Jesse Benton Brings Huckabee Critics to Iowa
Posted December 14th, 2007 by zenpiper
Although the AP headline reads "Paul Brings Huckabee Critics to Iowa" - this is Jesse Benton's initiative.
Paul's campaign said Thursday it was paying former Sen. Jim Holt and former Rep. Randy Minton about $5,000 each to go to Iowa for a series of radio interviews criticizing Huckabee's 10 1/2 years as Arkansas governor.
While this may be a viable strategy, many of us would cry foul if Huckabee's campaign brought Texans to New Hampshire to criticize Dr. Paul. Maybe this is the way the game is played but I, for one, am not comfortable with it.
Dr. Paul's personal integrity, coupled with his message of freedom, should be sufficient to attracts supporters and votes. He has come a long way without resorting to hired guns to smear another candidate. Seems a bit desperate to do something like this; and--if I had to guess--it was done without Dr. Paul's approval.
Benton said Paul does not plan to bring in additional surrogates to campaign against Huckabee or any other candidate.
I hope that is the case.
Late hit :
After reading some of the other posts, there appears to be (at least) two viewpoints, and both have merit. My view is that hiring paid shills does not reflect well on RP's integrity. Some agree with me. Others have stated, perhaps correctly, that sometimes the gloves have to come off if one wants to win, and this kind of thing is neither illegal nor inappropriate, and that it's "about time" that the RP Campaign started playing hard ball.
I am not savvy enough to know which is the better course. I tend to follow my gut and heart. Only time will tell if hiring the guys was a smart move.
.
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The reason I say you shouldnt smear nor associate
with those that do.
Read the comments on this article about Huck smearing McCain
http://abcnews.go.com/Pol...
In a heated race where your trying to catch a front runner smearing makes sense. otherwise its best to lay off. Notice how silent Rudy is? He's the smartest of the lot...stay mum and let Romney lose steam and money.
Ron Paul HQ needs to read my 12 steps to victory post...its guaranteed victory if they even do 1/2 of the things I lay out. To those that havent seen it here it is
http://www.dailypaul.com/...
Do Not Instigate, Just Hold It Off
Ron Paul is about the truth, and he tells about it. But not mudslinging, no way no how. It's not in his character. The more they focus on him, negative or positive, the more he can respond and reinforce himself as THE ONLY ONE. People get noticed two different ways. I'd prefer the positive way. Now, I am not conceding that I will not throw back something in defense. Believe me, I will. But at the right time. It's not yet time. Hold it off.
I Agree With Zenpiper
As I stated in my letter to Iowa voters, one of the reasons I support Ron Paul is that he is never mean-spirited toward his opponents; his goal is to educate people and help them understand his message of freedom. And though one could make the point that bringing these two men to Iowa is educating voters, I think this move by Jesse Benton is not in keeping with Dr. Paul's flawless character.
I hope that Dr. Paul chooses not to endorse any more moves like this and continues running as who he is: a man above reproach, winning people over with his wisdom and outstanding character. Let the rest of them wallow in politics as usual; he is above all that.
he should have the family of the girl murdered and raped
That would be a better person
Sometimes you gotta play the game to play the game.
Make sense?
Nope
not in this instance. Ron's coming from behind. It looks petty to sling mud at Huck...let Huck get caught up in this type of mudslinging and then Ron comes up from behind wtih a squeeky clean campaign .
Follow the 12 steps to victory Ron
Its yours to lose.
These Guys are There to Tell the Truth
Ron Paul isn't bringing in smear merchants. These guys are simply truth tellers.
Truth is Ron Pauls style. Not a problem.
I hate to tell you this, but if Ron is going to win……
……it will require some negative campaigning.
Ron will have the money to play all the way through the primary season. He is going to have a real chance to win this thing at some point, but it will require him to expose Huckabee as a taxer, Giuliani as a corrupt mayor that spent taxpayer money on the mistresses security detail or Romney as the flip flopper.
You can rest assured that the other campaigns will begin targeting Ron once he does better than expected in Iowa and New Hampshire.
In the end electoral politics is tough business. If you can’t handle it when this gets dirty last two weeks of January take a vacation for a couple weeks.
Interview
I just listened to an interview with these anti-Huckabee guys, I don't think Ron Paul came off very good at all....
I think Ron would be better off emphasizing his own qualities than going after anyone else.
I posted the interview
The only saving grace is that they were Fred Thompson fans so it doesnt seem like they were paying for votes.
People here rag on me for being anti jesse benton but every time I see his name there is some dim witted decision that makes me cringe.
Not so..
They are just talking about the records, which is what we do here on the radio all the time. They are not even supporters. It was totally benign and educational.
So benign that it wasnt worth the possible negative press
Jesee Benton should've nevver set this up. From a risk reward standpoint this was a dud.
INTERVIEW with the guys Jesse Paid to have come up
http://a1135.g.akamai.net...
Take Action To Defeat the New Shamnesty from Mike Huckabee!
Jesse made a brilliant strategic move and Alipac is apparently also spreading the word about the truth about Huckabee. Ladies and gents, as they request, shall we join them in their noble pursuit?
Take Action To Defeat the New Shamnesty from Mike Huckabee!
A message from Americans for Legal Immigration
Friends of ALIPAC,
The Open Borders Lobby wants to influence the GOP Primary so that American voters will be locked into a choice between a Democrat or a Republican amnesty supporter. Of course they will all deny they support Amnesty, just like the Shamnesty bills of the US Senate we defeated this year.
ALIPAC does not plan to endorse a candidate for President at this time. What we plan to do is to notify the nation about the immigration stances and records of the candidates to help you eliminate the bad amnesty apples from your consideration.
We know that all of the Democratic candidates and McCain, Giuliani, and Huckabee will facilitate a Shamnesty if elected.
Huckabee's poll numbers are rising and should fall if the public finds out the truth on his stances! He is trying to trick Americans with his Shamnesty Plan and has even picked up the endorsement of Jim Gilchrist Co-Founder of the Minuteman Project. We know that many of you will be shocked by this.
Please take the following actions immediately. We need a full ALIPAC Activist Deployment.
Please visit this link and read the entire piece titled
Mike Huckabee's Shamnesty for Illegal Aliens!
http://www.alipac.us/arti...
Then you can post or read comments at this link.
http://www.alipac.us/ftop...
We need you to forward this warning to every personal contact, campaign, and media source you can locate. We need you to call in on talk radio shows and get the word out!
We also need you to post this article and links to this article on as many websites and Discussion Boards as you can!
We can bring Mike Huckabee's numbers down which will help all of the candidates that oppose SHAMNESTY like we do, to rise.
Let's Roll!
The ALIPAC Team
http://www.alipac.us
Telling the truth about someone's record....
is the proper thing to do.....
Certainly the method may be disputable by some, but the campaign has to get the message out there somehow and use those who know firsthand the reputation of a given candidate. How the other candidates vote and have acted in office, Constitutionally or otherwise must be brought to the forefront to make the voters aware of who they are.
Unfortunately most people don't take the time or don't have the time to look at a politician's record and that is why we are in the mess we are in today.
Telling the TRUTH about a candidate in a political race, and a race this important to the future of our country, must be done without being afraid to do so and without calling it as a smear. If we are going to indiscriminately call a means of illuminating another's PUBLIC record a smear, this serves no purpose but to distract the voter away from the real issues.
This does not strike me as wise...
... nor very "Paulian".
It doesn't even make tactical sense. If Huck can knock Giuliani and Romney back, that plays into Ron Paul's hands.
This is not to say that individuals shouldn't expose others' records. I'm just saying the campaign should stay away from tactics like this.
AP
Because you have fallen for the AP 'spin' that suggests this is smearing Huckabee when all he's doing is having advocates talk about Huck's record. They aren't talking about rumors or scandals, they are talking real things he did or did not do, when he was governor.
This is not a 'tactic', it's campaigning. I make websites for many local candidates and I post PROMINENTLY their opponents voting scorecards for all to see........
This is great.
This is what most of us have been doing all across the state, whether paid or not. We go on tabling tours, and talk shows and discuss why Ron Paul is better than any of the other candidates. This includes having to talk about the other candidates' RECORDS. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a political neophyte. It's about time he had someone fighting for him in Iowa...
Jane, Why not let the other candidates do it...
Why does it have to be done by Ron Paul's campaign. Surely Romney or Ghouliani's campaign will find some way to EXPOSE Huckabee... why not wait and let the other candidates polish each other off. Always happens...
Look at what is going on between Obama and Hillary... getting nasty... only one person to date has really kept themselves above the fray Ron Paul and now you endorse dragging him into the campaign Dirt....
And its not like the press wont JUMP ON RON PAUL for any chance they get and here the campaign hands them Ron Paul's head on a silver platter.
I also forgot to ask..
...what you think of those of us who go on the radio and talk about this for free? I mean isn't that what talk radio DOES? We talk about the candidates' records. This isn't any more, excep that the AP has reported these guys had some help with their expenses. They are not even RP supporters!
They already are...
They are but they are also promoting themselves in the process. Why not let Ron compare his record to Huckabee's since he's the only one who hasn't 'found conservatism' suddenly and conveniently?
You people have all fallen for the AP Wireservice spin on this, as if it's something bad. It's not. It's routine campaigning. Don't fall for it. It's AP after all n'est ce pas?
PS - these people are not even RP supporters. They are just discussing candidates, all of them, on a radio show which we do every week! They could also have done it over the phone...it's not a big deal.
http://tinyurl.com/2x4frt
After hearing this I do think it's Huckabee using religion as an excuse for socialism... but that it was more about Tyson Chicken and his relationship to them than anything else.
Arkansas congressmen and Jesse Benton should be applauded
From the read of this, here is my take. Jesse Benton was probably contacted by a couple of conservative Arkansas congressmen that had first hand experience of the legislation passed in their state, promoted by Huckabee. Their opinion is that the legislation and Huckabee's political philosophy does not serve to conserve the principles of the Constitution but promotes a socialistic redistribution of wealth policy. A policy consistently promoted by Gov. Huckabee all in the name of "compassion".
As a result, these congressmen offered to present their viewpoint in Iowa if their expenses (i.e food, lodging, airfare etc) were covered.
Rather than ask them to provide a detailed accounting of every cup of coffee and considering FEC regulations, it is much simpler to pick a round figure that is close to the estimated expenses, offer it and ask them to cover all of their expenses. A “consulting fee” as defined by the FEC if you will.
Be assured that this was and is not a "mouthpiece for hire" scenario as presented by the media.
These senators have worked around Huckabee and felt deeply enough to risk their political careers to go to Iowa to discuss their firsthand viewpoint of Mike Huckabee. To me this is the absolute best way to present this information. Anything less would be Ron Paul giving hearsay about what these congressmen told him Huckabee did in Arkansas.
This is much better than Dr. Paul attempting to present hearsay regarding what these congressmen experienced.
These congressmen should be applauded. I wish we had more closet Republicans come out and do as their heart is urging them to do.
Now about Jesse Benton, the guy is hitting home run after home run; lining up Blitzer, PBS and Cramer all in 1 night.
Go Jesse Go! Give 'em hell and let 'em know we're comin'
Good!
Some one needs to expose Taxabee. Ron Paul for President!!
Jesse B. brings huckster critics 2 Iowa
if the huckster is indeed this honest,God fearing Christian evangelist he & his handlers claim he is,
HE HAS NOTHING TO WORRY ABOUT.. right?..if setting up a sanctuary city in Arkansas for illegals is O.K. with Iowa voters?again,the huckster has nothing too worry about..not a thing...this is about the future of the world as we know it..voters have every right to know about the real Mike Huckabee
You..
Said it! It's time for US to start playing fair!
This is playing dirty...
It's different when Paul addresses his concerns (which rarely EVER involve another politician's positions or conduct). This is just a common political hit. It doesn't fit in this campaign.
This is NOT anything like a
This is NOT anything like a smear. It is people who have personal experience working with Huckabee as a gov. They are not attacking him personally, they are stating FACTS about Huckabee's RECORD.
This is neither sneaky nor is it a smear. It is educational and necessary because no other candidates are willing to take the gloves off and tell the people of Iowa the truth about Huckabee.
I'm calling BS
If any other campaign did this to Ron, it would be called a smear also. Dr. Paul has nothing to hide, but it's not that hard to PAY MONEY to anyone to lie about one's opponents. On the face of it, it seems like a terrible idea, and that's what I think about that. This is going to blow up in their face, especially since Ron is gaining traction.
Exactly. Well said.
Exactly. Well said.
Fight Fire with Fire
All's fair in love and war, and politics is war!
Fear and Hope - thats what drives voters!
Sorry - had to do it.
Liberty is not free, It must be earned!
To listen to Minton & Holt
To listen to Minton & Holt on Steve Deace show (Deace is MH supporter):
http://a1135.g.akamai.net...
I can't listen anymore!
Steve Deace is speaking for God and doing all the talking. I sure hope the show gets better than this later, but I can't stand to listen to anymore!
The only way to determind if this was a good move is
Go with your first instinct.
Thats what non paul fans will do. They will take 5 seconds to create an impression and thats it.
My first impression is that
My first impression is that it's an underhanded move that will only reflect poorly on Ron Paul.
hmm....
The fact that Iowans don't like mudslinging is evident from the reaction to the Hillary/Obama drug thing that just went down... this is a bad move, imho.
AND... I would like to add..
Ron Paul's campaign (and grassroots movement) has come under CONSIDERABLE scrutiny... we cannot conduct ourselfs like other campaigns... We have to be more careful because the media will POUNCE on anything negative the campaign people do!
This fact in itself (besides the fact let Romney and Ghuliani's campaigns do the smearing, they wont pass Huckabee up believe me...) is reason to remain above tactics such as this...
Once again the campaign has highly distressed me... These people are only human and their supports say they are Professional.... well we on this website are professional too... Mr. Lyman is a professional, lots of people working in this campaign are professional... the campaign's sh&t does stink folks... dont think otherwise...
Minton is a public supporter of Thompson
From: The Arkansas Leader
"Minton said he supports actor and former Senator Fred Thompson of Tennessee for the nomination."
This was on December 4th.
Why is the Ron Paul campaign paying public supporters of Fred Thompson?
Good question...
I can think of FAR more useful ways to spend money in Iowa...
JMR
It's just 5k. I actually
It's just 5k. I actually like the fact the this guys is supporting Fred. This is a proof we are not giving him money to talk about Huck.
Someone should be held accountable...
Repost: The whole point about Ron Paul is that he keeps himself ABOVE such tactics as this... and I dont think it looks good for him that it was his Campaign Manager and not Ron Paul that did this.
If Ron Paul is going to be President, then he is going to have to be responsible for the people beneath him.
I have been none-to-happy with actions by the Campaign people in the past and still wonder about the disconnection between them. If Ron Paul has not endorsed some of the actions his campaign has done, (and I will not mention them again as we all know what i am talking about) then I really think he needs to question his loyality to some of his campaign members.
I was disappointed to hear about this whole thing, but I have a good idea it was not with the good Dr.'s approval... The campaign has done no-no's in the past...
I just signed
this petition. Not certain what's what here, but I am totally against campaign money being spent in this way.
http://www.ipetitions.com...
This petition is foolishness.
Jesse Benton would never have done this without Ron's permission. The fact that these people are paid to talk it up on the radio for Ron Paul is a good sign that Ron is finally getting serious about fighting back.
That's what I am trying to
That's what I am trying to tell everybody. of course "Jesse Benton would never have done this without Ron's permission."
Stop this.
Stop this.
People need to know the
People need to know the truth about the swindle talking Huckabee. I have friends who were getting fired up for Huck. I sent them a couple articles detailing his time as Gov. They were much less for him after reading the truth. “Smear” sounds so harsh, but it can be done in a tactful, “people just need to know the REAL truth” kind of way, and not really be “smearing.” I support this effort if it’s done the right way!
A GREAT CHESS MOVE
I think it's great! It's every bit as good a move as his one hour interview, a real debate, on Glen Beck on Tuesday. Fantastic campaign maneuver! ^5
12 Steps to victory - Long but would love feedback
Ron Pauls 12 Steps to a campaign victory
1. Coral the grassroots more effectively offering grassroots proselytizing suggestions rather than dictation
(ACTION: Jesse could do a video today pointing to the website and there could be a page of "Suggestions for how to tell people about Ron" page up by Monday)
2. Exude confidence when speaking and make promises in the first person
(ACTION: Communications team can work with Dr. Paul directly on this starting right now)
3. Open up the campaign to the talents of the followers (areas the campaign is weak in can be easily outsourced to small disparate groups of followers with arguably much more expertise than those in the campaign) The campaign crew can vet ideas without having to lift a finger
could even use something like www.basecamp.com?
(ACTION: Not sure of costs but this could be implemented in a week or less. i.e. Set out the criteria for submissions with ads, budget expectations, timelines and post on youtube , facebook, dailypaul, ronpaulforums, myspace etc)
4. Unite the followers using youtube and meetup more effectively online. Weekly chats and updates
(ACTION: Could be done within days)
5. Dispel the top 5 myths against you with more savvy PR and advertising rebuttals
weak against terrorists
cant win primaries and cant beat hilary,
not a republican
crazy, racist, anti semitic, 911 truther
will destroy medicare and social security
See some thumbnail ideas I proposed here http://www.dailypaul.com/...
(ACTION: Combination of looking at 3 and speaking with their existing ad agency tosolve the problem with poor ads)
6. Push message that Christ believed in peace and just war (quote from the bible IMHO)
(ACTION: Get a preacher to help you if you have to but this is important in the bible belt...make it important to you)
7 Offer more facts on those things that the public view as "conspiracy" so that you shed light on these secrets and call those to task to squirm and you to come out clean as a whistle
(ACTION: List links to youtube pages, offer information to respected organizations such as factchecker.org to see what they do with it...must be smart so you dont look like a conspiracy freak)
I'd stick to easily verifiable "conspiracies" such as NAU and the Amero and Transhighway
8. Illustrate what the "inflation tax " is more succinctly and use every single headline to push a press release showing why your right about the economy
(ACTION: I'm shocked they haven't told the world that Greenspan agrees with the idea of a currency board or Gold standard...that claim just eats up the nay-sayers)
9. Dispel soon coming negative campaigns in advance (see http://www.chron.com/disp... )
(ACTION: Beyond my scope...dont know how much is true)
10. Project optimism. Specifically project how optimistic you are that America under your leadership will be restored to its greatness
"When I am president and the constitution is restored again I see a bright future ahead for this country"
vs
"We're not moving in the right direction and the rule of law and constitution are being trampled"
(ACTION: Can be done immediately)
11. Bring your wife around more often. Your principled way of living puts you in stark contrast to guys like Rudy Giuliani. Shit ...send the media her cookbook if you need to.
(ACTION: If she's fine to fly and travel .... get her on the campaign trail..if Hil and Obama do it theres a reason)
12. Never smear your opponents. You've come so far without a need for it. Once the truth of your message sets in the rest simply pale in comparison. Have faith that the message overcomes all.
(ACTION: Reprimand or fire staffers that decided to attack Huck and take the high road from now on)
Feedback: Confidence+Christ+Cookbook = WinningCombo
Since you asked for feedback just my $.02, the points I mentioned in my subject line hit me right off as good advice and doable. We know deep down that Ron has confidence but needs to show it more. We know that he practices what he preaches, so to speak - he strives to LIVE a Christian life, not just talk about it like other candidates. And Carol's Cookbook being sent to the media I think is a great idea!
Home run...or grand slam, mrpaulfan! (IMHO)
________________________
*** God bless Ron Paul ***
* Ron Paul For President *
I for one do not have a
I for one do not have a single problem with this. In fact, when I first read it, I thought 'Man, it's about time that he went on the offensive.'
I don't consider it 'smearing' a candidate to have people with first-hand knowledge educate people about Huckabee's record. I would consider it smearing if it was people that did not have first hand experience making things up.
I don't understand why anyone would think it's a dishonest thing to do to try to educate a public that is probably largely ignorant of the true Mike Huckabee.
Huckabee is a fascist and I hope those people that the Paul Campaign are bringing in rip him apart.
You are no friend of freedom
This is not education, it is just ugliness, an evidence of the lowest common denominator . Those involved in the planning and approval process NEED to be fired, out of there today, from the one who thought it up to the one who approved it and the one who spent OUR money on this outrageous scam. And most Ron Paul Activists will agree that this campaign is about honor, the right thing, simple decency and NO DIRTY TRICKS.
If you agree, sign the petition. It says:
Support Ron Paul!
We the undersigned, activists, supporters and donors for the campaign of Ron Paul for President, demand accountability. We donate the money and our time; we know our candidate and his unswerving integrity. We therefore demand that those responsible for the uncivil and questionable payment of $5,000.00 to each Sen. Jim Holt and former Rep. Randy Minton of Arkansas be fired immediately.
The two individuals named were paid to go to Iowa to repeat what they should have been willing to say freely, if it is indeed true. The operation smells like political dirty tricks.
Anyone who knows Ron knows that he knew nothing about these plans. He would never approve the use of money given to advance his campaign to be used in this way. He has consistently taken the moral high ground, following his Christian principles, saying nothing to the defamation of other candidates.
The campaign run by activists has been decent and civil and we, the activists, insist it stay that way. We know that Ron will agree.
http://www.ipetitions.com...
God Bless America and Ron Paul.
The Melinda