For all the Anti-Mason bigots, please unload your fear and hate.
For all you pitiful people who have heard unverified rumors, seen unsubstantiated documentaries on television, listened to dialogue in movies and/or just make stuff up, this thread is for YOU. I just want to make sure you understand that not everything you see on TV or in the movies is true. No, really. Not everything you read in a book, or even on the internet is always true. You do realize that people can't fly, or stop time, or teleport or many other superhuman acts (At least not yet/or without mechanical aids) It is a fabrication. Yes, sometimes people lie to you on TV. You must learn to distinguish between reality and rumor. Too often people hear or read something and automatically assume it is true. Think about it this way, all you Anti-Masons, maybe all the propaganda being spread about Freemasons is there to make you fear the wrong group. There are many individuals to fear in the world, and some organizations. But not one person so far has shown any facts, supported by documentation that proves the Masons are evil. Fine, you THINK this is true. This is your personal opinion, but an opinion is not a fact.
Again, this thread is for you. Please, spew forth your hate. Get it all out. But do it now. I don't appreciate the Anti-Masonic comments, but your attitude is what is to be expected of intolerant bigots. Put the word Christian, or Republican in the place of Mason and you will hear how ridiculous your ranting sounds to me. I think a few Christians/Republicans/Masons/(Organization of your choice) act really good, a few act bad, and most are stumbling along in-between. In other words, if you believe that all Masons think the exact same thing, you are dead wrong. (Does Dr. Paul=good Republican think the same way as Dick Cheney=bad Republican) . Do all Americans think the same way? Obviously not.
Please don't continue to show your lack of knowledge by assuming you know more about Freemasonry than a Freemason. That is all I read and hear from ya'll, arrogance, fear and anger covering up ignorance. You can never conquer fear unless you study that of which you are afraid. Face your fear for it kills rational thought.
I am willing to believe the truth. You just don't seem to know what that is, yet. But, IF you can find any documentation supporting your theories about the Freemasons, I will give it fair consideration. Which is a whole lot more than you are willing to do, which again points to the fact that you are not tolerant of others, which is why our country is having the trouble it is. Not because the Masons help people, and try to better ourselves through research.
No one is stopping anyone from coming down to a Masonic Lodge during the monthly meeting and asking any questions you like. As long as you treat any women, kids and our Lodge with a modicum of respect, we will go out of our way to make you welcome and answer all questions we are able too. No, we may not answer every question, some things people have to learn through hard work and they have to do this themselves. It is like going to Dr. Paul and asking him to explain everything he knows about economics, medicine and politics. It is impossible to do in a short time. If you ask for guidance or assistance, we will give it, and not ask anything in return.
Glas stat or 777 or whatever name you want to call yourself- It is none of your business, but in the United States most Freemasons are Christian. Although many are Jewish, Islamic, Hindu and Buddhist. So please stop saying that we are not Christian, that is another lie you have told. The difference between our kind of Christianity and yours is: Masons try to act good all the time, which is impossible, but we try. Most people who claim to be Christian rarely act that way except maybe in church. What I see from you Anti-Masons is the same intolerant bigotry, fear-mongering and close-mindedness seen in many Americans lately. This is why our country is crumbling.
No less than an authority than
John Quincy Adams, the 6th president (and he was also head of the Anti-Masonic Party for awhile), said the following:
"Freemasonry is deceptive and fraudulent...Its promise is light—its performance is darkness" - John Quincy Adams
And President Millard Fillmore:
"The Masonic fraternity tramples upon our rights, defeats the administration of justice and bid defiance of every government which it cannot control." - Millard Fillmore
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/62031
Good Americans...
just say NO to secret societies. Collectivism kills.
PS
I don't blame any of it on him being a mason. I don't know how he has had the nerve to wear the ring with his behavior. I have felt the thing and had the mark of it on various places on my body many times while growing up. It hurt. I think in his sick mind beating his children was being a good father. he would even say we needed a beating because he was sure we had done something that he hadn't seen us do to deserve it so he had to make sure we were punished. Trust me folks he doesn't even understand politics and is not smart enough to be part of any conspiracy.
He only had his own business because he was raised doing it and his father taught him. Printing. He has a fifth grade education.
My dad is a mason
I think he just joined a club so he could feel like something he truly wasn't.
A good husband , father, person, smart, caring, giving, helpful to others.
A club he joined where he had some people fooled he was something he wasn't. As far as I could tell he didn't participate much. He was working or at the beer joint. He did have his own business and provided for his family financially but was abusive degrading and anything but a loving father and husband. he also ran around with other women. If they truly new how he was they would have thrown him out. Or if he was acceptable they are garbage. From what I understand he was the opposite of what a mason should be. He will likely be moving into the masonic home soon. He probably joined to further his business. Kinda feel sorry for him. Treated his 5 kids (well 4 of them anyway he had one he gave everything that turned out just like him and spit in his face later on) like crud and now that Mom is gone only one makes much effort to visit him and that's only because she wants his money. She will do whatever it takes and is trying to get the rest of us out of his will. If he goes to the masonic home they will take 70% of what he has. Boy will that kill her. She might kill him before he signs those papers. Greed is an ugly thing.
You sound quite bitter.
But is it about Freemasonry?
Did you get on one knee, bare your breast, and swear allegiance
to a "Most Worshipful Master?"
I mean, whatever you are in to is nothing to me, but did you or did you not do this thing?
Truth exists, and it deserves to be cherished.
By calling those opposed to Masonry "bigots"
You're admitting it's a religion.
Live and let masons live
I think if a bunch of guys want to gather in a secret, light some candles, strip down naked, and paddle each other that's their business. This is (ostensibly) a free country after all
http://goldsteinrepublic.com
Masons have an agenda, not all of them know it.
Some never climb high enough up the ranks to ever find out.
If you really want to see where the masons fit into the agenda, read John Robinson's book published in 1798 "Proofs of a Conspiricy" http://www.scribd.com/doc/2197662/1798-John-Robins-Proof-of-...
What ever happened to the Jacobins ... aye ?
Masonic document found on the body of a Jewish Communist Battalion Commander published in an Estonian newspaper on Dec 31, 1919 that suggests Communism in fact was a disguised economic, race and religious war. http://www.henrymakow.com/communism_zionism_fronts_for_w.html
NWO : Front for Zionist Tyranny
http://www.henrymakow.com/communism_zionism_fronts_for_w.html
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"Take hold of the future or the future will take hold of you." -- Patrick Dixon
I know nothing, but here's my take on Masons.
Generally successful businessmen, who want to be a part of something big, like a club, maybe with some college fraternity nuance. These men are generally or at least consider themselves Christian and just want to to do good things for their communities. Share their wealth so to speak.
Going through the rituals and stuff makes it fun and maybe gives sense of achievement. I think the whole concept is good and I would guess it's all about things being perfect or striving for perfection, you know, "square, level and straight".
So it's like a club for old guys to network and do good things for the community too, or "Build the Community", you might say.
Now having said all that, there will probably be a certain few evil individuals who are there to take advantage of the "network".
It's easier to get what you want when you network with all the successful people in the community.
Just my Opinion, based on absolutely no knowledge...well I did watch a few videos on history channel or wherever. And met a few masons and bricklayers, if there is a difference. lol
...I am not "afraid" of
...I am not "afraid" of masons...and I saw enough when I was younger and a freind tried to get me to join demolay. I was just supposed to go along with all their initiation ceremonies and symbols and all that and join them without having a clue as to what it all really meant or stood for...yea, right. I don't fear anything that hides in the dark... The answer to 1984 is 1776
RON2012PAUL...The r3VOLution continues...
"I always win"
http://youtu.be/Xtl2ZuJpG9M
+GOLD and SILVER are money+
http://www.youtube.com/user/ThisIsRogueLiberty
This type of discussion has a goal and that is to keep
emotions running high.
I don't think it matters what organizations a man belongs to as long as he has the courage to seek the truth.
I am not affiliated with a religion nor have I read the Bible, but, I know there is a God and this God that I know is a God of forgiveness, compassion and love.
I may not know what Love is and I may not be able to define what God is with words, but, I can certainly feel God and love.
This post invites nothing that have very much to do with the example our creator sets for us.
It invites cruel debate and thoughtlessness to each other.
I know that God is God of truth I know this in my heart I need no "expert" to explain this truth to me.
I know some of the men who rule this world hide behind secret societies and religions. This does not make the members of secret societies or the adherents of religions wrong.
It does do one thing.
It tells us that the truth is no secret.
God is the truth and the truth is a brilliant light from which all secrets are exposed.
A "confidence" between men is one thing. A lie is another.
A group of families own the central banks of this world.
They have used the "money franchise" to gain power over our leaders and economic conditions.
They have achieved this power over you and me through lies, secrets and deceit.
Any discussion on the DP that takes us away from the truth is in service to the lie.
Get on board gentlemen, the Lord cares not if a man is a Christian, a Mason a Jew, a bus driver or all three at once.
The lie is waiting to fall and screaming at your brother over what goes on on a Wednesday night once a month keeps the lie in power.
Unify
I do not believe they are hiding
Fraternal orders are not evangelists seeking souls. They are ESTABLISHED organizations that empower people to come together and do good work for the community.
I can not think of one president of the USA who was not a Christian, Matter of fact, I bet Jesus would have been a Mason given the opportunity,
WE ARE GOING TO WIN!
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Well Done.
Nice.
Look here, if you want.
http://www.masonicinfo.com/pikesphilosophy.htm
Demolay; you are a "Porch Mason"
Let me ask you directly. What are your thoughts on the skull and bones secret society?
http://www.jbs.org/
Semper Fortis
http://www.jbs.org/
Semper Fortis
when do masons use the
when do masons use the phrase 'as you please'. isnt that a pass into the lodge? Thats also what the insiders called jekyl island hunt club where the federal reserve was created.
"We must re-take the Republican Party"-Ron Paul. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlqXq8YxQFQ
the problem IS
you are part of a secret organization that has several agendas. Your members are in public office and they use OUR money to help further THEIR agendas. THIS IS WRONG and this is WHY they have been hanged and run out of town over and over. It is that simple. If you all just stayed in your clubhouse and got drunk, there would be no problem. However, you do much more then that and you know it, so do we. Secrets have NO place in the government. A government that is supported by the people. Many in that population have NO desire to play mason or knight. We simply want to practice our faith and love our families, not support your worldview.
Did you bare your breast and get on one knee before
a "Most Worshipful Master?"
Truth exists, and it deserves to be cherished.
I don't blame
the low-level Masons, because they generally are completely in the dark about anything that really goes on at the upper levels.
The lower lodges often are helpful to the community, and serve as the "front" for what happens at the upper levels.
Sort of like the way a pizza-parlor "fronts" for a Mafia operation. The guys making and selling the pizza might have no idea what happens in the back room.
And this is why you see the lower levels defending Masonry, because they genuinely think it's good.
So, I pretty much separate it into 2 groups. The useful dupes below 32 degrees, and the Illuminati at 33rd degree, or higher.
Exactly
It is an inner circle, surrounded by an outer circle of useful dupes, that DO do good things in the community. (even though the Shriners have been caught stealing money.)
Like you said, you can't blame the dupes, as they don't have any clue what happens at the higher levels.
I don't have any clue either, except that it is VERY prevalent throughout the world, and they have positions of high power and influence.
I don't care if you want to have your little secret society, just don't become Presidents, judges,lawyers,cops,etc.
★★★★★★
"The man who makes unheard of pronouncements that reveal themselves to be true is a proven genius. The man who scoffs at the pronouncements as folly proves himself to be a fool. Time is the true revealer of genius or foolishness." –Will Pitts
http://www.ronpaulbrochure.com/
http://www.dailypaul.com/donate
Secret societies are Anti-Christian
There is no biblical basis for being a member of a secret society.
The Masons are just that.
So, the Knights of Columbus, and others, are anti-Christian?
BTW, there is no biblical basis for driving a car, or flying in an airplane, either.
Your examples really miss
Your examples really miss the point. It is not that the Bible must dictate explicitly which actions are permissible, but rather that it describes what manner of activities are most likely to be good and wholesome. Consider the following verses:
This is why many Christians have a serious issue with any organization that is secretive -- even church board meetings. The light reveals all that is hidden, and we are to pursue to truth in all things.
Now there is certainly an aspect of covering sins and overlooking small offenses out of mercy and kindness, but that is not the heart of these organizations. They purposely hide and obscure the truth. When the light is shone upon them, the evil that hides within is inevitably revealed. This applies to all aspects of the church itself. Consider the examples of pedophilia in the Catholic Church or the various scandals of protestant pastors who tried to hide their lives from public view.
If one is hiding from the light and doing things in secret, it should make us suspicious.
Who missed the point, Khomar?
I was commenting on the "biblical basis" statement by RS.
You are talking about secrecy.
If all secrecy is suspicious, maybe you would care to post your bank account numbers and internet passwords here, for all to see.
There are many valid reasons for keeping things secret from others, one example being your sex life, as pointed out below.
So do you have sex with your spouse at rush hour on broadway?
Oh, so you must be a secretive pervert if you don't.
Many people who claim to be christian, do not act that way. Talk to Dick Cheney and George Bush.
Knowledge is hidden in the darkness. If mankind listened to your world view, we would all still be living in caves.
You bring that which is hidden to light, you throw light on the darkness of ignorance.
Christians in the Roman Empire had to act secretively at first, since you would be fed to the lions etc., if you were caught. Christians in China today have to meet in secret on occasion, otherwise they will be harassed. So does that make Christianity and all Christians evil?
Aren't Dick Cheney and
Aren't Dick Cheney and George Bush both Masons. What does Masonry have to do with how one behaves?
Obama also demonstrates many signs linking him to the Masons, does that make his policies good?
George Washington was a Mason, yet when it came to using his power as President he tended to tip the scales in his favor.
grant
These organizations were established before radio
These established fraternal organizations were from a time when life was much different that today. The sign boards on cities are go way back to when people joined these groups because they offered rooms for travelers.. yes it took a secret handshake to proove you were a member and had the right to come onto the property and be given hospitality.
There was more these organizatations were able to do that churches, by their nature in service to God, left huge gaps to be filled where government was concerned and people participating. My fraternal Order, The Patron of Husbandry, was established for farmers, and what teh Grange did for farmers, the Church, no one church could have achieved.
The Grange established rural mail, rural water, rural power, some Granges to day own solar and mathane poweer plants, it owns old folk homes for farmers and their children. For decades it provided the best insurance. It established the 4-H club, Future Farmers of Americ, put Ag in colleges, established the county and state fair systems. The Grange does not support or endorse political candidates, but we have meetings with them and at out local Halls, during election time, you can be sure the top runners are pouring coffee and talking to us.
The Grange began by employing The Holy Bible, which sits in the middle of the room opened, as the most sacred place in the room, with a Chaplin who is charged with it's protection. The Grange changed this policy to whoever is elected Chaplin has the right to place their Bible on the alter as the only guilding light in the room.
Now here's a kicker for you. I am a Granger and I am an Objectivist.. so what am I doing in what is obviously a Christian based organization? I RESPECT the freedom and rights our great nation endows to believers and while I may not be called at this time, it is NOT my job to stop or impede those who are doing good works first, in the name of mankind. Whatever it takes for people to do GOOD works of LOVE. If that takes a Bible, sobeit, open the book and lets proceed.
Why does the Grange accept me might be a bigger question. The Grange accepts me because I care about my community and willing to do something constructive and participate. These are my neighbors and friends and we all need each other. While we may not have the same faith or beliefs about God, the Grange with RESPECT gives us teh opportunity to work together witout prejudice. At the Grange, with so many who have so many beliefs, I see each person acting their best to represent their church as one with high morals and American values.
The secret handshakes and the regellia is loved by those who see the Grange bring 1965 to life.. it's a living histroy and facinating.. you get the feeling what it was like, and it makes you strong.
I am surrounded by good people helpong each other do good things, not in the name of God, but in hte name of people under the influence of God.
It is a shame YouTube is creating so much fear for fraternal ofers because they are what we might need most when the SHTF. Grange rebuilt farms after teh Civil War. We did it once, and we can do it again as long as people can find the LOVE and shun the fear and hate.
WE ARE GOING TO WIN!
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Correct on your subject title
KoC et al are equally wrong.
RS, thanks for sharing
your "biblical basis" knowledge.