Posting on the Daily Paul? If that's the case, I'm pretty sure they won't need a photograph to do it. They need only confiscate the server logs this site is hosted at. :P
Then they would have to contact each individual provider who has control over each IP on that list, but first they would have to get the names of those providers by having canns turn over their records, and then force them to go through their logs (assuming they keep them long enough) to determine exactly who had use of each of those given IP addresses at each specific moment in time.
That is of course after they forced Michael to turn over his logs, assuming that Michael keeps logs that old, or stores the IP of each post that is made, which is unlikely...
To be honest, you are pretty damned anonymous here, unless you voluntarily give it up.
_________
The Philosophy Of Liberty - http://www.isil.org/resou...
I was not intending to be scientific about it. My point was that if the government wants to, they absolutely will get that information.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"That is of course after they forced Michael to turn over his logs, assuming that Michael keeps logs that old, or stores the IP of each post that is made, which is unlikely..."
If they showed up on his door step and confiscated the server, they would have all the information they needed to locate anyone they wanted. Combined with the fact any Internet provider would readily hand over any information asked for, if the federal government was doing the asking (in this day in age, imo.)
This is not even to mention what could be done with the email addresses supplied with every account when registering.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
A trained, private individual could likely get into any residential server and acquire a physical address of posters if they put the time into it. This sort of thing happens all the time. They are normally called "hackers". Now just imagine what the full force of the state and federal government could accomplish if they put say a billion dollars into it.
For instance, if they retrieved an IP address and wanted to see where it was located, look what any public citizen can retrieve here, and imagine what the government could do with their technology: http://www.geobytes.com/I... (type in your IP)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Also, just for example:
"When is Comcast required by law to disclose personally identifiable information and CPNI?"
"the Cable Act requires the governmental entity to offer clear and convincing evidence that the subject of the information is reasonably suspected of engaging in criminal activity and that the information sought would be material evidence in the case."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"To be honest, you are pretty damned anonymous here, unless you voluntarily give it up."
This just isn't true, by any stretch of the imagination. Perhaps unless you use a random email to register, and only log in from very, very random internet cafes.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
That being said, if people are afraid of being identified for promoting Liberty here on the Paul, then the existence of this site is somewhat in vein. xD
The geobytes lookup is able to locate your general area because every IP address is geo-coded.
However, all provider given IP's are dynamic based on leases (unless you are paying extra for static, and if you don't know what I am talking about then I promise you that you are dynamic). This means that in order to determine who/where someone is specifically (as in address), you have to cross-correlate between time/date, provider's internal logs, and the actual IP address and then once that is found, demand from the provider that they turn over the name.
A hacker cannot locate you based solely on your IP, unless you have personal/private information available in some way. That is assuming they have the IP to begin with, which is a stretch. These CMS systems don't usually record connected IP's unless you specifically tell it to.
That is the only way to obtain that information, and therefore, yes, you are pretty damned anonymous unless you give up your info in someway, such as posting a website url that contains your whois info.
"You assume that more "skill/ability" means more information..."
On a side note, I was not implying a persons skill would give them more information out of an IP.
The point I was making here is that if a skilled hacker knew your IP address he could dig through your computer and more then likely find something in there containing your address (think IE cookies).
There are an infinite number of ways to make the IP to address connection, even without being an all powerful government entity.
By assuming "All the better to round you up with, my dear.", we are assuming the government would not be operating under constitutional conduct, or law.
Because of this, most of what you claim is completely irrelevant. The arguments you make, apply only under an entity operating under constitutional law.
If the circumstances were that the government were proceeding to "round up" Daily paul users (which would of course be unconstitutional, and unlawful), you could then easily interpret that they would seize any information, including your Identity and location, from your service provider.
Taking these two circumstances into account, we can assume with 100% certainty your location would be discovered. A prime example of this is child pornography "rings". When discovered, and investigated, these people are always located using the two sources we are talking about here, server logs once confiscated in conjunction with ISP logging. (unless someone made it easy for them and used there real name, credit card info for registering, or for purchasing an item).
My IP is Static, it has been for many years. The only time it changes is if the Cable modem itself is rebooted, unplugged, or is subject to a power outage. It is not uncommon for me to have the same IP for months at a time.
A Dynamic IP address is one normally associated with a DHCP server (router), and is normally very generic. However, you still have a very specific IP that is assigned to your cable modem, which can be used in the exact same way as a static IP address when it comes to location.
True with a Dynamic IP address it would be more difficult to identify a specific user on a network, however this fact is rather besides the point taking into consideration the nature of the circumstances we are speaking of.
Regardless of the above, even if you did a ipconfig /release, and then ipconfig /renew (manually change your IP) in a command prompt, a record of all these addresses is kept at your ISP, and the dates in which you had them along with other information. This log file at your ISP is all it would take to make the connection.
Well for anyone who's interested you can see a few pictures I have on myspace, if you have an account there. (profile is set to private, can't view them without an account.)
"What was taken from the boomers, it ain't there, what was taken from the X'ers it ain't there, what is being taken from their great, great, great squared grandchildren it ain't there. Some generation just has to have the guts to quit passing it on." Me
apparently. I've been told I look like my mom, my aunt, my sister (ok, her twin, could never figure that one out) and a large variety of strangers. LOL
For me, one of the most pleasant surprises about China was the popularity of umbrellas as a fashion statement and a practical way to protect one's skin. Of course, the beauty of it starts to wear off after the first few times you nearly lose an eyeball in a sea of sharp ended umbrellas and people! hehe
Pale-skinned and blonde foreigners tend to get the bulk of curious attention. The beach scene here is quite inverted. In the daytime during the summer, the beaches are pretty empty. Maybe just a few fisherman, some people walking along the water with umbrellas and the children etc...but in the evening, the beaches fill up with couples going for romantic walks and families enjoying the seaside.
I'm sure they must think I am nuts when I show up at high noon with a bottle of baby oil and mere sunglasses. haha!
"You never speak so I have to guess you're not free" - The Raconteurs
It's weird, the one in my account is the one I described. The one you are probably seeing is a headshot of me with a friends rifle, out at the range. Oh well.
I wanted to put up my chocolate, and yellow labs, as they are much prettier, and a lot better behaved than me.
Ehem....Jiminy....Your turn!!
ARE YOU KIDDING ME!?! Me writing about how my dog f_rted, was offensive?! At 1 am in the MORNING!?!
Have you read some of the attacks here in the last couple of days!?
I would think that some of the direct F__K Yous and such would get hit before that.
Dude, get a grip. You are a bit overzealous. I was going to apologize for being harsh on you for being an armchair quarterback living out of the country, but I will rethink that. Maybe that's why you are abusing your mod privileges on me in the first place.
Hey, not like I posted my real name or anything and there are apparently a lot of people out there that look like me. LOL At least I've had a lot of people tell me I look like someone they know.
As for the sunburn, I'm not gonna point it out to you then since you don't see it. I know it's there because I was outside a lot this summer.
an old growth coastal redwood was harvested a hundred years ago. A bluejay buried a tan oak acorn, which grew into and around the redwood stump, that split into two redwoods,growing through the garled tan oak.
The redwood is soft and tall, the oak is hard and garled, and together they stand. The redwood has a massive burl on the other side and the oak produces huge acorns that want to sprout where the drop. Very fertile and peacefull space, and represents to me, survival through balance, ying yang.
All the better to round you up with, my dear.
~
If they were going to round me up...
It would have been after I recieved a call from DC telling me I was under investigation about a year and 10 months ago :)
http://www.youtube.com/wa...
Vote em all out! - http://www.teabombs.com/
.
Well said there on the video.
For what?
Posting on the Daily Paul? If that's the case, I'm pretty sure they won't need a photograph to do it. They need only confiscate the server logs this site is hosted at. :P
Actually....
Then they would have to contact each individual provider who has control over each IP on that list, but first they would have to get the names of those providers by having canns turn over their records, and then force them to go through their logs (assuming they keep them long enough) to determine exactly who had use of each of those given IP addresses at each specific moment in time.
That is of course after they forced Michael to turn over his logs, assuming that Michael keeps logs that old, or stores the IP of each post that is made, which is unlikely...
To be honest, you are pretty damned anonymous here, unless you voluntarily give it up.
_________
The Philosophy Of Liberty -
http://www.isil.org/resou...
Are you kidding?
Absolutely no one is anonymous here if the powers that be want to know exactly who you are and everything about you. Don't be naive.
agreed
I was not intending to be scientific about it. My point was that if the government wants to, they absolutely will get that information.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"That is of course after they forced Michael to turn over his logs, assuming that Michael keeps logs that old, or stores the IP of each post that is made, which is unlikely..."
If they showed up on his door step and confiscated the server, they would have all the information they needed to locate anyone they wanted. Combined with the fact any Internet provider would readily hand over any information asked for, if the federal government was doing the asking (in this day in age, imo.)
This is not even to mention what could be done with the email addresses supplied with every account when registering.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
A trained, private individual could likely get into any residential server and acquire a physical address of posters if they put the time into it. This sort of thing happens all the time. They are normally called "hackers". Now just imagine what the full force of the state and federal government could accomplish if they put say a billion dollars into it.
For instance, if they retrieved an IP address and wanted to see where it was located, look what any public citizen can retrieve here, and imagine what the government could do with their technology:
http://www.geobytes.com/I... (type in your IP)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Also, just for example:
"When is Comcast required by law to disclose personally identifiable information and CPNI?"
"the Cable Act requires the governmental entity to offer clear and convincing evidence that the subject of the information is reasonably suspected of engaging in criminal activity and that the information sought would be material evidence in the case."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"To be honest, you are pretty damned anonymous here, unless you voluntarily give it up."
This just isn't true, by any stretch of the imagination. Perhaps unless you use a random email to register, and only log in from very, very random internet cafes.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
That being said, if people are afraid of being identified for promoting Liberty here on the Paul, then the existence of this site is somewhat in vein. xD
You assume that more "skill/ability" means more information...
Which is simply incorrect.
The geobytes lookup is able to locate your general area because every IP address is geo-coded.
However, all provider given IP's are dynamic based on leases (unless you are paying extra for static, and if you don't know what I am talking about then I promise you that you are dynamic). This means that in order to determine who/where someone is specifically (as in address), you have to cross-correlate between time/date, provider's internal logs, and the actual IP address and then once that is found, demand from the provider that they turn over the name.
A hacker cannot locate you based solely on your IP, unless you have personal/private information available in some way. That is assuming they have the IP to begin with, which is a stretch. These CMS systems don't usually record connected IP's unless you specifically tell it to.
That is the only way to obtain that information, and therefore, yes, you are pretty damned anonymous unless you give up your info in someway, such as posting a website url that contains your whois info.
_________
The Philosophy Of Liberty -
http://www.isil.org/resou...
.
"You assume that more "skill/ability" means more information..."
On a side note, I was not implying a persons skill would give them more information out of an IP.
The point I was making here is that if a skilled hacker knew your IP address he could dig through your computer and more then likely find something in there containing your address (think IE cookies).
There are an infinite number of ways to make the IP to address connection, even without being an all powerful government entity.
.
By assuming "All the better to round you up with, my dear.", we are assuming the government would not be operating under constitutional conduct, or law.
Because of this, most of what you claim is completely irrelevant. The arguments you make, apply only under an entity operating under constitutional law.
If the circumstances were that the government were proceeding to "round up" Daily paul users (which would of course be unconstitutional, and unlawful), you could then easily interpret that they would seize any information, including your Identity and location, from your service provider.
Taking these two circumstances into account, we can assume with 100% certainty your location would be discovered. A prime example of this is child pornography "rings". When discovered, and investigated, these people are always located using the two sources we are talking about here, server logs once confiscated in conjunction with ISP logging. (unless someone made it easy for them and used there real name, credit card info for registering, or for purchasing an item).
My IP is Static, it has been for many years. The only time it changes is if the Cable modem itself is rebooted, unplugged, or is subject to a power outage. It is not uncommon for me to have the same IP for months at a time.
A Dynamic IP address is one normally associated with a DHCP server (router), and is normally very generic. However, you still have a very specific IP that is assigned to your cable modem, which can be used in the exact same way as a static IP address when it comes to location.
True with a Dynamic IP address it would be more difficult to identify a specific user on a network, however this fact is rather besides the point taking into consideration the nature of the circumstances we are speaking of.
Regardless of the above, even if you did a ipconfig /release, and then ipconfig /renew (manually change your IP) in a command prompt, a record of all these addresses is kept at your ISP, and the dates in which you had them along with other information. This log file at your ISP is all it would take to make the connection.
.
Well for anyone who's interested you can see a few pictures I have on myspace, if you have an account there. (profile is set to private, can't view them without an account.)
http://www.myspace.com/st...
Where have all the photos gone?
long time passing.
pic
http://www.facebook.com/a...
http://c4.ac-images.myspa...
http://c4.ac-images.myspa...
"Oh, foolish man, what can you not be made to believe?" - Adam Weishaupt
www.cuttingthroughthematr...
I'm
I'm hot...
http://i3.photobucket.com...
or at least I was when that pic was taken.
“One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors.” Plato
150 degrees fahrenheit?
Oops. Time for a thermometer recall.
southern iraq in he middle
southern iraq in he middle of summer that shirt was supose to be tan ;)
“One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors.” Plato
Ouch!
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Pic Added....
Sorry for double post must have clicked submit twice.....
Pic Added....
JT
.
Love to see a face to the name
I always visualize what others look like.
Then see if their pic was anything like your visual...
Wow.....
you look just like a golden Ron Paul!
Nothing wrong with that ;-)
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Where is your....
pic?
where indeed
where indeed
The two people I would like to see most,
are quiltingsando and legalize liberty.
don't forget sentinel!
_____________________________________
Who gives a cluck. Just make it a clean egg-sit.
I already know what sentinel looks like..but he's not here
anymore unfortunately....:-(
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Good pic(k)s! Yeah, me too!
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Ok, well, done whether I like it or not. lol
Apparently things look different with IE than Mozilla.
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
You look like a lady I worked with at Regions Bank
y'all could be twins.
"What was taken from the boomers, it ain't there, what was taken from the X'ers it ain't there, what is being taken from their great, great, great squared grandchildren it ain't there. Some generation just has to have the guts to quit passing it on." Me
Heheh Thanks! Yeah, I could be twins with a lot of people
apparently. I've been told I look like my mom, my aunt, my sister (ok, her twin, could never figure that one out) and a large variety of strangers. LOL
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Ick, just noticed my sunburn in that pic!
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Vitamin D
Good that you are getting sun - you want your vitamin D maxed out for fighting the flu.
Upon examining your picture with my microscope, I pronounce you one of nature's most perfect creations.
You're very sweet to say that! :-D
Anyhow, never had any sort of flu that I remember and guess I am too pale to get a sunburn noticeable to anyone besides me LOL
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Pale
Pale has been a sign of beauty in Europe and Asia for as long as gold has been money. Sunburn, not so much. ;-)
Umbrellas are classy
For me, one of the most pleasant surprises about China was the popularity of umbrellas as a fashion statement and a practical way to protect one's skin. Of course, the beauty of it starts to wear off after the first few times you nearly lose an eyeball in a sea of sharp ended umbrellas and people! hehe
Pale-skinned and blonde foreigners tend to get the bulk of curious attention. The beach scene here is quite inverted. In the daytime during the summer, the beaches are pretty empty. Maybe just a few fisherman, some people walking along the water with umbrellas and the children etc...but in the evening, the beaches fill up with couples going for romantic walks and families enjoying the seaside.
I'm sure they must think I am nuts when I show up at high noon with a bottle of baby oil and mere sunglasses. haha!
"You never speak so I have to guess you're not free" - The Raconteurs
Northern European with sunburn -- yeah you're right! LOL
Took that pic a few months ago, so sunburn has turned into a tan.
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Me too
Couldn't crop the boobs, or the ex out, so you'll have to settle for a pic of me with my arms around a couple of my buddy's girlfriends....8)
I am so on the list now.....Geez.
Jiminy, you are NOT off the hook.
★★★★★★
http://www.documentarywir...
http://freedocumentaries....
Oh my God Jefferson......
you look like Jesus with a haircut!
;)
Hmm..we must be looking at different pictures. I only see one
person and I assume it's you. Good to "see" you Jefferson! :-)
Jiminy, your turn! No weasling your way out now!
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Yep
It's weird, the one in my account is the one I described. The one you are probably seeing is a headshot of me with a friends rifle, out at the range. Oh well.
I wanted to put up my chocolate, and yellow labs, as they are much prettier, and a lot better behaved than me.
Ehem....Jiminy....Your turn!!
★★★★★★
http://www.documentarywir...
http://freedocumentaries....
Yeah, I know what you mean -- good pic though anyhow!
I personally would rather have a photo of my cats instead of me. lol
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Jefferson,
Check your email.
Oh, and thanks for sparing us the boobs. Lol.
Eyes watering!!
Offensive post. Sorry! zp, mod.
ARE YOU KIDDING ME!?! Me writing about how my dog f_rted, was offensive?! At 1 am in the MORNING!?!
Have you read some of the attacks here in the last couple of days!?
I would think that some of the direct F__K Yous and such would get hit before that.
Dude, get a grip. You are a bit overzealous. I was going to apologize for being harsh on you for being an armchair quarterback living out of the country, but I will rethink that. Maybe that's why you are abusing your mod privileges on me in the first place.
★★★★★★
http://www.documentarywir...
http://freedocumentaries....
I wanna hear about the dog (I think)
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
And the ex and the girlfriends lol Jiminy, it is SOOO your turn!
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
Oh no. I wasn't joking below...
...about either of the things I said.
I would never put my pic on internet and I really don't know how to load pictures in my computer even if I wanted to post my pic
... And Jefferson was right. I am shy.
But I appreciate you guys posting yours. Y'all got guts.
...also, I don't see your sunburn if that makes you feel better. ;)
What?? No webcam for a self-portrait even??
Hey, not like I posted my real name or anything and there are apparently a lot of people out there that look like me. LOL At least I've had a lot of people tell me I look like someone they know.
As for the sunburn, I'm not gonna point it out to you then since you don't see it. I know it's there because I was outside a lot this summer.
What are you fightin' for?
Caught in the middle?
Freedom is only for those with the guts to defend it!
My secret place
an old growth coastal redwood was harvested a hundred years ago. A bluejay buried a tan oak acorn, which grew into and around the redwood stump, that split into two redwoods,growing through the garled tan oak.
The redwood is soft and tall, the oak is hard and garled, and together they stand. The redwood has a massive burl on the other side and the oak produces huge acorns that want to sprout where the drop. Very fertile and peacefull space, and represents to me, survival through balance, ying yang.