RON PAUL Vs. McCain debate

Maybe if we get a Ron Paul media outlet like RPR or FreeMe.TV to be the host, it could be done. I have a hard time believing we'll get anywhere with this through corporate media though.

"Why is John McCain Scared of Ron Paul" story floating around.

In Christ,
Dave

www.lionandlambministry.com
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McCain may be crazy, but he's not crazy enough to debate Ron Paul one-on-one. He might as well drink arsenic.
www.paulforronpaul.com

Hey if they do have a debate, could ya let me know? I'll need to plug my TV back in :-P

Remember the past as you look forward to today...

John McCain would rather be back in a bamboo hut in Southeast Asia than debate Ron Paul.

By Roland C. Eyears
http://www.wcltam.com/news/special/articledetail.cfm?article
id=23261
Roland C. Eyears

JOHN McCAIN
THE MOST FLAWED PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE IN HISTORY

It is now clear that what is left of the Republicon Party, after being fatally poisoned by the Bush administration, intents to commit suicide by nominating Senator John McCain (R-Hanoi) for the presidency. Where do I start?

THE EARLY YEARS

McCain spent his boyhood in exclusive boarding schools where staffers were paid to put up with his tirades. We all did some immature things before we matured. But with McCain, the tirades continue today.

Had he not been the son and grandson of admirals, there is scant chance he would have been admitted to the U.S. Naval Academy. Given his behavior patterns and academics, had he not been the son and grandson of admirals, there is little doubt he would have been thrown out. Instead, in 1958 he managed to graduate 894 out of 899. Had he not been the son and grandson of admirals, he is no chance he would have been accepted into the prestigious naval flight training program over far better qualified officers. On his way to becoming a North Vietnamese ace, the aviator lost 3 expensive aircraft on routine, non-combat flights. Little was made of all that, because he was, you know, the son and grandson of admirals.

McCain's most horrendous loss occurred in 1967 on the USS Forrestal. Well, not horrendous for him. The starter motor switch on the A4E Skyhawk allowed fuel to pool in the engine. When the aircraft was "wet-started," an impressive flame would shoot from the tail. It was one of the ways young hot-shots got their jollies. Investigators and survivors took the position that McCain deliberately wet-started to harass the F4 pilot directly behind him. The cook off launched an M34 Zuni rocket that tore through the Skyhawk's fuel tank, released a thousand pound bomb, and ignited a fire that killed the pilot plus 167 men. Before the tally of dead and dying was complete, the son and grandson of admirals had been transferred to the USS Oriskany.

As a rising naval officer, McCain was surrounded by rumors of numerous adulterous affairs, such as used to be called "conduct unbecoming an officer." Author and biographer Robert Timberg has detailed several of McCain's sexual relationships with subordinates when serving as a Squadron Leader and an Executive Officer. I think we all know such behavior is a clear violation of the Uniform Code of Military Justice, in other words, a crime.

When McCain's application to the National War College was rejected, according to noted author and researcher Joel Skousen, he whined to daddy who pulled strings with the Secretary of the Navy.

PRISONER OR HONORED GUEST?

McCain's 5½-year stay at the Hanoi Hilton (officially Hoa Loa Prison) has ever since been the subject of great controversy. He maintains that he was tortured and otherwise badly mistreated. One of many who disagree is Dennis Johnson, imprisoned at Hanoi and never given treatment for his broken leg. He reports that every time he saw McCain, who was generally kept segregated, the man was clean-shaven, dressed in fresh clothes, and appeared comfortable among North Vietnamese Army officers. He adds that he frequently heard McCain's collaborative statements broadcast over the prison's loud speakers.

On October 26, 1967, McCain's A-4 Skyhawk was shot down over Hanoi. The fractures of 1 leg and both arms were reportedly due to his failure to tuck them in during ejection. According to U.S. News & World Report (May 14, 1973), McCain didn't wait long before offering military information in return for medical care. While an extraordinary patient at Gi Lam Hospital, he was visited by a number of dignitaries, including, to quote McCain himself, General Vo Nguyen Giap, the national hero of Dienbienphu.

Jack McLamb is a highly respected name in law enforcement circles. After 9 years of clandestine operations in Cambodia and unmentionable areas, he returned home to Phoenix where he became one of the most decorated police officers on record. Twice McLamb was named Officer of the Year. He went on to become an FBI hostage negotiator. This man has stated that every one of the many former POWs he has talked with consider McCain a traitor. States McLamb, "He was never tortured…The Vietnamese Communists called him the Songbird, that's his code name, Songbird McCain, because he just came into the camp singing and telling them everything they wanted to know." McLamb further quotes former POWs as saying McCain starred in 32 propaganda videos in which he denounced his country and comrades.

The Glavnoje Razvedyvatel'noje Upravlenije is the Soviet's military intelligence division. Numerous sources confirm that during the Nam Era, the English-speaking Vietnamese who conducted interrogations of American prisoners were always overseen by Russian GRU officers. The ranking GRU officer at the Hanoi Hilton had a multilingual teenage son who was tasked with translating all interrogation reports into Russian. He would become known only as T.

According to T who interpreted all interrogations and notes pertaining to McCain during the latter's stay from December, 1969, to March, 1973, when a well-fed looking McCain's was released, privileges were extended. These included time at a furnished apartment in Hanoi – furnished with 2 prostitutes. McCain would attribute such absences to solitary confinement.

It has been widely reported that following his father's appointment as CINCPAC Commander-in-Chief of all U.S. forces in the Vietnam theater of operations, McCain was offered an immediate parole. McCain insists that he refused such a preference. Others insist that his father refused to allow such a preference. In any event, such an offer would have required the approval of the Soviet masters, and T would have seen documentation. He has no recollection of such an offer.

In 1991 the Soviet Union was in a state of collapse. People and things were up for grabs. During that thaw, a mass document swap took place between the KGB and CIA. All T's translations were included. If these dots are really connected, it is small wonder that McCain had fought consistently to keep all files sealed, block any attempts to retrieve POWs, and establish the friendliest of relations with his former tormentors.

Imagine the possibilities. A Clintonian leak during the presidential campaign. Or, in the unlikely event of a McCain victory, blackmail of the Manchurian Candidate.

It is public record that Admiral McCain was on hand to greet his son upon return. According to Major Mark A. Smith (USA Retired), a Green Beret and former POW, a trusted friend of his accompanied the Admiral that day. Later, when the friend referred to that meeting, McCain became enraged, volunteered that he had received "no special treatment," and then denied that his father was there.

In 1989 legislation known as The Truth Bill was introduced in the U.S. House. It required the Department of Defense to publish the names and information on all unaccounted for POWs, MIAs, and KIAs in WW II, the Korean War, and Vietnam. It languished and was resurrected 2 years later. Then came the McCain Bill, promptly enacted, that blocked such information. The DoD does not even have to acknowledge confirmed sightings of live Americans.

TEMPER AND TEMPERMENT

The senator's temper and temperament remain in question. His biographer quotes him: "At the smallest provocation I would go off into a mad frenzy, and then suddenly crash to the floor unconscious." Has he moderated over time? Apparently. Somewhat. Senators who have had McCain scream hyphenated obscenities at them nose-to-nose include Rick Santorum, Richard Shelby, Thad Cochran, and James Inhofe. Most colleagues decline comment. The man has been called psychologically unstable.

BIRDS OF A FEATHER?

Four years ago McCain loudly defended the glorious hero of the Vietnam War, John Kerry. That would be the young naval officer who hid out in an office until he took command of a river patrol boat for a few weeks. He put in for a purple heart every time he got a scratch or bruise. With 3 of those, he rotated out with the intention of running for public office as a war hero. When Kerry saw the level of anti-war sentiment, he quickly morphed into an anti-war hero running for public office and later married the widow of an extremely wealthy, conservative senator who died under highly suspicious circumstances. Swift Boat Veterans for Truth have not died. Their affiliate is Vietnam Veterans Against John McCain, headed by former Sergeant Ted Sampley, who also serves as vice-president of the half-million member Rolling Thunder Motorcycle Rally.

Sampley has spent years working toward the return of Vietnam era MIAs and POWs abandoned by our government (which is invariably the case at a war's end). McCann has thwarted him at every turn, dismissing 1,600 credible first hand sightings, 14,000 second hand sightings, and countless radio intercepts that supported the observations.

In 1991 a Senate Select Committee held hearings on the subject of Vietnam POWs. Tracy Usry, honored Vietnam veteran and former chief investigator for the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, testified that American POWs were routinely interrogated by Soviet intelligence officers. Several times, an enraged McCain interrupted, shouting that, "…none of the returned U.S. POWs released by Vietnam was ever interrogated by the Soviets." He knew better. So apparently did Bui Tin, former Senior Colonel, NVA, who testified that he had been privy to all Soviet documents pertaining to American prisoners. He supported Usry, refuted McCain, and offered his personal records as added proof.

In short order, Usry and all participating staff members were fired. Jack Wheeler, Republicon insider and master strategist, attributed that to McCain's behind-the-scenes pressuring.

Add to that McCain's despicable treatment of families of POWs. Is that based on guilt or is the man simply despicable?

A LITTLE HISTORY LESSON

In the 1920s, the Bronfman family of Montreal rose to power and wealth based particularly on its Seagrams liquor business, which had as its Prohibition Era partner Meyer Lansky, American Mafia boss. Bootlegging profits were enormous. The family branched into many areas, including media. In recent years, Bronfman acquired a major chunk of Time-Warner.

Michael Collins Piper is the author of several books including FINAL JUDGMENT and THE HIGH PRIESTS OF WAR. According to his research, Jack Ruby, Texas nightclub manager and silencer of JFK's alleged assassin, was a Bronfman asset. Piper identifies Ruby as "a key player" in the smuggling of arms stolen from U.S. military bases to Israel.

In the years prior to World War II, the move into Arizona was made. In 1941, Gus Greenbaum of Phoenix started a national wire service for bookies. When he shifted to Las Vegas in 1946 to oversee Meyer Lansky's casino interests and subsequently replace the infamous, violent Bugsy Siegel, Kemper Marley was appointed crime syndicate boss of Arizona. According to sources within the Marley group, it was Bronfman who put him in the liquor business and enabled him to build a statewide monopoly. In 1948, the feds sent 52 employees to prison for liquor violations. Rumor has it that Marley remained untouched because one of his lieutenants, James Hensley, took the fall and did a dime. Piper reports that Hensley's attorney and dealmaker was William Rehnquist. Yes, that would be the Chief Justice who later pulled his former girlfriend onto the high court and spent his last decade on the bench hallucinating on drugs. Upon release, Marley gave Hensley one of the biggest Anheuser-Busch distributorships in the country – certainly the biggest in Arizona. Thank you for your faithful service.

Then one day in 1981, an obscure, newly retired naval officer rode into the land of sun, cacti, and retirees. After his first wife, who had raised his children and waited for him became crippled in an accident, John McCain had dumped her overboard and married his mistress – Cindy, daughter of James Hensley. The next year the "straight talker" was installed in the U.S. House of Lords. Four years later he moved to the senate.

So who owns honest John McCain? The mob that runs Arizona? The big Vegas money that continues to contribute heavily? The Israeli connection? You be the judge.

UNDERSTANDING ECONOMICS – WHO NEEDS IT?

Not long ago, McCain stated to a journalist that, "Economics isn't my strong suit." But, he added, he is reading Greenspan. That would be Fed Chairman Alan Greenspan who, during his tenure, expanded the money supply more than in all the years since 1913. The Greenspan who kept the printing presses running at warp speed, turning out little pieces of paper called money and backed by the promises of politicians. Alan the Inflator fueled the dotcom bubble, the stock market bubble, and more recently the real estate bubble. It is no wonder that the LONDON ECONOMIST recently pegged 2007 true U.S. inflation at 17%. Just what we need – another president who is an economic illiterate. It's small consolation that McCain admits it, because if elected, he'd appoint the wrong advisors.

MCCAIN VERSUS THE CONSTITUTION

McCain, also known as senator hyphen around D.C., frequently partners with members of the far left. The McCain-Feingold Campaign Finance Reform Bill was an obvious, full-frontal attack on the First Amendment – perhaps the most blatant since the Sedition Act 200 years previous. Specifically, it outlawed the most protected of free speech, political descent. This alone should be a deal breaker. Anyone voting for the bill should have been impeached and removed from office. George Bush, when he broke another of his pledges and signed the odious legislation, said he had problems with it but that the Supreme Court might very possibly strike down parts. Apparently, his thinking was (1) this is bad law, but why should I worry, and (2) I don't need to do my job because somebody down the line might do it for me.

Accordingly, it is entirely logical that radio talk show hosts are in strong opposition to McCain. They understand how much he hates free speech, and they don't want to see a return to the deceptively named Fairness Doctrine that used to force broadcasters to devote matching time to the promotion of liberal views to balance conservative. At the core is the liberals' fear of exposure to the marketplace of ideas and free discourse. To them, it is not enough that you have a dial and an opposed thumb. If we're going to have a Fairness Doctrine, let's carry it all the way out. For every 80 anti-gun news stories, I want to see 80 (easy to find) pro-gun stories. Not 1. For every male bashing commercial, mandate one female bashing. Let's limit the number of black players on college and NBA teams to 12½ percent, reflective of the population. Et cetera.

McCain also works to destroy the Second Amendment. John McCain does not trust you with a firearm, regardless of the plain words of the Constitution. He would bar you from defending yourself from marauders and certainly from an out-of-control government. The Gun Owners of America rates McCain F minus. Although the National Rifle Association is far softer in defending gun rights, its president has termed McCain the "worst Second Amendment candidate." Example: McCain sponsored an amendment to S. 1805 that would destroy gun shows by outlawing private gun sales at such events, although they have been proven to not be a significant source of criminals' weapons. A next step would be the outlawing of private transfers. A father would be unable to pass down a family treasure without government blessing. The unconstitutionality of all this is of no importance to the senator and his ilk. Check his record. This alone should be another deal breaker.

Just about everybody loves a maverick, right? Spirit of America and all that. We often impute a certain sense of integrity to someone who turns on his own. Is the senator from Hanoi really a maverick? Sure, but from what? Honor? Duty? The Constitution he works so hard to make irrelevant? But as a career politician and long-time member of the Council on Foreign Relations, McCain is also a one- worlder and a senior insider.

CAMPAIGN FINANCE

I'm sure the sponsor of the so-called Campaign Finance Reform Bill wouldn't mind if we took a cursory look at his donors. They include the sinister international currency manipulator George Soros, JP Morgan Chase & Company, Citigroup, Goldman Sachs, and Lehman Brothers. In other words, McCain is backed by most of the usual suspects who back "the competition."

According to WorldNetDaily, since 2001, this candidate has receiving funding via the Reform Institute of Alexandria, Virginia, founded to launder money from George Soro's Open Society Institute and Theresa Heinz Kerry's Tides Foundation. Let's just know who owns whom. All this only makes sense. The senator is a long-time member of the Council on Foreign Relations, a one-worlder, an ultimate insider.

Funding scandals? Sure. We have them too. Does anybody remember the Keating Five debacle from 1987 that cost depositors and taxpayers $160 million? Charles Keating owned American Continental Corporation and its subsidiary Lincoln Savings & Loan. Facing multiple federal indictments, he called on the recipients of his largesse – Senators Alan Cranston, John Glenn, Don Riegle, and from the great State of Arizona Dennis DeConsini and John McCain. Strings were pulled, but, in the end, Keating was convicted. In 1991, the Senate Ethics Committee (I know, such an oxymoron) ruled that McCain hadn't quite done anything illegal. But by his own standards he was corrupt.

D.C. FOLLIES

Recently, the New York Times ran a piece suggesting that McCain may have had an affair with lobbyist Vicki Iseman that went back 8 years. Ms. Iseman is a partner in Alcalde & Fay, who represent Carnival Lines, several broadcasters, and municipalities. The Times, along with Drudge and the Washington Post, had been sitting on the story for some weeks. The allegations are unproven, and, the senator has exhibited extraordinary self-control when denying them. I can only say that he has a history of this type of Clintonian behavior, both in the military and, admittedly, during his first marriage. Apparently it is acceptable anymore. In any case, I question whether the Times should have run with this.

Influence peddling? Sure, McCain rode Lowell Paxson's jet several times. It would be asking a lot of a high-profile senator to walk through a crowded airport and climb on a commercial flight. Maybe he wrote Paxson checks at the commercial fare rate. He did accept $100,000 donation from Alcalde & Fay. And he did write 2 letters recommending that the FCC approve Paxson's purchase of a Pittsburgh TV station. Only two? Lobbyists lobby. I don't have any finger to point here.

THE GREAT CONSERVATIVE

Taking a page from Bill Clinton's Attorney General, McCain has called Christian leaders "agents of intolerance."

McCain often crosses the aisle to block the confirmation of conservative judges with strict construction leanings. His record on taxes is clear; he likes them. Senator hyphen has co-sponsored ill conceived legislation that would boost gasoline prices by more than half a dollar a gallon. And he supports radical global warming measures that would significantly disadvantage the U.S.

COME ON UP. HERE'S A CHECK.

Teaming again with Teddy Kennedy, at al, the senator from Hanoi sponsored an amnesty bill for illegal aliens. A top aide, Juan Hernandez previously held a cabinet level position with ex-president of Mexico Vincente Fox. This dual citizen is on record as favoring "Mexico First." McCain supports open borders. Well, until he caught sight of the prize. These days he's auto-phoning into Ohio, promising that "first I'll close the borders." He'd still like to see Social Security money paid to the sneak-ins. Another deal breaker?

DISCLAIMERS AND CONCLUSIONS

The presidential frontrunners have a curious commonality. Not one has any significant administrative history. None has headed a company, none has managed an organization, and none has ever had to meet a payroll. Their experience has been totally devoted to throwing other people's money at problems they created (often for that very purpose), and they've run nothing but their mouths. Seriously, if you owned a large business enterprise, is there any chance that you would pick one of the candidates to manage it?

Personalities aside, I'm not certain how much difference it makes. McCain has essentially endorsed Hillary. According to him, "She has integrity," and "I have no doubt that she would be a good president." He likes, really likes the woman, and says, "I think she's a very good person." Meanwhile, Barack Hussein Obama's policies differ not one whit from Hillary's. So that's a popularity contest.

Then there is the matter of the label. In his way, George Bush has done to the Republicon Party what Bill Clinton did to the Democrat Party in his way. In the last congressional race, the Rs did poorly; yet their D replacements have fixed nothing. The congress's approval rating is 22 percent. As the legatee of Bush, what does baggage does McCain bear? Here are just a few bags: unrestrained spending, huge trade deficits, illegal wars of aggression, empire building beyond our capacity, abandonment of our fallen veterans, war crimes, the elimination of civil liberties with war as a pretext, the death of habeas corpus, favoring Israel over the U.S., the stock bubble, the real estate bubble, collapsing home values, permanent core job losses, true 10 percent inflation, debasement of the currency (They won't even publish M3 numbers anymore.), torture of prisoners (On October 6, 2006, McCain voted to exempt the CIA from restrictions.), prisoner rendition, deconstruction of the Constitution, opening our borders to everybody and anybody, violations of separation of powers, corruption, and incredible incompetence. I could go on. My question: Is the Republicon nomination worth more than 15 cents? Even if McCain puts nominal Democrat Joe Lieberman on his ticket to demonstrate bi-partisanship and pull in Dems and Independents?

Are you a genuine social conservative? Do you believe in our wonderful Constitution? Are you opposed the Iraq War and its precursor strategies that have killed hundreds of thousands of innocents? Are you fiscally responsible? Do you truly understand the principles of republicanism? Do you believe in marital fidelity? Are you a supporter of free speech? I submit that if your answer to any of these questions is yes, you cannot vote for John McCain and retain your integrity. The lesser of 2 or 3 evils is still evil. In this case, not by a measurable amount.

The party of Ronald Reagan left me years ago. America's bright beacon of hope, so loved by much of the world for over 200 years, is being reduced to a faint glow in the eyes of the true believers.

We have had some incredibly unqualified and inept people run for and sometimes win the top job. But John McCain must be the most flawed and compromised candidate in our nation's history. __._,_.___

gcarroll-grand rapids, mi

when we can show them we have the delegates?

www.ronpaulflags.com, tell all your friends, pass on the link so they can learn about the process.

The GOP would never allow McInsane to debate anything, they know they have another bumblebee replacing Bush.

Why would there even be a debate with McCain already having the nomination? If the shoe was on the other foot, do you believe Paul would agree to debate McCain with the nomination in hand? Of course not.

I would love to see it, but the MSM rarely will even mention RP in passing. Hard to imagine they would give 60 or 90 minutes to someone that they have already dismissed as a candidate. Maybe you guys will figure out a way to make it happen. Good luck, I sincerely mean it.

John McCain is far too afraid of Ron Paul to ever allow himself to be in a one-on-one confrontation. When Ron asked him the economic question in the last debate, I thought McCain would bust a vein. He attempted his usual strained smile, but everybody could see how uncomfortable he was. He tried to get angry, but it didn't work. So, what did he do? He starts naming off all these ex-presidential candidates and cronies. It reminded me of a kid about to get his butt stomped that starts trying to scare his attacker by claiming to have connections.

And McCain has reason to be afraid of Paul. He once called Ron Paul the 'most honest man in Washington'. The spotless record of Ron Paul is certain to make McCain's look even dirtier. The Keating 5, giving huge concessions to democrats, and NOT EVEN SHOWING UP TO VOTE HALF THE TIME are all things that make him seem a little less than 'presidential'.

I'd love to see a debate, but I don't think it'll happen.

A debate needs to be demanded through every media outlet.

Why would McCain debate us when he has the nomination ??

Nope

Vote RON PAUL 2008
_____________
During one of the real debates (one that RP was invited to participate in because of the visibility of it -- they still treated him like a second-class citizen, but that's another matter isn't it) RON PAUL asked MCCAIN a question and MCCAIN stepped all over his d*ck trying to come across sounding like he isn't a complete dork. He didn't succeed -- He sounded absolutely lame.

The media, the GOP -- have been united in keeping RON PAUL in the shadows (while they pushed their choice into the light) // you'd have to be deaf, blind as a bat, and MCCAIN not to see it otherwise. There's no way under the sun that MCCAIN will debate RON PAUL -- RP has been all but relegated to out of sight, out of mind. MCCAIN has given his acceptance speech, expressed his gratitude for everyone's support.

Enough to make a maggot gag, isn't it.

You are going to become a delegate, right?! Put up signs, educate your neighbors and not listen to the news!

and the media will NEVER acknowledge Ron Paul. MSNBC tonight said it would be "impossible" for Paul to win and that he will be conceding soon.

Everyone here is a delegate or finding out how to become one, right?!

Ron Paul had nothing to gain by debating Peden. So he ignored him. McCain has everything to lose by debating Paul. McCain and the MSM will ignore Ron Paul.

The rules have changed: only two candidates. Now there are no time limits, no other candidates planted as distractions, no opportunities to circumvent the truth. The gloves would come off and McCain would be utterly exposed before the world.

Intelligence denotes one being able to solve a problem by making a valid observation, applying a moral principle, and operating within reason; reason being the soul of the Law. Ron Paul is intelligent. McCain is shrewd. But even animals can be shrewd. 100 years of undeclared war between two bankrupt nations to secure the interests of the international oil cartels and the Bush crime family? That's sub-animal. McCain would go down in flames by accepting a debate at this point. He's got too many other crimes to worry about.

is watching Dr. Paul TOTALLY DESTROY Obama in a debate!!

Obama better start calling Dr. Paul "Mr. Bus Driver"... because he's gonna take Barack TO SCHOOL!

There will be a debate in September at a little event called the Republican National Convention. Ron Paul will destroy McCain.

.

John McCain and the MSM are insync with each other. They will continue to ignore Ron Paul.

... the MSM once again will "dictate" when the next debate will be. I believe they're figuring it out now. I'm suspecting they'll have all the candidates together from now on, so McInsane won't get his ass handed to him trying to debate Dr. Paul, one-on-one.
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People worldwide support Dr. Paul too :-)
http://www.pollingmatrix.com