. You're not going to convince him.
-jcr
"The problem with trying to child-proof the world, is that it makes people neglect the far more important task of world-proofing the child." -- Hugh Daniel
ditto
How do people like that get up in the morning and look at themselves in the mirror??
You might also read about how Maria Montessori had tremendous
success using her method on the so-called "uneducable" children in the slums of Rome. Google away.
Read the essays of John Taylor Gatto...
I think you can also read his books online. He was NYC Teacher of the Year 3x and NY State Teacher of the Year in '91. Here is the link to his website... http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/
Murray Rothbard-Education Free and Compulsory..
also anything by Jay Greene, Carol Huxby, Martin L. Gross, and theres also The Twelve Year Sentence-Radical Views on Compulsory Teaching get em at your tax supported public library. Theres alsoa video on Youtube called "Stupid in America" by John Stossel and Milton Friedmans Free to Choose Series has one episode in which he debates the educationists also on youtube.