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Official Campaign VS Grassroots?
Posted October 28th, 2007 by WRellim
DubaRuba (and others in similar "Chill" replies) pose some statements under the "First Ad" that I feel need a response (but it's buried there).
Statement 1: This is just the openning [sic] TV ad in a coordinated, multimedia blitz timed to take place over a period of 6 weeks.
Statement 2: The campaign knows what its doing. What are YOU doing?
Let's see where to start...What are WE doing locally?
You said: This is just the openning [sic] TV ad in a coordinated, multimedia blitz timed to take place over a period of 6 weeks.
THAT is what is SO scary! If this ad is an example of what is to come... Well, even if the rest of the campaign ads are TWICE as good as this ad, then all the money spent on that "blitz" may as well be taken out back and burned... In my sincere opinion, it would help the campaign more that way.
EDIT: [ Looks like the first ad was an aberration... the second is an "acceptable" ad... not great on an objective basis, but on a RELATIVE basis to the first, it is a dramatic improvement! (So only money that was "burned" was that spent on making and airing the first ad). Hopefully the rest of the ads can repair the damage.]
You said: The campaign knows what its doing.
I say: No, it obviously does NOT have a clue.
What does that comment mean anyway, other than "Trust Big Brother. Big Brother knows MORE than you." It also says: "Trust the Technocrats of Centralized Planning: They know best! / (P.S. the public at large and their combined opinions and the Free Marketplace of YouTube is worthless)."
You said: What are YOU doing?
I say: A helluva lot more than this P.O.S. will. Try the following (all volunteer mind you, not a single penny of campaign funds used here):
- Running a local Meetup (#766)
- Running a statewide meta-meetup (#687) to coordinate all the meetups in our state, where we are:
- Working on targeted Print, Radio and TV ads for local media.
- Producing and distributing about 100 DVD's per week
- Canvassing local neighborhoods to get new supporters, and getting out donation forms, info, DVD's, bumper stickers and Yard Signs.
- Creating, printing and distributing literature targeted to gain support of pro-life voters.
- Sponsoring and manning booths at GOP events, flea markets, etc.
- Working to get "Students For Ron Paul" groups started at area colleges.
- Doing Banners and PTTR stuff (but admittedly on a lower level than Sept 30).
- Joining and working for support WITHIN and WITH the local GOP structure.
- Developed, sponsored, and maintaining the InfiniteRonPaul website that provides a powerful set of "guerrilla marketing" tools for Ron Paul supporters to promote RP and his campaign issue stands on campuses and in towns nationwide at very low cost. (And which is gaining ground every day -- See the marker map -- though it's only been up for a month.)
- No longer donating to the main campaign because I am MAXED OUT (how about you?)
- Donating to local efforts and PACS (like American Liberty Coalition and OperationNH -- which BTW has MUCH better TV ads than the [first ad anyway from the] "official" campaign!)
- Becoming increasing concerned that the "official campaign" staff is going to ballocks the whole thing up! (And in the end make me feel like a fool... You think you know what Apathy is? Try me in January if RP loses NH because of idiocy like this ad!) This last is tempered -- a bit -- by Ad #2.
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then all the money spent on
then all the money spent on that "blitz" may as well be taken out back and burned... In my sincere opinion, it would help the campaign more that way.
Who would take this person seriously? In your "SINCERE"??? opinion. Well if that is what you REALLY mean... then your ideas for the campaign should be ignored.
Unless you sat in on the meetings that the campaign had to discuss this ad then you have no standing. Can you point out the PROS they came up with on this ad? No?
From what I heard on a radio interview with Ron Paul the other day he said he is personally involved in these matters... because he does not want people twisting his message to try to "sell" better.... So what are Ron Pauls reasons for going with this ad...? Do you have any clue? No you dont so until there is a response all you are doing is blowing off steam at all our expense... many of us donated ALOT of money and we dont want you ruining it. We gave. And we delegate to Ron Paul to do his best. We want YOU to do the same... until you are invited to become part of his inside team.
We didnt entrust our money and hopes with YOU... we did with Ron Paul... You are perfectly welcome to run your own campaign efforts your own way.
OKAY,,, lets dont fights... fyi I got a Campaign Response...
Hello, *fellow supporters* of Ron Paul... I see everyone is having a VENTING TODAY... fine, let everyone do it and get their screams out and then SETTLE DOWN. This reminds me of when I posted that *if* Ron Paul is *not* running (in any way shape or form) in the final election, and because my state *does not allow write in votes*, I will vote Hillary over Guiliani because I *hate* the man...
All of a sudden I am blasted about HOW COULD I?? YOU ARE A TROLL, GET OFF THE BOARD, KILL YOURSELF, etc... Well its a free country and I prefer Hillary VS Guiliani if those are my own two choices.
So PLEASE, DONT LET US BRING UP *THAT* TOPIC AGAIN... I took enough flake over that... stupid comments like HOW COULD YOU ABANDON RON PAUL etc.... Arrgghhh, it was a hypothetical question where I am in the voting booth come election day and its pull the lever for hillary or pull the Lever for Rudy and my hand just wont close over the Rudy lever....
But continuing on to the Commercial. I GOT A RESPONSE TO ME FROM THE CAMPAIGN OVER MY CONCERNS about the negativity and poor content of the Ad. I was *assured* that it was geared for a certain market just like IN IOWA RON PAUL STRESSED HE WAS AGAINST ABORTION because that Iowa market is very bible belt and conservative.
Well, here is my response for all its worth. The powers to be at the Ron Paul Campaign are DETERMINED to air this campaign. They say it has been tested to appeal to the type of voter of NH and introduce Ron Paul to people who may not have heard of them. I do hope they didnt use one of those test groups that pulled like THREE people off the streets as a representation of their opinions.
But I personally feel they have made a TERRIBLE mistake because if they geared Ron Paul's speeches towards abortion and such in Iowa to appeal to THOSE voters, Someone has forgotten that NH IS A MUCH MORE INTELLECTUAL STATE THAT SUPPORTS LIBETARIANS. You do not offend intelligent Libetariains with a Hick Commercial like this that should be shown in the DEEP SOUTH LIKE LOUSIANA, MISSISSIPPI, ETC. ETC.....
BUT - I WAS ASSURED BY THE RON PAUL CAMPAIGN THAT THIS IS JUST THE BEGINNING OF A MEDIA BLITZ and this is not their only AD they will push. So lets just all be friendly, and dont forget that we internet users are much more intellectual than the backyard rockin good ole guys and lets see if this Ad will attrack those people (even though I doubt it) and THEN KEEP OUR FINGERS CROSSED THAT OUR WORD HAS BEEN HEARD AND THE NEXT COMMERCIALS ARE BETTER...
IN OTHER WORDS...
CHILL OUT AND BE NICE EVERYONE... DONT CALL EACH OTHER NAMES (AS I HAVE BEEN DONE) AND lets hope this *one lesson*will not be repeated...
Transition State
I feel like the campaign has reached a temporary plateau with the slow fundraising, the booing at the last debate, and now this frustrating TV spot. I think this curve is analogous to melting ice. Heat is constantly added and the temperature rises at the same rate until the melting point is reached. At this point the total energy is continuing to rise, but the temperature remains constant. The energy is being used to melt the ice. Once this work has been done the temperature rises again, but now more quickly. These types of lulls are probably inevitable. I think Nov.5th will mark the beginning of the next phase of accelerated growth.
yeah but then the campaign
yeah but then the campaign managers will toss another bucket of water on it with another "three day donation drive". That's what really happened. The donors got exhausted and demoralized by the three day radio ad campaign.
They'll do it again. and again. Every time there is an increased rate of donations they'll get greedy and squeeze our turnip till it hurts.
They just don't understand.
That we the people are real people.
One Last Thing
I totally agree with WRellim's assessment. The ad that he prepared on his website was excellent and at least indicates the directions that the NH ads needs to be going. BTW, Great work WRellim! This is the kind of ad (with a tad more polish) would be the type to set the campaign ablaze and one that I would have expected from campaign HQ. I surely hope they are paying attention.
Ad is NOT my work... just someone from my area.
Alas, *I* personally had absolutely nothing to do with the creation of those ads (I *wish* that I could claim even a smidgen of credit -- because I feel they are excellent, in all ways, and need to be aired a LOT more -- but the ads are *much* better than anything I could have done). I cited the efforts because a) it is another example of what grassroots people are achieving EVEN in the area of TV ads; and b) because I know it was created by someone near my geographic area.
Credit belongs to the people at the ALCPAC and OPERATIONNH -- and all of the people who supported their work with initial faith, and those who continue to donate to get them aired.
it really pains me to see
it really pains me to see some of the comments in here, if we are letting a 30 sec ad, change our views about Dr. Paul then we are in serious trouble.
Our views are unchanged
Cero, please do not be pained. Our positive views of Dr. Paul can never be changed. We are only in serious trouble if we allow the professional advertising hacks to torpedo Dr. Paul's chances to win the NH primaries… Now THAT is when we will be in serious trouble.
A sense of dread
I'll tell you what. I am over sixty years old and a rabid RP supporter. After seeing the recent TV ad from the "official" campaign a feeling of dread swept over me. It was so demoralizing that I cannot express my true thought in mere words. This was perhaps the very worst political ad that I had ever seen in my life. Personally, I was more than disappointed.
The things that attracted me most to Ron Paul was his honest message and the enthusiasm and the creativity of his volunteer supporters getting his message out. Some of his YouTube videos were so moving that tears streamed down my face. This kind of support cannot be duplicated or ignored, or be replaced by "hired" advertising hacks. I hope and pray that this awful ad is NOT a sample of what is to come. There are hundreds of VERY talented and creative Ron Paul supporters who could produce TV ads that would literally blow the socks off the other candidates.
Saying that the ad was, "not that bad" is wrong… Yes it was "that bad". Since the ad has aired, I have watched the support and donations rapidly dwindle. Is it because of the ads? The grassroots DOES know what it is doing and does not like to see all of their hard work, money and efforts flushed down the toilet. We have only ONE chance to get our hero elected. Just remember that I am one of those geriatric old farts that this so-called ad was trying to appeal to, and it totally turned me off. So, crucify my opinion if you like. I just call them as I see them.
When you attack the Campaign, you attack Ron Paul
Do you know who is ultimately in charge of Ron Paul's Campaign? Thats right, Ron Paul is. So if you are attacking his campaign , then you are attacking his decisions. Do you think he is a mindless robot, that simply follows around his campaign?
"Its time for a new Revolution! Ron Paul 2008"
Either you're with or you're with the terrorists
JustinS, you might be new here. I don't know. But that kind of thinking doesn't work here.
Campaign ADs right or wrong
Have you gone to your parents and asked them what they think of Ron Paul? Have you gone to your grand parents and asked them about Ron Paul?
What is their response, What would we do if there were no taxes?
What would we do with out Social security?
most do not what all this change right now they are comfortable where they are at. They do not want to fight. So you need to approach these people in a whole different way. The Seniors are the ones that get out and vote. So we have to look at them and see what makes them want to change to vote to help us and the country out.
As I was standing on the street corner holding signs and shout out. young and old were saying who is Ron Paul and what is he running for ? People do not even know that it is for President of the united States?
Some of these old corny ads may seem bad to us but what about the others out there?
If we start nick picking and stop supporting what we have now then what do we have? More Hillary???
Lets all work to get every one involved in may ways and many ideas not every thing will be perfect. But we can all try together to improve and set our great country back on track.
We have to start some where and here is the place to start.
If we don't like the ad's let make our own and put out there?
How many have been on your local TV or radio talk shows?
Have you been on TV just to say you support RON PAUL?
How about making your own local ads 30 or 10 sec ones collect about 1500 dollars plus 750 for making the ad will get you 10 or so ads on your local TV.
Prove your ads work Locally then bring them to the Campaign head quarters.
I hope to have funds available to you all who need.
Thanks, and may GOD Bless each and every one of you out there.
Tim
YouTube is not Mainstream
The campaign needs to reach out to a mainstream audience which just isn't going to be as hip as people online. The grassroots/online campaign and people on this site are doing a great job recruiting young/tech savvy people, but here are a lot of people that don't need or want to get fired up. They just want to feel safe and re-assured. Sure these ads aren't exciting, but they do a good job at that.
It's not about YouTube
It's not about YouTube versus Mainstream, it's about good quality versus bad quality. They could have taken ANY ad from another candidate, change the name, change the issues, and they would have a better ad than this one; a slick, mainstream ad.
It's not just the "YouTube RP fans" who are disagreeing with HQ, every other political ad is much better than this one, so all those high-paid marketing guys from the other campaigns are also apparently "targeting a different group"?
Please calmer
Be calm and be considerate of others.
I don't think the ad is good.
The acting was done by people who are not actors and it shows.
I would prefer that one of the independently produced ads were put
on the air over this one. However, this ad could be improved with a
few changes.
But more important than that, You need to criticize with a little
more tact. Attitude is important. While you (all of you) have
done a lot of work and that is wonderful. The people (all of them) you
are criticizing have also done a lot of work. They take it personally.
Those supporting the ad are attacking back at the criticism
And then the critic is attacking back at the criticism that was
directed at him.
We have to realize
that the new ad may not be what you might like, but it is the type of ad that will reach out to the eldrly and those who do not have the internet, and cable news networks. I have full belief in Ron Pauls staff and the fact that they know what they are doing in presenting this ad. It is simply to attract those voters who have not yet heard the message. I think the ad puts things in the very simplest of terms, easy to understand, positive and completely avoiding attacking any other candidate which always puts a good light on our good doctor. I for one, who have worked in advertising in the past, saw right from the begining that this ad is targeting those groups I mentioned above. I think it's important, especially at this point in the game, to stand together, believe in the campaign staff and support them in any way we can.
Just because you would have to be senile
to like this ad doesn't mean it's 'going to reach out to old people'....Old people have a clue as to what quality is too.....'old' doesn't mean 'mentall challenged' like so many seem to think when talking about this ad...."ehhh they're old...they'll vote for anyone as long as they happen to see his name on the screen...the actual sincerity of the ad....well that's just superfluous when it comes to old people"
No appeal for the elderly
What are you basing your assumption on, that this works for "the elderly" and the non-internet users? Remember that the priority target group now is people registered to vote in the primaries!
For example, wouldn't it be better, in order to reach out to the elderly, to make references to recent history such as Ronald Reagan? And to mention that Ron Paul is a doctor and has been married since 50 years and has 17 grandchildren? (Oh, some anonymous B-actor did mention that he is a doctor, somewhere in that 30 second mess of disparate statements)
I think that this ad makes a particularly lousy job especially with respect to the elderly!!!
And while I'm not a commercials professional, there are obvious almost "technical" flaws in this ad. What in it is supposed to grab peoples attention? What is the message that people are supposed to remember from it afterwards? Why doesn't Ron Paul look happy or more like a president? Why can't the camera stay still for more than a second?
The best way to support them....
is to tell them the truth so they can fix it.
YES!
"The campaign knows what its doing." Nope. Sorry the campaign does not. I do not give up my view for the “campaign”. Whatever the campaign is to other people I don't know, but to me it is an organic structure of us, the people, whom have on their own dime and time promoted Ron Paul and the idea of liberty!
I will cheer for Dr. Paul today when I see him in Wyoming he is still my candidate…
Seriously...
Really nice trolling there..
"DubaRuba (and others in similar "Chill" replies) pose some statements under the "First Ad" that I feel need a response (but it's buried there)."
It's BURIED There? GOOD, as it should be. I haven't even read, nor contributed to that, and I believe it belongs there.
Another negative thread, great - whats this add to anything? It's a personal attack, seriously. [All I had to do is skip to the end]. If you want to air your dirty laundry, please do it where I don't have to smell it...
So all I have to say to you is: WhatWouldRonPaulDo.org [WWRPD.org]
Troll? Not hardly.
Nope. No dirty laundry was aired.
What was "aired" was a series of important points about what IS happening locally, and that a LOT of people are already doing what he suggested -- and MORE. (I gave examples from myself and local volunteers in our area groups... but grassroots people are doing similar things around the country.)
What was being emphasized in the original post (which you also didn't read since you "haven't even read [...] that [thread]") was that the "official campaign" is what "really" matters and that our local efforts are only in support of that, and are otherwise somehow insignificant (basicly "shut up", donate, and then go pass out slim-jims).
BTW, a troll is someone who, in your own words: "All I had to do is skip to the end" and then posts a snarky reply.
WWRPD is a phrase that borders on blasphemous -- since it attempts to somehow raise Ron Paul to the equivalent of sainthood or deity. He is a man, just a man, and one with many faults (ask him).
And the site that you propose doesn't say what you think it does (have you visited it? Or did that get "skipped" too?).
Well to me...
It seems like you need to vent. I know what the sites says, I DID read all of your post, I was merely mentioning - like I said; you have to skip to the end, and then you get the "snarky" reply.
"BTW, a troll is someone who, in your own words: "All I had to do is skip to the end" and then posts a snarky reply."
You fulfill your definition pretty well. Rhetorical question directed at DubaRuba, ring a bell? Needless to say most of the post - is pretty much a directed response to him. Email does exist...
WWRPD - blasphemous? That depends on what you consider sacred.. Lol come on... I directed you there BECAUSE "If you find yourself in a difficult situation or faced with a difficult person while working for the cause of liberty, you might find it helpful to step back and ask yourself..." to ME, it looks like you are having some kind of difficulty, right?
Ron Paul would treat everyone with respect.
Ron Paul would maintain hope.
Ron Paul would genuinely appreciate all of your efforts.
Ron Paul would not divide and conquer. Ron Paul would unite and lead.
Treating everyone with respect? Maintaining hope? Dividing OR Uniting?..........
a few of my thoughts on this
...posted here, FWIW.
My basic opinion here is that we need some clearer communication from HQ, beyond "shut up and trust us". I also agree that the vitriol is damaging -- but, it's inevitable given the circumstances, as I explain in the above link.
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