Michael Moore admits that Capitalism is not the problem (and then reveals he's a socialist)

discussion. He thinks your problems strt when you enter college.

If you are born into our system, you have a huge debt that you cannot even legally be contracted to. But, yet...

The problem is our debt based paper money system that only Ron Paul is willing to talk about at length.

He can hardly articulate his own position.

How would fixing the corporatism help those on the lower rung? By stopping the richest from robbing the poorest of their savings by counterfeiting money!

It doesn't matter if one person makes 4, 40, or 4000 times more than someone else. What matters if that they make it honestly: by offering something that others voluntarily choose to buy.

And if we didn't have all this fraud and counterfeiting going on and there was no automatic assumption of monetary inflation and all its side effects then shareholders wouldn't stand for today's ridiculous PE ratios. CEOs would have to actually deliver solid earnings to make the big bucks.

Become a creditor. Don't be a victim. Michael, my family in Argentina would not send their MAID to a government run hospital. So much for socialized healthcare. Credit cards are actually gift cards if you realize what is going on.

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"Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it." -- Joseph Goebbels

through the barrel of a gun.

RE: Student loans...amazing that they can't connect government backed loan systems with tuition inflation...amazing

He actually makes some good observations and comes to the wrong conclusions.

They both rightly identify entrenched corporatism as the major problem in our current exploitative environment.

However, an interesting problem arises talking about the golden days or golden ideal of free market America. The problem with the collegiates reasoning is that an aggressive capitalist mindset will / may lead powerful free market companies to seek a corporatist government suprastructure to permanently establish them as the powers that be, regardless of any true value. Historical development from late 19th century America onward bears this truth out. I think Michael Moore understands that, as do many contemporary liberals, but they don't usually reason it out very well.

This is why I keep myself firmly ensconced as a moderate libertarian and all the theoretical / abstract reasoning has yet to convince me otherwise. Although if we had enough dedicated honest statesmen like Ron Paul, a nearly voluntarist-anarchist or at least minarchist government might be possible. However, this government could / would not exist without a majority of enough dedicated honest and virtuous citizens, at least not as a democracy. So then we are left with an aristocratic type government as the option, enforcing freedom and virtuous behavior on the crooked by force, and that breaks most libertarians first theoretical ideological law.

"Either force or corruption has been the principle of every modern government." --Thomas Jefferson to John Adams, 1796

Force is what he's advocating and has been used by this government for generations.The role of government is not for charitable uses.To promote charity is one thing,but to fund it with tax money is socialism,which will lead to communism.
I wonder when did life,liberty and the pursuit of happiness were traded in for "safety"? My guess...incrementalism.

somebody needs to grab this person by the lapels of his jacket, pull his face right up next to their's , look him in the eye, and say: "Dude, Ron Paul dude, have you ever heard of Ron Paul? What The ****?"

i thought the constitution said this is a republic?

This is a man shilling for the worker's paradise.

He is a communist, nothing more.

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"The consolidation of the states into one vast republic, sure to be aggressive abroad and despotic at home, will be the certain precursor of the ruin which has overwhelmed all those that have preceded it."

- Robert E. Lee, 1866

a better quality of life in Scandinavian countries, and in the video Moore lauds France as being closer to the ideal he'd like to see:
Socialism, higher taxes, government allocation of the taxes for health care, education, etc. He and many people see advantages to all this and no significant downside.
Are there any objective books, studies, etc. that impartially analyze these systems?
I realize the US system is not so very different from the European countries in policies. And it's hard to compare, since ours is so much bigger and the populace way more diverse, so there's far less agreement on anything; and maybe because of the massive size of the US gov., corruption is impossible to restrain, and waste grows exponentially? Then all the wars and empire we finance add to the monstrous calamity of our system.

http://www.lewrockwell.com/blog/lewrw/archives/038966.html

"What was taken from the boomers, it ain't there, what was taken from the X'ers it ain't there, what is being taken from their great, great, great squared grandchildren it ain't there. Some generation just has to have the guts to quit passing it on." Me

* CAPITALISM AND THE HEALTH-CARE DEBATE *
regarding the HEALTH-CARE DEBATE,......how valuable is a man's life compared to"the gold standard" that capitalism has raised ?
it's good to see and hear of those who show how valuable a man is, like jack herer, (as an example) by their donations toward the hospital cost. but here we also have a show of those who wouldn't lift a finger to help a man in his need, unless compensated with money......
VALUES ! man vs. gold!
we mankind have placed value on things like gold, when we should rather place our value and standard toward the well-being of each other and raise that standard alone !
that's what i would call true health-care all around the earth, where no-one's left out! because their' well-being is the standard in us!
gold should be lowered to the status of being a common thing....values!?
my friend jack herer's life is worth more than capitalism's standard of whats valuable!
capitalism robs all mankind of the dignity due them....that means:" being valued by those around you". an example of those who's dignity been stolen from are the homeless. does anyone really care about a homeless person's well-being? the homeless are always being run off the the establishment of capitalism with police-force backing!
how just is capitalism ? seeing that it robs from another ? of even life itself ? gold was more valuable than the lives of san salvador the day columbus' ship arrived. the same with north america from the east coast all the way to the west coast. how many died because their neighbor saw gold as being more valuable than themselves...?
when it comes to showing genuine care for another, the means employed doesn't begin with capitalism, but with the heart.....capitalism hinders the heart's resources from being employed toward the well-being of those you care for....LIMITATIONS !
IF IT NOT BE TRUE,......then why is everything hindered by a lack of capital $ from the homeless to the united states government ?....! and that's not speaking of the welfare of other nations, countries, and peoples. it doesn't matter if your a capitalist or socialist. it doesn't matter if your a democratic nation or a communist nation. CAPITALISM HINDERS ALL PEOPLE !
if our standard is being that the well-being of our family, friends, and neighbors, and even the neighbors you've never met before, are important to you, then we have shown signs of compassion drawing from our own personal experiences,.....knowing personally, what it might be like for someone else, being in similar circumstances we've treaded in before.
then we've obeyed what was counciled out of the mouth of moses, who spoke about meeting a stranger along the way....reflecting on our own personal experiences of hardship and suffering (in egypt) and being without someone who cared for our own well-being in a time of need....saying, remember what it was like for yourself....opening your heart of compassion as well as your hand and give to the need of the stranger, remembering how it was, that there was not anyone there to help you in your times of need, past, relating it to your neighbors, strangers, family and friends' needs at present. that there may not of been someone there to help in there own present need, if you don't.
that's what it means to fulfill the law and the prophets....loving your neighbor as yourself, treating them with the same care you have had a need of in your own time of need, so that you can receive help in for your needs, down the way....reaping what you've sown toward others.....
the measure you meet out, you will receive back to your own need from your neighbors MULTIPLIED!........speaking of karma, sowing and reaping. karma is one's own livelihood based upon one's relationships with family, friends, and neighbors, as well as his god. it's the disposition of our circumstances. he who sows to the well-being of another's good, well then receive it back again in a due course of time, from many of our neighbors. it's that easy to be a benefit to others as well as being benefitted, enriching and being enriched.
then all else, being things (food, shelter. clothing, etc.) will fall into it's rightful place (priority) in all our lives and in all our relationships, being administered in love to one another.
biblicallyspeaking, council drawn out of experience, is understanding. thus, the old testament, becomes the new ! law is transformed into council based upon one's experiences, drawing the line between being a wise person or a foolish person.....learning from the experience of one's history and that of others......

Well.... who knew?

Every day bring a new shocking revelation!

I may not know the truth, but I know when I'm being lied to...

He seems incapable of making sense.

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"Is Anybody Out There?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXaXV2OZmLw&eurl=http%3A%2F%2...

Should of asked him what he thought about the federal reserve & to abolish it

Well owned sir. Love it when we force hacks to define their terms.

im not kidding. What a commie.

This guy admits that the title of his film is probably not accurate. He then talks about how we should have competition, and yet his whole career is based upon socialism, which is totally incompatiable with competition. What a fool!

or majority rule. This country we founded as a republic because of almost exactly the same things that are going on right now here in this country.
But instead of a bunch of greedy corporations wanting to run the planet, there was King George wanting to be a tyrant. Same song different day and we all remember what happened with King George. If the majority of American people took to the street with axes and torches this sh#t would be over in no time. We showed an overwhelming presence in washington on Sept 12....If those folks had been armed exactly what do you do about that?

What Michael Moore fails to realize is that every time we spend our money, we are in fact "voting".

We vote with our wallets everyday!

The companies that don't get our money, are voted out!

That's why it's so important for our government to not interfere in the people's "vote" by bailing out the failed companies or giving certain companies unfair advantages and special favors.

notice he never answered the question

we are living in a time and a culture where. 90% of the people don't know...
1 what money is or where it comes from.
2 what form of government they have.
3 thier position in the political spectrum.
he clearly also does not know that a calorie and an BTU are the same thing!
and umm, who are you calling "old" wise guy!

" the important thing is to never stop questioning, curiousity, has it's own reason for existing..
Albert Einstien