The Draft is Here!
Posted February 20th, 2008 by Bob W
output
Updated: Sorry to scare people about a draft, as the letter is not exactly a draft letter.....but not far from it. When the establishment asks people to register, this is quite concerning. While, as people have posted here, it has apparently been going on for 28 yrs. now, it doesn't give me a good feeling about it. (The IRS was apparently not ratified and not legal, but that doesn't stop them from taking huge sums of money from The People). I don't have family or close friends that this would impact, but I don't like injustices for anyone; I guess that's why I am a huge RP supporter.
I don't know if anyone else has reported this, but I just met someone with some very troubling information. He has 3 sons apparently, and one of them is 17 yrs. old. When he opened his mailbox in Florida today, he had gotten a letter from the military saying that his son was required to sign up for duty. Our worst nightmares have arrived. And on top of that, I was talking with a Canadian couple today. They told me that the military has long been quiet there, but has been making a big push in building up lately. Yep folks, this is not good.
I had practically screamed at some people to vote for Ron Paul or be concerned that their family and friends would be getting drafted. Most just brushed it off like I didn't know anything. I didn't know it would start this early, but know that Ron is the only one that would stop it. People were offended on this site when I said that people that didn't vote for Ron would be sending their friends and family to death in many cases......and some were offended here. I wonder if they will be offended when their kid gets that same draft letter and find out that any other President will not stop the war.
We are truly living in hell folks. Whatever it takes, Ron must be President!
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It's a stealth draft
Someone already mentioned stop/loss.
There is also a draft by demographic, or a "class draft".
Military service might be the only option for some.
It feels voluntary, but a large number sign up for economic reasons.
If the economy improved, and middle class expanded. There would be far fewer voluteers. Draft by Class.
My opinion, BTW
Selective Service
It has always been the law that young men have to register with selective service at age 18. This is probably just a reminder.
Any chance you could post a
Any chance you could post a scan of the letter? I mean cover up the personal info of course, but I wouldn't mind reading the letter myself
@ebinrock Swiss.
'A special treat. Switzerland from the air courtesy of the swiss air force with US F16s'. Beautiful sceneries for you to enjoy from ze other side of da pond. Take it away Hans....
http://www.youtube.com/wa...
I always think of all you canvassors and precinct leaders at the front line.
Good luck out there &Thank you. It's appreciated'.-fip -U.K
Another reason to vote for Ron Paul - and/or to protect his seat
Ron Paul wrote legislation that would have ended Selective Service. We should not have this attitude of "It's just a formality", etc. Over 100+ years of "Oh, it's only..." has got us into this mess where the federal government knows no bounds, because we don't put strict bounds on our government.
Remember, a prominent libertarian named Michael Cloud said, "It's not the abuse of power, it's the power to abuse". I may use that as my signature from now on.
Great White North
Go ahead, draft me you chicken hawk cowards...all that will do is increase the population of Canada by 1.
Mark my words, if the US were truly threatened by an outside force, you would not need to draft this American. I would stand up and defend all I stand for.
The problem with Selective Service is it is defending what I abhor. You don't need to steal someone's freedom to defend freedom. If freedom were truly threatened by another country, you will have millions waiting in line to defend it.
By their logic, my freedom must be stolen to be shipped across the planet and chase ghosts that hate me for my freedom. I must die to protect what I haven't had since birth? We aren't free, and we are getting farther from it every day.
Steal my freedom, and you will find out how hard I will fight for it. Don't be surprised when the best equipped people in America pick the other side.
Can I get a "Hell no, we won't go!"?
Let it not be said that no one cared, that no one objected once it’s realized that our liberties and wealth are in jeopardy. -Ron Paul 7/10/03
I WILL BURN MY DRAFT NOTICE IF IGET ONE
If I get drafted, I will burn the draft card infront of the white house. This corrupt government can kiss my ass, I will never put my life on the line for a line and a bunch of rich elites. I will however, fight to the death for liberty. As the resistance grows, soon everything here in the US is going to coming crashing down, so it is time to choose your side. Your either a patriot, a sheep, or one of the elite
There IS a draft...
It's called Stop Loss.
When a soldier like myself has about 6 or 7 months left in the service and is told they Must extend for 15-18 months in order to complete a tour overseas... This is a Draft.
" Teh Dude abides..."
Draft is ready and
Draft is ready and coming,BUT NOT HERE, change your stupid fear mongering title. please
How did the draft come about for Vietnam?
Previously known as DCALIFANO
why the scaremongering?
I did this back in '85 when I turned 18....whether one agrees with registering for selective service or not this is still a policy that has been around for quite awhile and shouldn't be news to anyone. Fearmongering isn't just a tactic of "the other side" as witnessed by any number of threads here...Rangel intentionally introduced draft legislation in order to point to the Left and say "see, the draft is coming" as a weapon against the current administration. Getting all bent out of shape over something which has existed for generations and pretending there is some new meaning there is the equivalent.
There is
NO DRAFT !!
Before they will draft....
Calm down people, before they will draft people they will break yet another promise and extend the duration of the Reserve and Guard deployments.
We have 100k troops to send, it just isn't strategically wise.
The Army is 500K plus Guard/Reserves = ~ 1 million
The Marine Corp ~ 250k
Then you could get some of the Navy guys off their boats, and some of the Air Force from behind their desks (not taking shots, just the two branches have large portions of their force that doesn't serve in a combat roll)
It takes about two years to really get a soldier trained well in today's army. Counter Insurgency is not a game for amatuers let alone draftees...
So calm down, there isn't going to be a draft to fight Iraq...now attack Iran, then you might want to start getting in shape, lol.
Draft?
Why start the draft when all they have to do (and ARE doing) is extending the time served for the current soldiers in combat assignments.
These soldier's tours of duty are be extended way over what they signed on for.
My nephew, AJ, just shipped out for Iraq last week. His heart is in the right place, but he is in for a re-education. Yes, I talked and preached until I was blue in the face to this kid. I am a US Army vet and I talked up the military for years to my great regret. He drank the Kool-Aid and signed up for the National Guard.
His son is required to register with Selective
Service within a certain period of his 18th birthday. He can register at any post office. The draft has not been reinstated but the Selective Service system has continued to operate for generations now. However, there is a bill, in committee the last time I looked, that seeks to reinstate the draft.
For the third time, Rep. Charles Rangel (N.Y.) has introduced a bill to reinstate the military draft, with some remarkable changes from the previous draft that was in operation during the Vietnam war. Rep. Rangel's bill would make all men and women, who are physically able, between the ages of 18 to 42, subject to a draft for either military service or some form of involuntary public service. The bill was rejected the first two times that he introduced it, but he has introduced it a 3rd time. I haven't followed it closely during the past few months but it was in committee the last time I looked.
The previous draft applied only to young men between the ages of 18 to 26, unless they had received a deferment before their 26th birthday. In that case, they were legally eligible for the draft until age 35, although I don't think the army was interested in inductees who were that old. Young men are far more prone to obey orders than older men. If the U.S. is to continue foreign military intervention, and especially with the economics involved in attracting volunteers, it will eventually be necessary to force men and women to submit to involuntary service.
With McCain in the WH the Surge will continue
There will be a surge in the number of troops deployed to Iraq and Afghanistan, with a goal to reach 800,000, the number recommended by Gen. Barry McCaffrey, U.S., retired (who published his latest report on Iraq in December 2007--worth reading). McCain will order more U.S. navy ships as close as he can get them in the international waters surrounding Iran, itching for any provocation to engage them in war.
Whether or not there is a draft going on now, there assuredly will be under McCain, and likely under Clinton or Obama, as well. Ron Paul is the only SANE choice for president. It's either him or watch your sons die in an endless war of aggression.
People, don't give up on this revolution! Ron Paul isn't our best hope for America...He is our only hope.
Selective Service Registration.
This thing has been around for awhile. Though my Son turned 18 july of 07, and just the other day he got the notice to register.. Its funny that you bring this up and at the same time he got his. Maybe they are just getting prepared with a head count of bodies to send.
Nah
"Maybe they are just getting prepared with a head count of bodies to send."
Nope. They are just trying to get a ballpark figure for the body bags they will need to order from a handy supplier that charges 8K each.
The New Draft Bill Is Already Written.....
This is a brief snap-shot of the bill that Congressman Charles Rangle, one of the most powerful elected representatives in Congress, had proposed last year and had planed on resubmitting this year. The story is that the Democratic Party and the Speaker of the House have an agreement with Rep. Rangle to hold off resubmitting his bill until after a new President is sworn in and they assured him it would pass and be approved then.
Democratic Congressman reintroduces bill for military draft in US
By Joe Kay
12 January 2007
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Charles Rangel, the Democratic chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee, reintroduced a bill on Thursday that would institute a military draft for all legal residents of the United States between the ages of 18 and 42.
In his press release announcing the move, Rangel—a liberal Democrat who claims to oppose the war in Iraq—made clear that the central motivation for the bill is to alleviate the strains on the military, which will be further overextended as Bush moves to increase the number of troops in Iraq. A draft would also provide sufficient cannon fodder to use in Iran, Somalia, North Korea or any other country the United States decides to invade.
“The military is at the breaking point with more than 50 percent of our combat troops already deployed in Iraq,” Rangel said. “The question is: where will the additional troops—including those that may follow if the war is escalated further—come from?” He noted that many of the 21,000 additional troops that Bush is ordering to Iraq “are already on the ground in Iraq and will have their deployments extended. Almost 250,000 of the troops currently deployed in Iraq have served more than one tour, and some have been deployed as many as six times.”
Not only is the Bush administration escalating the occupation of Iraq, it is also increasing the threat of military action against Iran, while launching air strikes against Somalia Rangel pointed to these tendencies in November 2006, shortly after the midterm elections, when he said on CBS’s “Face the Nation, “If we’re going to challenge Iran and challenge North Korea . . . we can’t do that without a draft.”
Notably absent from Rangel’s press release announcing the move was any suggestion that the bill is intended primarily to deter further military action or the deployment of additional troops in Iraq. This is a rationale that Rangel has advanced in the past, suggesting that politicians would not launch wars if the sons and daughters of the wealthy would be subject to conscription.
Rangel claims to be opposed to the war in Iraq, as well as the plan to introduce more troops. He is attempting to justify his draft bill by couching it in the language of “equality of sacrifice.” The draft is necessary, he wrote in his press release on Thursday, because “if Americans are to be placed in harm’s way, all of us, from every income group and position in society, must share the burden of war.”
Indeed, Rangel’s bill would require that a significant portion of the population take up this “burden of war.” Not only is he calling for a draft of all residents between 18 and 42—an age range that far exceeds previous drafts and would include immigrants as well as US citizens, women as well as men—but his bill would also deny all deferments for college students. This is the product of the recognition that a large proportion of young people of military age are attending college or university.
If such a measure were actually put into law, it would mean something on the order of 100 million people subject to conscription. Rangel’s bill provides that those not selected for the military would be required to carry out some other form of “service,” such as policing or border patrol.
Rangle
I wouldn't worry too much about that bill. Rangle or whatever his name is has tried getting it passed numerous times now, and it always gets shot down. Though I wouldn't put anything too stupid past our government...
His reasoning behind the bill is pretty funny though, "We wouldn't have gone into Iraq if the politicians' own children's lives were at stake." I do kind of feel him there, though I think these politicians AND their children should have to fight. Let the warmongers have what they want, with their own front seat.
McCain says the solution to
McCain says the solution to Iraq is 100,000 more troops. We don't have them.
Hillary and Obama have both stated that nothing is off-the-table militarily with respect to Iran... not even the use of nukes.
Obama recently suggested sending US troops into Pakistan.
I would be very afraid of two years minimum "universal service" in the military or in "support of Homeland Security" for ALL residents (not just citizens and regardless of gender) ages 18-42. Which is what the bill proposes.
This is beyond a draft... it's conscription of ALL residents who live past the age 18.
I would be concerned. We need more troops just for Iraq. We don't have them to send. Obama wants to invade Pakistan and possibly nuke Iran. McCain's "solution" is 100,000 more troops that we don't currently have.
=)
Same old.
My brothers and every male friend got the same "reminder" letter when they were 17, back in the 80's.
Now, I've purposely kept my male childrens' SSNs out of any state & fed records, including schools and doctors and dependents on our taxes... let's see if THEY get the same letter in a few years. ;)
They will.
The Selective Service System actually assigns you a number.
In the eSociety we live in, they don't need a Social Security number. They just deny you admittance into the system if you don't jump through their rings.
Then F the system
If nothing changes in the next 6 years or so regarding this, my sons will not be driving with a state-issued drivers license. Where we live, it won't make one bit of diff, anyway.
It won't concern just males.
It won't concern just males.
I also got one of these
I also got one of these letters when i turned 18. Its just a letter stating that you need to register for the draft... by law every male that turns 18 has to do this.
There will not be a draft
There will not be a draft for sure while Bush is in office. What McCain would do I dunno, but he won't win either way and Hillary and Obama will never consider the draft. Some may disagree here but that just won't happen. The reason a draft won't occur under Bush is because a draft in his mind means one and only one thing: failure. If they accept the need for a draft, that means they did not succeed at their mission. They may want to succeed at their goals but they are delusional and thus do not make logical, rational decisions. A draft is logical and they are emotional.
Both Obama and Hillary are
Both Obama and Hillary are pushing for mandatory military service. That's part of their presidential platforms.........not sure where you've been. It's not a *draft*, but what's the difference if high schoolers just graduating are forced to do 2 years of mandatory military service where they get sent off to war versus high schoolers just graduating getting forced to do 2 years of draft where they get sent off to war???? I fail to see the differentiation.
No, what you are referring
No, what you are referring to is probably the idea of National Service, not necessarily a draft. Nevertheless, whatever either of them are saying it's all talk. No draft will be instituted or encouraged by them because it is simply political suicide. And no national service will be instituted either as that is just an insane level of red tape that it is simply not feasible now.
"national service"
is the double-speak they are using for the draft. They will institute it, because it is not the voter they fear. To stop the endless war is political suicide for them, as the war funds the people who fund them. Listen to them both, the "anti-war" candidates. They promise to bring SOME troops home, but also promise to leave some there, indefinately. The "ballot" appears to be shaping up like this:
Less war in Iraq but Pakistan is OK Obama
Less war in Iraq but everywhere else is OK Clinton
100 years in Iraq and lots more war where ever McCain
Peace is worth writing him in for Paul
Note the theme? They others don't care where, as long as the military-industrial complex has bodies to eat and blood to drink.
Yes I am very clear on where
Yes I am very clear on where they stand. I don't believe for one second Obama and Clinton will stop and change the foreign policy of the United States. I do believe however they will stop one thing: the occupation. That dynamic is the what the Bush administration has created. That has been the insanity of the past 6 years. I believe they will stop what the Bush administration has made into a catastrophe. I do not believe they will withdraw all the troops from Iraq or anywhere else. I believe, in essence, they will restore the foreign policy of the country that existed before the occupation of Iraq. Before the insanity of Iraq by the Bush administration there were troops in Iraq and all over the globe. We all know that. I hate it as much as you probably. However, I also accept that what we want is not going to happen. However, I want the occupation to end and I believe absolutely that one Clinton and/or Obama will do that someway and two that that issue out ways anything else. It is that important and that big.
Bulls**T legislation has already been submitted for discusion.
Check it Jan. 10th 2008!
"It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." - Samuel Adams
Yeah, and there was
Yeah, and there was legislation a couple of years ago by Charles Rangel. Great. I don't deny it's being discussed. Of course it's going to be discussed. I mean we are thinking about it. Not surprised legislators are thinking about it. But they discuss many things. Either way, I don't know what to tell you, but it's not going to happen. Do you have absolutely no faith in your neighbor and complete faith in those you oppose. I mean come on. You give the idiots too much credit. A draft will result in a civil unrest. How many people are against the foreign policy...70 something percent. If they were gonna institute a draft, it would have had to of happened back around 04 before it was blatantly obvious how pathetically bad things were and are.
You kidding, Adam?
There is nothing they will stop at. A draft is a minor issue to them. You think that they are worried about civil unrest? They are busy hiring more and more of a private army and voting on whether citizens can have guns. Civil unrest is a minor inconvenience to them.
Most don't want the war, the illegals, NAFTA, the stripping of the Constitution, radiated food, and 800 annual trade deficit, a plunging dollar, a Fed that prints money at a whim, you name it, but has that changed anything? Wake the hell up! Please tell me that you are not that stupid.
I am not "that" stupid. You
I am not "that" stupid. You are just "that" scared. You don't even realize the good in what you say. You say most don't want what's going on. That is good. They cannot stop everyone. They can't imprison everyone. I mean who they hell do think are these people. You are crazy the amount of credit you give a sect of society over society as a whole. The erosion of society is not through these people you are scared about enacting what they wish. No, the erosion of society has been happening through the inaction of the majority of us. As a consequence of that, you see nut jobs like the people in power able to enact their wishes. But that is not because of how smart and savvy or what not they are. It is an effect of something else. They aren't controlling anything. They are taking advantage of something. There is an enormous difference. The problem isn't the abuse of power. The problem is the inaction of society. Hence, at some point that inaction will feel stuck in a corner with only one choice to make to survive: action. Eventually all the inaction will become action. You give the sadomasochists in power way too much credit.
Adam.....
Just have another sip of Kool-Aid.
I registered....
for selective service when I was 18. However, I registered because I would happily be drafted if our country really was in danger. Such as an invasion, etc. Not because the boogyman is hiding in the closet.
And I didn't sign up for the selective service to wipe out the radicalism in Islam. I also didn't sign up for selective service to try to stop suicide bombers around the world.
I signed up to defend this country, that's all. From REAL threats where a draft really is needed, and our country is in real danger, like I said before, such as an invasion or an attempt by another country to overthrow our government (although at this point that wouldn't be so bad now would it? lol)
Spoken like a true Patriot!
I agree with everything you say.
I almost hope someone does
I almost hope someone does invade us... liberate us from our politicians and issues... haha.
Selective Service
Please post the letter verbatim. I promise you it's not what you think.
I'll talk my daughter out of registering...
and I'll help her every step of the way. If 100,000 refuse to go, what will "they"do? My son is 9. In 8 years (if there is an 8 years) I'll talk him out of it, too. Screw the neo-cons and their lust for war profiteering! Are you with me?
Selective Service Does Not Apply to Women
Women are not required to register for Selective Service, only males on or about their 18th birthday and they remain registered until 26.
You people make me laugh sometimes
The DRAFT has ALWAYS been here...
It's just those that haven't volunteered aren't currently subject to it.
There are two things:
Stop-loss and the IRR that both draft military members beyond their active enlistement.
Stop-Loss is basically you are told that your paticular job/unit is of critical demand and you are not allowed to be discharged or retire.
The IRR is the Inactive Ready Reserve...this is where everyone who enlists goes to spend the balance of their 8 year enlistment. (if you enlist for 4 years, then you sit on the books for 4 more years) If you are an NCO with 13+ years (I think thats the number) or a commissioned officer, you remain in the IRR until you are 54, unless you resign your federal commission (kind of a big deal to some people, me included) As long as you are in the IRR you can be deployed.
Both of these programs have been used repeatedly over the last several years to beef up units and keep critical MOS's
So when you panic about some conspiracy to draft the public I just have to laugh, people are already getting drafted everyday!
Not laughing
People that have signed up, I expect and know are subject to be sent off....time and time again sadly. Requesting people to sign up at 17 is of concern and did not know this before. I am quite familiar with legal contracts as have worked with them for 27 years. When you sign, you may as well be drafted, because they now own you! This is no laughing matter.
Either way, thank you for your service. As a active, or semi-active military person, do you believe we should be at war with Iraq now or at its inception? And do you believe that most of the personnel there do not want to be there?
Thanks.
Well...
I would agree that anyone paying attention would know that the time spent in IRR is time which you can be called back, but it is still a draft. You receive your discharge and are "out" of the military. Call it the "A list" for the draft.
Now stop loss is an entirely different animal, since it impacts you regardless of how many years you have in, years you have left on your enlistment etc. I know guys that were in the process of retiring after 20+ years, had not received their letter, and got hit with stop loss and served another tour, against their will.
Whether or not people know that there is a possibility of it doesn't make it any less a draft. Draft meaning, service not of your own free will.
At 17 signing up for the selective service is a relic from the cold war, and it was to have the foundation of a draft system in place, so that if we ever went to war with Russia there would be little delay in conscription.
About Iraq, myself personally in the begining was very much for the war on the WMD issue, I knew from the get go that the 9/11 reason was bunk (Saddam was a secularist) I had studied Saddam/Iraq since the 1998 Desert Fox raid, and from the information released to the public, there was a very strong circumstantial case for attacking Iraq. Now take that information available to me, and couple that with Bush/Cheney/Powell saying they had undeniable intelligence, and I figured the argument was a done deal...but yeah they were looking at the same intel I was, and just made giant assumptions.
There are few things that have universally angered troops:
1. Went with far too few (250k, but sent 100k home before they got in country) needed 400k
2. The country has never gone to war, the full burden of the war has been laid on the military and our families.
3. We have become nothing more than political capital to McCain/Obama and being told "what we want"
Myself in my support of Dr. Paul, and I imagine a lot of the military is the same, is for a lot more than just being against the war. I think the fact that he is against the war, not just for the sake of being antiwar like a lot of people, but because he sees that the mission cannot accomplish the strategic objective and that we never declared war.
There are a lot of good things happenening in Iraq, but at the end of the day, when we leave they will be left to their own self determination unless we are to stay there so long as to entirely influence and change a generation or two. The question is can we afford it, and are we as Americans willing to suffer the consequences of additional terrorism for our continued presence there. I think the answer to both is no.
he won't answer you...
you raise too many valid points. Why even have a "registration"? Just so "they" know who is available. It is, and can only be, one thing! The same that it has ALWAYS been...and it is not "just a mere formality" but rather a preclude to the DRAFT when it is "needed" to further the war profiteering. Just because they haven't needed it yet means nothing! Jeez! Some of these IDIOTS here that continue to "sleep" really make me want to cry NOT LAUGH at how gullible they are. Remember the old German saying, "They didn't come for me so I didn't worry..."
Those that forget history are doomed to repeat it!
Actually I will
Unlike your statement his was not insulting and inflammitory.
Those of you "here" who are self professed "awakened" need to back off the caffine pills...
Just because in a vaccum a fact appears to be a grand conspiracy doesn't mean it is. Most things taken as a whole have a much more reasonable and logical explaination.
The Selective Service for instance, do you really think that if the government instituted a draft, that somehow not having signed up for the Selective Service will exempt you from service? Do you not exist to the government? Never filed taxes? Never been to school? Never born and given a SSN? Never had a Driver's License?
The Selective Service is simply a means to rapidly conscript and process peple into the military. A relic from the draft of WWII where massive conscription occurred.
The idea was that if we were ever in the fight for survival against say the USSR, and needed massive conscription, then there wouldn't be a six month delay while the government figured out how in the heck to do it.
The selective service is not some giant conspiracy hidden draft steal your young to war profiteer system.
If for nothign else, and serious talk of the draft is political suicide. Too few Americans are willing to let their children serve, let alone be drafted.
I am not asleep I'm just realistic about things. Often the most obvious explaination is the truth.
Have to disagree, LTBjorgaard
Once a person signs onto the selective service, the person then has signed a legal contract with military services for them to be used when needed. Someone that hasn't signed this, may have technically done something illegal, but has not signed that contract to make themselves absolutely bound. Yes, the gov't may still come and bring them to jail, but the legalities would be different and could potentially fight being sent to war. Once someone signs for selective service, it's not like they give you contingencies in the contract, i.e., only if a just war, only if we are attacked, not war for oil, etc. Once someone signs on, they are then owned by the military......like it or not. That is not a free country. In WW2, people were anxiously joining the service as we were actually attacked.....even if we provoked it. Of course, most did not know that or care about that....only that the U.S. was attacked.
Hmm
You make and interesting point. I will have to see if I can find a copy of the Selective Service card. To be honest I never read it because I wasn't concerned about it when I was 18. I enlisted a couple years later.
I would agree with your reasoning given the language in or referenced in the selective service card is of a certain nature.
I wonder though should the government decide to draft is not having signed it will give you any additional options.
I appreciate that you and I can have this conversation civily :)