In response to the growing calls for armed revolution…

or principle I receive is that our problem(s) can be fixed and our liberty can be redeemed, if only we elect the correct people to this or that public office, at least as some primary focus of preferred rebellion. It's a message that's been repeated (by the enemies of liberty as well as those who espouse the blessings of liberty) for many generations. I've been hearing the same message, over and over, for a lot longer than Mr. Harris has been on this earth. Indeed, he screams this (by way of using all-caps in his message), on his own behalf, by writing:

"HELP ME GET INTO THE ARENA TO DO BATTLE FOR YOU AND I SWEAR ON MY SOVEREIGN LIFE THAT I WILL NOT EVER VOTE TO MAKE ANY OF YOU SLAVES NOR STAND ASIDE WHEN/IF THE GOVERNMENT EXCEEDS ITS AUTHORITY BY MAKING WAR AGAINST US!".

I do not question, and indeed I do assume, the sincere nature and integrity of Mr. Harris. The previous quotation leaves little doubt as to his intentions; all too rare in the world of political dialogue. I don't know of anyone here who actually prefers violent revolution to peaceful revolution, as long as peaceful revolution exists as a viable and effective alternative. The question then seems to revolve around just how viable and effective the idea of peaceful revolution (here urged, by the thread author, in the political arena) has actually become.

Hawkiye's presentation cannot simply be overlooked or so easily dismissed. The thread's author prefers to engage the battle in the political arena in order to right past wrongs. Politics, by its nature and operation, has little to do with right and wrong. Politics has only to do with numbers. I wish it were not so. Surely Mr. Harris' political advisors, if any he has, have delivered this principle to his doorstep. The numbers, as they exist, demonstrate that the beneficiaries of statism outnumber, by no small amount, those who want to reclaim lost liberties (sworn to protection by all those who seek, and in the past sought, political office). The result of these ballot-box battles is more radiant today than ever before......and still the destruction of liberty not only continues but has actually accelerated, now that most opposition has been effectively neutered through the political process, like some thief driving a getaway car from the scene of a robbery. A system has been concocted whereby individuals and corporate entities not only accept, but will eventually clamor for, government (taxpayer) bailouts and other public emoluments, all facilitated by the operation of the ballot box; the process itself being little more than publicly organized gang warfare. If your gang is bigger than my gang, thanks to the attitudes of our courts, your gang can do just about anything it wants to my gang. How many more generations of our offspring shall be placed into debt, paid for by the product of their future labors and long since evaporated liberty, while we continue to "fight the good fight" by putting a checkmark next to this or that candidate's name on a ballot?

Our courts dispense fluid opinion that distances itself further and further from our Constitution and, with help from various other entrenched participants in the political system, have effectively rendered the U.S. Constitution as, for the most part, some kind of quaint historical artifact instead of the body of principle that each of them have sworn (or affirmed) that they will uphold. Even as we here use the internet to discuss and to inform and to support others who share our beliefs and hopes for the future, the "strengths" of our enemies (both GOP and Democrat) propose a new mechanism by which, with the operation of time and circumstance, can be used to shutdown or restrict our use of this communications medium. (The Cybersecurity Act of 2009 )

Each will decide on his or her own regarding the point at which physical resistance, violent or otherwise, will be offered. We approach the fluid point at which more and more of our fellow citizens have less and less to lose, and when those numbers grow sufficiently large, the result will not likely be a large group of people who will gather some measure of solace from leaders who simply encourage them to throw teabags on the steps of the capitol.

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"An economy built on fiat money is a society on its way to ashes."

If we can provoke the government into doing something bad against us that captures the American imagination, we will have succeeded. Samuel Adams was a provocateur. He successfully goaded the British into firing on unarmed American civilians in the Boston Massacre, which (along with the Boston Tea Party) kicked off the American revolution.

The important thing to do is to keep the sympathy of the public on your side.

Say someone in our movement killed Bernanke or blew up the Federal Reserve, this would NOT end the Federal Reserve. Someone else would slide in to fill those positions and they would now have public sympathy on their side. Imagine if the 9-11 terrorists had crashed a plane into the Federal Reserve instead of the two towers. Do you think the Fed would have gone away? I think they would revel in the sympathy and public support.

Mind you US sympathy evaporated pretty quickly after 9-11. Maybe it would be short term sympathy, but emboldened long term awareness and hatred against the Fed? This is an area I'm not too confident about.

BTW RJ Harris, you should think twice about using the word "nay" in this day and age.

First of all I don't think anyone is calling for an "armed revolution". There is a call to have arms at the ready for self defense.

RJ Harris writes:

"Two central tenants of warfare are to not fight on your opponents ground nor to play to his strength. Lashing out, as disparate leaderless groups, will do exactly that; play to the beast’s strength. This monster has at its disposal the FBI, INTERPOL, the Patriot Act, the CIA, and all other manners of evil and oppression to round up those dissidents they find here and there to cut them off from the people and the message. What good does it do us to get the few enlightened leaders we do have arrested or worse? "

Agreed lashing out as disparate leaderless groups will play to their strengths. However doing nothing is not the answer either. Organized planned resistance striking at their weakness is more appropriate.

"Let us look to the founders for guidance then.

They organized into legitimate state legislatures and operated within English law to plead for their rights under the Magna Carta and English Common Law. They drafted and published statements over a long period of time, which both asserted their trampled rights and gave due process to the King should stronger action ever become necessary."

Yes they spent about 20 years pleading with the King to honor his charters to them before they went to war. We have been pleading our cause for a minimum of 30 years. We don’t have 20 more years on top of that to plead our cause.

"Yes, there was also some civil disobedience like the tea party and it’s like but those were the exclamation points on long attempts to legally sue for redress not the central focus of their movement. Had Jefferson, Washington, and Franklin merely ran around inciting riots and revolution they would have been arrested and executed before there could have even been one."

Oh there was a lot more civil disobedience then that. Tax collectors and judges among others were tarred and feathered or their windows broken, or burning effigies etc. when they made bad decisions or tried to collect unlawful taxes. So if we were to follow our founders we would have to grow a pair and be doing a lot more then wee are now.

"And make no mistake, the founders did not start the war even if they did foment the Revolution. The British started the war by firing on our militia at Lexington. At any time prior to that, the King could have relaxed the heavy hand of his government and the revolution would never have been."

”all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

So how much longer shall we endure the already much longer train of abuses and usurpations then those our founders endured?

They have thumbed their noses at the law that is supposed to govern them the Constitution. They have robbed us stolen our wealth, destroyed are economy, poisoned us with vaccines, poisoned our water, poisoned our food supply, sent us off to die in foreign unconstitutional undeclared wars of opportunity for their benefit and not for freedom. Seek to disarm us, and outlaw growing our own food and animals, they have put our very future in jeopardy, etc. etc. etc.

At what point do we consider they have initiated violence against us? How many have died in wars for corporate/elitist interests?

"We need to follow their example and work within the Constitution to assert the sovereign rights of our states. To do this we need to take over the state legislatures with citizen politicians that think the way we do. Small state races can be dominated by an energized minority, which will quickly turn into a buzzing majority.
Once we have a couple of state legislatures moving the right way we can pass legislation like Oklahoma just did asserting its 10th amendment sovereignty. "

This seems like a good plan except it will take a minimum of ten years (most likely more then that) to get control of our State legislatures. In Idaho we have a good number of activists and we did not replace a single legislator last election and we only had a couple that ran. We have few prospects for 2010 and fewer resources.

You mentioned two central tenants of warfare being neither to fight on your opponents ground nor to play to his strength. In this arena we do not have the resources to take them over in time before they make their play for complete totalitarianism. They have the media and the funds to win just about any race and if they don’t they just cheat in some of them.

"Simultaneously, we must find among Constitutional Conservative leaders, like myself, Rand Paul, Peter Schiff, Charles Key and others, willing to take this fight directly into our congress. No we don’t have time for them to spend 10 years in the state legislatures, we need them in Washington DC yesterday. Unfortunately, the number of candidates that can make that huge initial leap will be few and the fight for them will be arduous but if it supplants a revolution of bullets with one of ballots then we must try it first. "

As I said it will take us a minimum of ten years just to get enough in there to effect change much less have them in there working for ten years. Where are all these leaders supposed to come from? We have few prospects and even fewer resources. This is not a year and half ago things have changed and are escalating fast. Unless we have some miracle conversion of millions of people I don’t see how you expect this to work. At least not in the amount of time we have. And in the mean time that long train of abuses and usurpations grows ever longer.

"Many of you that are frustrated and angry need to realize that there are more and more Americans taking the "red pill" everyday and waking up at a rate not seen in the last several generations. These people will and are joining our ranks and they will make a difference in the fight ahead. "

Really? Where are they? Some folks are taking light chartreuse pills with a blue tint but I see few people taking the red pill. Very few are joining our ranks, they are still addicted to American Idol, football and NASCAR. They still look at you like your nuts if you suggest they prepare for possible hard times.

"If the government gets frustrated and moves against us with force, then people will join this cause in numbers not seen since the 1770s."

No they won’t, the media will smear us as radical drug dealers, child molesters, terrorist, racists, or (insert label here) that needed eradicating and those folks will go back to the football game after watching a few clips like they did Waco.

The government will not move against us in mass we are too scattered, beside that is not their MO. They are doing fine just nickel and dimming us to death why would they change that? There will be no government initiation of force on any scale that will foment large resistance they know better then that. They are implementing their plans as plain as day there is no need for them to do that unless we attempt to stop them from continuing to implement their plans.

"We cannot give into that temptation to take the easy and rash action. We must display the courage, resolve, and yes patience of our beloved founders. Make no mistake; we can win this revolution without firing a single shot if we can get 50% +1 Conditional Conservatives elected to the House of Representatives. "

If it were easy we would have done it but now. Yes we should not be rash but it would not be easy to resist the long train of abuses that are being perpetrated on us daily and escalating with each day we fail to resist them.

"We will have to rely on the state legislatures to defend us as best they can till we can achieve that goal. Please don’t get yourselves arrested before we can get our champions into this fight."

I had to laugh at this sorry. Again here in Idaho we have some pretty good legislatures and some of them are even Ron Paul supporters. But they still are rubber-stamping socialist bills and taxes even while passing our sovereignty bill. When it comes time to stand up to the feds they will be little or no help. Perhaps you are assuming we will have changed many by then. Well the Federal government is threatening to rule every aspect of our lives now and did anyone think two years ago it would have escalated to where it is now? Where do you think it will be in two more? WE DON’T HAVE THE TIME!

"Because when we begin asserting our state’s sovereignty, legally under the 10th amendment, the federal government will face a choice. It can begin to retract into the constitutional republic it was meant to be, or like King George, it can start a war that we may then have to finish"

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We the people will have to be the ones to assert those rights. Because the most of the legislatures passing these bills know it’s just window dressing and there is no teeth in them. Are Governor made all kinds of noise about not taking the socialist bailout and then turned around and took it and the legislature did nothing.

The ones that need to get off the couch are the ones ho are taking those light chartreuse pills but they won’t Lots of the hard core Ron Paul supporters won’t get off the couch much less the sheep. When the sheep are out of work, loosing their homes, and starving they will not come rushing to our side they will be looking for a handout anywhere they can find it.

I am sorry but just thinking positive will not change the reality of the things we face. You seem to think we have all the time in the world to implement these ideas. We don’t The usurpers in power are making their play right now while we still shake off the TV induced fog of our fantasy society.

The US will not look the same in two years as it does now. We will either unite and resist or bow down to our new masters. We don’t have time or the support for taking over the congress or even our local state houses before they make their final acts. This is the sad reality of our state and we continue to act like we did in the campaign a year and half ago.

Wake up sleepy heads or die!

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Get Prepared!
Only dead fish go with the flow...

arrive as fully developed rEVOLutionaries. We have learned fast, we're stronger, leaner, way smarter than a year ago, light years beyond our two-year-ago selves.

I'd hate to lose a single one of you, because you're great human beings, you've educated yourselves into expert freedom warriors, and you'll multiply our numbers many times over as you help sear our message into the public consciousness.

We'd lose too many in a physical fight. Our amateur pop guns against the professionally trained, most fiercely-equipped army the world has ever seen? And what for? A majority of Americans wouldn't have a clue what the fight was about. The media would call us crazy cranks, their believers would shudder and be glad to be rid of us as they turned back to the mainstream stories about Michelle's sleeveless fashions, Obama's suave diplomacy and pandering.

We have champions like RJ Harris, Dr. Paul, BJ Lawson, Judge Napolitano, and many others who've emerged as great spokesmen for freedom, some as excellent candidates for congressional seats. We must back them fully while we work full out in every educational venue, to help turn the hearts and minds of more Americans to the proven but forgotten values of freedom, and away from the learned helplessness and irresponsibility that big government fosters.

For those who say it's too late: look, none of us has a crystal ball. While our ideas are true, our timing has never been exact. The enemy is wily and may prolong the fall of the economy longer than expected here. If so, that gives us more time. If not, we're more prepared than most.

As the administration brings out its heavy artillery, denying more huge chunks of freedom, it reveals its hand to more people; we'll be out there in our own media, blogging, reporting, educating, plus demanding MSM time for our spokespeople, our candidates.

We're in revolutionary times, but it's a revolution of ideas, radical ideas, and we're the leading edge.

Martin Luther King's revolution happened quickly, Ghandi's too was fast, but the ancient Christian movement took a long time to become a major player. We can't know how our time will fly, but we have a powerful philosophy, more fully developed than all previous revolutions. Our ideas may not gain traction fast, but every intellectual inch we gain will add to our strength.