California: U.S. Marines to Staff Vehicle Checkpoint Along with Law Enforcement Agencies
So it Comes not in great leaps, but in small bounds.
Source: http://www.duiblog.com/2008/12/16/here-come-the-feds-contd-m...
Snip:
The U.S. Marines have landed…and are apparently manning "sobriety checkpoints" in San Bernardino County in California. Yes, Marines. Yes, civilian DUI roadblocks.
From an official December 10th California Highway Patrol public relations release:
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CHP to Conduct Sobriety/Driver’s License Checkpoint
The Morongo office of the California Highway Patrol (CHP) in conjunction with the San Bernardino Sheriff’s Department and the USMC military police will conduct a joint sobriety/driver license checkpoint on Friday, December 12, 2008, somewhere in the unincorporated/incorporated area of San Bernardino County.
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As an American citizen, not to mention a former Marine, I find this troubling — particularly in view of the clear wording of the Posse Comitatus act of 1878, described in Wikipedia:
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The Posse Comitatus Act is a United States federal law (18 U.S.C. § 1385) passed on June 16, 1878, after the end of Reconstruction. The Act prohibits most members of the federal uniformed services (the Army, Air Force and State national Guard forces (when such are called into federal service) from exercising nominally state law enforcement, police or peace officer powers that maintain "law and order" on non-federal property (states and their counties and municipal divisions) in the former Confederate states.
The statute generally prohibits federal military personnel and units of the National Guard under federal authority from acting in a law enforcement capacity within the United States, except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or Congress. The Coast Guard is exempt from the Act.
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A follow-up call to a Marine Corps public affairs sergeant resulted in assurances that the Marines would be there "as observers". Hmmmm…..military observers. Isn’t that how it all starts?
Thanks to Branson Hunter and Andre
Full post: http://www.duiblog.com/2008/12/16/here-come-the-feds-contd-m...
flagrant disregard for posse commitatus
It's a law for a reason. The cowards just won't admit it's a military coup. Instead they sponsor "toys for tots" while lugging around a 50 caliber gatling gun and an armored HUM-V.
http://killfiat.blogspot.com/
http://killfiat.blogspot.com/
We were just following orders..
There are many good men and women in the Armed Forces that just dont see the bigger picture, yet. Be patient with them, they will have their eyes opened too. I have disdain for the higher-ups like Bush, Gates and most members of Congress.
-MY OPS ARE BLACKER THAN YOUR OPS-
Yes, I'm a Californian and accustomed to road blocks . . .
. . . . . . and the presence of military.
I have been stopped and searched at least a few times before, over my 60 year life time, but only by the military when I visited other countries. I could put my lawyer on the phone immediately, but I treat the situation as if I were part of training exercise instead.
Usually, searches go on all over the place, like vehicular, or at the border in Mexico and international airports, or your local rock concert.
On the other hand, I have had gang types screw with me worse.
And the Illuminati is no pal of mine.
In the area these marines are present, the housing situation is precarious, with many abandoned homes, and an accummulation of new people to our country and are yet a bit displaced.
It is the Moreno Valley area, observing recent massive home development full of residents who mostly commute a long ways in traffic congestion, for up to 2 1/2 hours one way to get to their jobs.
Understanding the relative comfort zone for people, well, not only "gang" types will be acting agitated. I mean, in Tijuana, Mexico . . . "beheading" is a quit popular terrorism. Just think about it . . . about one mile south of San Diego, California, many people are being terrorized, and the police are overwhelmed.
I am glad we are allowing the Marines to get a handle on the reality of being around civilians on their own turf, and can see how it can drive some enlisted persons to drink.
If you want to change things, run for a local central commitee position.
It's working in Los Angeles.
(see what our local Campaign for Freedom fighters have accomplished (http://www.dailypaul.com/...)
We need our police and we need our military, and this advice comes from a fellow freedom fighter. I don't like to be thugged around and thieved from gang types, whether they are named Illuminati or M-13, they are real, and are nothing about freedom. I tend to look at military personel and police as individuals with families, and will be on our side when the universal consciousness momentum hits.
And never forget, “Humans, despite our artistic pretensions, our sophistication and many accomplishments, owe the fact of our existence to a six-inch layer of topsoil and the fact that it rains.”
Listen, All this is over the top speculation, Here's the lowdown
1. As a former Military Police Officer From the San Dog area I have knowledge of this program
2. It is as some think, a joint effort to curb the Marines that are ever increasing drinking and driving under the influence in this area. War's do that to our fine men and women and this is a fact!
3. The "Marines" at these checkpoints are MP's not just ordinary infantry. They are not carrying M-16 nor are they actively participating in the stops. If the DUI suspect is a Marine, we take care of our own, get it?!
4. It is training for the MP's so they can conduct sobriety checkpoints on base more effectively.
I too watch out for any overstepping of military in civilian roles, but this program is not a hidden try to desensitize us to the real threat of wrongful use of military powers.
Good looking out, but this is not a overreaching program and actually we do these programs with locals all the time everywhere in the US. It's known as joint community LEO training.
SirRic
Yes, I get it, but...
"If the DUI suspect is a Marine, we take care of our own, get it?!"
Yes, I get it. In fact, that was obvious. I'm not the paranoid type who sees black helicopters everywhere.
However, I still think that it is a bad idea. If a Marine gets a DUI, the Corps will hear about it soon enough and can discipline the Marine, in addition to the punishment that the local courts impose.
But what happens if a civilian criminal (say, a bank robber) starts a fight and the Marine observer is killed in the melee? What if it turns out that the criminal is a member of a large criminal syndicate that is sworn to revenge the death of their member?
Do you see where this is going?
Now the USMC and a criminal syndicate are at war with each other on American soil. And the Marines are a fat target - their bases here in the continental U.S. are largely unguarded, at least compared to bases on foreign soil.
Such joint operations with local LE are a very slippery slope, even if, as you say, the Marines "are not carrying M-16 nor are they actively participating in the stops."
They certainly will be actively participating if the suspect pulls out an M-16 and starts shooting - even if their participation is limited to taking a bullet.
Incidentally, I used to live in Sacramento and it was well known then (circa. 1990) that a former S. Vietnamese Colonel was running a drug ring near McClellan Air Force Base, serving Air Force personnel. This was a big problem for the Air Force - a lot of their men were addicted and there was a concern that Air Force personnel might reveal military secrets or sell weapons if they became indebted to their drug dealer.
I moved and I'm not sure how this situation resolved itself. I bring it up only to point out that I understand your concern - the Air Force (or the Marines) cannot allow their men to get involved with people like this off base. But to actually go to war with someone like this Colonel is worse. War on American soil is something we really need to avoid.
They would be better off locking down their base until the civilian authorities can find the Colonel - from what I heard, he never left a mile-square area of the city. The local authorities, but not the Air Force or Marines, have the authority to cordon off an area like that and sweep it, if they really want to. But getting the military involved, even as observers, would be a big mistake.
________________________________________
Shaka, you so crazy! www.sniperflashcards.com
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Shaka, you so crazy! www.axiomaticeconomics.com
Thanks a lot!
Its only sensible to let MP's deal with their local military issues. More efficient than custody transfers and such.
After "Section 1076 of the John Warner National Defense Authorization Act for Fiscal Year 2007" (http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/2008/09/24/army/)
Its getting easier to hear every fly as a black-helicopter.
Boston Massacre - Provoking the revolution
Recently I heard a historical account of the Boston Massacre. It seems some Brit soldiers were being mocked and pelted with rock-cored snowballs by patriot-protesters. Then (Adams?) wrote it up in the newspaper making it look like the Brits started it all.
Propaganda works both ways.
I hate to suggest provoking soldiers or police with automatic weapons to the end a massacre takes place. But politics being what it is, the losers win, and the "winners" lose.
Game Theory.
hey that kinda sounds like...
what happened to Sean Hannity...
2Chronicles 7:14 If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
Except
that Hannity had the lion's share of the "ink" in that fight, making Ron Paul supporters look like unruly thugs right before the NH primary. We undoubtedly lost gobs of votes with that one thoughtless act.
New Hampshire and Ecuador
(Adams?) Yes.
Samuel Adams, and the sons of liberty were to have been the ones who provoked the incident, while his cousin John Adams defended the soldiers in court. Ironic isn't it?
All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. Thomas Jefferson
All tyranny needs to gain a foothold is for people of good conscience to remain silent. Thomas Jefferson
Contact em
Tell em we are not interested in being slowly cooked frogs.
_________________________________
My liberty-minded home base of thought:
www.ponderthis.net
_________________________________
Freedom - Peace - Prosperity
observers = minders
Anyone recognize the term minders? Marines have absolutely no business being deployed for any reason within the united states including martial law. It doesn't take the military to enforce martial law either.
they are
desensitizing us to seeing military personal policing us by adding it to a DUI checkpoint. Seems harmless and if we don't get upset they'll start showing up in more places.
This so reminds me of the what they did to the Jews. Little subtle changes taking away rights until we are in FEMA camps and killing one another for food. It's just a matter of time,
Where is the line they cross where we'll actually have to do something?
Re: your words "As an
Re: your words "As an American citizen, not to mention a former Marine, I find this troubling"
Response: I'm also a former Marine - Semper Fi. And I also find it troubling. Not to defend the decision, but I happen to know that there is a large population of Marines in the San Bernardino area - it's within short drive of both Camp Pendleton and MCAGC 29 Palms. It also tends to be a popular destination for weekend liberty. I wonder if the impetus for this might be an attempt to crack down on other Marines who are driving under the influence in the town? I sure hope that's all it is.
It's possible.
Semper fi, brother.
You raise an interesting point. I remember JTF with the border patrol to catch Marines going to Tijuana too, which is/was pretty much forbidden to do while I was in. With all the combat grunts coming back all FUBAR'ed and turning to drinking to escape, your idea is a distinct possibility. It may be an effort to crack down on the troops. I had more than one chaser duty to pull drunk Marines out of the county lockup and stick them in the brig.
The overall picture is still alarming though, and merits watchfulness. The army is stepping up it's presence too; we've all seen the articles. It sickens me to see what our Corps has become.
If the Marines and the
If the Marines and the Police will be conducting road blocks throughout California, maybe the citizens of California should have their own. The people should shut down a major artery and carry signs stating "NO ROAD BLOCKS IN CALI" or something like that. Maybe some could state "NO ROAD BLOCKS NO MARINES!"
If citizens of California did something like that, there is no way the gov could stop the news from spreading, MSM or no MSM. People will learn about what the CA state government is allowing the military to do in their state.
I hope to God that they are not preparing California for bankruptcy in a few months.... Maybe that is the point.
Either way, the people shouldn't stand for it.
There should be lawsuits springing up all over the place regarding the Marines policing California. The state legislature should outlaw this practice.
Or better yet, maybe everyone could decide that California sucks and all move away to a better state that has some politicians with sense.
...
Neighbor's son:
Came home for Christmas leave and he is stationed in southern Cal. as a Marine. I spent a long while talking with him today and the conversation started with his asking questions about my U.S. civil flag. After I schooled him a little in history, I learned first hand how totally brain washed these young men can be. I am so sad after watching him grow up and seeing him headed this way, I can barely come up with the words. But he has been enticed with money and college and other things. I thought I had been a better influence. But as we talked on for a long while, I actually had him thinking in an opposite direction about our military on our soil.
He still can wait to get to Afghanistan though. I guess he's had to many years of video war games and wants the real thing. I hope we are not in for what I think we are in for.
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I love my country
I am appalled by my government
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I love my country
I am appalled by my government
interesting facts
1. Joe Biden said there will be a generated event to test Obama within the first six months of his presidency.
a. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpiNfuG8YY8
2. Colin Powel said there will be an incident on the 21st or 22nd of January that we don’t know about yet.
a. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLPOeQZdHYw
3. The Canadian Prime Minister has suspended parliament and has dictatorial powers until one week after parliament returns to session. The earliest they could return is January 27th so he calls the shots till February 4th.
a. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Imrzo8ZkXRE
4. The SPP agreement sets the stage and basis for military cooperation between the US and Canada in the event of a nuclear, biological or chemical attack. Some think this goes so far as Canadian troops policing on US soil if invited.
a. http://www.spp.gov/
5. Detroit is the only Major City that touches Canada. Separated only by a river.
6. The big 3 automakers are being given trouble getting a bailout for their industry which is based in Detroit.
a. After giving the banks 700bn suddenly the Neocon republicans can’t spare 15bn for an industry that actually produces GOODS unlike the banks which don’t directly produce anything. (not that I am in favor of the bailouts but I just find it interesting)
7. Canada has said they believe that terrorist cells may be operating in the Toronto Area.
a. http://www.canadafreepress.com/2006/cover060606.htm
creepy eh?
~
Who's in charge? where do orders like this
originate? I assume it's a federal decision, but does the California State government have any choice, and if so, would the governor's office approve it? Or is it such a blatantly illegal act that nobody knows, no one takes responsibility, the troops just appear? There must be coordination with local police units, but what is the chain of command? Just trying to get a handle on this and wondering what could be an effective response.
NORTHCOM probably makes the
NORTHCOM probably makes the call, it's either sold to the state the same way it's sold to the public, or the state is simply powerless to stop it.
Remember, California is deeply in debt. They don't have a whole lot of leverage against the Federal govt.
http://federalfallacy.com
http://federalfallacy.com
Not that it makes any real difference, but
I wonder if the Morongo office is located on the Morongo Indian Reservation? And, if that's where they'll be?
IMissLiberty
Voting for the Lesser Evil? http://www.inductionworks.com/iw/form/qamap.php/ElectLesserEvil
IMissLiberty
national military police force
Isn't it obvious that if government dissent becomes so large that the police can't handle it, then it's because they're on the wrong side?
If the folks in CA don't do anything about it
that is the same as saying it is OK.
Speak out or consider yourself under military rule.
I am impressed that marine officers have nothing to say about this.
I thought the commandant was a constitutionalist.
Sad day in Cali. Put down the suntan oil and get something done here.
Unify
Posse Comitatus and the Insurrection Act
Someone should sue...
Thanks for allowing me to join the site, Michael. Glad to be a new member!
George
Welcome
:)
An amendment to the act last
An amendment to the act last year leaves a loophole for this...
Besides that, any action that has anything to do with "homeland security" will not be questioned by anyone, and if it is, they will be scared straight.
http://federalfallacy.com
http://federalfallacy.com
Where's all the protesters where it really matters?
Yes, let's "End the Fed", but who really cares about Martial Law, right?
This is the chance for the Ron Paul people to do the Civil Disobedience they talk so much about but never actually do -- you know like their heroes MLK and Gandhi.
Who's going to this road block?
I bet if I went down there, maybe we would have 2 other Ron Paul supporters and 4 Code Pinkos.
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Glen Beck -- An Exposed Enemy:
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/90198
Glenn Beck Supports NAFTA and taking your job:
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/86643
California has long been
California has long been known as the bellwether state. Meaning that it often serves as an example of what the rest of us can expect to see unfolding in our own states.
In 1993 when California passed its primary seatbelt enforcement law many cities set up road blocks to "educate" people about the new law. I saw that as an amazing willingness of governments in CA to use police-state tactics for even the most trivial purposes.
This is one reason that I am happier now that I live in Wisconsin. We have no primary seatbelt law, no motorcycle helmet law and no "proof" of insurance law. As a result we have to endure much less interaction with police. -- Matt
Yes, but
New Hampshire has no seatbelt law, and no insurance requirements along with no state income tax or general sales tax. No wonder the Free State project picked New Hampshire
.Constitution revolution!