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A Letter to Ron Paul Supporters from LP Prez Candidate Christine Smith

http://www.libertarianfor...

A message from Christine Smith, December 6th, 2007

Why did Ron Paul leave the LP as a means to advance liberty as a candidate? I'm asking this of myself over and over. Is the reason because he saw the LP as a futile path? A waste of his time and energy? No place for an individual who really wants to be part of achieving liberty in America now? For myself, as someone who is devoted to advancing liberty and sharing libertarianism, I am having serious doubts as to whether the LP deserves individuals willing to give of themselves so selflessly. Perhaps Ron Paul's experiences brought him to such a point and decision. I know my experiences with the LP are pointing that way.

Every several days, it seems I learn of yet another individual I respect who has left the LP, and always for reasons I now more completely understand than ever before.

They are individuals who achieve progress in advocating liberty. They are the truest libertarians I have ever met. And they left the LP.

These are all individuals who tried to make a difference within the LP and finally made the decision that the LP was unworthy of their continued support and participation, that the LP did not deserve what they offered to give, that they could accomplish much more good work for liberty outside the LP rather than within it (and they've done it!).

I am at a point where I am seriously questioning whether the LP is a political party to take seriously at all or is it primarily a place for those who merely sit around and talk and argue but never actually do anything of substance? Is it a place where winners (those who actually work hard to achieve progress and success in advancing liberty in our nation) find themselves surrounded by losers (those whose priority is not liberty but who use the cause of liberty for other agendas)?

I have been reluctant to follow that line of thinking until now.

Because now, the more experiences I have, the more I wonder if all those who left the party are right.

I know it was the right choice for themselves because I see them joyfully doing good work which makes a difference, and now I also am thinking that maybe they are right about the utter failure of the LP as a means to make meaningful progress toward liberty...maybe it is a waste of one's time.

Since writing 'I Will Not Compromise - An Open Letter to libertarians,' I have obviously become even more discouraged, and even more disillusioned about the LP.

I am yet undecided, and though I yet am making a conscious choice to believe there is yet hope and yet a possibility that the LP may be a viable vehicle to advance liberty, I am uncertain. I am discouraged. I am wondering...and I am watching.

Meanwhile, my appreciation goes to Ron Paul (and his supporters) for doing more to advance liberty in this nation than anyone has ever done in the political arena before.

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Best of Both Worlds

I'm very happy to have changed my registration to help Republicans select Ron Paul as their nominee. (Not to mention donating lots of money, walking precincts, sign waving, etc.)

But I'll never give up my membership in the LP, and my voter registration goes back to Libertarian on February 6. Those of you who remain in the Republican Party or registered Republican can count on me working from the outside to support your defence of freedom, but I don't trust the powers-that-be in the dominant parties. I think they'll be obstructive and the last to go. And even at that, they both have built in limits on freedom in their platforms that it will take a long time to change.

I'm much happier working with a small, but agile and committed alternative party that defends all freedom from principle.

IMissLiberty

Wayne Root!

I was registered as a Libertarian. But I changed to Republican so I can vote for Ron Paul in the primary (Pennsylvania has a closed primary). Since the Republican party is closer to Libertarianism than the Democratic Party, I will probably stayed registered as a Republican just so can vote in their primaries. Third parties usually don't have real competitive or meaningful primaries anyway. In the general election, its doesnt even matter what your party registration is because you can vote for whoever no matter their with. So you could I left the "L"ibertarian Party but I'm still a "l"ibertarian in that I vote for candidates that are the most libertarian. I think in an ideal America there wouldent be political parties. Politicans should all just be independants who represent their constituents, them and their constituents are the "party" they belong to.

Anyway, if Ron Paul doesnt get the Republican nomination and he doesnt run as an independent or third party, then I will vote for Wayne Root in the Libertarian Party (www.rootforamerica.com). He is almost identical to Ron Paul. Except, he is a little softer on foreign policy. But still believes we need to get the hell out of the Eastern Hemisphere ASAP! He is a millionare from Las Vegas who owns a gambling company. He is a TV celebrity who's good on camera and very well spoken. I sort of think of him as Ron Paul 2.0

Root certainly seems like a

Root certainly seems like a Las Vegas showman, and he comes off a bit of a slickster... his message is just about right though. He is well spoken and represents the next phase of the Libertarian party. I'd love to see where he takes his campaign, but obviously Ron is the way to go.

Lead your party back into it's rightful place in the GOP fold.

Hi Christine,

As Dr. Paul has said of Iraq, "we just marched in, we can just march out".

Perhaps, as the leader of the Libertarian Party, you could choose the opposite. Let's assume that the libertarians marched out of the Republican Party after the defeat of Barry Goldwater or some other event. I don't know the history. You've reorganized as a third party, but, had little impact on national elections, so maybe, now it is time to March Back In to the Republican Party with the added numbers of the Ron Paul Revolution and take the GOP back to it's conservative/liberty and constitution loving roots. March Back In.

It is a moment in time that is open to you and to all Libertarians to be relevant in the two party system again. You wanted Dr. Paul to be your nominee. He still can be. Re-join the GOP, bring your friends, and let's take our party back. Join the fight.

contingency plan

If suicidal Republicans nominate anyone other than The Good Doctor for President, then I will likely return to the Libertarian fold and support their candidate, UNLESS, Ron is so moved by surging support and accepts the nod from the new Federalist Party (or LP or CP).

Our Federalist ticket: Paul/Smith '08 ?

Viva Agora!
LehrBoy
www.citizenduquesne.org

Helping Ron Paul

We are all allies who sincerely devote ourselves to advancing liberty.
Ron Paul's campaign is one of the most debated and discussed topics among libertarians/Libertarians today. Due to such discussion (and the emails I receive on this topic), I want to share with you what I think:

I, as an individual am committed to advancing liberty in our nation, thus I am and will do everything I can to help the campaign of Ron Paul.

Advancing liberty is my goal, and for the past month and half, I've been doing whatever I can to share/promote Ron Paul's campaign. I'm doing even more now. I believe it is imperative everyone who truly wants to achieve true liberty in this nation do all they can to help those who courageously step forward to make a stand in this nation for our freedoms-and Ron Paul has stepped forward!

I did not always feel this way, thus I can more easily comprehend those Libertarians who differ with me, but I have grown in my understanding and my awareness, especially in the past two months. I now reject the knee-jerk reaction which I see many Libertarians still harbor. The reason? Because nothing is more important to me that achieving greater liberty in America, I now understand the necessity of putting aside differences (and certainly disregarding political party affiliation) when it comes to advancing liberty. If I believe a candidate is sincere, trustworthy, and devoted to the cause of liberty - I am more than happy, I am elated, to help them. This is how I feel about helping Ron Paul.

Last night, I was again on another radio show to promote Dr. Paul and share about the Boston Tea Party 2007. On the show (heard in America and also in Europe via internet) I invited everyone to view the video of the speeches given at Faneuil Hall, particularly recommending the speech by Jacob Hornberger as it was a most eloquent impassioned elucidation of Dr. Paul's key issues which distinguish him from every other major party candidate.

(Interested in viewing it? Visit

BOSTON TEA PARTY 2007 SPEECHES/VIDEO

or visit

http://www.jozefnagy.com:...

Fast forward to a few seconds past the 15-minute mark to hear Hornberger's speech about Dr. Paul - I'm sharing that link with many, and shared it with everyone on the radio show last night--the speeches are good--but Hornberger's is the one I particularly recommend since it was so powerful).

On the radio show, I discussed Paul's amazing $6 million in fundraising this past Sunday and explained just what that means in terms of the incredible grassroots support he has. I discussed his several key issues (on which we both agree), and even shared some of Dr. Paul's comments about how he feels about his fundraising getting media attention versus his ideas/policy (which in itself speaks to the popularity of his ideas). Now that's a man of integrity. (I also discussed HR 3600, Dr. Paul's attempt to get fair ballot access for all candidates.)

It was a great show, and just one of the things I intend to keep doing for Ron Paul especially now and during the next few months of primaries.

Why you might ask, considering I'm seeking the LP nomination? Well, I think most of you comprehend how important achieving liberty: restoring our rights, getting us on a path to economic prosperity, and most of all peace, is to this nation. So it follows that with liberty as my goal, I'm going to help others who sincerely share this goal...and I think Ron Paul has done more for the cause of liberty in this nation than any other politician in our lifetime.

As an individual I intend to always do all I can for the cause of liberty throughout my life. And I feel that at this time, right now, whatever I can do to help his campaign is directly helping the cause of liberty in America.

As I shared on the radio show last night, people need to get past the political party next to someone's name. We need to support the candidates who we trust are truly devoted to achieving liberty. I've gained a much deeper understanding and appreciation for this necessity at this point in my life...because we need to save America...we need liberty...and for me that's more important than anything. I don't care if there's an "R" a "D" an "L" or any other party designation by someone's name - I care about who they and what they stand for-and if they are devoted to advancing liberty-I'm for them.

I'm aware that I didn't possess this understanding fully when I began my campaign. I did intellectually to some degree, but at the same time, I of course was very focused (and still am) on my campaign and thereby distracted enough to allow myself to have an irrational knee-jerk reaction to Paul's campaign. I always appreciated him (for his voting record and his strong uncompromising position of non-interventionism in foreign policy), but now, due to those of you who shared much with me (and my in depth reading of Dr. Paul's writings), I began to realize that the most important thing I can do for liberty right now is to help Ron Paul. Those of us who care about liberty need to gather signatures (support those who are), talk to everyone we possibly can in person-phone-letters, etc., and do our best to help Ron Paul in general (and specifically in the important primary states). And that's what I'm going to do every chance I can.

I've become a reader of Dr. Paul's columns on Lew Rockwell, and highly recommend them to you because his consistency for liberty on so many issues are in his columns - you will learn much - I know I have a far greater deeper appreciation for Dr. Paul because of those columns - columns I only began reading consistently in the past two months - I'm glad they are archived. Prior to this, I didn't have the knowledge to make a judgment and thus I was mistaken in doing so. Now that I've taken the time to really research this man, his consistency for years, and read his positions in depth - I too am excited and want to help.

As for my campaign, it is stronger than ever thanks to so many of you. I thank everyone for their support. You came through for me in so many ways, and I want you to know all my experiences this past year have made me an even stronger communicator of liberty because I have learned so much. I want to always learn and grow, I want to learn from other's wisdom and experiences, so I can be the best advocate for liberty I can be. And my heart is filled with gratitude to all the libertarians/Libertarians who have graciously shared so much with me each step of my campaign. Now, I'm more ready than ever to be the best LP Presidential candidate for us --and I owe that to so many of you. I have learned much in this past year, and I am stronger for it. Thank you.

Yes, my campaign is continuing, it is strong, and I am happy, grateful and encouraged! Liberty is my goal and I will do all I can to work for it and I will always support others I believe are sincerely working for it.

Each of us have unique gifts to give; it's time to put aside differences, join together, and create the nation we envision of liberty for all.

I'll be meeting more of you in this coming year, and am looking forward to what we're going to do at the LP National Convention In Denver in May, 2008. I hope you can join us in person, and if not, join us in spirit - the spirit of liberty!

And, I reiterate the truth I am now more fully aware of and taking action for: We are all allies who sincerely devote ourselves to advancing liberty.

Christine Smith
Libertarian Candidate for President
http://www.LibertarianFor...
Christine Smith for President
15400 W. 64th Ave., E9-105
Arvada, Colorado 80007
(303) 731-5879

PAID FOR BY CHRISTINE SMITH FOR PRESIDENT

I am Deeply

Thankful for your support of Dr. Paul. Hopefully someone more eloquent than myself will respond in greater depth.

And, again thank you for all the messages to me

And, again, my deep appreciation to all sharing with me through this message board and via emails. Your communications have meant much to me.

Christine Smith
Libertarian Candidate for President
http://www.LibertarianFor...
Christine Smith for President
15400 W. 64th Ave., E9-105
Arvada, Colorado 80007
(303) 731-5879

PAID FOR BY CHRISTINE SMITH FOR PRESIDENT

I dont care about parties

I care about not having to vote for the lesser of two evils for the first time in my life. There is a movement here, and it will continue after this election and the LP has the most to gain from this. Dont get discouraged because of this one election, but join our best chance to truly change things this time around.

Not sure it is the party

Christine,

I have never been a part of the Libertarian Party. I never knew who Michael Badnarik was, but I'm voted Badnarik in 2004.

I'm nearly certain that it is not the Libertarian Party per se, instead the political system where the "ruling parties" are subsidized by the government.

You may be looking to assign blame where the blame lies elsewhere.

The LP - Update from Christine Smith, December 9th, 2007

Since a number of you have asked what is disturbing me: fundraising is only part of it (though significant), it is also my general feeling about the LP itself, the LNC, and the LP's Executive Director Shayne Cory (for whom I have no respect based on my personal experiences). As a 3rd party candidate, I am willing to fight the system, but I shouldn't have to constantly fight my own party which I've had to do since my campaign began.

Christine Smith
Libertarian Candidate for President

http://www.LibertarianFor...
Christine Smith for President
15400 W. 64th Ave., E9-105
Arvada, Colorado 80007
(303) 731-5879

PAID FOR BY CHRISTINE SMITH FOR PRESIDENT

Changed from LBT to Republican this week...

I've been registered Libertarian for 15 years, ran for state office twice just to get the word "Libertarian" in front of the public eye, but this week I changed to Republican for obvious reasons. The word "libertarian" has been uttered on TV and other media more when talking about Ron Paul this year than the entire history of the LP combined.

I'm disappointed that the entire LBT party has not dropped what they're doing to get behind RP, and only time will tell if I change my registration back. For sure, though, if Paul doesn't win I will certainly unregister Republican.

Thanks to Christine for sharing this letter, I hope you'll come over!

Breaking News from LP Exec Committee

The story has changed dramatically as of yesterday's LNC meeting...

http://dailypaul.com/node...

That is a solid set of actions to take on behalf of Ron Paul!

We haven't all left, just stepped away for a while...

I fully support the LP's platform, and will definitely cast a vote for any LP candidate on my ballot in VA, with the sole exception of the Presidency... this time, anyway. Ultimately the rEVOLution IS the Libertarian Party of the future, in my view. Ron Paul as a Republican gets to be on national TV to spread the message. Ron Paul as a Libertarian would not be where he is now, there's no doubt about that in my mind. That doesn't mean the LP doesn't have value, though, especially for Congress and statehouses.

If Dr. Paul doesn't get the GOP nomination, most of us will have nowhere else to go but the LP. I do notice that Ron hasn't completely ruled out an independent candidacy, even if he has no plans to do it. I personally think that he'll eventually go where his army takes him, but he can't think about that in the pursuit of his current goal. Very sensible, IMO. But that might not happen, and we'd need people like you desperately in that case. If it does, then the LP will see the biggest surge of publicity in its history.

There might even be a Libertarian blimp :)

Personally I hope the LP turns towards running a candidate for every single seat in Congress. Ron Paul could very well be the first candidate to have his coattails cross party lines, and he'll need every vote possible in Congress to implement his agenda. LP congressional candidates could benefit enormously from public endorsements from Dr. Paul. We'll be much better off working together than against each other. A win for Dr. Paul is a win for the LP in the long run.

Sam Marsh
Musician
http://www.myspace.com/sc...

When I vote…

When I vote, I fully intend to vote for every libertarian bent candidate on the ballot with the exception of Ron Paul (R). In other words, I intend to give 98% of all incumbents their pink slip on election day. Ron Paul will need all of the people closest to his views when/if he wins the presidency. It would be very wise of the Libertarian party to throw 100% of their money and support behind Ron Paul during the primaries. If not, the Paul supporters (like me) will not forgive the libertarian party treason to the cause of liberty (IMO).

I agree with larethdf (above). Either we hang together or we will certainly hang separately. So, you libertarians get on the ballots in every open seat across the country any way you can (best shot is by temporarily changing parties) and espouse your undying support for Ron Paul while you are running. Together we WILL win this thing.

"It does not take a majority to prevail... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." Samuel Adams

amsterdam?

amsterdam?

Where would we go if Ron doesn't get nomination?

We'll have momentum and excitement and workers.

We'll not be working for Mitt or Obama.

So where else would we go?


Dennis
State education: The best way to insure implicit obedience is to commence tyranny in nursery. - Disraeli
Parents: http://p196.ezboard.com/b...

Funny

I will be leaving the Republican Party if the NeoCons win and keep control of the party.
I lean to the Libertarian side, but I would consider myself a constitutional conservative.
If NeoCons do keep control of party I will have to become independent or find another party.
Libertarians I can agree with for the most part except right to life issues.
I am for the unborn's right to life.

I just hope Ron Paul wins, then it won't be as complicated.
If Ron does win, then we just got to work to get 500 or so Congress people like him in office to carry the Revolution to reality and to it's full fruition.

It's the ideas, not the party.

Dr Paul has an impeccable record upholding the principles both you and I hold dear, Christine. That is why he has my vote for president in 2008. He has captured the nation's imagination and bought back a long-lost sense of hope by speaking simply and honestly about liberty, small government, and the gold standard. As a result, these ideas are resurging with a strength not seen since 1776. The LP can only stand to benefit from this: there aren't many like Dr Paul in the Republican party, so if the LP continues to run candidates true to those ideals, I'm sure you will have the support of more r3VOLutionaries than you could have dreamed of a few years ago. In the mean time: thank you for your work, and keep fighting the good fight for the ideas, not a party.

Illegal Immigration

I was going to vote for the Libertarian candidate for governor in my state but could not find his stance on illegal immigration which is not only a major problem in my town and state, but across the country. While doing research on the Libertarian Party I read that they are for open borders which was a big turn off to me. With Ron at least he seems a little tougher on this issue then what is typical LP stance.

The Math

I converted to the LP several years ago and only this year changed my registration back to Repub. It has to do with math. There are at least three factors to look at here:

How much I agree with the platform
Integrity of the candidate to follow through and not be corrupted by power
Odds of winning

With any of the LP candidates, I would have to score them as:

-99%- I truly love the LP platform. it is an ideal
-??%- The integrity of most LP Candidates hasn't been tested. Power is a corrupting influence. I would be optimistic, and realize that if they were truly only seeking power, they would have picked a different party, but it's still a big unknown.

-1%- let's face it- the two party system is a self preserving biased system.

With Ron Paul, i get:

-95% I agree with
-100% integrity- He has been tested in the crucible of public office for 20 years, and has not been found wanting.
-And right now, I'm giving 1 in 4 odds that he can win it all! Don't attack me for not saying 100%- I'm a realist. I think RP's support is way underestimated in polls and media, but I also realize that there is still A LOT of work to do. Half of the New Mexicans I talk to haven't even heard of him.

By using my little math formula, you can see that there is no way I could ever support any of the other Republican candidates currently running, unless maybe Tancredo changes his stance on the war and lightens up on his border rhetoric (we shouldn't shut down legal immigration)

So I will be voting for Ron Paul in the primaries and in the General election, even if that's a write in vote. Is there anybody here who can't spell R-o-n P-a-u-l?

LP

The LP is irrelevant. The republican Party is ripe for the picking. With 3/4 of Americans sick of the neocon agenda The Libertarian Wing can take over the publicans.

Maybe this will actually help the Libertarian Party

I have to agree to an extent. I'm a card carrying member of the Libertarian party and I think that Ron Paul is doing the party a big favor. All of the publicity he has received about being the presidential candidate in 1988 brought a lot of exposure to the party. He has opened the floodgates to what the libertarian philosophy is all about. He has brought the Libertarian message to the masses.

People you NEED TO VOTE for the libertarian candidates for every local position you are able. These people are the closest thing you can get to a Ron Paul in your local, county and state governments. If you want Ron Paul to be more effective when he IS elected, we need like-minded people who are apt to support more of his policies in there working beside him. The only ones to do that are the libertarians.

Since the Libertarians won't even decide on their candidate for president until election time is just around the bend and Ron Paul continuing to gain support in leaps and bounds they'll get zero exposure by the media.

If you are a Ron Paul fan you may think you're a Democrat or a Republican , but you're not. You my friend, are a Libertarian and it's time you put your support where it's due.

help us

help you. A Ron Paul Presidency will mean a sea change for American Politics. maybe even World Politics. I am an Objectivist, and have some disagreements with Ron Paul. My relationship to this r3VOLution is mutually beneficial. The Ron Paul Campaign is doing more in the War for Freedom in this single year than has been accomplished in all of the previous 50. Although, we are certainly the beneficiaries of many lifetimes of patriotic effort on this front. The Ron Paul Movement represents the Tipping Point for Liberty in our Culture. The Libertarian Party will have it's First chance at presidential Victory exactly 4 years after we Elect Ron Paul.

Just curious........

to what do you object, generally speaking, as an objectivist?



What is the core difference between objectivism and libertarianism?



Objectivism sounds "negative" where libertarian sounds "positive" though I certainly "object" to using force to impose the will of either an individual or a collective group onto another individual or collective group. I believe in individual free will. How does that differ from your core principles?




I'm not being a smarty-pants; I really am curious about the differentiation because I have seen alot of anti-Paul folks who call themselves objectivist. Then a guy at our meet-up said HE was an objectivist, but I didn't get a chance to talk to him about it. I had forgotten about my mild curiosity until I saw your post. Someone else in the group said the objectivist guy was an atheist, but then, so are alot of libertarians I know. So what's the deal?
Thanks!


"...it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security..."

Interesting

A well-known Libertarian said, around 1986, that he figured running for President in 2012 would probably be the right time to have a decent shot.

I like to think 8 years, actually...

:-)

Dear Christine

Dear Christine,

My heart ached hearing your concerns.

There have been so many small pools of freedom trudging along for so so many decades. Ron Paul's success does not prove that those pools were worthless! Rather, Ron Paul is the result of that rich irrigation provided by those many pools.

Having made 'libertarian' a household world (and a school word and a company word and a ...) since 1980, I can tell you that the LP had a major impact on myself and on the people around me. That being said, the forces arrayed against a third party finally beat me into despair.

But I've always been thankful, on election day, to have someone to vote for who wasn't trying to expand tyrrany over other people.

With great fondness...


State education: The best way to insure implicit obedience is to commence tyranny in nursery.
-- Disraeli
Parents: http://p196.ezboard.com/b...

Lets assume that it really is a 2 party system.

We all know the Republican, and Democrat party has lost its ideals. But why? Perhaps its because all the idealist have left and tried to form other 3rd parties. From Libertarian to Reform party. If we admit that there is a structural bias to the two party system maybe we simply gave up on the parties too soon. Instead of working to gain power in our respective parties and properly steer them in a direction they needed to go, we abandoned them to the crooks that now control them. We left control of this nation to a gang of crooks. Effectively we jumped ship thinking we could save it from a dingy pulling against the current. We need to take back the rudder and steer a course to Freedom!

I highly suspect...

...that the reason a LOT of these "idealists" abandoned the Dems and Repubs in the first place is because they found it utterly impossible to "steer them in a direction they needed to go." As completely as the 2-party system has rigged the game against third parties, the two parties encompassing it are even MORE rigged against radical change from within (Ron Paul is a classic example). Maintaining the status quo is the name of their game. And the "rudder" is securely nailed down, and set on a course for more power, more money and less accountability. Good luck swimming upstream against that (to mix metaphors :-))...

NOW IS THE TIME

Now is the time for these libertarian and other 3rd party folks to join us and take the Republican Party back! When we win this thing, theres going to be a significant change in the two parties. Lets force the big government neocons where they belong to the democraps, and take back the limited government Republican Party!

I agree

Besides, the two-party system is a myth. There is only ONE party. The Demopublicans. There's two FACTIONS in this beast, with different constituancies, but it's all one show.

I was going to say that...

...but since this is pretty much a GOP-centric forum, I didn't want to burst anyones little bubble... :-)

Third Parties

(Note: Sorry for the incomplete links in parenthesis. I couldn't direct link because the site kept flagging my post as spam, and I wanted to get this posted while Christine was still reasonably likely to come back and read it. Note to admin: the anti-spam system is really stifling!)

Third parties are not the answer, in my opinion. Supporters of third parties like to complain about the two party system and how it is "unfair," but the two party system is just the natural result of the electoral college. Many of these same people complain just as loudly about how "unfair" the EC is, but they are wrong (The Pro's and Con's of the Electoral College System: uselectionatlas.org/INFORMATION/INFORMATION/electcollege_procon.php).

The LP is worthless (Why the Libertarian Party Is Worthless: humanevents.com/article.php?print=yes&id=18555), but the same goes for all third parties. The answer is to reform the two major parties from within. There are efforts underway to do this (The Republican Liberty Caucus: rlc.org & The Republican Liberty Caucus Political Action Committee: republicanliberty.org). Ron Paul understands the value of this approach (The Liberty Political Action Committee: libertypac.net). There are of course efforts to fix the LP (The Libertarian Reform Caucus: reformthelp.org), but ultimately that is a waste of time.

Again, this is just my opinion, but I'm quite confident that I am right. If history is any indication, the LP is near death (How long can third parties survive under plurality?: rangevoting.org/TPHist.html). On a positive note, Ron Paul has given a huge boost to the "reform from within" effort, especially for the Republican Party, which I feel will ultimately be more receptive to the small-government ideas of libertarianism. There are likely similarly attractive efforts to reform the Democratic Party in a libertarian direction, but I haven't bothered looking into them closely (I lean Republican over Democratic, because while I can easily circumvent government regulation of my personal behavior, there's not much I can do to escape a state-controlled economy, and in general I find it's easier to convince Republicans to relax their social authoritarianism than to convince Democrats to relax their economic socialism).

Just my FRN$0.02!

---Signature---
Liberals want to be your Mommy. Conservatives want to be your Daddy. Libertarians want to treat you like an adult.
---
Stop the Thought Crimes Act (H.R. 1955) with one click: http://capwiz.com/jbs/issues/alert/?alertid=10528846

A Quick Update/Overwhelming Response to My Dec. 6 message

A quick update:

I have received over 100 replies to my December 6, 2007 message.

Approximately 95% of those are from individuals who have left the LP (most of them current Ron Paul supporters) or are current members who are experiencing similar disillusionment with the LP as I have; with many sharing personal stories of the reasons they left or are thinking of leaving. The other 5% of messages have come from LP members asking me to stay in the race and be a leader in the LP, but few of them cared to contribute to help me be the leader they say they want in the LP.

My goal is advancing liberty and joining only with others who share that commitment. I thank each of you for taking the time to write and share so much with me; my suspicion about the LP is being confirmed.

I have quite a bit to ponder as Dec. 31 approaches (it is the date I will decide to withdraw or not from the LP presidential race).

Christine Smith
Libertarian Candidate for President
http://www.LibertarianFor...

PAID FOR BY CHRISTINE SMITH FOR PRESIDENT

Thank you to each and every one of you

I want to thank each of you for taking the time to share so much with me.

I always want to learn and to grow. Truth is my highest priority, both sharing and knowing/learning it.

Thus, reading all of these comments has meant so much to me. I will be re-reading them all as well (actually I will print and save these-as I find much value in reading other's experiences and perceptions).

We are here for each other, to learn from one another, and I am so grateful that so many of you decided to take the time to share your thoughts, experiences and feelings with me.

My goal is advancing liberty and joining only with those who share that commitment. I certainly see that in everyone posting in this DailyPaul thread. You have given me much to ponder, and for this I thank you.

Best wishes.
Christine Smith
Libertarian Candidate for President

PAID FOR BY CHRISTINE SMITH FOR PRESIDENT

Libertarians; stop kicking yourselves

We are learning just how powerful the two party machine is. It's called a 2 party system but it's really one big machine and the Libertarians and Constitutionalists are not part of it. Ron Paul is not part of it, we're the spanner in the works, the monkey wrench that threatens the smooth running control of the globalist elite superstructure.

If the primary elections get diebold stolen and things start going badly for Dr. Paul I would like to see the Libertarian party endorse Ron Paul and get him on the ballet in every state for the general. There will not be time to set up another third party with the GOP convention set so late in the year.

We may need to start playing power politics with these clowns and threaten the two party machine with destruction. Not very many of us will go back to politics as usual if Ron Paul is robbed. For me it's Paul or nothing at all.

Thank you, Christine

For this thoughtful and heartfelt message. Stay true.

Philip Blumel
www.rlcfl.org

Different strokes for different folks

As individuals, we all have different talents, inclinations, networks, presentation, interests and priorities. For this reason, as libertarians we should all seek the tools that leverage our particular characteristics and where we feel most comfortable.

As a college student in the 1980s, that place for me was the LP and this experience was invaluable to me. As an adult in a professional life, the LP has proven a poor tool for me to advance liberty. Today, I am a libertarian Republican and a member of the RLC. See www.rlcfl.org.

For some libertarians, any political action would inhibit their effectiveness because of their persuasive role as educators or journalists or economists.

There is no single answer. Let a thousand flowers bloom. Wherever you best fit, keep up the fight. We need to be loyal our principles, not organizations.

Everybody keeps talking

Everybody keeps talking about running mates. It's too early to name someone, but I think Christine has the platform that really would perfectly compliment Ron's. She stands for freedom above all, but would help appeal to more left-leaning liberal types without compromising the most important economic liberty stances and foreign policy matters. IMHO.

Bias

The system really is so biased against the LP, especially at the pres. level. As we can clearly see, all it takes is a chance for these ideas to get on the same stage with the other fools, and the stark difference is so blatant. I think if Ron were king, he'd probably shake up that 2-party system, but that's going to take a lot more time. This is a good start, though.

Time for the libertarians to come home. Ron Paul needs you

Ron Paul is bringing together a huge cross section of the American people. Many of them are drawn into the Ron Paul revolution by one or two issues, or maybe by the shock of seeing a politician speak the truth. Many of these people have no experience thinking or reading about the philosophy of liberty. Part of this movement is educational - teaching people, including new recruits, about the deep and powerful principles of liberty that make Ron Paul what he is, and make this movement what IT is. I have watched (and participated in) this process on these boards and at the local meetup events. And it is the long-term, hardcore libertarians that are keeping the grass roots of the Ron Paul revolution centered on liberty. The libertarians are the idealogical backbone of the Ron Paul revolution.

The Libertarian Party was formed by Republicans who felt powerless to stop the Republican Party's drift away from the ideas of freedom. We now have a powerful movement in progress to restore the Republican Party's respect for freedom and peace. We need the Libertarian Party to join us.

It is time for the libertarians to come home.

Peace

IRV, anyone?

Another quick comment...

When doing my presidential homework (i.e. reading every candidate's website and positions in their own words in the interest of fairness), I came across a neat little thing that Kucinich (hear me out) is advocating that could greatly aid both the Ron Paul Republicans AND the Libertarian Party. Anyone else ever heard of instant runoff voting? It's pretty much amazing.

Essentially, IRV works like this:
When you vote, you rank your candidates (either first to last or top 3, depending on the administration and locale of the ballot, i.e. Ireland, Australia, etc.) according to preference.
Next, the votes are tallied strictly on the basis of your first-ranked vote. If nobody reaches a majority, then the lowest ranked candidate is eliminated and everyone who's vote ranked that person first, then falls to those votes' second-ranked candidate. If no majority is met for any candidate again, the process repeats itself.

So, basically, I could vote LP all my heart desires in the general election, but still vote AGAINST the Democrats. This format would be especially effective if we had proportional representation at some level of federal represenation, but I digress. Thoughts?

"Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together."
-Dwight D. Eisenhower

IRV and Proportional Representation

IRV is a good for third parties because it overcomes the primary objection to voting for them, namely that "my vote will be wasted". You can vote your conscience, knowing that your vote will go to your second choice if your candidate gets dropped during the iterative vote counting process.

IRV and proportional representation are independent. IRV still translates to "winner take all", albeit in a better scheme that redirects "wasted votes".

The problem with proportional representation is that it often produces minority governments, which are beset by compromise because of the coalitions that must be formed in order to govern. This creates an inertia that prolongs the status quo, which isn't something that a RP supporter would favor. And in the American system, where elections occur at fixed intervals, minority governments can also create prolonged gridlock. In a British parliamentary system, the gridlock usually gets broken because a new election is held if a bill proposed by the governing coalition loses a vote in parliament (unless a new coalition can be formed, which is a relatively rare occurrence).

Range voting is also a good

Range voting is also a good alternative to IRV.

Very interesting

I don't know that much about the LP, but I'm learning quickly many of the tenets of Libertarianism. And without a doubt, RP has made more progress for liberty outside of the LP than inside of it. These people leaving the LP should totally get behind Ron. Heck, I think the whole LP ought to throw their support behind them.

Ron Paul 2008!

Ron Paul has done more for the Libertarian Party than any one

In my mind, the word "libertarian" was never a household term before Ron Paul ran for president. Now the media always has to preface their introduction with, "the LIBERTARIAN republican" to make people think, "oh he's not really a Republican," but really, the VAST MAJORITY of Americans never even knew what libertarian meant before Ron Paul!!!
So I see two possibilities: the Libertarian party will start to gain real traction as voters say, "oh, Libertarian, like Ron Paul," and vote Libertarian, or, "Ron Paul Republicans" will bring the Republican party back to its original foundations of small government. Hey, remember Abraham Lincoln founded the Republican party, so it's not like the party itself is corrupt.

Not to nitpik

I also hate to nitpic but Lincoln was an AWFUL President. He started an unconstitutional war, instituted the first Federal income tax, suspended the writ of Habeas corpus, shut down newspapers that were critical of his administration, had political opponents jailed, started the first military draft (and used the navy to shell New York to put down the riots protesting the draft), used the army to intimidate voters at the polls to insure his re-election, printed huge quantities of fiat currency to fund the war, and used his presidency to perpetuate the ruinous protectionist tariffs that were one of the root causes of conflict between the north and south. In short, he was a tyrant.

Oh, but he freed the slaves! Well, he freed SOUTHERN slaves. He didn't free the slaves in the states that were fighting on behalf of the North. Didn't mention that in your history book, did it?

Lincoln was a tool of the industrial special interests of the North and he ran roughshod over the Constitution and civil liberties to make them wealthy. He did more than any other single president (except maybe the vile FDR) to concentrate power in the Federal government. But he has been canonized as a great American hero so it is better to just leave that chapter of our history shut and move forward to try and restore the freedom that he helped destroy.

Peace

Enlightening

and frightening, considering how highly Lincoln was and is regarded.

WOW...That's like...

gonna really twist some necks, especially as it is all quite true. However he did try and warn of the "underworld" powers that were undeniably controlling him and he spoke of his fears for the future. Which by the way, we are living!

"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed." - Abraham Lincoln

But hey, jeez...that's the kind of speech that'll invite some name calling! We don't like our Icons messed with do we?

“Think of the press as a great keyboard on which the government can play.” -Joseph Goebbels-

“Allow me to control the issue and the nation’s money and I care not who makes its laws!” — Amshell Rothschild