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Honduras Crisis Forces Obama to Focus on Latin America

The military coup against Honduran president Manuel Zelaya puts pressure on President Obama to break sharply with past American policies or risk massive defections in what remains of Latin American goodwill.

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http://www.thenation.com/doc/20090713/hayden2?rel=emailNation



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I highly doubt that since

I highly doubt that since Ron Paul is so consistent he would have a different opinion about us interfering into the internal affairs of Honduras, then he had about our interference in the internal affairs of Iran.

Statement of Congressman Ron Paul

United States House of Representatives

Statement Opposing Resolution on Iran

June 19, 2009

I rise in reluctant opposition to H Res 560, which condemns the Iranian government for its recent actions during the unrest in that country. While I never condone violence, much less the violence that governments are only too willing to mete out to their own citizens, I am always very cautious about “condemning” the actions of governments overseas. As an elected member of the United States House of Representatives, I have always questioned our constitutional authority to sit in judgment of the actions of foreign governments of which we are not representatives. I have always hesitated when my colleagues rush to pronounce final judgment on events thousands of miles away about which we know very little. And we know very little beyond limited press reports about what is happening in Iran.

Of course I do not support attempts by foreign governments to suppress the democratic aspirations of their people, but when is the last time we condemned Saudi Arabia or Egypt or the many other countries where unlike in Iran there is no opportunity to exercise any substantial vote on political leadership? It seems our criticism is selective and applied when there are political points to be made. I have admired President Obama’s cautious approach to the situation in Iran and I would have preferred that we in the House had acted similarly.

I adhere to the foreign policy of our Founders, who advised that we not interfere in the internal affairs of countries overseas. I believe that is the best policy for the United States, for our national security and for our prosperity. I urge my colleagues to reject this and all similar meddling resolutions.

Non-Intervention

wins again. The internal squabbles of other nations should not be our concern.

For almost 100 years, the American people have been fooled into this.

We need to stop.

But, if the US Military grabbed Obama, Geithner, Bernamke, Pelosi, and Reed in their pajamas and booted them out of the country, that would not be too hard to take....

But, if the US Military

But, if the US Military grabbed Obama, Geithner, Bernamke, Pelosi, and Reed in their pajamas and booted them out of the country, that would not be too hard to take...

Maybe this is why Obama and the leaders of the other countries are all condemning the actions of the Honduran Congress, courts and military.

Militarism = Statism

Remember that the military is the government's lapdog. That the military is socialized and that Obama is the leader of the military.
Not all countries give their political leadership title and authority as commander of the armed forces.
Like it or not Obama is the commander of the armed forces. And since those in Congress have given extra powers to presidents, they no longer need the permission of Congress to take military action. Many countries separate the military from politics and as such the military does not recieve direct orders from the president.
When the Constitution was written there was a risk of making the president commander of the military. For this reason States were given a role in regulating the military, and Congress was given the role of controlling the military.
This has all changed today and the president of the United States can give direct orders to the military, send them to intervene without the approval of Congress or even send them onto the streets of the U.S. If we still followed the Constitution the power of the president would be limited, as would the military, but that is no longer the case.
Good morning.
grant

Very sad, isn't it. That

Very sad, isn't it. That our Constitution is being and has been turned into nothing more than as Bush said, a g**()&Y?^ piece of paper. At least by most of our elected officials, that is. You know the ones who took an oath to defend and protect it.

Try to PAY ATTENTION!

The additional term nonsense is PROPAGANDA from the Elite. This coup was organized by the Elite because Zelaya RAISED MINIMUM WAGE. The Elite own the media in Honduras, just as they do here. The additional term nonsense is a DISTRACTION to cover up the Elite's TRUE AGENDA - which is to KEEP ALL THE MONEY!! Get it?

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Horse Hockey...the minimum wage should never be defended here!

http://mises.org/story/2130

The rich don't get poorer because somebody puts in a minimum wage. What communist brainwashing manifesto have you been reading? Poor get even poorer with a minimum wage!

Entrepreneurs are less likely to expand and take risks with minimum wage laws in place because the risks are higher do to the higher costs. Also, the higher the minimum wage, the easier it is to justify spending capital on automation to eliminate the need for a labor force for those jobs. The unions push minimum wages so that companies can't outsource their work as easy to somebody across the street that employs wrench turners for half of what the union pays.

No class of elite truely cares what the minimum wage is, they know they can rebalanced their books and reduce the amount of labor needed to conduct their business as competitively as before the minimum wage laws were passed. If they truely are over throwing the government for minimum wages laws good for them! Maybe Honduras is where freedom is going to be at! I wish our elite would stand up and defend the free market, but they are all in it with our government.

I don't think she's defending it

She's just pointing out what happened and the fact that the elite don't like it (I've often wondered if salaries are somehow 'calculated' to make sure you're always one missed paycheck away from going under).

If they want to raise it, then let 'em...it's none of our business.

You seem to be missing the

You seem to be missing the point. And the point would be it's their business, not ours.

Speaking of TRUE AGENDAS , what's yours?

Actually,

I believe that Dr. Paul's stance on non-intervention is more to the tune of anti-war mongering, as Bush did, and WITHOUT due process, I might add. This intervention by Obama has more of a peace-keeping agenda. Maybe we should ask Dr. Paul what his stance is on this particular matter?

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

OK, I'll ask him! He is a

OK, I'll ask him! He is a wise man with much life experience...I don't think he will disappoint me.

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

For someone to come and post

For someone to come and post on DP you don't seem to know much about what Ron Paul believes. Because you seem to want to revise and/or use your own interpretation of what Dr. Paul has plainly said on numerous occasions, about interfering into the internals affairs of other nations.

Maybe you're the one who should be asking him what his stance is on this particular matter? I have no doubt you would be disappointed with his answer.

You'd better read-up a little on Ron Paul's position

And don't be fooled by "peace keeping missions".

But Mike...

I don't think there is any information yet as to how Dr. Paul feels about this particular Honduras issue. Maybe we should ask him about this specifically.

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

I'll bet you $100 he says something along the lines of:

"stay out of it"
A couple weeks ago Dr Paul said: "As an elected member of the United States House of Representatives, I have always questioned our constitutional authority to sit in judgment of the actions of foreign governments of which we are not representatives. I have always hesitated when my colleagues rush to pronounce final judgment on events thousands of miles away about which we know very little."

You could bet a lot more than that and not be risking anything.

That would be a stupid bet, since we already know that Ron Paul is against intervention and would not want us to get involved in issues that are not our business.
grant

My take

Because of rampant drug trafficking and prostitution throughout Honduras, I doubt very much that either of these presidents was much of a saint.

http://www.madcowprod.com
http://waynemadsenreport.com (As long as you accept Madsen uses "anonymous" sources...which I don't like one bit)
http://insider-magazine.com

Bottom line, the Drug Trade is a multi billion dollar mega industry. It is not small. It's larger than most entire countries and their infrastructure.

Honduras is home to the cocaine, contraband, and marijuana trade. If the people had any real choice in election, they probably would have elected someone honest over either Zeleya or Michelleti because lets face it....anyone would be better.

But instead, they went with Zelaya and maybe violated the law. This isn't any of our business. Ron Paul and Schiff have said countless times, we should just stay out of this country's affairs.

With Obama going in there and basically working behind the scenes to put Zelaya back in, it tells me this is the USA being stupid AGAIN and lighting a fire just because we might lose some business or drugs business in South America.....

I hope

you will read the article I referenced below for cactus1010, showing the TRUE reason for the coup...

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Isn't there ALWAYS some sort of distraction

when the elite are pulling something underhanded and sneaky? It's all about the money. Money, power and greed make the world go 'round. But maybe that's about to CHANGE! Someday maybe love will make the world go 'round. A leader who cares enough about his people to give them a 50% RAISE in pay seems like a step in the right direction to me! Maybe they can stop peddling drugs and prostitution now. No, wait! That benevolent leader seems to have been ousted by the greedy elite. There is nothing new here, folks...move along now.

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

There is

what?

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

We should not interfere...

Because we don't know what's best for those nations. And we always get in the middle of it due to things like the drug trade, which is stupid.

http://www.dailypaul.com/...

http://www.dailypaul.com/node/97993
Ousted Honduran President Attempted to Violate Constitution. In Addition to Defying Congress And Courts

We need to mind our own business. We don't walk in their shoes and have no idea what's really going on in their country. Nine times out of ten countries resent our interference into their internal affairs, just as we did when Mexico was pushing their weight around in Washington working against the wishes of a majority of Americans.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/8123513.stm..

Both Congress and the courts had opposed Mr Zelaya's referendum, which asked Hondurans to endorse a vote on unspecified constitutional changes alongside the November elections.

Tensions over the issue had been escalating for several days, with the army refusing to help with preparations for the referendum.

Just before dawn on Sunday, troops stormed the president's residence. There was confusion over his whereabouts for several hours before he turned up in Costa Rica.

Mr Zelaya called his ouster "a plot by a very voracious elite, an elite which wants only to keep this country isolated, in an extreme level of poverty".

He urged Hondurans to resist those who had removed him and late on Sunday flew to Nicaragua for a meeting of regional leaders.

Congress said it had voted to remove him because of his "repeated violations of the constitution and the law and disregard of orders and judgments of the institutions".

One man told the BBC that he had been in the city's main square all day, along with 2,000 Zelaya supporters. Jeronimo Pastor described the situation as tense and called on the international community to get involved.

But another resident of the capital said people were relieved at Mr Zelaya's removal. "Now we have a new president and will have elections and things will go back to normal," Kenneth Bustillo told the BBC.

The coup plotters

seized on Zelaya's attempt to hold a non-binding referendum Sunday on such a constitutional assembly as the PRETEXT for his removal. They claimed that he was seeking to change the constitution so as to allow him to remain in power for a second term, a charge which Zelaya DENIES. The opposition of the Honduran Congress, Supreme Court and military appears to have increased sharply after Zelaya RAISED THE MINIMUM WAGE BY 50 PERCENT, a move that incensed the most powerful business interests in the country. The Obama administration is officially calling for Zelaya's return to power.
Read more:
http://www.wsws.org/
US Seeks Deal Between Honduran Coup Leaders and Desposed President

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Well that right there tells the tale.

"RAISED THE MINIMUM WAGE BY 50 PERCENT"

And you think this is a good thing? In addition, I would hope our military would do the same if Obama wanted to give himself an unauthorized term. Protect from enemies foreign or domestic.

"Government spending cannot create additional jobs. If the government provides the funds required by taxing the citizens or by borrowing from the public, it abolishes on the one hand as many jobs as it creates on the other.", www.mises.org

"Endless money forms the sinews of war." - Cicero, www.freedomshift.blogspot.com

You are really

NOT paying attention. It's NOT about another term, that is the Elitist Propaganda. It IS about the poverty level of our species on this planet. God help us if we can't see anything but our own personal financial agenda.

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

Isn't there ANYONE

else interested in getting past the Elitist Propaganda to the real story about what is going on here?Or are you more interested in Obama bashing?

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!

The real story is we need to

The real story is we need to mind our own business Honduras is a sovereign nation. They need to take care of their own problems without outside interference,

That's the bottom line.

OK

I hear you... but I have to say I am very disappointed in your attitude.

. @ @ . Power to the People!
@ O @ -----> PEOPLE
. @ @ . NOT Corporate Entities!