Questions for conspiracy theorists

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Preface: I do not disagree with folks and their conspiracy theories, I just think that the DP is the wrong place for loitering conspiracy aficionados. I feel that it's disrespectful to RP and counter productive to the very thing that would help expose all the corruption on a grand scale ie. hack at he root and not the branches. Still I have a few questions.

If the MSM is completely evil and owned by evil powers, why do they EVER let RP on to discuss issues?

What would have been the motivation for blowing up WTC7 a day after the main towers fell?

If the all powerful literati controls everything why would they allow 9/11 videos to be played on YouTube?

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What Is A "Conspiracy Theory?"

Something you don't agree with, or don't like?

________________________________________________
"Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." -- Joseph Goebbels

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"Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." -- Joseph Goebbels

this guy is jerking us around

Or are yousaul,noelle,slapshot???hmmmm

WTC7

did not "blow up" a day after the towers fell. It was "pulled" later that afternoon. In fact here's a BBC news clip that reports the fall of WTC7 20 min before it actually falls.
Do you find this at all troubling?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgLxMLaWJuQ

Here is Larry Silverstein telling you that he ordered the building "pulled" and then watched the building fall.
Do you find this at all troubling?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WYdAJQV100

People who live in denial need to wake up. The masters don't even try to hide what happens, Its just that some people refuse to believe that true evil exists.

WTC7 = Flight 93 target(?)

Since the building was already rigged with explosives leads me to believe that it was the target of Flight 93. If a plane has hit it, it would have looked like the exact same scenario as the other two buildings.

...

"I think, therefore I am pissed-off!"

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...

Enjoy www.freetalklive.com

WTC7

What really is scary is the list of tenants that occupied that building!

http://www.wtc7.net/background.html

Nice details;


"How curious that on the day of the attack, Guiliani and his entourage set up shop in a different headquarters, abandoning the special bunker designed precisely for such an event."


Ron Paul's Convention Speech

When U.S. Joint Chiefs Planned Terror Attacks on America

by Edward Spannaus

According to documents that were intended to have been destroyed almost 40 years ago, top levels of the U.S. military proposed carrying out acts of terrorism against the United States in the early 1960s, in order to drag the United States into a war against Cuba.

These documents take on added significance in light of the Sept. 11 attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon, which were clearly intended, among other things, to drag the United States into a "Clash of Civilizations" war in the Middle East. As Lyndon LaRouche has stressed, the Sept. 11 attacks could not have been carried out without complicity from rogue elements in military/security circles inside the United States.

Operation Northwoods
The first comprehensive published account of the 1962 documents, is contained in James Bamford's book on the National Security Agency, Body of Secrets: Anatomy of the Ultra-Secret National Security Agency, released in late Spring of this year. Bamford concluded that the Joint Chiefs of Staff "proposed launching a secret and bloody war of terrorism against their own country in order to trick the American public into supporting an ill-conceived war they intended to launch against Cuba."

Bamford's account is based on documents which were ordered declassified by the Assassination Records Review Board, and subsequently released by the National Archives within the past few years. EIR has obtained the relevant documents and has independently reviewed them, and we can confirm that there is no exaggeration in Bamford's description of these documents as containing proposals for U.S. military agencies to carry out terrorist actions against the United States and attacks on U.S. military facilities.

The time period in question, Winter-Spring of 1962, is bounded by the CIA's failed Bay of Pigs invasion of April 1961—an operation which had been set into motion under the previous Eisenhower Administration—and the Cuba Missile Crisis of October 1962.

The terrorism plan was called "Operation Northwoods," and it was drawn up after President John F. Kennedy had shifted responsibility for dealing with Cuba, in late 1961, from the CIA to the Department of Defense (DOD), in the aftermath of the Bay of Pigs. The overall Pentagon project was known as "Operation Mongoose," and was the responsibility of Edward Lansdale (a CIA man who was Deputy Director of the Pentagon's Office of Special Operations at the time), and the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (JSC), Gen. Lyman Lemnitzer, a holdover from the Eisenhower Administration.

The military planners led by Lemnitzer wanted to launch a full-scale invasion of Cuba to overthrow Castro—and perhaps, as well, they were anxious to show that they could succeed where the CIA had failed. Lemnitzer and others were also extremely distrustful of the new administration—especially after the Bay of Pigs, in which there were allegations that President Kennedy had refused to provide air support at the last minute (although it has since been documented that this was not Kennedy's decision). The top military brass were accusing the Kennedy Administration of "going soft" on Castro, and their plans for a "pretext" operation to justify an attack on Cuba must be seen in this light.

Pretexts for Military Invasion
The planning culminated in a series of memoranda and recommendations which were addressed in their final form by Lemnitzer to Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara, on March 13, 1962—although it is not certain McNamara ever received them. (Last April, the Baltimore Sun quoted McNamara saying, "I never heard of it. I can't believe the Chiefs were talking about or engaged in what I would call CIA-type operations.")

Lemnitzer's covering memorandum states that the Joint Chiefs of Staff "have considered" an attached memorandum, which is a "description of pretexts which would provide justification for military intervention in Cuba." He says that he assumed "that a single agency will be given primary responsibility for developing military and para-military aspects of the basis plan," and he recommends that this responsibility be assigned to the Joint Chiefs.

The attached memorandum, entitled "Justification for U.S. Military Intervention in Cuba," says that it is assumed that a political decision for a U.S. military intervention "will result from a period of heightened U.S.-Cuban tensions which place the United States in the position of suffering justifiable grievances." World opinion and the United Nations "should be favorably affected by developing the image of the Cuban government as rash and irresponsible, and as an alarming and unpredictable threat to the peace of the Western Hemisphere."

The proposed pretext actions should take place within the next few months, while it is still likely that the Soviet Union would not intervene, the memorandum declares, noting that there is "as of yet no bilateral mutual support agreement binding the U.S.S.R. to the defense of Cuba," that Cuba is not yet a member of the Warsaw Pact, and that the Soviets have not yet established major bases in Cuba.

What then follows, is a series of proposals for actions which would be used to provide the justification for U.S. military intervention.

`Blow Up A Ship ...'
The first proposal is for "a series of well-coordinated incidents" to take place in and around the U.S. Navy base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba; these were to include having friendly Cubans dress in Cuban military uniforms to start riots at the base, blow up ammunition inside the base, to start fires, to burn aircraft on the air base, to sabotage a ship in the harbor, and to sink a ship near the harbor entrance.

That was just the start. The next proposal elaborated: "A 'Remember the Maine' incident could be arranged.... We could blow up a U.S. ship in Guantanamo Bay and blame Cuba," or blow up a drone ship in Cuban waters. The memorandum coldly predicted: "Casualty lists in U.S. newspapers would cause a helpful wave of national indignation."

The memorandum continues:

"We could develop a Communist Cuba terror campaign in the Miami area, in other Florida cities and even in Washington. The terror campaign could be pointed at Cuban refugees seeking haven in the United States. We could sink a boatload of Cubans en route to Florida (real or simulated). We could foster attempts on the lives of Cuban refugees in the United States...."

"Exploding a few plastic bombs in carefully chosen spots, the arrests of Cuban agents and the release of prepared documents also would be helpful...."

Among other actions proposed were to use fake Soviet MiG aircraft to harass civil aircraft, to attack surface shipping, and to destroy U.S. military drone aircraft. "Hijacking attempts against civil air and surface craft" were also suggested, and then—the most elaborated plan of all—to simulate the shooting down of a chartered civil airliner in Cuban airspace.

President Kennedy rejected the plan, and Lemnitzer directed that all the pertinent documents be destroyed. Nevertheless, some of the documents did survive, although hidden by heavy classification for decades.

To the astute reader, the potential parallels with recent events should be chilling.

More at ...

http://larouchepub.com/other/2001/2839operation_northwds.html

http://www.baltimoresun.com/bal-te.md.nsa24apr24.story

http://www.salon.com/books/review/2001/04/25/nsa

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

Just a few numbers that make 9/11 conspiracies nearly impossible

J.L. Hudson’s in Detroit, Michigan, the tallest building ever razed, was 439 ft. (26 stories)
http://www.implosionworld.com/records.htm

WTC 7 was 570 ft. (47 stories) 1.3 times the height of the J.L. Hudson. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/7_World_Trade_Center

WTC 1/2 was 1,368 ft. (110 stories) 3.12 times the height of J.L. Hudson.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1_World_Trade_Center
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2_World_Trade_Center

So, on 9/11, three buildings were razed with perfect precision. One was 131 ft. taller than the record tower and the other two (minus cell phone antennas) were 929 ft. taller than the record holder.

The Hudson Building “It took us 24 days with 12 people doing nothing but loading explosives…” James Santoro – Controlled Demolition Incorporated"
http://www.history.com/media.do?id=most_hudsons_implosion_br...

Even according to the Loose Change guys, the heightened security and bomb-sniffing dogs had only been lifted for 5 days.

Of course, the construction is different and the towers would need less explosives if they were the same height. However, the towers were much taller and had more columns to cut as a result. Even if they did have the same amount of columns it would still take over 72 days with 12 people doing nothing but loading explosives. That's just one building. Add the second tower and WTC7 and you see where this is going. It quickly becomes absurd. As if this absurdly complex plan was the ONLY way to scare Americans.
http://www.debunking911.com/freefall.htm

P.S.

Your debunking911.com site that addresses these issues is equally as absurd. Those guys sure do try their darndest to prove the impossible though. What a huge challenge that must have been to come up with all those explanations and equations to pass a falsehood off as truth. Just can't be done though.

bullsh!t

..therefore, the only possible explanation could be what our dear government tells us.

Believe your government, and shut-up!

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"I think, therefore I am pissed-off!"

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...

Enjoy www.freetalklive.com

Disagreed.

You fail to explain how NORAD, on that particular day, was unable to even come close to intercepting at least one of the 4 commercial aircraft hijacked and in the air for over 45 min. Our airspace is the most well-protected of any in the WORLD and you expect me to believe they just let them slip by?? How can a building collapse towards the path of most resistance? Why did 3 buildings collapse in on themselves in a fashion that takes computer-controlled demolition precision? How can jet fuel (4/5 kerosene) burn hot enough to melt through structural steel (or any steel for that matter)? Why was there molten metal for WEEKS after 9-11 being uncovered by the ground zero workers if only a few floors burned? Why are there witnesses reporting explosions in the BASEMENT of BOTH towers BEFORE ANY PLANES HIT??? How can ANY steel structure collapse due to fire, something that has NEVER happened before OR after 9/11? I'm not sure, but I do know that no steel structure ON 9/11 collapsed due to fire either.

Now you are asking us to believe that people who have unlimited resources, billions of dollars at their disposal, and many many years' time to plan would be unable to place all those explosives in enough time? Is that really how you plan to convert the masses to your way of thinking? Your explanation, upon reading, is the only thing that quickly became absurd to me.

"So, on 9/11, three buildings were razed with perfect precision." Are you telling me that now instead of using explosives to raze buildings with perfect precision, we can just crash planes into them or better yet, just set them on fire and achieve the same effect???

I have my own question for conspiracy theorists.

Why is Castro still alive?

Because

he plays the game.

Sniff, Sniff...

This rusty ol' buick kinda smells like a... TROLL!

www.Umake.it - The online resource for the Hand Made Society

Say "hello" everyone to rustybuick,......

President and Founder of the Illiterati!

Rustybuick doesn't fish...he only cuts bait!

You might even call him a "master- baiter"!

* He has and never will have any intention of seriously contemplating any evidence contrary to what he already believes...hes not going to "fish"
any evidence you post!

* He is just sitting back laughing at you who "took the bait"
on this post which is merely for his own "master-baition" at successfully creating a never ending discussion of division.

Thats just my 2 cents... and I'm sticking to it! Now...can we just move along?
**********
"Thomas Jefferson is rolling in his grave fast enough to be a new source of energy independence."~ samthurston

http://www.campaignforliberty.com/

"I think we are living in a world of lies: lies that don't even know they are lies, because they are the children and grandchildren of lies." ~ Chris Floyd

Please ignore the following

The following are topics that for quite a while were considered tin foil hatters realm.

1) Anthrax attacks. Originally the msm and public yelled that al-queda did it, they do all terrorism just like the media tells me. Wrong, it was done by an insider.

2) Gulf war syndrome. It's all in your head, you must have had a pre-existing condition before signed up, sorry go die of cancer on your own time and money. Yesterday the federal government owned up to their complicity. It was shots administered to protect from nerve gas. Until yesterday trusting the government meant calling those vets crazy, which sounds like something you wouldn't have an issue with doing.

Again, just ignore those two things, they don't exist. Bad things are never done by people in compartmentalized parts of the military industrial complex. All is well, go back to calling people conspiracy theorists.

As for the 9/11 commission and their conspiracy theory it comes down to me just not trusting the investigators. They tried to push Kissinger on us. Then gave us Zelikow. Jamie Gorelick was a Fannie Mae exec that helped crash the economy. Lee Hamilton, the guy who always lets the Bush family off the hook. Ben Vineste, Keane, et al very shady and filled with conflicts of interest in their backgrounds.

It wasn't shots it was pills...

...I threw them over my shoulder.

Troll..

you's a troll.

Find out if you have a local militia - http://www.uaff.us/

Real Patriots for 9/11 truth -- http://patriotsquestion911.com/

The evil media

knows what Dr. Paul is going to say because he has been saying it for thirty years. They have him on when it furthers their cause and it gives them creditability. It is called steering the sheep.

Question two answer is MONEY.

You answered the third question yourself "all powerful" their not afraid in fact they are laughing their asses off at how ignorant we are. It is like a killer who wants the cops to know how clever he is. Getting away with murder and the truth is denied.

The DP is for people with open minds and willing to discuss issues. To assume you can trust the government is rather naive. Just research history.

Prepare & Share the Message of Freedom through Positive-Peaceful-Activism.

:)

You always Rock Quiltingsando
Glad you are on the DP

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Ron Paul 2012 - Not just for America, for the World!

We Advocate Free Speech...

Respectfully,

Conspiracy is almost a government institution - I don't have time to list all of the known government conspiracies from the Gulf of Tonkin to the Federal Reserve Banking system.

Government conspiracies are probably the biggest reason that our nation is on the verge of economic collapse and locked in a perpetual war against vague enemies. Maybe you don't think this is central to economic and political discussions but please allow us the freedom to disagree.

END the FED before it ENDS US

We cover everything

else under the Ron Paul forum heading. Abortion, gay marriage, survival, buying gold, etc. We do not all agree with Dr Paul on all of these issues, nor do we agree with each other.

If 9-11 was not as we were told in the official story, I want to know about it. If we are not supposed to discuss it, then why did I stand in front of Jesse Ventura at the Rally for the Republic, and listen to him ask questions about 911?

"It’s not like I’m just trying to win and get elected. I’m trying to change the course of history." ~Ron Paul

bbagnal--lead the charge

I'm ready to stop "pontificating".
Are YOU ready to take up arms and do something other than calling your senator and saying, "I THINK the Fed needs to be dissolved"?
Everyone has all sorts of solutions but no meeting place to start the "real revolution".

crazyrustyforpresident

crazyrustyforpresident

We'll get there

We've just gotten over the election and from the thread Michael Nystrom started it sounds like we are trying to figure out some effective strategies. It will all come out in the wash. I've always done as much as I can in terms of donating money to this movement and I'll continue doing that, and I hope people out there will focus on getting good employment so that when 2010 rolls around we are a real financial powerhouse. Make sure to focus on your own economic security as much as focusing on our enemies.

From the thread, it sounds like we have it whittled down to two important targets:
- the Republican Party (a takeover from the neocons)
- the Federal Reserve

Hopefully we can get some good action started against the Fed soon while the public mood is sour against them. Once someone does something even very small against them that makes the news, it will be a small victory that will rally us and inspire us to try larger and larger attacks on them (peaceful of course).

We're kind of relying on Ron Paul supporters who live in the same city where the Fed has a presence, though. Anyone know the geographical locations of the various Fed buildings? Once we know that and get a feel for what they physically look like, maybe we can start with the graffiti or whatever. Maybe slingshot water balloons filled with black paint to make some sort of message. You might do some time for that, but hopefully weeks. Usually civil disobedience with a political purpose doesn't get you as much time, or at least in the past it hasn't.

Register as Republican and Vote for Ron Paul

Yeah you keep trying to white wash 9/11

you do that.. You keep that evil shit up. Worthless scum.. Ideas will spread the message will continue to be here for people who are waking up and I'll be here pointing pieces of shit like you out for what you are.

You on one hand say you're for the message of freedom yet when anyone get's close to uncovering the men behind the curtain or actually has a decent conversation you and your 10 different handles step in and spread divisiveness.

Find out if you have a local militia - http://www.uaff.us/

Real Patriots for 9/11 truth -- http://patriotsquestion911.com/

I'm not white-washing anything

Look, I've done the research and came to the conclusion that there is nothing to these 9/11 theories. I did the fact checking and the math on the various theories that are out there and came to the conclusion that none of them are true.

So apparently we disagree. Are you alright with that? Is it okay that I came to a different conclusion than you?

Register as Republican and Vote for Ron Paul

If you did the math

Then you failed physics. If you attempted the science then you failed chemistry.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SlBjAZ4EFR0&feature=related

Your belif that two planes can demolish three steel framed buildings into piles of dust at near free fall speed gives me the conclusion that you're a moron.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VfvqO4wVLM

Spread your lies elsewhere

Find out if you have a local militia - http://www.uaff.us/

Real Patriots for 9/11 truth -- http://patriotsquestion911.com/

It wasn't "near freefall"

The shroud of debris falling around of the building was indeed falling at freefall speed, as you would expect since it was unimpeded. The collapse was not at freefall. It took almost double freefall time. I did the calculations (8.85 seconds is freefall) and I timed the observations.

As for thinking that two 747s could take down the towers, yes this clearly happened. There were no telltale shock waves from any explosions. The fire weakened the structure and it collapsed. As for WTC7, it was hit by debris, started on fire, and it got out of control. Once again, fire weakened the structure and it collapsed. No telltale shock waves from explosives charges.

Register as Republican and Vote for Ron Paul

To see proof that Oruval is a LIAR when he says that the Towers

fell at near free fall speed, watch this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLShZOvxVe4&eurl=http://www.d...

You just got owned, son! LOL